[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Are Cain supporters ready to admit… (Page 3 of 5)
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 18%? That still works out to about a 9-10% tax increase over what people like me pay now. Our payroll taxes are abut 7.6%. Double my taxes? No thanks. We need a REGRESSIVE tax code. People who create jobs and feed the economy the most pay a lower percentage of their income. People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services, contribute more. Regressive taxation = politically impossible. You forgot to subtract the first $25K or so of your income (deduct the poverty level). FYI, "People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services" don't have any money to contribute. |
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First, when did women start voting? Who allowed this to happen.
The female voters we are "losing", if not intelagent enough to know he didn't harrass anyone, probally aren't smart enought to not vote for Obama again anyways. Romney scares me because the GOP was talking about backing him months ago, before the debates even started. That to me means that he is just another inside the belt way republican. Not good. Look at the way the candidates answers questions. Perry and Romney beat around the bush and talk alot with out saying anything. Cain is, yes or no, and heres why. If you are looking for no more politics as usual, heres your guy. |
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First let me start by saying my mind is not made up yet on which to support, but if anyone thinks for one minute that these acquisitions deter me one bit, they have lost their mind. This was so predictable that some crap like this would be dug up by the Dems it is laughable. Funny how when Clinton gets caught with fat chick getting his pole smoked that it was his private life and it didn't affect the way he governed so no big deal. Then fast forward to 2011 and they dig up this crap from 10+ years ago and get a couple more "anonymous" cunts to say the same thing. If Cain was another dem running it would be page 4 news and the press would be doing every thing they could to discredit the woman, calling her everything but a cheap whore, digging up as much dirt as possible on her, and so on. Learn this: the dems and the media don'play fair.
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 18%? That still works out to about a 9-10% tax increase over what people like me pay now. Our payroll taxes are abut 7.6%. Double my taxes? No thanks. We need a REGRESSIVE tax code. People who create jobs and feed the economy the most pay a lower percentage of their income. People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services, contribute more. Regressive taxation = politically impossible. You forgot to subtract the first $25K or so of your income (deduct the poverty level). FYI, "People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services" don't have any money to contribute. Yes they do. that is the point of the national sales tax. They buy crap at convenience stores all day long. They buy cell phones, Escalades, junk food, Kools, big tv's, computers, sound equipment, and car care products. They spend billions, and pay no taxes. they are the "poor". |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The Aquila scandal hasn't even been questioned yet. That's because there is no scandal For a man pushing for Privatized Pension Plans, it's kinda tough to turn a blind eye on helping lose $200+ million dollars from your employees' retirement accounts. It has already been investigated and shown he had no role in that. Even though his name was listed on the original lawsuit, it was removed later after the investigation. You mean AFTER he sat in court with the other execs, settled out for $10.5 million with the stipulation of "No Fault". |
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OP, if you're serious about discussing this, go back and edit your posts––I'll edit mine too.
Understand that Herman Cain is STILL polling at the top of the pretty much all polls, and most of us believe this isn't going to kill his candidacy. It is a common troll tactic to come in and declare candidate ____'s campaign dead. If you're not a troll, then I apologize. Your move. |
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you muOk I can see that I'm in the deep water here. yeah, I'm basing my thoughts on people I talk to who are not arfcom folks. There's a backlash coming and I can see now that Cain supporters don't see it yet.  st be talking to actual voters then....
I can only vote for the man that I agree with Ron Paul |
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OP, if you're serious about discussing this, go back and edit your posts––I'll edit mine too. Understand that Herman Cain is STILL polling at the top of the pretty much all polls, and most of us believe this isn't going to kill his candidacy. It is a common troll tactic to come in and declare candidate ____'s campaign dead. If you're not a troll, then I apologize. Your move. Done. I am serious about this and I appreciate a civil discourse. |
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Lots of Political Science Majors here  Hi, how can I help you? What are the Odds ( in Vegas ) of Herman Cain, a Successful Businessman to defeat Barack Obama, a Clown Community Organizer 
That's a question I'd have to ask my brother, he's the actuary. That's not something a "political scientist" could answer. 
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OP, if you're serious about discussing this, go back and edit your posts––I'll edit mine too. Understand that Herman Cain is STILL polling at the top of the pretty much all polls, and most of us believe this isn't going to kill his candidacy. It is a common troll tactic to come in and declare candidate ____'s campaign dead. If you're not a troll, then I apologize. Your move. Done. I am serious about this and I appreciate a civil discourse. You may want to edit the quoted posts too. Your call. NOW.... How do you figure Herman Cain will be hurt by losing support of women? Women usually lean left, and the ones who were going to vote conservative are not swayed easily. I maintain that this is a whole lot of NOTHING. |
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The Aquila scandal hasn't even been questioned yet.
That's because there is no scandal For a man pushing for Privatized Pension Plans, it's kinda tough to turn a blind eye on helping lose $200+ million dollars from your employees' retirement accounts. It has already been investigated and shown he had no role in that. Even though his name was listed on the original lawsuit, it was removed later after the investigation. You mean AFTER he sat in court with the other execs, settled out for $10.5 million with the stipulation of "No Fault". Cain chaired the Compensation committee. There were two other committees, the Pension and Benefits Committee and the Retirement Committee which were the committees directly related to the “pension and retirement for company stock” issue which brought about the class action lawsuit. Herman Cain was never a part of either of those committees and, therefore, was not involved in those aspects of the company, those policies or their direction to encourage employees to move their pensions and or retirement into stocks.
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OP, if you're serious about discussing this, go back and edit your posts––I'll edit mine too. Understand that Herman Cain is STILL polling at the top of the pretty much all polls, and most of us believe this isn't going to kill his candidacy. It is a common troll tactic to come in and declare candidate ____'s campaign dead. If you're not a troll, then I apologize. Your move. Done. I am serious about this and I appreciate a civil discourse. You may want to edit the quoted posts too. Your call. NOW.... How do you figure Herman Cain will be hurt by losing support of women? Women usually lean left, and the ones who were going to vote conservative are not swayed easily. I maintain that this is a whole lot of NOTHING. Sorry I think I've fixed them all. I really want a conservative alternative to Mitt, but there are so many independent voters that determine elections that even hard liners have to appeal to them. Women voters are a niche that have to be taken into account and Cain has been damaged there, for right or wrong. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 18%? That still works out to about a 9-10% tax increase over what people like me pay now. Our payroll taxes are abut 7.6%. Double my taxes? No thanks. We need a REGRESSIVE tax code. People who create jobs and feed the economy the most pay a lower percentage of their income. People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services, contribute more. Regressive taxation = politically impossible. You forgot to subtract the first $25K or so of your income (deduct the poverty level). FYI, "People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services" don't have any money to contribute. Yes they do. that is the point of the national sales tax. They buy crap at convenience stores all day long. They buy cell phones, Escalades, junk food, Kools, big tv's, computers, sound equipment, and car care products. They spend billions, and pay no taxes. they are the "poor". Collecting sales tax on money that came from the government in the first place is foolish. I still think that both a national sales tax and any sort of regressive income tax would be politically impossibilities. Yes, I realize the FICA (Social Security & Medicare) are already regressive. I'd like to see that stop, too. |
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It's not a new tax though. It's a replacement. Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I'm with you- I think we should be talking about eliminating as many taxes as possible. It's time to start starving the Washington beast. I live in a state with the 2nd lowest cumulative tax burden with very high quality of life indices. No need for any new taxes here. |
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If he bails out, I will be pissed. |
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Quoted: Again.I responded by putting a Cain bumper sticker on my truck and donating another $25 to his campaign. If I run across any voters he's lost, I'll see if I can persuade them to renew their support. So far, I haven't met any. If Romney gets the nomination, this country is fucked. And there are only so many times you can be fucked before it becomes a habit. |
No really! I'm still backing a Cain/Newt ticket.
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 That kills one of the major advantages of 9-9-9. If you collect the tax in two different places, it becomes almost impossible for people to dodge it. At best, they might be able to dodge one 9, but not the other. Drug dealers, prostitutes, illegals, and other people working under the table all still will have to pay the sales tax when they buy things. Because it needs repeating. |
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If he bails out, I will be pissed. He'll probably announce something in regards to his Campaign Management Team, it does need to be beefed up, maybe some big name to run it, who knows. |
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OP, if you're serious about discussing this, go back and edit your posts––I'll edit mine too. Understand that Herman Cain is STILL polling at the top of the pretty much all polls, and most of us believe this isn't going to kill his candidacy. It is a common troll tactic to come in and declare candidate ____'s campaign dead. If you're not a troll, then I apologize. Your move. Done. I am serious about this and I appreciate a civil discourse. You may want to edit the quoted posts too. Your call. NOW.... How do you figure Herman Cain will be hurt by losing support of women? Women usually lean left, and the ones who were going to vote conservative are not swayed easily. I maintain that this is a whole lot of NOTHING. Sorry I think I've fixed them all. I really want a conservative alternative to Mitt, but there are so many independent voters that determine elections that even hard liners have to appeal to them. Women voters are a niche that have to be taken into account and Cain has been damaged there, for right or wrong. It sounds like you are letting the liberal media dictate who you should vote for. If the person at the top of the polls isn't Mitt, they will try and make it Mitt. |
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? You're definitely not alone in not understanding the 9-9-9 plan very much, that's for sure. I am here to learn, seriously, no trolling, can you explain what about the plan I'm missing? The essence of my problem is that it creates an entirely new tax (income tax), without eradicating an existing tax, and in the future what is to stop congress or a rogue president from increasing BOTH the income tax and national sales tax??? I know it does away with many other taxes, but its income and sales tax that are the brunt of what middle class america has on their backs. What will stop this is the fact that EVERYONE pays, making such a move political suicide. Right now, nearly half the country doesn't pay federal income tax, so "fuck the rich" (meaning "fuck the other half of the country") is a viable political platform. If you want to cut spending and cut taxes, you need to get EVERYONE on the same side of the fence. 9-9-9 is a way to do this. QFMFT |
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I have to agree with the OP, it's over. Our choices are going to be Romney or Obama. That's certainly the media choices. I'm just not sure what motivates their choice except their imagined status as learned scribes. I don't buy into the 'media picked Romney' conspiracy. But he has been through this before. And he has the money, name recognition and staff in place that Cain doesn't. |
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I am considering the points about the 9-9-9 plan being an open taxation plan instead of a hidden one. I hadn't really thought about it like that, the national sales tax really scares me, but I'll have to really give some thought to the merits of the plan. Its possible that I have just ran with my initial "no fucking way am I voting for a new tax" reaction without really considering all angles. This is the first election in my life where I have been truly torn and I honestly don't know what the right thing to do is. I am torn between voting my principals (Ron Paul) and voting for pragmatism (whoever has the best chance to beat Obama). Its had me up nights, thinking about it. Go ahead and vote Paul in the primary. That is the correct place to make a stand. Once the general comes around, it is all about NOT letting 0bama get a second term. I am stocking up on Pepto and Tums in case Mittens gets the nomination. I may need to add Cuervo to my preps. 
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Quoted: Ok I can see that I'm in the deep water here. yeah, I'm basing my thoughts on people I talk to who are not arfcom folks. There's a backlash coming and I can see now that Cain supporters don't see it yet. No, you're OK. Cains a boob. He'll be his own undoing. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: snip Cain chaired the Compensation committee. There were two other committees, the Pension and Benefits Committee and the Retirement Committee which were the committees directly related to the "pension and retirement for company stock” issue which brought about the class action lawsuit. Herman Cain was never a part of either of those committees and, therefore, was not involved in those aspects of the company, those policies or their direction to encourage employees to move their pensions and or retirement into stocks. http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/05/herman-cain-aquila-lawsuit-2012 Cain served on the board of directors throughout Aquila's ill-fated trading misadventure and the subsequent collapse of the company's retirement fund. In fact, he chaired the board's compensation committee, which, according to the lawsuit, had direct oversight of the push to get employees to invest more and more in Aquila stock. As chair of the compensation committee, Cain also saw fit to dole out $30 million in bonuses, not including stock options, to the top five execs at Aquila in 2002, with the company's stock plummeting. A month after the Kansas City Star reported on the hefty bonuses in July 2002, the company laid off 500 employees, and the losses to employees holding company stock had reached hundreds of millions of dollars. As a board member, Cain would've had direct knowledge of Aquila's activities, says Fred Taylor Isquith, a New York attorney who litigated the employee class action. Asked if it was fair to place blame on Cain for the debacle at Aquila, Isquith replied, "Yes, I believe it is." |
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So far, Cain's the guy I like best. Perry can't talk his way out of a paper bag, and Romney is The White Obama. Gingrich? Please. Paul? Yeah, right. You got a better suggestion, OP? This. And his donations are skyrocketing. What's wrong with Dr. Gingrich?? Smartest and most experienced, not to mention the most realistic vision of all the candidates. |
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That it’s time to start looking at other options? For right or wrong, this guy has lost a huge amount the female vote. It ain’t coming back. Now he’s losing the moderates who can’t stand the way he “jokes” about everything. “Princess Nancy”, Anita Hill jokes, and others at a time when everyone is looking to him as a serious alternative to Mitt just show that he lacks some basic good judgment. I’ve seen these boards burn completely up making fun of Perry’s dumbass moments and ass-hattery, which actually pale in comparison to some of Cain’s quips. But Cain gets a pass? Nope. I call ‘em like I see ‘em. Cain is not the right guy and conservatives better come up with a plan ‘C’ pretty damn quick. Mitt is surging ahead by simply keeping his mouth shut and not screwing up in debates. 
Because smart people can identify a smear campaign when they see it. |
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His behavior is being framed as odd by the media. Of course, some of the things he has said do have an odd tone to them. It's almost snarky. A friend and I were just talking about this today. Reminds me of a Ben Franklin quote.
Romney is going to sail his way through the primaries if the rest of them aren't careful. Perry has not done remarkable in the debates and a lot of people, myself included, thought he was going to be a heavy hitter - the one to beat. Paul doesn't carry the numbers in the polls, and if he runs as a third party he will steal votes from the conservative ticket. I think Cain would make an excellent Vice President. It's just going to feel so dirty voting for Romney. It's going to be 2004 all over again for me. 
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OP, if you're serious about discussing this, go back and edit your posts––I'll edit mine too. Understand that Herman Cain is STILL polling at the top of the pretty much all polls, and most of us believe this isn't going to kill his candidacy. It is a common troll tactic to come in and declare candidate ____'s campaign dead. If you're not a troll, then I apologize. Your move. Done. I am serious about this and I appreciate a civil discourse. You may want to edit the quoted posts too. Your call. NOW.... How do you figure Herman Cain will be hurt by losing support of women? Women usually lean left, and the ones who were going to vote conservative are not swayed easily. I maintain that this is a whole lot of NOTHING. Sorry I think I've fixed them all. I really want a conservative alternative to Mitt, but there are so many independent voters that determine elections that even hard liners have to appeal to them. Women voters are a niche that have to be taken into account and Cain has been damaged there, for right or wrong. It sounds like you are letting the liberal media dictate who you should vote for. If the person at the top of the polls isn't Mitt, they will try and make it Mitt. They want Romney because he is a Progressive, just like them. |
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He stole that from Ken Hamblin! |
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Anyone have a link to Savage show online other than the one in the article? |
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Well the Princess and A. Hill are jokes. I'm glad Cain called them out. The only ones bitching are the Perry fan-boys, MSLSD, the GOP establishment types, and the Dems.
Are Cains jokes "Presidential" in the traditional sense?....No they are not but at this point that is not much of a much to me. There are much bigger fish to fry and Cain just might be the cook I'm looking for. Still plenty of time to flesh them all out before we choose. Anyone else notice that Newt is creeping up on the top spot? 
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Quoted: Newt is on the rise big time. It's the natural order of selection. Get tired of the gimmicks, and go back to the most knowledgeable and experienced guy in the room. FWIW, Obama was the gimmick that got elected. If Newt had surged earlier (suggesting he's interesting or appealing), the media would be ripping him apart right now instead of Cain, just like they did Perry a while back. When and if Newt gets to the top of the heap, that's very very bad for this nation because he's a tepid RINO turd and will bore conservatives and hand Obama another victory. Remember McCain? Newt might actually be worse. Awesome. |