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Posted: 11/6/2018 4:38:03 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you're a SOT. If not it's $200 +$5 iirc Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I thought about getting one and filing through eforms since it's like $5 for that stamp (I think) If not it's $200 +$5 iirc |
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Posted: 11/6/2018 4:41:05 PM EST
[#2]
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If you are an 02/07 once it's on the books as a NFA post sample would it matter if it had the very grip without the happy switch since you can make an she as well? It's still a title 2 without the auto mode. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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This has been established. With the back plate installed the gun is Title II and grip/stock are ok. If the backplate is swapped back the gun is title I and the grip/stock would have to be removed PRIOR to swapping the backplate. |
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Posted: 11/6/2018 4:50:50 PM EST
[#3]
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The conversion device is usually what's registered, it remains a machine gun until destroyed. The pistol goes back to being a pistol once the conversion device is removed. It's not like were talking about an expensive pistol here. Or serial an 80 frame and make a throw away frame for it. Even better. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 7:52:07 AM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are an 02/07 once it's on the books as a NFA post sample would it matter if it had the very grip without the happy switch since you can make an she as well? It's still a title 2 without the auto mode. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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This has been established. With the back plate installed the gun is Title II and grip/stock are ok. If the backplate is swapped back the gun is title I and the grip/stock would have to be removed PRIOR to swapping the backplate. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 7:53:11 AM EST
[#5]
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In before your dust cover or grip breaks off and you shoot off some fingers with 10mm goodness....  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11fcg543JowQuote HistoryQuoted:
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Oh you will! I think a 10mm FA handgun is going to require two hands  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11fcg543Jow |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 7:53:32 AM EST
[#6]
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Only one more? You should put one on the top, too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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it already comes with one...how many do you think you're gonna need...  |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 7:55:47 AM EST
[#7]
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In that case. Register the gun not the device. It's not like were talking about an expensive pistol here. Or serial an 80 frame and make a throw away frame for it. Even better. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The conversion device is usually what's registered, it remains a machine gun until destroyed. The pistol goes back to being a pistol once the conversion device is removed. It's not like were talking about an expensive pistol here. Or serial an 80 frame and make a throw away frame for it. Even better. Also I'm 90% sure that the ATF doesn't approve Glock frames as MG's, it's my understanding they make you serialize/register the auto sear itself. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 7:55:52 AM EST
[#8]
Well, your avatar is fitting.
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:04:15 AM EST
[#9]
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Also I'm 90% sure that the ATF doesn't approve Glock frames as MG's, it's my understanding they make you serialize/register the auto sear itself. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:06:59 AM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, your avatar is fitting. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:09:29 AM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why wouldn't they? What if I actually milled the slide for G18 parts instead of a drop in auto sear? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Also I'm 90% sure that the ATF doesn't approve Glock frames as MG's, it's my understanding they make you serialize/register the auto sear itself. I have heard people say that their Form 2's were denied on registering the frame and that the ATF wanted the sear itself done. Hearsay I know. I think the reasoning is that since the sear can be easily swapped they want to keep track of it not the gun it's dropped into. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:21:46 AM EST
[#12]
You'll shoot your hand off kid.
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:25:24 AM EST
[#13]
Once again GD has proved that it has very serious jealousy issues.
OP, Post vids! 
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:30:53 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In before your dust cover or grip breaks off and you shoot off some fingers with 10mm goodness.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11fcg543JowMight as well put a stock on it too.
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Posted: 11/7/2018 9:07:26 AM EST
[#15]
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Once again GD has proved that it has very serious jealousy issues. OP, Post vids! |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 9:32:21 AM EST
[#16]
If you haven't already decided, my personal favorite was the FGG-S, which is nearly identical to the FGG-K but without the trigger cover slider. They can be had on ebay for under $40.
ETA: The ENDO stock adapter works extremely well, too. Not QD, but rock solid. You might be weirded out by the springy feel on FA at first, but it's the slide and barrel reciprocating, not the stock. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 10:17:47 AM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh that's a guarantee. Looks like I'll have a stock too so my hands may be safe. Maybe. I just need to find an SOT with a happy switch end plate that would let me play
 Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 10:49:07 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would like to build a 10mm FPG at some point, as a big brother to my FPG 9..... I just need to find an SOT with a happy switch end plate that would let me play
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/173511/IMG_20170620_121255592_jpg-731156.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/173511/IMG_20170620_121839760_jpg-731157.JPG Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Oh that's a guarantee. Looks like I'll have a stock too so my hands may be safe. Maybe. I just need to find an SOT with a happy switch end plate that would let me play
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/173511/IMG_20170620_121255592_jpg-731156.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/173511/IMG_20170620_121839760_jpg-731157.JPG How south into SC are you
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Posted: 11/7/2018 10:58:56 AM EST
[#19]
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LEGITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT How south into SC are you https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Magpul-FMG-FPG-update/15-712326/ |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:06:25 AM EST
[#20]
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If I were putting a VFG on a Glock, I'd probably want something like the ALG 6 Second Mount and an MP5K-style VFG. Might as well put a stock on it too.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: In before your dust cover or grip breaks off and you shoot off some fingers with 10mm goodness.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11fcg543JowMight as well put a stock on it too.
Id be willing to SBR a Glock for something like this. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:08:56 AM EST
[#21]
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I saw a MAC video about these: http://www.osagecountyguns.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/BT-USW-G17-00011.jpg Id be willing to SBR a Glock for something like this. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:15:36 AM EST
[#22]
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:16:22 AM EST
[#23]
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Might as well put a stock on it too.
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:19:09 AM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
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Might as well put a stock on it too.
https://www.endotactical.com/images/gallery/product/IMG_2130.jpg |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:22:49 AM EST
[#25]
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Full auto ETA: I see it was posted. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:23:27 AM EST
[#26]
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If that wasn't 3D printed airsoft I'd have bought one when they first came out. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Might as well put a stock on it too.
https://www.endotactical.com/images/gallery/product/IMG_2130.jpg |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:36:06 AM EST
[#27]
LOL to all the page 1 firearms police responses.
All I can recommend, OP, is get something that's sturdy. That beast is gonna be a wild child. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 12:17:42 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh you will! I think a 10mm FA handgun is going to require two hands Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I wanna see the FA awesomness you are putting together Get an ALG mount. I can absolutely see the recoil of a full auto G20 breaking the dust cover off and potentially ruining your day. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 12:37:04 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
LOL to all the page 1 firearms police responses. All I can recommend, OP, is get something that's sturdy. That beast is gonna be a wild child. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 12:40:37 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I thought about getting one and filing through eforms since it's like $5 for that stamp (I think) |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 2:35:13 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, it's NOT title II if the auto sear is removed. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 2:37:43 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You can pay an SOT to "convert" it, whatever their charge, and then the form 4 is $5. If you do it yourself on a form 1 it's $200. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If you’re a SOT. If not it’s $200 +$5 iirc If you do it yourself on a form 1 it's $200. Once I get around to doing an AR or similar "pistol" I'm thinking of going the AOW route and it seems like everyone's paying $200 for the stamps, but they have all done Form 1s. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 2:43:11 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It would still be a SBR... a title II firearm. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 2:46:09 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So $5 to transfer, $200 to build? Once I get around to doing an AR or similar "pistol" I'm thinking of going the AOW route and it seems like everyone's paying $200 for the stamps, but they have all done Form 1s. The only advantage you'll have with an AOW over a pistol will be that you can run a front grip at an overall length under 26" Some states won't allow a rifle to be loaded in a vehicle, but a pistol can, not sure about AOW's... |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 2:58:38 PM EST
[#35]
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Is there a reason you want to go AOW instead of SBR, if you're going to F1 it? Interstate travel? The only advantage you'll have with an AOW over a pistol will be that you can run a front grip at an overall length under 26" Some states won't allow a rifle to be loaded in a vehicle, but a pistol can, not sure about AOW's... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So $5 to transfer, $200 to build? Once I get around to doing an AR or similar "pistol" I'm thinking of going the AOW route and it seems like everyone's paying $200 for the stamps, but they have all done Form 1s. The only advantage you'll have with an AOW over a pistol will be that you can run a front grip at an overall length under 26" Some states won't allow a rifle to be loaded in a vehicle, but a pistol can, not sure about AOW's... A braced pistol as an alternative poses some risks in CA. So far DOJ has not considered pistols with most braces to be SBRs. But they seem to consider shouldering to make it an SBR under State law based on what I've read so far, and the former is potentially subject to change or prosecution attempts by other authorities. However, a Federally registered AOW is exempt from the CA SBR laws, and they can't prosecute you for having or shouldering the brace, whatever they determine there. The only thing that seems to be problematic is shouldering the brace as far as the Feds are concerned. I'm getting the impression that they'd consider a shouldered braced AOW to be an SBR. Also, in CA AOWs can be added to CCW permits if the issuing authority has no problem with it, not that I have a shot at a permit in my current county (but most are close to or essentially shall-issue). Some counties do have issues with it or with rifle-calibre weapons, but not all. Just something I'm considering when the time comes. I wouldn't mind going the Form 4 route, but SOTs here are almost never willing to deal with ordinary folks even where NFA stuff is legal. I do know an SOT here who is a manufacturer, but I've never asked if he facilitates NFA transfers and stuff for anyone but LEOs. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 3:16:46 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Can't SBR it in CA. If it was C&R, you could still SBR it until 2011, when it was ruled that doing that makes it a new weapon and negates C&R status, which would make it illegal in CA. Not very many ARs qualified by that point and I doubt any were SBRed, as it's an obscure law (and all would be registered AWs and thus not transferrable, anyways). Even with C&R status, under 30" makes an SBR an AW, and thus illegal. A braced pistol as an alternative poses some risks in CA. So far DOJ has not considered pistols with most braces to be SBRs. But they seem to consider shouldering to make it an SBR under State law based on what I've read so far, and the former is potentially subject to change or prosecution attempts by other authorities. However, a Federally registered AOW is exempt from the CA SBR laws, and they can't prosecute you for having or shouldering the brace, whatever they determine there. The only thing that seems to be problematic is shouldering the brace as far as the Feds are concerned. I'm getting the impression that they'd consider a shouldered braced AOW to be an SBR. Also, in CA AOWs can be added to CCW permits if the issuing authority has no problem with it, not that I have a shot at a permit in my current county (but most are close to or essentially shall-issue). Some counties do have issues with it or with rifle-calibre weapons, but not all. Just something I'm considering when the time comes. I wouldn't mind going the Form 4 route, but SOTs here are almost never willing to deal with ordinary folks even where NFA stuff is legal. I do know an SOT here who is a manufacturer, but I've never asked if he facilitates NFA transfers and stuff for anyone but LEOs. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 3:41:48 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What an absolute CF of laws. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Can't SBR it in CA. If it was C&R, you could still SBR it until 2011, when it was ruled that doing that makes it a new weapon and negates C&R status, which would make it illegal in CA. Not very many ARs qualified by that point and I doubt any were SBRed, as it's an obscure law (and all would be registered AWs and thus not transferrable, anyways). Even with C&R status, under 30" makes an SBR an AW, and thus illegal. A braced pistol as an alternative poses some risks in CA. So far DOJ has not considered pistols with most braces to be SBRs. But they seem to consider shouldering to make it an SBR under State law based on what I've read so far, and the former is potentially subject to change or prosecution attempts by other authorities. However, a Federally registered AOW is exempt from the CA SBR laws, and they can't prosecute you for having or shouldering the brace, whatever they determine there. The only thing that seems to be problematic is shouldering the brace as far as the Feds are concerned. I'm getting the impression that they'd consider a shouldered braced AOW to be an SBR. Also, in CA AOWs can be added to CCW permits if the issuing authority has no problem with it, not that I have a shot at a permit in my current county (but most are close to or essentially shall-issue). Some counties do have issues with it or with rifle-calibre weapons, but not all. Just something I'm considering when the time comes. I wouldn't mind going the Form 4 route, but SOTs here are almost never willing to deal with ordinary folks even where NFA stuff is legal. I do know an SOT here who is a manufacturer, but I've never asked if he facilitates NFA transfers and stuff for anyone but LEOs. But yeah, CA finds all sorts of ways to muck things up. But our convoluted laws also lend themselves to the existence of loopholes, like this one in the SBR laws. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 3:43:25 PM EST
[#38]
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Posted: 11/7/2018 8:07:24 PM EST
[#39]
Quoted: Not if you remove the stock/grip before removing the registered end plate. If the plate is the F/A item he can swap stuff as needed. It opens up options. |
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Posted: 11/7/2018 10:06:31 PM EST
[#40]
 Attached File...although I prefer the Micro Roni chassis. Way more controllable.  Attached File FA Glock/Roni |
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:48:11 AM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It would still be a SBR... a title II firearm. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's NOT title II if the auto sear is removed. |
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:18:29 AM EST
[#42]
Really consider if you want to put that on the dust cover rail.
That cover is not very substantial to be trying to hold down the front of the gun. With as much leverage as you will get on a VFG, I would expect the cover to fail, especially with 10mm recoil. Try it without it first. The auto glock is actually reasonable with practice. |
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:49:14 AM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really consider if you want to put that on the dust cover rail. That cover is not very substantial to be trying to hold down the front of the gun. With as much leverage as you will get on a VFG, I would expect the cover to fail, especially with 10mm recoil. Try it without it first. The auto glock is actually reasonable with practice. |
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:54:15 AM EST
[#44]
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Posted: 11/8/2018 10:01:46 AM EST
[#45]
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I'm not trying to be a jerk, but you're saying the recoil is reasonable however I will certainly rip the frame apart with a VFG? Take a Glock frame (without the slide) and grab the dust cover. They're not very rigid. https://www.ar15.com/forums/handguns/I_cracked_the_frame_of_my__G19_using_my_bare_hands__Iandapos_ll_be_damned__PICS_INSIDE_/13-140580/? 
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 11/8/2018 10:03:17 AM EST
[#46]
Your Glock 19 already has a vertical grip, just saying.
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Posted: 11/8/2018 10:51:19 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your Glock 19 already has a vertical grip, just saying. 
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Posted: 11/8/2018 10:51:32 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He's just saying the dust cover was never intended to take the forces it will see if you use a vertical grip. Take a Glock frame (without the slide) and grab the dust cover. They're not very rigid. https://www.ar15.com/forums/handguns/I_cracked_the_frame_of_my__G19_using_my_bare_hands__Iandapos_ll_be_damned__PICS_INSIDE_/13-140580/? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/adairtd/broken-glock17.jpg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Fr5ccyriJIQuote HistoryQuoted:
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I'm not trying to be a jerk, but you're saying the recoil is reasonable however I will certainly rip the frame apart with a VFG? Take a Glock frame (without the slide) and grab the dust cover. They're not very rigid. https://www.ar15.com/forums/handguns/I_cracked_the_frame_of_my__G19_using_my_bare_hands__Iandapos_ll_be_damned__PICS_INSIDE_/13-140580/? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v392/adairtd/broken-glock17.jpg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Fr5ccyriJI |
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Posted: 12/5/2018 8:23:56 PM EST
[#49]
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 12/5/2018 8:27:18 PM EST
[#50]
Vertical video? Really?
That’s pretty damn awesome! I
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