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Link Posted: 7/20/2023 11:22:20 AM EDT
[#1]
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Quoted:



300zxtt suck fat wiener to work on but worse are Audi all roads or the s4 with the 2.7tt. Good lord I hate those stupid cars.
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Worst cars I've ever had to work on were a 300ZX twin turbo and a Celica All-Trac.  Horry Sheet.



300zxtt suck fat wiener to work on but worse are Audi all roads or the s4 with the 2.7tt. Good lord I hate those stupid cars.
Porsche 928 deserves an honorable mention.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 11:22:46 AM EDT
[#2]
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Quoted:


Just changed a headlight bulb passenger side Gen 2 Prius.  Oh, my lord ....
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Did you have to pull off the front fascia
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 11:24:17 AM EDT
[#3]
Interesting thing in very old cars is they were expensive and very technical for the time, common to have your own driver employed to keep up the car and maintain/service it
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 11:29:25 AM EDT
[#4]
I changed professions from mechanic to machinist to CNC programmer to computer IT.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 11:51:39 AM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
I remember back in the day.... When shopping for new vehicles, the man in the family would always ask the new car/truck salesman to look under the hood.  The prospective new car/truck buyer would look at how easy it was to access things for anticipated maintenance and repairs.
Things like:
1. How easy is it to change the oil and access the oil filter?
2. Changing drive belts, spark plugs, etc.
3. Changing a battery.  No way people back in the day would have bought the need for a special computerized tool to get your car to accept a new battery.
4. How easy will it be to access and remove major components?
5. How much un-necessary/undesired stuff did they add to the car? (for .gov mandates).
6. Jack and spare tire.

Nowadays, people buy vehicles without ever looking under the hood.
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I look under the hood.
And the I say to myself; "Jesus Christ".
And then my wife buys one.
Only if it's under warranty will I take it back to the dealer.
But I do understand why my mechanic friends hate working on cars.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 11:55:05 AM EDT
[#6]
Modern cars are indeed marvels of technology but at the price of ease of repair
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 12:23:55 PM EDT
[#7]
I feel your pain.  I have taken older cars completely apart ( and I mean completely ) and performed a full restore.  I had to replace a head on my 2012 Jeep JKUR recently and for the most part it was pretty straight forward.  There was a few things that had me scratching my head for " why the fuck did they do that ".  A few things on it I thought were brilliant,  the exhaust manifold attachment to the head was genius, 4 bolts,  only the tops come out, the bottoms just hold a u-shaped flange that the pipe drops in to. Usually pulling the exhaust mani is a fucker,  this was maybe 5 minutes and it was off.
 
On the other hand my wifes Macan Turbo has an oil and coolant leak,  I'm glad we have a warranty on that,  I've changed the oil on it a few times ( this is how I noticed the oil leak from the upper timing cover ) and have no desire to rip the whole front of the car off just to access the fucking timing cover.
 
The tight packaging on the newer cars blow for sure but it's always been an issue with smaller cars,  my wife when we were dating had a Fiat X1/9 and changing the alternator on it was a real son of a bitch,  needed 5 year old sized hands to get in there.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 12:27:59 PM EDT
[#8]
@ramairthree

Something I just thought of... If my guess is correct and the vehicle in question is a Toyota Rav4, I highly suggest your kid replace the water pump while the belt and alternator are off. Leaks and water pump failures are extremely common on both the 2.5 and 3.5 engines and you're already 95% of the way to replacing the water pump. If it's the 2.5, the water pump is extremely easy once the alternator is off, in the off chance it's the 3.5, I'd say just send the car to a shop. I'd rather work on a dozen M2s in a row than one V6 Rav4
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:06:15 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:


It isn't to save weight - it is to build things as assemblies that get integrated on the assembly line with little to no regard for servicability afterwards.
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Who says they’re not?

The price of having vehicles that are not all gigantic overweight land yachts is that stuff will be crammed in tighter and harder to work on.  And I say that as someone with an affinity for gigantic overweight land yachts.

What got smaller or lighter?


It isn't to save weight - it is to build things as assemblies that get integrated on the assembly line with little to no regard for servicability afterwards.


Exactly!

A lot of alcoholics in the technician world. Also parts and body shops. At least today not as prevalent in parts as it used to be. More that once I’d have reason to go to another dealership parts department (I was a GM parts counterman and management level for 47 years) and late in the day it was nothing to see a can of beer on a desk or parts counter.

One gas station I worked at during high school had a Coke machine with an “out of order” sticker on one of the buttons. That was the Hamm’s Beer selection and it did work, that kept the customers (usually) from hitting that button.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:18:39 PM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:
Very rewarding to take something broken and fix it or improve it
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Only silly people do such things!
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:21:06 PM EDT
[#11]
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Quoted:



Only silly people do such things!
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We silly people have more fun in life
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:21:21 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:
The funnest repair jobs are when there is no book and you have to figure everything out, like when given a box full of parts you've never seen before and figure it out, like a puzzle
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Add everything is in a language you don't know.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:23:57 PM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:

We silly people have more fun in life
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Quoted:



Only silly people do such things!

We silly people have more fun in life



True..
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:27:33 PM EDT
[#14]
It is a frustrating, stressful and thankless job. Good Mechanics should be paid more for the crap they have to deal with.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:30:28 PM EDT
[#15]
Become as good a mechanic as possible, then choose the field you enjoy, most of the time in mine I enjoyed it and looked forward to going in every day
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:34:41 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
drunken, depressed, miserable guys that have not had a psychotic break?

I’m not the least mechanically inclined guy out there.
I have a decent amount of tools.  A lift.  I can cool or heat my garage.  
I have replaced relays or fuses on modern cars or recharged AC and saved people from getting a new compressor they were told they needed.  I have put better discs and pads on modern cars for people for less than they would have paid for just worse parts.  Or time for new shocks and struts.  Now, this is pretty much limited to just immediate family.  And I am not way versed modern stuff.

My set up is more for me maintaining older vehicles.  Which have their own quirks.  Have you ever tried to connect the wiper motor to the arms on, say a 71-74 Javelin, or the extensions need to do spark plugs on an ‘85 Z28.  Let alone how to get to the fuel pump on one.  But for the most part throwing a new rotor in the distributor, rebuilding a carburetor, new wiper motor, repack wheel hubs, convert drums to discs, new starter, throw some relays in the wiring harness, new transmission, etc. is pretty straightforward and easy.

One of my adult kids got the check charging system light on their 11 year old mid sized, Japanese AWD CUV.  They had just put in a new battery a few years ago, whipped out their multimeter, it’s the alternator, and the belt has proper tension.
They asked if I could show them how to change it.  I said should be easy.  Give me a minute.  I looked it up.
This is going to involve like 18 inch extensions and 18 inch shaft wrench, both longer than what I have, and require several hard to get connectors to move part of the wiring harness out of the way, then shifting an AC line out of the way, then moving fluid reservoirs, then you can get belt out of the way and start removing the alternator.  Which also has a bushing likely to shift requiring messing around just to get the new one back in.  Plus, it wouldn’t hurt to have child sized hands on the ends of extra long, extra skinny arms.

Now, open up the hood of a ‘70 Chevelle or ‘68 GTO, ar just about any SBC truck of yesteryear, and you can have a decent alternator plus new voltage regulator for about 100 bucks and have it replaced in 15 minutes without a single curse word or bruised knuckle.  And you could have hands like Hodor on arms the length of Tyrion arms.  Plus the modern CUV alternator will cost two to three times as much.

I would go mad working on stuff like that all day.

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It's like we have some sort of psychic connection.  

I guess I always assume guys doing it everyday get really good at it.  At one time, I had so many brake issues with my F150, I could rebuild those rear drums in 15 minutes.  I finally sorted that out and then, five or six years later, the brake line burst.  The line was seized in the wheel cylinders, so I just though, what the hell, I'll redo the rear brakes altogether.  Holy shit.  Three days and four thousand cuss words later, it was done.  Chasing down parts was harder than I expected and a seized parking brake cable made it real interesting.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:37:24 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
have it replaced in 15 minutes without a single curse word or bruised knuckle.  
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Such things are not possible in my garage.

Surely you jest.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:40:48 PM EDT
[#18]
It even worse when you own the shop. Then you get to baby sit angry, hungover, depressed mechanics. And do your own work.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:41:15 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
Mechanics are one of the most underpaid professions. That and machining.

Buy all your own tools. Deal with garbage ass cars that they manufacturer can’t even figure out how to fix. Then the dealers pay flat rate which outside of some good weeks, fucks the tech more often than not. Otherwise they would never use that system.

“Can you pull this in quick and look at her window that squeaks?” Oh it was only 30 seconds to clean and lube the upper track? I’ll get you on the next one bro.

I steal every good dealer tech I can find and offer them 30+ an hour to start, working in aerospace assembly.

The dealerships hate this one simple trick
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What state?  PM if you want.

Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:43:26 PM EDT
[#20]
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:44:23 PM EDT
[#21]
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Quoted:
Try working on boats especially sterndrives.
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Try working on old Soviet armor.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:45:26 PM EDT
[#22]
I did a Nissan truck starter last year. While it wasn't very complex, it was such a pain in the ass to remove the intake to get to the starter. Then the bolts were facing the firewall with about 8 inches of clearance. I guess I should be thankful for the 8 inches. But yes, you're standing on a small step ladder leaning on top of the engine to get back there.

Never did it before. Spent the money on a Milwaukee 3/8 cordless ratchet and was glad I had it. Took one evening to pull it apart, picked up a new starter the next day, installed it the next evening in my driveway.

No busted knuckles or anything, but I never want to do it again.

Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:52:55 PM EDT
[#23]
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Small cars/SUVs are a bitch.  One of the reasons I try to limit my ownership of them.  Daughter just bought a used 2017 Escape.  Engine bay is the definition of 10lbs of shit in a 5lb bag.  Just getting access to the battery is

Changed the alternator in my 2001 Suburban in well under an hour.
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An hour is a long alternator change job. I did the last one in my Audi in 20 minutes and it's never done one in that car before.

Don't ask me how long the 14hr job is to do a timing belt though.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 1:57:59 PM EDT
[#24]
I did it for 4 years after high school then I got out. I was making awesome money at 20 years old but I was putting in 60 hours every week at the dealership and I recognized that I was going to work myself into a wheelchair by the time I retired.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:04:00 PM EDT
[#25]
How many hours does it pay? I used to work on airplanes. Sometimes you had to take a bunch of stuff apart to replace a part. It’s not a big deal. Some things are easy to access and change, others aren’t.

If you have a small block bored and honed it’s not a big job to put the pistons back in. It’s a bit of work getting to that point and from that point to driving the car.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:07:18 PM EDT
[#26]
I'm a toyota fan boy but fuck the location of the starter on the 4.7
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:19:46 PM EDT
[#27]
diy mechanic here - profanity is the lubrication that keeps the wheels of civilization turning.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:39:50 PM EDT
[#28]
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Quoted:
diy mechanic here - profanity is the lubrication that keeps the wheels of civilization turning.
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Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:45:00 PM EDT
[#29]


Masochists! (The buyers too)
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:48:43 PM EDT
[#30]
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Quoted:
I'm a toyota fan boy but fuck the location of the starter on the 4.7
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Under the manifold?  That is easy
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:50:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
drunken, depressed, miserable guys that have not had a psychotic break?

Snip…..

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Bold of you to think we aren’t, OP.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 2:52:26 PM EDT
[#32]
I've got two friends that are master mechanics. One works for Hyundai/Genesis and the other owns his own German shop after working at several dealers. They are both doing well and love their work. But they're both competent Xennials/Gen-X like me and aren't afraid of technology and don't do the shit work. They also have the experience, tools, training, and information to deal with all the shit the fudds on GD always bitch about.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 3:12:28 PM EDT
[#33]
Mid '80s after I got out of the Army (mechanic) I worked at two different service stations over a two year period. Mostly AAA towing calls, pumping gas as full service was a bigger deal back then, and light mechanic work; brakes, tires, oil, etc... The tools were outrageously expensive and you were expected to have a complete set of your own tools in one of those two shops I worked in. I could not afford to work that job. One buddy at one shop would complain everyday how his hands were being trashed. In the other shop my buddy would boast how he could not fully open his fingers as his hands were clutches at this point as wanted to be a real mechanic. He was beast at replacing clutches.

One day I came to the realization that the only people from the public that wanted to talk to you is because they have a problem. This problem is because their vehicle is broken. Even thou I was green and new to this industry it was obvious these people cared more for the vehicles then their own children at times. This is my BABY you are told. They treated you like shit and took all their grievances on you. You Service Manager's out there, when not lying, deserve an extra twinkle on your halo.

I realized and saw the abuse and quit. The older mechanics were worn down and the clients were getting ruder. I went back to school to be an Accountant then landed into the computer field and I am an IT Manager today.

With that said. I recently found a new shop since I moved. This is after going to a shop I trusted for 20 years to touch the big stuff I can't or do not want to do. When I bring my car in I tell them I am very thankful and talk to them like people and tell them all the work I did on my car and if you don't mind giving it a look over if you time. Finding a good shop is not easy!
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 4:20:21 PM EDT
[#34]
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Quoted:
Who says they’re not?

The price of having vehicles that are not all gigantic overweight land yachts is that stuff will be crammed in tighter and harder to work on.  And I say that as someone with an affinity for gigantic overweight land yachts.
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I would compare the size of say a 1968 Mustang vs a new one, or a 1971 Dodge Challenger vs a new one.  Do a 69 Z28 vs a 2015 Z28 as well.
Sure, there were some massive classes of cars, then a lot of smaller budget cars post oil crisis, etc.
But our modern cars are huge and heavy compared to the era 50 or so years ago.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 4:22:05 PM EDT
[#35]
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Sounds like you are doing the repair based on "the book" procedure.  After you do one or two jobs you learn shortcuts.
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I’m not a mechanic.  I might change the shocks/struts on a modern SUV once during ownership, then have another model,  I am not, say, working on two or three 4Runners and FJ cruisers a day five days a week.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 4:23:29 PM EDT
[#36]
I resemble that remark !
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 4:32:54 PM EDT
[#37]
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Quoted:
Under the manifold?  That is easy
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Quoted:
I'm a toyota fan boy but fuck the location of the starter on the 4.7
Under the manifold?  That is easy


I really don't understand all the fuss about the 4.7 starter, it's easy to get to. If people want to complain about a Toyota starter, they should be complaining about the starter on the 5.7; Toyota crammed it under the B2 exhaust manifold for some reason.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 4:34:24 PM EDT
[#38]
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Quoted:


I really don't understand all the fuss about the 4.7 starter, it's easy to get to. If people want to complain about a Toyota starter, they should be complaining about the starter on the 5.7; Toyota crammed it under the B2 exhaust manifold for some reason.
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Yep
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 4:35:30 PM EDT
[#39]
Well I did buy this today



Link Posted: 7/20/2023 5:48:15 PM EDT
[#40]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I look under the hood.
And the I say to myself; "Jesus Christ".
And then my wife buys one.
Only if it's under warranty will I take it back to the dealer.
But I do understand why my mechanic friends hate working on cars.
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It’s not just under the hood.

Compare putting a new battery in, say your 1973 Roadrunner.
Instant swap right at front.

Now, with a new car hook up another battery to keep settings.
Then, go to your trunk, like in a challenger, or worse yet dick around getting it out from under the seat in your WK2 Cherokee…
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 5:50:02 PM EDT
[#41]
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Quoted:
@ramairthree

Something I just thought of... If my guess is correct and the vehicle in question is a Toyota Rav4, I highly suggest your kid replace the water pump while the belt and alternator are off. Leaks and water pump failures are extremely common on both the 2.5 and 3.5 engines and you're already 95% of the way to replacing the water pump. If it's the 2.5, the water pump is extremely easy once the alternator is off, in the off chance it's the 3.5, I'd say just send the car to a shop. I'd rather work on a dozen M2s in a row than one V6 Rav4
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Its an Acura product.
With the SHAWD, and the super magnetic or whatever computerized shocks/struts, I think I paid 1/4 in parts for what the exact replacements were, plus it came with a warning light bypass, just to put regular shocks and struts on it.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 5:56:22 PM EDT
[#42]
We saw the writing on the wall and left the business for something better.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 5:58:28 PM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I've got two friends that are master mechanics. One works for Hyundai/Genesis and the other owns his own German shop after working at several dealers. They are both doing well and love their work. But they're both competent Xennials/Gen-X like me and aren't afraid of technology and don't do the shit work. They also have the experience, tools, training, and information to deal with all the shit the fudds on GD always bitch about.
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I’m Gen X.  

There is nothing whatsoever hi tech about an alternator change.

Just like there is nothing hi tech about a light bulb change.

Simply,

I would rather change a light bulb on an 8 foot ceiling vs try to get to one in a recessed housing on an 87 foot ceiling,
Or 87 feet down a 24 inch diameter tunnel.  And I’d like to just change the 10$ light bulb in ten minutes, not spend four hours removing panels to get to the point I can install the 287$ bulb assembly.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:00:50 PM EDT
[#44]
Anybody who complains about working on modern cars has never been under the hood of an 80'-90's fwd from the rust belt.

Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:03:50 PM EDT
[#45]
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Quoted:
Anybody who complains about working on modern cars has never been under the hood of an 80'-90's fwd from the rust belt.

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Late 70s/early 80s japanese cars with 900 miles of vacuum hoses
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:10:25 PM EDT
[#46]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Late 70s/early 80s japanese cars with 900 miles of vacuum hoses
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US vehicles of that era had 1800 miles of vacuum hoses because the engines were 2x the size.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:12:33 PM EDT
[#47]
Buy a DeLorean. You will start swearing before you even get to within 20 feet of the car.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:13:32 PM EDT
[#48]
My dad had a Cadillac SRX with a transverse mounted V6. You hade to remove the forward motor mounts to change the serpentine belt. It is not something that can be done along side the road.
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:15:21 PM EDT
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Worst cars I've ever had to work on were a 300ZX twin turbo and a Celica All-Trac.  Horry Sheet.
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Easy compared to most things now
Link Posted: 7/20/2023 6:16:36 PM EDT
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



300zxtt suck fat wiener to work on but worse are Audi all roads or the s4 with the 2.7tt. Good lord I hate those stupid cars.
View Quote


Volvo s60 hybrid
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