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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:31:53 PM EDT
Could a round from a Tiger with a clear shot take out an Abrams tank? Assume perfect shot.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:35:23 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted: Could a round from a Tiger with a clear shot take out an Abrams tank? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/259519/09E5D967-F9EC-4769-9A05-3210CD2AACC2_jpe-1900280.JPG Hit it in the rear, sure. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:37:13 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hit it in the rear, sure. Of course it would need the Abrams to stop moving first... 
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:40:58 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: Could a round from a Tiger with a clear shot take out an Abrams tank? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/259519/09E5D967-F9EC-4769-9A05-3210CD2AACC2_jpe-1900280.JPG That’s the King (Royal) Tiger. This has been discussed before and I believe it could. Not frontally of course. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:41:54 PM EDT
[#4]
It would have to be a hell of a good shot in the right place at the right range. Having said that, they very well could.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:42:42 PM EDT
[#5]
With a golden bullet, sure. The real question is how many Tigers the Abrams kills before one manages to get in a position to fire said golden bullet.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:43:00 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That’s the King (Royal) Tiger Yep. Totally different gun and round. Last 2 for comparison 
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:43:36 PM EDT
[#7]
M1A1 took a direct hit from 155mm, US in cold war era testing. Don't remember what type of round or where it hit, or mobility after the hit or fighting capability after the hit, but they said crew would have survived. Video showed the whole tank sort of lifted like it turned on a hovercraft mode and then settled down.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:43:54 PM EDT
[#8]
You could sent a battalion of tigers and the M1 kills them all before they fire a shot
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:44:00 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That’s the King (Royal) Tiger. This has been discussed before and I believe it could. Not frontally of course. True, and a valid point out, since the King Tiger had a bigger cartridge. Still an 88mm, but it was like a Magnum version, quite a bit more oomph and velocity, if I recall my |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:46:39 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: True, and a valid point out, since the King Tiger had a bigger cartridge. Still an 88mm, but it was like a Magnum version, quite a bit more oomph and velocity, if I recall my Yup..  Attached File |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:47:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You could sent a battalion of tigers and the M1 kills them all before they fire a shot Yep I get that. I’m talking a one-off perfect money shot, maybe from a hidden position. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:47:31 PM EDT
[#12]
We pool all our money together and I bet we could find out!
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:47:55 PM EDT
[#13]
With an 88mm gun?
My guess is yes, but only with a rear shot. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:49:41 PM EDT
[#14]
Fortunately the internet has answered this already.
 100 KING TIGERS vs 10 ABRAMS - WW2 TANK vs MODERN TANK - Call to Arms - Scenario #2 |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:52:06 PM EDT
[#15]
With a KT, it would be possible to get a mobility kill on an Abrams. Not sure if you'd live long enough to take the shot, though.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 8:59:04 PM EDT
[#16]
The Abrams would start shit canning cats before they could even get in the fight.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:00:41 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You could sent a battalion of tigers and the M1 kills them all before they fire a shot Basically, yes. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:02:44 PM EDT
[#18]
Wittmann and his crew in a Konigstiger vs. a Saudi crew in an M1A2S. Go!
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:04:20 PM EDT
[#19]
I think some of y'all are missing the point. OP isn't asking if a King Tiger could kill an Abrams in normal combat. He's asking if the 88mm gun is capable of knocking an Abrams out.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:05:24 PM EDT
[#20]
No because an Apache would take it out before they loaded the main gun.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:12:08 PM EDT
[#21]
What could the long 88 penetrate if it had a modern apfsds projectile?
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:12:53 PM EDT
[#22]
no because of the sticky bomb thrown on the Tiger's tread
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:14:57 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Fortunately the internet has answered this already.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOL00YjWbHINow this is an interesting scenario. 10 Abrams vs. 100 King Tigers. Tigers will eventually swarm and kill them at a 10 to 1 ratio. Rational follows..... 1. The ability to use 120mm to maximum range possible terrain wise is not very likely or rarely ever seen. 2. Fire and maneuver. The Tigers will not be doing a simple frontal attack but rather using terrain to close distance while being overwatched. This attack will not be a turn based scenario. 3. Taking an individual tank out of the game does not have to be a catastrophic kill. It can be firepower (optics or gun), mobility, manpower, or communications as well. 4. A single vehicle taken out of fight by any one of the above methods exponentially increases number of threats they have to deal with rather quickly as well. 5. This is a simple tank on tank scenario. Throw in combined arms approach and things get dicey quick. ETA: Quantity has a quality all its own |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:19:54 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now this is an interesting scenario. 10 Abrams vs. 100 King Tigers. Tigers will eventually swarm and kill them at a 10 to 1 ratio. Rational follows..... 1. The ability to use 120mm to maximum range possible terrain wise is not very likely or rarely ever seen. 2. Fire and maneuver. The Tigers will not be doing a simple frontal attack but rather using terrain to close distance while being overwatched. This attack will not be a turn based scenario. 3. Taking an individual tank out of the game does not have to be a catastrophic kill. It can be firepower (optics or gun), mobility, manpower, or communications as well. 4. A single vehicle taken out of fight by any one of the above methods exponentially increases number of threats they have to deal with rather quickly as well. 5. This is a simple tank on tank scenario. Throw in combined arms approach and things get dicey quick. 
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:20:05 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think some of y'all are missing the point. OP isn't asking if a King Tiger could kill an Abrams in normal combat. He's asking if the 88mm gun is capable of knocking an Abrams out. Which leads me to wonder what could've become of the 88, if it was updated to more modern projectiles like APFSDS. ETA: Aaand beat by 8 minutes. 
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:21:11 PM EDT
[#26]
Is the Tiger shooting up into the Abram's belly or down onto the top of the Abrams?
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:22:48 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: no because of the sticky bomb thrown on the Tiger's tread It’s in the manual! |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:28:44 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now this is an interesting scenario. 10 Abrams vs. 100 King Tigers. Tigers will eventually swarm and kill them at a 10 to 1 ratio. Rational follows..... 1. The ability to use 120mm to maximum range possible terrain wise is not very likely or rarely ever seen. 2. Fire and maneuver. The Tigers will not be doing a simple frontal attack but rather using terrain to close distance while being overwatched. This attack will not be a turn based scenario. 3. Taking an individual tank out of the game does not have to be a catastrophic kill. It can be firepower (optics or gun), mobility, manpower, or communications as well. 4. A single vehicle taken out of fight by any one of the above methods exponentially increases number of threats they have to deal with rather quickly as well. 5. This is a simple tank on tank scenario. Throw in combined arms approach and things get dicey quick. ETA: Quantity has a quality all its own Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Fortunately the internet has answered this already. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOL00YjWbHINow this is an interesting scenario. 10 Abrams vs. 100 King Tigers. Tigers will eventually swarm and kill them at a 10 to 1 ratio. Rational follows..... 1. The ability to use 120mm to maximum range possible terrain wise is not very likely or rarely ever seen. 2. Fire and maneuver. The Tigers will not be doing a simple frontal attack but rather using terrain to close distance while being overwatched. This attack will not be a turn based scenario. 3. Taking an individual tank out of the game does not have to be a catastrophic kill. It can be firepower (optics or gun), mobility, manpower, or communications as well. 4. A single vehicle taken out of fight by any one of the above methods exponentially increases number of threats they have to deal with rather quickly as well. 5. This is a simple tank on tank scenario. Throw in combined arms approach and things get dicey quick. ETA: Quantity has a quality all its own  Attached File |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:29:53 PM EDT
[#29]
The L71 88 was not slouch gun. I’m sure it have no problem in the rear.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:30:43 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It’s in the manual! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: no because of the sticky bomb thrown on the Tiger's tread It’s in the manual! Well we don’t have a field manual right now.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:33:04 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is the Tiger shooting up into the Abram's belly or down onto the top of the Abrams? It also all depends on if Ditka is driving. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:33:23 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think some of y'all are missing the point. OP isn't asking if a King Tiger could kill an Abrams in normal combat. He's asking if the 88mm gun is capable of knocking an Abrams out. GD doesn’t read. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:34:38 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: True, and a valid point out, since the King Tiger had a bigger cartridge. Still an 88mm, but it was like a Magnum version, quite a bit more oomph and velocity, if I recall my An 88 magnum? Does it shoot through schools? |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:37:16 PM EDT
[#34]
A Tiger Tanks 88mm loaded with AP at almost point blank range would NOT penetrate an Abrams tank. At 100m loaded with AP could penetrate about 132 mm of hardened armor at an angle of 30°.
Newer M1A2 Abrams armor is equivalent to 950mm hardened armor. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:37:32 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: GD doesn’t read. Ain't nobody got time for that. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:39:09 PM EDT
[#36]
I love how this battle always happens on a giant pool table instead of in a city or forests. One of the times we did this over the years I pointed out that an 88 would have zero problem sailing right through the top of an Abrams and some guy that forgot there are things called “hills” wondered how the Tiger was going to fly.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:40:32 PM EDT
[#37]
lol no
the 88's tungsten superkraut round wouldn't come close gg wehraboos |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:40:55 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I love how this battle always happens on a giant pool table instead of in a city or forests. One of the times we did this over the years I pointed out that an 88 would have zero problem sailing right through the top of an Abrams and some guy that forgot there are things called “hills” wondered how the Tiger was going to fly.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:41:13 PM EDT
[#39]
Could it? Sure...will it get close enough to do so? No. Commo and sensors will result in Tiger kill before Tiger even knows it's dead.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:45:30 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: GD doesn’t read. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I think some of y'all are missing the point. OP isn't asking if a King Tiger could kill an Abrams in normal combat. He's asking if the 88mm gun is capable of knocking an Abrams out. GD doesn’t read. Pretty much. It could get an engine kill in the rear or a mobility kill on tracks but that’s about it. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:45:36 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Could it? Sure...will it get close enough to do so? No. Commo and sensors will result in Tiger kill before Tiger even knows it's dead. Is the crew even awake? No commo or sensors on Abrams I know of can address that scenario. ETA: To clarify, there has to be someone actively monitoring these sensors. There is no passive sensor at this time. Trophy perhaps. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:48:24 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A Tiger Tanks 88mm loaded with AP at almost point blank range would NOT penetrate an Abrams tank. At 100m loaded with AP could penetrate about 240 mm of hardened armor at an angle of 30°. Newer M1A2 Abrams armor is equivalent to 950mm hardened armor. APCR* But this. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:48:34 PM EDT
[#43]
Can a M24 Chaffee's LP 75mm take out a King Tiger? That's the disparity we're talking about here.
Answer: Yes, but it require Lottery-type luck to pull off. I damn sure wouldn't want to be in a KT against an M1. Totally outclassed in every way. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:49:44 PM EDT
[#44]
Tankers are a small step up from sailors.
But with that said, if the Abrams sat there and did nothing, it could be disabled. Given enough rounds the Tiger could eventually kill it. Just let Abrams move, nope, total luck shot to just disable it. Let Abrams maneuver and shoot, lots of dead Kraurts. |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:51:16 PM EDT
[#45]
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Posted: 4/10/2021 9:59:18 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now this is an interesting scenario. 10 Abrams vs. 100 King Tigers. Tigers will eventually swarm and kill them at a 10 to 1 ratio. Rational follows..... 1. The ability to use 120mm to maximum range possible terrain wise is not very likely or rarely ever seen. 2. Fire and maneuver. The Tigers will not be doing a simple frontal attack but rather using terrain to close distance while being overwatched. This attack will not be a turn based scenario. 3. Taking an individual tank out of the game does not have to be a catastrophic kill. It can be firepower (optics or gun), mobility, manpower, or communications as well. 4. A single vehicle taken out of fight by any one of the above methods exponentially increases number of threats they have to deal with rather quickly as well. 5. This is a simple tank on tank scenario. Throw in combined arms approach and things get dicey quick. ETA: Quantity has a quality all its own Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Fortunately the internet has answered this already. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOL00YjWbHINow this is an interesting scenario. 10 Abrams vs. 100 King Tigers. Tigers will eventually swarm and kill them at a 10 to 1 ratio. Rational follows..... 1. The ability to use 120mm to maximum range possible terrain wise is not very likely or rarely ever seen. 2. Fire and maneuver. The Tigers will not be doing a simple frontal attack but rather using terrain to close distance while being overwatched. This attack will not be a turn based scenario. 3. Taking an individual tank out of the game does not have to be a catastrophic kill. It can be firepower (optics or gun), mobility, manpower, or communications as well. 4. A single vehicle taken out of fight by any one of the above methods exponentially increases number of threats they have to deal with rather quickly as well. 5. This is a simple tank on tank scenario. Throw in combined arms approach and things get dicey quick. ETA: Quantity has a quality all its own If the tigers are moving, slowly, the Abraham’s are moving quickly. With gun stabilization and tts that sees through the smoke etc. Tigers are fucked Read about 73 Easting |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 10:00:11 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wittmann and his crew in a Konigstiger vs. a Saudi crew in an M1A2S. Go! Wittmann and his crew would then have to figure out how to operate an abandoned M1A2S. In German....."What's all this shit do????" |
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Posted: 4/10/2021 10:00:14 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A Tiger Tanks 88mm loaded with AP at almost point blank range would NOT penetrate an Abrams tank. At 100m loaded with AP could penetrate about 240 mm of hardened armor at an angle of 30°. Newer M1A2 Abrams armor is equivalent to 950mm hardened armor. 
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Posted: 4/10/2021 10:03:08 PM EDT
[#49]
Take all the ammo out of the Tiger I or Tiger II and make an IED. Then park the Tiger near the IED. When the Abrams crew dismounts to look at the cool old tank you blow the IED.
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Posted: 4/10/2021 10:06:27 PM EDT
[#50]
Maybe knock the track off, but it’s going to explode in a few seconds
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