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Posted: 11/25/2021 5:26:26 AM EST
[#1]
“I told y’all!”
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Posted: 11/25/2021 5:27:35 AM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What was that filmed with? Or is this the version the prosecution sent to the defense? 
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:16:28 AM EST
[#3]
MSM says no black man no care.
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:27:54 AM EST
[#4]
Shooter doesn’t even get charged in this one.
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:28:29 AM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nope, when a trespasser REFUSES to leave, sometimes, they need a bit more convincing. Not your residence? Asked to leave, you fucking leave. PERIOD. By not leaving, you are the aggressor. Not sure why this is even an issue. Common sense does not seem to be a trait of dead guy.  If the trespasser was trying to leave with a weedeater from your toolshed after dark, sure. As it is, we'll see I suppose. Having no responsibilty to retreat on your own property(and that's a big assumption that it was) and returning with a long gun during a civil dispute muddies the waters quite a bit. You can"t shoot trespassers unless they're engaged in other criminal activity against you or your property(or maybe you can depending on how this plays out). |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:32:59 AM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If the trespasser was trying to leave with a weedeater from your toolshed after dark, sure. As it is, we'll see I suppose. Having no responsibilty to retreat on your own property(and that's a big assumption that it was) and returning with a long gun during a civil dispute muddies the waters quite a bit. You can"t shoot trespassers unless they're engaged in other criminal activity against you or your property(or maybe you can depending on how this plays out). Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Nope, when a trespasser REFUSES to leave, sometimes, they need a bit more convincing. Not your residence? Asked to leave, you fucking leave. PERIOD. By not leaving, you are the aggressor. Not sure why this is even an issue. Common sense does not seem to be a trait of dead guy. If the trespasser was trying to leave with a weedeater from your toolshed after dark, sure. As it is, we'll see I suppose. Having no responsibilty to retreat on your own property(and that's a big assumption that it was) and returning with a long gun during a civil dispute muddies the waters quite a bit. You can"t shoot trespassers unless they're engaged in other criminal activity against you or your property(or maybe you can depending on how this plays out). Like threatening to take the property owners gun and use it against him, and then trying to follow thru with the threat? |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:37:20 AM EST
[#7]
De-escalating and avoiding someone getting killed is the prudent course of action in a civil dispute like this with known parties. Even if you're 100% right and justified in your position it would be smart to walk off, let things cool down, and sort it out later. No sense in shooting someone, or getting shot, when you can avoid it easily.
The dude coming out with the PCC in that context was a fucking moron. The father getting in his face and turning it physical was equally stupid and he got himself killed. Even if you're right and the other person is wrong, attacking an armed dude isn't likely going to turn out well. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:41:21 AM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: De-escalating and avoiding someone getting killed is the prudent course of action in a civil dispute like this with known parties. Even if you're 100% right and justified in your position it would be smart to walk off, let things cool down, and sort it out later. No sense in shooting someone, or getting shot, when you can avoid it easily. The dude coming out with the PCC in that context was a fucking moron. The father getting in his face and turning it physical was equally stupid and he got himself killed. Even if you're right and the other person is wrong, attacking an armed dude isn't likely going to turn out well. I agree with this. Need more info but dead guy in the wrong. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:44:45 AM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Like threatening to take the property owners gun and use it against him, and then trying to follow thru with the threat? When, at what point, and by whom, did the property owners gun come into play? And who the property owner actually is still seems to be in flux. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:46:57 AM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I agree with this. Need more info but dead guy in the wrong. Well...dead guy is in the wrong by default, he's fuckin dead, Jim 
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:54:12 AM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When, at what point, and by whom, did the property owners gun come into play? And who the property owner actually is still seems to be in flux. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Like threatening to take the property owners gun and use it against him, and then trying to follow thru with the threat? When, at what point, and by whom, did the property owners gun come into play? And who the property owner actually is still seems to be in flux. The shooter had free access to the residence. Whether or not he was the actual owner it certainly seems reasonable to assume he’s a resident and he was well within his rights to obtain a firearm to defend himself and the property to demand the gentleman immediately leave the property. This was a “good” shoot, only in the sense it is justifiable homicide. But this is a classic case of when assholes collide, and unfortunately it had a very sad ending that could have been prevented. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:54:54 AM EST
[#12]
You pull a gun like that and you better be ready to pull the trigger, this guy thought just showing the gun would scare the guy and then in a spilt second, he thought he had the right to shoot him and did.
Probably play that one over and over sitting in prison for the next 20 years. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 6:55:58 AM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You pull a gun like that and you better be ready to pull the trigger, this guy thought just showing the gun would scare the guy and then in a spilt second, he thought he had the right to shoot him and did. Probably play that one over and over sitting in prison for the next 20 years. lol, he’s not going to prison |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:06:15 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They're all calm as shit for a guy just being murdered. "I have it on video, you did it, not him." Yeah that's great but you don't care the guy you're with is now drt? Came here to post this. Definitely a bad shoot. Been there with my daughter's mom always playing games with visitations. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:07:53 AM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If the trespasser was trying to leave with a weedeater from your toolshed after dark, sure. As it is, we'll see I suppose. Having no responsibilty to retreat on your own property(and that's a big assumption that it was) and returning with a long gun during a civil dispute muddies the waters quite a bit. You can"t shoot trespassers unless they're engaged in other criminal activity against you or your property(or maybe you can depending on how this plays out). Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Nope, when a trespasser REFUSES to leave, sometimes, they need a bit more convincing. Not your residence? Asked to leave, you fucking leave. PERIOD. By not leaving, you are the aggressor. Not sure why this is even an issue. Common sense does not seem to be a trait of dead guy. If the trespasser was trying to leave with a weedeater from your toolshed after dark, sure. As it is, we'll see I suppose. Having no responsibilty to retreat on your own property(and that's a big assumption that it was) and returning with a long gun during a civil dispute muddies the waters quite a bit. You can"t shoot trespassers unless they're engaged in other criminal activity against you or your property(or maybe you can depending on how this plays out). And here is the problem. we have emboldened criminals. We see it almost everywhere. If idiots knew they could get deaded for doing shit they should not be doing, we would not be in the social problems we are in now. I am all for shooting trespassers that do not want to leave, as I am car jackers, petty thieves and violent attackers, pedophiles, and the likes. Dont want to end up dead, do do shit that will get you that way. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:13:23 AM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And here is the problem. we have emboldened criminals. We see it almost everywhere. If idiots knew they could get deaded for doing shit they should not be doing, we would not be in the social problems we are in now. I am all for shooting trespassers that do not want to leave, as I am car jackers, petty thieves and violent attackers, pedophiles, and the likes. Dont want to end up dead, do do shit that will get you that way. You just equated trespassers to pedophiles. That's fucking retarded, and that's on you to defend. Wow. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:15:08 AM EST
[#17]
I’m genuinely curious how many folks think Kyle Rittenhouse was not guilty, and think this guy is guilty
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:18:36 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You just equated trespassers to pedophiles. That's fucking retarded, and that's on you to defend. Wow. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: And here is the problem. we have emboldened criminals. We see it almost everywhere. If idiots knew they could get deaded for doing shit they should not be doing, we would not be in the social problems we are in now. I am all for shooting trespassers that do not want to leave, as I am car jackers, petty thieves and violent attackers, pedophiles, and the likes. Dont want to end up dead, do do shit that will get you that way. You just equated trespassers to pedophiles. That's fucking retarded, and that's on you to defend. Wow. Did I? Well, I cant tell you what to think, so thats on you. ZFG. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:18:51 AM EST
[#19]
When divorced dad didn't leave when asked thats paints him as the aggressor.
When divorced dad manhandles firearm carrying new daddy of his kids in a aggressive manner he gives the new dad an out for shooting old dad. Now there is just one dad.  Powers that be will see 90% dead dad instigating his own demise. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:20:44 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You just equated trespassers to pedophiles. That's fucking retarded, and that's on you to defend. Wow. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: And here is the problem. we have emboldened criminals. We see it almost everywhere. If idiots knew they could get deaded for doing shit they should not be doing, we would not be in the social problems we are in now. I am all for shooting trespassers that do not want to leave, as I am car jackers, petty thieves and violent attackers, pedophiles, and the likes. Dont want to end up dead, do do shit that will get you that way. You just equated trespassers to pedophiles. That's fucking retarded, and that's on you to defend. Wow. That is what you took from that comment? 
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:23:54 AM EST
[#21]
Bad shoot
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:27:09 AM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is what you took from that comment? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: And here is the problem. we have emboldened criminals. We see it almost everywhere. If idiots knew they could get deaded for doing shit they should not be doing, we would not be in the social problems we are in now. I am all for shooting trespassers that do not want to leave, as I am car jackers, petty thieves and violent attackers, pedophiles, and the likes. Dont want to end up dead, do do shit that will get you that way. You just equated trespassers to pedophiles. That's fucking retarded, and that's on you to defend. Wow. That is what you took from that comment? A lot like the mentality of libtards all over the USA. I dont get it either, but, WTF do I care. I chuckled at his comment. 
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:29:35 AM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bad shoot So you’re in the KR should have been found guilty camp? |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:34:40 AM EST
[#24]
A lot of retards in this thread .... sometimes you guys make me see the argument for gun control
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:36:11 AM EST
[#25]
Dad comes to get son.
Ex wife, NOT a judge thinks she is above the law and doesn’t have him ready for pick up. Man gets angry, another man shoots him in the face. Ex wife gets her way and no more dad issues. Great outcome for the kid. Fuck that woman. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:37:20 AM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you’re in the KR should have been found guilty camp? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Bad shoot So you’re in the KR should have been found guilty camp? It looks like a bad shoot to me too. This guy was safe in his house. He came outside to escalate. If Kyle did that he would be in prison. The dad had a legal right by the court to pick up his kid at 3:15. Mom must have played this game before because someone was recording. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:37:35 AM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dad comes to get son. Wife, a judge, thinks she is above the law and doesn’t have sim ready for pick up. Man gets angry, another man shoots him in the face. Judge gets her way and no more dad issues. Great outcome for the kid. Fuck that woman. lol, excellent Analysis of what didn’t happen |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:38:57 AM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you’re in the KR should have been found guilty camp? KR was being pursued by a mob that was trying to murder him. Both guys were being assholes but the shooter in this instance went into the house to retrieve a gun to threaten to kill someone. Then did. Did the dad have the right to be there to retrieve his kid? I'd guess he did and that's why everyone was recording. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:40:30 AM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It looks like a bad shoot to me too. This guy was safe in his house. He came outside to escalate. If Kyle did that he would be in prison. The dad had a legal right by the court to pick up his kid at 3:15. Mom must have played this game before because someone was recording. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Bad shoot So you’re in the KR should have been found guilty camp? It looks like a bad shoot to me too. This guy was safe in his house. He came outside to escalate. If Kyle did that he would be in prison. The dad had a legal right by the court to pick up his kid at 3:15. Mom must have played this game before because someone was recording. So if someone is on your property that you want to leave, you’re saying you shouldn’t be able to arm yourself? In Tejas this child custody shit goes on ALL the time…. Dead guy was obviously familiar as he knew he would have to take them to court and get a court order from a Judge. When shooter comes out with the gun and demands he leaves, at what point does advancing on him, chest bumping and threatening to take the gun and use it on him and then attempting to do so seem like a good idea? |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:40:39 AM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: lol, excellent Analysis of what didn’t happen It seems pretty accurate. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:43:47 AM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: KR was being pursued by a mob that was trying to murder him. Both guys were being assholes but the shooter in this instance went into the house to retrieve a gun to threaten to kill someone. Then did. Did the dad have the right to be there to retrieve his kid? I'd guess he did and that's why everyone was recording. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So you’re in the KR should have been found guilty camp? KR was being pursued by a mob that was trying to murder him. Both guys were being assholes but the shooter in this instance went into the house to retrieve a gun to threaten to kill someone. Then did. Did the dad have the right to be there to retrieve his kid? I'd guess he did and that's why everyone was recording. Did the dad not advance on the guy? Did the dad not threaten to take his gun and use it on him? Did dad not make an attempt to do so? The only difference in KR and this situation is this guy was defending “his property” and his life after an attempt was made to disarm him. A threat was already made that he would take the gun from him and use it on him. What reasonable person wouldn’t think after someone followed thru trying to disarm you, still advancing on you didn’t intent to do serious bodily harm or kill you. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:48:33 AM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: People using words and terms they don't understand. What you "think" and what is illegal in your neck of the woods may not be applicable here. Section 9.41 of the Texas Penal Code Texas Penal Code Sec. 20.03 Kidnapping I'd like to have more info, but I'm inclined to believe he will easily walk. Why do you believe that is not kidnapping? |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:52:08 AM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why do you believe that is not kidnapping? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: People using words and terms they don't understand. What you "think" and what is illegal in your neck of the woods may not be applicable here. Section 9.41 of the Texas Penal Code Texas Penal Code Sec. 20.03 Kidnapping I'd like to have more info, but I'm inclined to believe he will easily walk. Why do you believe that is not kidnapping? Because a parent refusing to turn over a child to “baby daddy/mommy” is a civil issue and not kidnapping……. Read the statue |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:52:46 AM EST
[#34]
White trash gone wild
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:52:53 AM EST
[#35]
What in the trailer trash did I just watch.
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Posted: 11/25/2021 7:55:51 AM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bad shoot. Good Shot |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:00:19 AM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Guy hasn't been charged yet. If was going to be charged wouldn't he have been arrested already? Fucked up situation. When assholes collide Not necessarily on being arrested. The local DA had to hand it off because shooters now ex-wife is a recently appointed judge. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:03:41 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because a parent refusing to turn over a child to “baby daddy/mommy” is a civil issue and not kidnapping……. Read the statue Amber alerts say otherwise |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:04:34 AM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did the dad not advance on the guy? Did the dad not threaten to take his gun and use it on him? Did dad not make an attempt to do so? The only difference in KR and this situation is this guy was defending “his property” and his life after an attempt was made to disarm him. A threat was already made that he would take the gun from him and use it on him. What reasonable person wouldn’t think after someone followed thru trying to disarm you, still advancing on you didn’t intent to do serious bodily harm or kill you. The shooter was completely safe in the house when he decided to escalate. I'm gonna go with manslaughter here. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:06:09 AM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dad comes to get son. Wife, a judge, thinks she is above the law and doesn’t have sim ready for pick up. Man gets angry, another man shoots him in the face. Judge gets her way and no more dad issues. Great outcome for the kid. Fuck that woman. This wife causing the shit show on visitation is NOT the judge. Shooter's ex-wife is the judge. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:07:34 AM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Amber alerts say otherwise Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Because a parent refusing to turn over a child to “baby daddy/mommy” is a civil issue and not kidnapping……. Read the statue Amber alerts say otherwise lol, it’s not kidnapping |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:08:04 AM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The shooter was completely safe in the house when he decided to escalate. I'm gonna go with manslaughter here. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Did the dad not advance on the guy? Did the dad not threaten to take his gun and use it on him? Did dad not make an attempt to do so? The only difference in KR and this situation is this guy was defending “his property” and his life after an attempt was made to disarm him. A threat was already made that he would take the gun from him and use it on him. What reasonable person wouldn’t think after someone followed thru trying to disarm you, still advancing on you didn’t intent to do serious bodily harm or kill you. The shooter was completely safe in the house when he decided to escalate. I'm gonna go with manslaughter here. So KR should have been found guilty then? Cause after all, he could have just stayed home and not escalate a riot by bringing a gun. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:11:21 AM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When, at what point, and by whom, did the property owners gun come into play? And who the property owner actually is still seems to be in flux. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Like threatening to take the property owners gun and use it against him, and then trying to follow thru with the threat? When, at what point, and by whom, did the property owners gun come into play? And who the property owner actually is still seems to be in flux. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:11:28 AM EST
[#44]
When green shirt stepped up and touched Rifleman it was assault.
Bigger and on his property, Rifleman feared for his life and protected himself. Jail? Not even a stretch to claim self defense. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:15:16 AM EST
[#45]
I don't think trsspasser man had to die.
I don't think pcc man is a good person. I don't think pcc man is guilty of murder in 1st. I think voluntary maslaughter is still a hard sell given the facts. The facts: * The tresspasser man was asked to leave the property * The tresspasser man advances on pcc man * The tresspasser man lays hands on pcc when not pointed at him * The tresspasser man continues to be agressive even after an ill advised warning shot from pcc man Better move for pcc man would have been to retrieve gun, reiterated request for tresspasser man to leave then shut the f*sk up while waiting for leo to arive. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:16:36 AM EST
[#46]
Three major takeaways
1 The song in the background.- the words that played right before the gun play She needs wide open spaces Room to make her big mistakes She needs new faces She knows the highest stakes. The 2A guy listening to Dixie Chicks? What a song to die by. That was his ultimate punishment. 2 Dead guy’s fashion sense- Am I the only one that cringes when I see tennis shoes with blue jeans? 3. The girl in the center of all this mess really knows how to pick dudes. That is all. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:17:49 AM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I’m genuinely curious how many folks think Kyle Rittenhouse was not guilty, and think this guy is guilty Kyle retreated and then continued to attempt to disengage. This guy was able to disengage but just came back armed. Looks to me that he became the aggressor. Should have pulled the lady in and called the cops. Shot the guy if he tries to come in. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:18:34 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This wife causing the shit show on visitation is NOT the judge. Shooter's ex-wife is the judge. Thank you for clarification. Woman still the problem here. She knew it was time for the son to leave and she opted to not have him ready. She wanted this outcome. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:21:20 AM EST
[#49]
Don't care to call this one. I believe that under AZ law, it would come down to the "warning shot". The shooter was justified in threatening with deadly force to remove the other guy from the property (assuming he's a resident of the home), but was not justified to shoot at that time because there was no threat.
I'd give it about a 50-50 chance that the first warning shot/ND would be considered assault with a deadly weapon, and provocation. If we assume this, then the dead guy was defending himself when the shooting occured. If not, then the dead guy was the agressor and the shooting was justified. All depends on how that first shot is interpreted, and where that interpretation falls under the law in that jurisdiction. Edit: Watched it again, and am correcting myself. Dead guy did offer a threat before the warning shot. Still don't care to call it, but I don't think it was murder, maybe manslaughter. Both parties escalated. |
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Posted: 11/25/2021 8:25:06 AM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Kyle retreated and then continued to attempt to disengage. This guy was able to disengage but just came back armed. Looks to me that he became Should have pulled the lady in and called the cops. Shot the guy if he tries to come in. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I’m genuinely curious how many folks think Kyle Rittenhouse was not guilty, and think this guy is guilty Kyle retreated and then continued to attempt to disengage. This guy was able to disengage but just came back armed. Looks to me that he became Should have pulled the lady in and called the cops. Shot the guy if he tries to come in. So you’re obligated and required to retreat on home turf? Let me be perfectly clear, I agree 100% with underlined above and that’s what I would have done. I don’t ever want to have to take a human life, even assholes lives are precious But legally, this was justifiable homicide. |
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