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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:28:39 AM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Think about the cost to replace the batteries every 8 years . Also Tesla knows if a unlicensed tech is working on the car and Tesla will lock the car out. Also here in va you pay a $400/yr highway tax that normally is paid through gas prices. The batteries don’t need to be replaced every 8 years. Only instances I’ve ever hear of Tesla “locking out” a car is with salvaged vehicles. Then you are just “locked out” of the supercharger network. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:31:58 AM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And batteries are only warranted for 100k miles and cost 20k to replace. So 40k in addition to reach the 250k a modern ICE should hit. Then batteries in freezing weather isn't the best thing. Or not What makes you think the battery needs replaced every 100k? Many have gone several times that. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:34:09 AM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How much is the charger installed at your home for the Tesla. It comes with a portable. Unless you want a bigger/faster hard wired, the only cost is a dryer/RV type outlet in the garage. If your dryer is in the garage you could actually unplug it and use it to charge if you wanted to.  |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:41:57 AM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Compare the time it takes to charge your EV over the course of a month, to the time it takes to fill up your car with gas. Then take that charging time and add that to sitting in traffic. What happens when you have to run the heat while sitting in a traffic jam when the ambient is below freezing? Will surely tank your range. It doesn't take any time to charge out of your day when you charge overnight in your own garage. It charges while you sleep. And sitting in traffic will cost you less than doing it in a gas truck. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:44:46 AM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Chinese batteries. That is an absolute deal breaker Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Battery/Drivetrain warranties: Model 3 Standard: 8yrs/100k miles Model 3 LR/Perf and Model Y.: 8 yrs/120k Model S/X: 8 Years/150k OP, with the amount of miles you are driving it would be best to consider trading it in for a new one every 2-3 years while still in warranty. Resell values for Tesla's have remained very strong and you would still come out ahead of your F150 unless you are the kind of person who likes to keep a car until it turns to dust. Many Tesla's out there over 200k miles on the original battery but much beyond that any survivors are generally on a new battery. Also note that the Model 3 Standard is now using LFP batteries made in China. They are supposed to last longer but are more susceptible to cold weather. For your daily mileage you should stick with a long range model. Chinese batteries. That is an absolute deal breaker Fords batteries aren't made in China |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:48:27 AM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good luck charging your ev when the power grid is severely compromised by FJB and the lunatic left. We have a solution for that. 
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:53:15 AM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/114071/screenshot-tiremeetsroad_com-2021_11_08--2160136.png WHY WOULD ANY ONE SPEND ALL THIS MONEY TO BUY ELECTRIC WHEN IT TAKES 10HR TO CHARGE 10 hours to charge while you're asleep in your bed. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:55:35 AM EST
[#8]
IMO if you buy/drive a Tesla You are a Bitchass Biden kneeler
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Posted: 11/9/2021 3:03:57 AM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If I had to wait 2 hours to Charge a car I would rather pay to use gas that takes only 5 min to fill the car...I have better things to do then be attached to a vehicle..I think this would be good for driving around town not driving NY to Philly Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: My Mustang Mach e averages 3 miles per KW. Charging at home is about 10 cents per KW. So about $5.00 150 miles÷3 kw/mile=50kw 50kw ×.10= $5.00 150 miles @ 15 mpg = 10 gal. 10gal x $3.25 per gal =$32.50 You would save $27.50 each trip. I also have a F-150. It mostly sits in the garage unless I'm towing the horse trailer or going to Home Depot. Today we went on a 250 mile round trip. We we able to charge for a couple of hours for free at a type 2 charger at a shopping center across the street from the hospital where i was having outpatient surgery. We could have made the round-trip without recharging but then we didn't have to worry about running low and it was free. I don't know of anywhere to get free gasoline. https://i.imgur.com/ZEyD1eR.jpeg If I had to wait 2 hours to Charge a car I would rather pay to use gas that takes only 5 min to fill the car...I have better things to do then be attached to a vehicle..I think this would be good for driving around town not driving NY to Philly Who waits two hours for a charger? We took two hours of free electricity while my wife waited for me to come out of surgery. She also got dinner. Not one minute was spent waiting for the car. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 3:07:27 AM EST
[#10]
This fellow has done some interesting stuff with wrecked Teslas to include using there battery packs with his home solar system. Very interesting Twitter feed and his web page.
https://mobile.twitter.com/wk057 https://057tech.com/ |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 3:07:53 AM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: IMO if you buy/drive a Tesla You are a Bitchass Biden kneeler Because they hadn't sold a few hundred thousand while Trump was President? |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:41:23 AM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: IMO if you buy/drive a Tesla You are a Bitchass Biden kneeler How do you feel about GM and Obama? |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:16:04 AM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What's the reason for that? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Check into insurance cost. I'd REALLY like a Tesla, but it would cost twice the premium of my 2020 RAM 1500. What's the reason for that? I was told the cost and difficulty of getting parts, along with very limited places that can work on them. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:18:37 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: IMO if you buy/drive a Tesla You are a Bitchass Biden kneeler This comes off as a guy who still buys those old tablets we used to get in school, just so he can write MOPAR all over the cover. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:21:59 AM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This comes off as a guy who still buys those old tablets we used to get in school, just so he can write MOPAR all over the cover. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: IMO if you buy/drive a Tesla You are a Bitchass Biden kneeler This comes off as a guy who still buys those old tablets we used to get in school, just so he can write MOPAR all over the cover. ???? |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:22:40 AM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/114071/screenshot-tiremeetsroad_com-2021_11_08--2160136.png WHY WOULD ANY ONE SPEND ALL THIS MONEY TO BUY ELECTRIC WHEN IT TAKES 10HR TO CHARGE That is with a 110v outlet. If you are buying such a vehicle and have a place to park it you will install a 220V charger. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:27:06 AM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do jot give a fuck. Not going to give up my 5.7 tundra.   I make it a point to floor it past any Prius to make up for their faggotry.Who is the actual faggot? The Prius driver or the guy that behaves irrationally when he sees one? |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:33:19 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is with a 110v outlet. If you are buying such a vehicle and have a place to park it you will install a 220V charger. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/114071/screenshot-tiremeetsroad_com-2021_11_08--2160136.png WHY WOULD ANY ONE SPEND ALL THIS MONEY TO BUY ELECTRIC WHEN IT TAKES 10HR TO CHARGE That is with a 110v outlet. If you are buying such a vehicle and have a place to park it you will install a 220V charger. No, it will take 10 hours with 240. But you will be at home, eating dinner, playing Xbox, fucking your girl, etc. while it charges. I'm not saying I've NEVER had sex at a gas station, but it is just inconvenient. The point is even if you completely drain the battery everyday running errands, commuting, etc. You will still have a "full tank" each morning when you wake up with no trips to the gas station. And the 10hrs is if you are COMPLETELY empty. The more realistic scenario is, you just "top off" every few days. (Don't use 110. That is an emergency option.) |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:44:37 AM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Model 3 gets about 4 miles per Kwh. For 150 miles per day you are looking at about 38 Kwh of electricity a day. Times that by your per kwh electricity cost to see what it will cost you. For our electricity costs here that would be about 17 bucks in electricity a week for your commute. I also have a 4runner that gets about 15mpg and in my experience the model 3 is way cheaper to run. Compare that to a Honda or Toyota getting 35-40mpg and how long does it take for the price difference to even out? |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 10:47:55 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You'd have to replace the battery after 8 years in a modern EV about as often as you'd have to replace the transmission or engine in any other car after 8 years. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Think about the cost to replace the batteries every 8 years . Also Tesla knows if a unlicensed tech is working on the car and Tesla will lock the car out. Also here in va you pay a $400/yr highway tax that normally is paid through gas prices. You'd have to replace the battery after 8 years in a modern EV about as often as you'd have to replace the transmission or engine in any other car after 8 years. *laughs in Toyota* |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 11:04:45 AM EST
[#21]
Out of the box a bit, 150 miles a day id probably just move closer
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Posted: 11/9/2021 11:14:03 AM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You can drive the f150 250k more miles for the price of a new Tesla. I don't think Tesla drivers are the kind of people to keep cars that long. I believe Elon said they wanted to make an easily replaceable battery but virtually no one actually keeps their cars long enough |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 11:40:31 AM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Can we get a source on that? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Teslas are around 3kWH/mile, so you're talking ~50kWH of electricity ($5-15) vs. 10 gallons of gas ($35-$40). That's probably $7200/year savings. You'd be running the battery down around 75%, so you'd get probably somewhere around 600-900 trips before needing a new battery, so let's call it 4 years. After 4 years of saving ($29k), you'd need a new battery at a cost of $16,000, so you'd still come out ahead. Now, hot/cold temps and hills will affect the numbers on the Tesla significantly, so factor that in. All in all, maybe run the numbers on something like a Prius, that takes gas, but still gets amazing mileage. Can we get a source on that? I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 12:25:50 PM EST
[#24]
Man, I love GD electric car threads, its better than beans in chili. The inability for someone who's OWN use case for a car to recognize other people have different situations is hilarious.
It sounds like OP drives something close to 40k miles a year. It seems reasonable that the battery will last at bare minimum, 4 years of that. It seems to me that the biggest cost of ownership variable here is insurance. I have a coworker that did not pay appreciably more to insure a Model 3 than a her previous ICE car, but that's with her carrier, risk profile, etc. It looks like Model 3s hold their value pretty nicely, and OP could drive for 3.5 years when he's close to the warranty expiration, look at battery life, and either trade in for peace of mind, or bet on Tesla actually aiming for a 300k pack life. Four years from now, you'd have some clarity as to whether to trust Tesla or not. So, either OP can get a EV now, or buy an efficient ICE car drive for a couple years, and reconsider an EV. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 12:27:19 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. Tesla (and presumably other EV manufacturers) use a "trick" to extend their battery life - the battery capacity is actually higher than what is listed, and when the battery is "fully" charged, it is only charged to somewhere in the neighborhood of 80% of the actual capacity (when new). This allows more charges before any noticeable degradation occurs, because the battery can actually degrade 20% without affecting the actual range by simply charging it fully, resulting in the same charge that it carries as when it was new - you have a built in reserve that degrades without any effect on performance until that reserve is completely used up. Additionally, by not fully charging it, actual degradation is reduced, allowing more cycles before degradation reaches a given point. This DOES increase the cost of the battery, however, since you are buying a larger battery than listed on the specification sheet, and trading capacity for longevity. Mike |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 12:55:48 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tesla (and presumably other EV manufacturers) use a "trick" to extend their battery life - the battery capacity is actually higher than what is listed, and when the battery is "fully" charged, it is only charged to somewhere in the neighborhood of 80% of the actual capacity (when new). This allows more charges before any noticeable degradation occurs, because the battery can actually degrade 20% without affecting the actual range by simply charging it fully, resulting in the same charge that it carries as when it was new - you have a built in reserve that degrades without any effect on performance until that reserve is completely used up. Additionally, by not fully charging it, actual degradation is reduced, allowing more cycles before degradation reaches a given point. This DOES increase the cost of the battery, however, since you are buying a larger battery than listed on the specification sheet, and trading capacity for longevity. Mike Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. Tesla (and presumably other EV manufacturers) use a "trick" to extend their battery life - the battery capacity is actually higher than what is listed, and when the battery is "fully" charged, it is only charged to somewhere in the neighborhood of 80% of the actual capacity (when new). This allows more charges before any noticeable degradation occurs, because the battery can actually degrade 20% without affecting the actual range by simply charging it fully, resulting in the same charge that it carries as when it was new - you have a built in reserve that degrades without any effect on performance until that reserve is completely used up. Additionally, by not fully charging it, actual degradation is reduced, allowing more cycles before degradation reaches a given point. This DOES increase the cost of the battery, however, since you are buying a larger battery than listed on the specification sheet, and trading capacity for longevity. Mike Even in OPs scenario, he's only using ~50% of the battery between charges at 150 miles a day, which is going to radically extend life, compared to if it was discharged to nearly empty every time, and supercharged back to 80% and then fast charged to 100% immediately. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 1:43:45 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Tesla (and presumably other EV manufacturers) use a "trick" to extend their battery life - the battery capacity is actually higher than what is listed, and when the battery is "fully" charged, it is only charged to somewhere in the neighborhood of 80% of the actual capacity (when new). This allows more charges before any noticeable degradation occurs, because the battery can actually degrade 20% without affecting the actual range by simply charging it fully, resulting in the same charge that it carries as when it was new - you have a built in reserve that degrades without any effect on performance until that reserve is completely used up. Additionally, by not fully charging it, actual degradation is reduced, allowing more cycles before degradation reaches a given point. This DOES increase the cost of the battery, however, since you are buying a larger battery than listed on the specification sheet, and trading capacity for longevity. Mike This is correct. Last I talked with Tesla about commercial grade battery installs, they spec to end of life. So if you buy a 5 year warranty, they build to provide rated capacity at that point. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 2:05:39 PM EST
[#28]
150 miles per day
15mpg 10 gallons per day just to go to work and back  Some basic assumptions: 5 days/week, M-F = 50 gallons per week, or 200 gallons per month. Gas here is $3.25/gallon so we'll go with that. $3.25 * 200 = $650 in gas, per month, just to drive to work and back  OP are you insane? Do you like paying $7,500-$8,000 per year just in gas to drive to work? Do you really love your job that much?  Not including your cost for tires (almost 30,000 miles of commuting per year) and wear and tear, but the biggest issue here is YOUR TIME. Have you considered finding something closer to home? All those hundreds of hours add up -- that's at least 2.5 hours/day commuting, so you spend about 50 hours per month in your car. So in addition to working 160 hours/month, you're spending 50 hours/month just to get to the job to work 160 hours/month. 50*12 = 600, so you're spending about 15 work week's worth of time stuck in your car per year, just to drive to work and back home.Personally I try to avoid spending a little time as possible commuting. If I were in your shoes I'd spend every waking moment trying to find a job closer to home. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 3:21:05 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Compare that to a Honda or Toyota getting 35-40mpg and how long does it take for the price difference to even out? It's north of 300,000 miles for a Model 3 versus a mid trim level Corolla, and even higher for a Prius. From a purely financial standpoint it hard to justify, but there's nothing wrong with simply wanting a Tesla. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 4:54:04 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Here you go... just quoting myself from the thread the other day... so it's a bit out of context, but the math is still good: Long story short... 150 miles costs us about $6 in the Taycan. New Taycan comes with the 36 months of 30 minute free charging sessions. My cast for the 2200 miles on my 4S is very low because I've only charged at home a few times. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:02:34 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Logic Monster stepping in here. Guys.... this is just a math equation. TCO is all that matters, if you are trying to analyze costs. You must add together all the operating and ownership costs to accurately calcuate "Total Cost of Ownership". Your costs are: *Depreciation *Finance charges (unless you paid cash for said car) *fuel costs *insurance costs *Cost of expected repairs & maintenance. Without crunching the math, I would expect the Tesla to have very high depreciation, insurance, and repair costs! It would of course excel in fuel costs. You can't ignore TCO though.... You're also probably better off by buying a 3-7 year old old used Civic, Corolla, or Prius, and paying cash for it. It may not have as low of fuel costs as the Tesla, but it will have less depreciation and less cost of repairs and insurance. Your depreciation assumption is wrong. I've old two Teslas and my buddy sold one and got great money for them. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:15:15 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: New Taycan comes with the 36 months of 30 minute free charging sessions. My cast for the 2200 miles on my 4S is very low because I've only charged at home a few times. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Here you go... just quoting myself from the thread the other day... so it's a bit out of context, but the math is still good: Long story short... 150 miles costs us about $6 in the Taycan. New Taycan comes with the 36 months of 30 minute free charging sessions. My cast for the 2200 miles on my 4S is very low because I've only charged at home a few times. Yep. And we've been using it (the "free" charging) the very few times we've charged on the road. But the vast majority of our charging time is just topping off at home. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:30:49 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Teslas are around 3kWH/mile, so you're talking ~50kWH of electricity ($5-15) vs. 10 gallons of gas ($35-$40). That's probably $7200/year savings. You'd be running the battery down around 75%, so you'd get probably somewhere around 600-900 trips before needing a new battery, so let's call it 4 years. After 4 years of saving ($29k), you'd need a new battery at a cost of $16,000, so you'd still come out ahead. Now, hot/cold temps and hills will affect the numbers on the Tesla significantly, so factor that in. All in all, maybe run the numbers on something like a Prius, that takes gas, but still gets amazing mileage. Can we get a source on that? I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. So, that's a no on the sourcing your claims? |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:32:44 PM EST
[#34]
We had an electrician wire a NEMA 14-50 outlet in our garage. It was quick and not terribly expensive. The car is always fully charged by morning. I should add, I do not charge above 85% unless I am going on a road trip and need the extra range.
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:33:49 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, that's a no on the sourcing your claims? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Teslas are around 3kWH/mile, so you're talking ~50kWH of electricity ($5-15) vs. 10 gallons of gas ($35-$40). That's probably $7200/year savings. You'd be running the battery down around 75%, so you'd get probably somewhere around 600-900 trips before needing a new battery, so let's call it 4 years. After 4 years of saving ($29k), you'd need a new battery at a cost of $16,000, so you'd still come out ahead. Now, hot/cold temps and hills will affect the numbers on the Tesla significantly, so factor that in. All in all, maybe run the numbers on something like a Prius, that takes gas, but still gets amazing mileage. Can we get a source on that? I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. So, that's a no on the sourcing your claims? 
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:38:12 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You'd have to replace the battery after 8 years in a modern EV about as often as you'd have to replace the transmission or engine in any other car after 8 years. Only time I have ever replaced a transmission. My 2003 Tahoe with 304k miles is still on the original engine and transmission. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 5:42:27 PM EST
[#37]
just plug in to your neighbors house and get a free charge
bonus points for plugging into the street light |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 8:42:57 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, that's a no on the sourcing your claims? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Teslas are around 3kWH/mile, so you're talking ~50kWH of electricity ($5-15) vs. 10 gallons of gas ($35-$40). That's probably $7200/year savings. You'd be running the battery down around 75%, so you'd get probably somewhere around 600-900 trips before needing a new battery, so let's call it 4 years. After 4 years of saving ($29k), you'd need a new battery at a cost of $16,000, so you'd still come out ahead. Now, hot/cold temps and hills will affect the numbers on the Tesla significantly, so factor that in. All in all, maybe run the numbers on something like a Prius, that takes gas, but still gets amazing mileage. Can we get a source on that? I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. So, that's a no on the sourcing your claims? Yeah, it's a no. Because I'm tired of idiots believing overhyped marketing on cheap chinese lithium batteries claiming they can go 5,000 charge cycles. And I'm tired of idiots who think that if a battery is still functioning, it's still counting towards charge cycles. And I'm tired of idiots who just lazily say "Source?" when someone says something that they disagree with. This isn't a scholarly paper, I'm not going to take the time to record every source I've looked at in the post, or keep a list of them in case someone asks for them. Yes, I'm calling you lazy. If you disagree with something, make a claim. Don't just sit there going "cAn wE GEt a SoURCe oN THaT?" Quit being lazy or STFU. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 8:47:17 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah, it's a no. Because I'm tired of idiots believing overhyped marketing on cheap chinese lithium batteries claiming they can go 5,000 charge cycles. And I'm tired of idiots who think that if a battery is still functioning, it's still counting towards charge cycles. And I'm tired of idiots who just lazily say "Source?" when someone says something that they disagree with. This isn't a scholarly paper, I'm not going to take the time to record every source I've looked at in the post, or keep a list of them in case someone asks for a source. Yes, I'm calling you lazy. If you disagree with something, make a claim. Don't just sit there going "cAn wE GEt a SoURCe oN THaT?" Quit being lazy or STFU. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Teslas are around 3kWH/mile, so you're talking ~50kWH of electricity ($5-15) vs. 10 gallons of gas ($35-$40). That's probably $7200/year savings. You'd be running the battery down around 75%, so you'd get probably somewhere around 600-900 trips before needing a new battery, so let's call it 4 years. After 4 years of saving ($29k), you'd need a new battery at a cost of $16,000, so you'd still come out ahead. Now, hot/cold temps and hills will affect the numbers on the Tesla significantly, so factor that in. All in all, maybe run the numbers on something like a Prius, that takes gas, but still gets amazing mileage. Can we get a source on that? I had some numbers up when I typed that showing tests with a certain % discharge, and extrapolated. If you're not at the extremes, cycles vs. charge/discharge depth is somewhat linear. But even without numbers, that figure should be evident. If you're testing to industry standards (not YouTube idiot "bUT tHe BAttEry SteEL WuRKS" methodology), then really, lithium ion is only good for around 500 full charge/discharge cycles. Going 70% would extend that out some, maybe 900 or so. Keep in mind that in OP's case, he wouldn't need the battery to FAIL. Since he would need to use about 75% of nominal capacity for each day, he would need to replace it when it lost even 15-20% of nominal capacity. So, that's a no on the sourcing your claims? Yeah, it's a no. Because I'm tired of idiots believing overhyped marketing on cheap chinese lithium batteries claiming they can go 5,000 charge cycles. And I'm tired of idiots who think that if a battery is still functioning, it's still counting towards charge cycles. And I'm tired of idiots who just lazily say "Source?" when someone says something that they disagree with. This isn't a scholarly paper, I'm not going to take the time to record every source I've looked at in the post, or keep a list of them in case someone asks for a source. Yes, I'm calling you lazy. If you disagree with something, make a claim. Don't just sit there going "cAn wE GEt a SoURCe oN THaT?" Quit being lazy or STFU. Cool story, bro. 
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:02:35 PM EST
[#40]
Trade it in on a Ford Maverick for 25K and 42 MPG for the win...
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:10:55 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A hybrid makes sense for a lot of applications. EV's make sense for very few applications. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:20:16 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I just did the math. I'm currently spending about $240 per week in gasoline. The cost in electricity would be about $22 per week. Looks like it would save me about $218 per week in fuel. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:28:52 PM EST
[#43]
I've put over 13k miles on my tesla since june...I pay 0.13 cents per kw and have solar panels so it has cost around 400 bucks to go that far. My car gets about 35mpg and I would have spent $1300 based on average cost of fuel. So for a 15mpg vehicle about double that fuel cost.
Cost of vehicle though will take some time to recoup vs cost of a fuel efficient gas vehicle |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:35:56 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Compare the time it takes to charge your EV over the course of a month, to the time it takes to fill up your car with gas. Then take that charging time and add that to sitting in traffic. What happens when you have to run the heat while sitting in a traffic jam when the ambient is below freezing? Will surely tank your range. He drives car 150 miles a day. He comes home, plugs it and walks away. That's it. With the F150 every other day, he has to stop at a gas station and fill up. The guy in a Tesla just drives home while the F150 guy has to dick around at a gas station. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:40:44 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do jot give a fuck. Not going to give up my 5.7 tundra. I make it a point to floor it past any Prius to make up for their faggotry.How does an eleven-year-old afford a Tundra? 
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:44:54 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good luck charging your ev when the power grid is severely compromised by FJB and the lunatic left. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:47:11 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even at a supercharger, it costs me less than $20 to charge my long range 3 from less than 5% to 80% (and about 25 minutes). But I so rarely charge outside of home Of course, some idiot in a Tundra keeps trying to blow past me for some reason, and going from 0-60 in 4.2 seconds to keep away from him does drain my battery some.  Attached File |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:47:38 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Strange , the last four vehicle I have owned all have gone just under 200,000 miles, one made it 214,000 and over 8 years old and never a transmission issues. Show me a phone , power tool , car or truck ( normal ) that the batteries last longer than around 6 years ~  An $899 produced-in-the-millions cell phone or a $299 DeWalt multi-tool is not a good analogy to a $75,000 electric car, with its amazing engineering, constantly-updating software, endless support organization, and daily use. Perhaps you don't think the engineers have actually thought this out? Because engineers don't think through problems? 
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:48:13 PM EST
[#49]
Quoted: I drive about 150 miles per day for work. Currently I have an F150 that gets about 15mpg. My question is, if I purchase a Tesla to drive, how much will it cost me in electricity to drive about 150 miles per day? Also, there are no oil changes so that saves money, but are there any other hidden fee's I'm unaware of? I'm trying to decide if it's worth is financially to make the jump to electric. I don't mean to be a dick but this is a silly question. Unless you're single living in a downtown condo or something, it's retarded to buy an EV unless you can afford at least one more conventional vehicle. Even more so if it's one of the more expensive EV's. This is because having an EV is not 1:1 to owning a conventional vehicle (ICE or hybrid). You WILL find yourself without power, or without enough range, or unable to make trips on demand like you could otherwise for various reasons. Every family I know with a Tesla is a constant chinese fire drill of swapping vehicles because of range and charge issues, even if they enjoy the Tesla - they all use them as a luxury good/toy and the EV is wholly incapable of handling normal errands and daily drive uses 100% by itself. If you are keeping the F-150, forget about it; it doesn't pay at all. Now, if this vehicle is primarily for business purposes and you otherwise would have no vehicle at all, that's different. And even then a hybrid is probably the way to go for reasons of opportunity costs - again, you're shelling out a bunch of money; it makes little sense for almost any application to sink that much money and not be able to drive any damn place you please whenever you want to. And good luck if you're in the part of TX that gets cold in the winter or need to go some place cold. |
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Posted: 11/9/2021 9:49:31 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I just did the math. I'm currently spending about $240 per week in gasoline. The cost in electricity would be about $22 per week. Looks like it would save me about $218 per week in fuel. That's $900 per month! You could probably buy the most expensive Tesla and not pay that much! |
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