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Posted: 4/26/2023 2:38:39 PM EDT
I don’t know much about fighter technology so please educate me.  Since it’s a 5th Gen fighter, as Maverick would say, does that mean that missiles couldn’t even lock onto them?  So, Fat Amy would basically have free reign over any battle space?
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:41:04 PM EDT
[#1]
A range of possibilities:

They could all get shot down if they go over heavily contested areas with lots of Sukhoi jets and S400 sites.  

If used appropriately, meaning at a distance flinging AMRAAM missiles to first suppress the Russian airforce then HARM missiles to take out S400 sites.....fairly well.

Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:41:56 PM EDT
[#2]
Likely as well as anything.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:45:01 PM EDT
[#3]
Never take off...

Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:46:50 PM EDT
[#4]
What would be the nationality of the pilot(s) of said F-35 in your question?
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:49:06 PM EDT
[#5]
F35 is a significant force multiplier due to its sensors. Those sensors are only useful if you have enough sensors in the network and follow on capability to take quick action.

Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:50:00 PM EDT
[#6]
Presuming a trained NATO pilot, I would imagine a few F-35s could establish air dominance in short order.

Not sure Air Supremacy is possible anymore with ALCMs and hypersonic, or how that strategic theorem works when the other side uses SRBMs and MRBMs in the same manner we use bombers and strike aircraft.  Doubly so when strikes are launched from non-combatant nations like Belarus.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:54:14 PM EDT
[#7]
Dominate. I suspect a few losses from S/A.

Maybe the big guy will need another 10% and we will find out.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:55:59 PM EDT
[#8]
The Aviation Week Answer:

The F-35 will be completely mission ineffective against 8th gen Sukhoi fighters.  We read the ROSOBORONEXPORT sales brouchure and are 300% convinced that the vaporware Neosov threat will completely invalidate any Western fighter and that (Pierre Sprey authoring) only F-16's setup for daylight ops will solve the problem.  It's Aviation Week's estimation that the F-35 will be the next Vought Cutlass!

Real World:
F-35 would embarass the VVS in 12 hours.  There would probably be multiple Ace-in-a-days. The myth of Russian air power would be crushed in multiple smouldering wreckage piles as exposed-rivet/inlet "5th Gen" NeoSov S$%t falls to a AIM-120 bukkake they didn't see until it was too late.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:57:20 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
I don’t know much about fighter technology so please educate me.  Since it’s a 5th Gen fighter, as Maverick would say, does that mean that missiles couldn’t even lock onto them?  So, Fat Amy would basically have free reign over any battle space?
View Quote

Too many variables to consider before you even scratch the surface on actual 5th gen capes.  Who is flying them? Who is providing planning info? How many are available? What restrictions (ROE) are there?

How successful was the F-117 in Kosovo?  Low observable is not invisible.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 2:58:56 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Likely as well as anything.
View Quote


A-1 Sandy's would probably fare well in Uke-Land...definitely better than the turd KA-50.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:06:02 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The Aviation Week Answer:

The F-35 will be completely mission ineffective against 8th gen Sukhoi fighters.  We read the ROSOBORONEXPORT sales brouchure and are 300% convinced that the vaporware Neosov threat will completely invalidate any Western fighter and that (Pierre Sprey authoring) only F-16's setup for daylight ops will solve the problem.  It's Aviation Week's estimation that the F-35 will be the next Vought Cutlass!

Real World:
F-35 would embarass the VVS in 12 hours.  There would probably be multiple Ace-in-a-days. The myth of Russian air power would be crushed in multiple smouldering wreckage piles as exposed-rivet/inlet "5th Gen" NeoSov S$%t falls to a AIM-120 bukkake they didn't see until it was too late.
View Quote


Multiple ace in a day assumes 10 flying RuAF aircraft.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:08:32 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:


Multiple ace in a day assumes 10 flying RuAF aircraft.
View Quote

It’s doubtful they would even try and fly any kind of A/A sorties. They would have shots at them before they even had a chance to rendezvous with their wingman.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:13:24 PM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:

It’s doubtful they would even try and fly any kind of A/A sorties. They would have shots at them before they even had a chance to rendezvous with their wingman.
View Quote


OK. That assumes they'd get two planes up.

But yeah, the RuAF was never really a coherently thought out organization at its height, and thirty years of being the junior service sucked it dry.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:18:36 PM EDT
[#14]
Bro plz believe me bro S-400 shot down decadent F-35.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:19:37 PM EDT
[#15]
With US pilots that 40 mile convoy and everything  at the staging area would have never left Russian. And just about everyone there would be dead.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:25:00 PM EDT
[#16]
Figure out what airbase they are going to fly from. Draw a 600nm radius circle around it. Everything in that circle is vulnerable.  The hardest part is identifying and prioritizing targets.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:48:38 PM EDT
[#17]
F-35s greatest use would be information gathering. Being able to spot and sort targets, relay that information to ground teams, is probably more important than limited air to ground or air to air stuff. Why let Russia even know F-35s are flying?
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:49:54 PM EDT
[#18]
They would absolutely dominate.

A Ukraine type environment is the one they were made for.

We know lightnings do well against S300s and stealth "defeating" radars (see, syria).

They would not do well in Ukrainian hands. Going from legacy soviet jets to a 5th gen plane is a big leap and some capabilities need to expand and grow first.

Baby steps..f16s.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:50:05 PM EDT
[#19]
DP...
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:50:37 PM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
With US pilots that 40 mile convoy and everything  at the staging area would have never left Russian. And just about everyone there would be dead.
View Quote


Pilots? With himars operators and artillery men.

Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:50:47 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Figure out what airbase they are going to fly from. Draw a 600nm radius circle around it. Everything in that circle is vulnerable.  The hardest part is identifying and prioritizing targets.
View Quote


Targets are easy...Engels gets smashed by the thumb of god.  Every AB within 200nm of Engels gets smashed to crush ants.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:51:43 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
With US pilots that 40 mile convoy and everything  at the staging area would have never left Russian. And just about everyone there would be dead.
View Quote



I'm just here to comment on your avatar.   That's a rather obscure screenshot but I get it.    I liked that movie but as a young kid watching it the first time that was quite the surprising moment.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:52:51 PM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Multiple ace in a day assumes 10 flying RuAF aircraft.
View Quote


I know its a stretch...I will have to use those WW2 rules of kills on the ground.  I don't give the VVS much credit but I think even they could gen up 10+ airplanes to die on short notice.

Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:55:01 PM EDT
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Dominate. I suspect a few losses from S/A.
View Quote

Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:58:21 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The Aviation Week Answer:

The F-35 will be completely mission ineffective against 8th gen Sukhoi fighters.  We read the ROSOBORONEXPORT sales brouchure and are 300% convinced that the vaporware Neosov threat will completely invalidate any Western fighter and that (Pierre Sprey authoring) only F-16's setup for daylight ops will solve the problem.  It's Aviation Week's estimation that the F-35 will be the next Vought Cutlass!

Real World:
F-35 would embarass the VVS in 12 hours.  There would probably be multiple Ace-in-a-days. The myth of Russian air power would be crushed in multiple smouldering wreckage piles as exposed-rivet/inlet "5th Gen" NeoSov S$%t falls to a AIM-120 bukkake they didn't see until it was too late.
View Quote
I would like to subscribe to your channel.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 3:58:38 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
They would absolutely dominate.

A Ukraine type environment is the one they were made for.

We know lightnings do well against S300s and stealth "defeating" radars (see, syria).

They would not do well in Ukrainian hands. Going from legacy soviet jets to a 5th gen plane is a big leap and some capabilities need to expand and grow first.

Baby steps..f16s.
View Quote


What personal experience do you have with the f35?
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 4:06:59 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
With US pilots that 40 mile convoy and everything  at the staging area would have never left Russian. And just about everyone there would be dead.
View Quote


Kind of amazing to watch a Wish.com version of the German Army's initial thrust through the Ardennes at the start of the battle of France in 2022.

Attachment Attached File


Link Posted: 4/26/2023 4:08:22 PM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
They would absolutely dominate.

A Ukraine type environment is the one they were made for.

We know lightnings do well against S300s and stealth "defeating" radars (see, syria).

They would not do well in Ukrainian hands. Going from legacy soviet jets to a 5th gen plane is a big leap and some capabilities need to expand and grow first.

Baby steps..f16s.
View Quote

We won’t give real allies F22 but sure let’s give some corrupt commies F35. You’re a real patriot.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 4:22:41 PM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

We won’t give real allies F22 but sure let’s give some corrupt commies F35. You’re a real patriot.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
They would absolutely dominate.

A Ukraine type environment is the one they were made for.

We know lightnings do well against S300s and stealth "defeating" radars (see, syria).

They would not do well in Ukrainian hands. Going from legacy soviet jets to a 5th gen plane is a big leap and some capabilities need to expand and grow first.

Baby steps..f16s.

We won’t give real allies F22 but sure let’s give some corrupt commies F35. You’re a real patriot.


Yeah we should only support the nations that that are staunchly anti-socialist and have always been our best friends like the UK, Japan, and Germany. Situations like this definitely aren't how strong alliances are forged.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 4:26:02 PM EDT
[#30]
What could the F-35 do vs waves of cruise missiles and one-way drone attacks? Don’t think there are too many dogfights to be had over Ukraine these days.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 4:40:13 PM EDT
[#31]
Good report on air combat during the war: https://www.cna.org/reports/2023/04/Russian-Combat-Air-Strengths-and-Limitations.pdf

Some highlights below. Since the topic is A2A and GBAD, these snippets are much more positive than the assessments of SEAD/DEAD and CAS. Obviously, this is against Ukrainian aircraft like MiG-29 and Su-27, not the F-35.

The radar and missile performance of the primary Russian Su-35S and Su-30SM fighters has been impressive throughout the conflict. The N035 Irbis-E and N110M Bars-M radars on the two respective fighters give them a major advantage over Ukrainian fighters in a meeting engagement with up to five times the effective range, greater tactical flexibility with track-while-scan (TWS) capabilities, and significantly better ability to burn through electronic interference compared to the radars carried on Ukrainian Su-27P and MiG-29 fighters. Both radars have also performed well in look-down, shoot-down engagements against very low-flying jets, helicopters, and UAVs trying to hide in ground clutter. Su-34 fighter bombers and also Su-30SM and Su-35S fighters have also generally carried L-175 “Khibiny” electronic warfare pods throughout the war, although during the first week many did not have them fitted. The Khibiny pods have proven effective at degrading Ukrainian in-flight communications and radar performance, although they also interfere with Russian radar performance when in use.

Meanwhile, the use of the AA-12B medium range air-to-air missile has consistently allowed Russian pilots to fire at much greater ranges than their Ukrainian opponents, who have been limited to shorter ranged R-27R/ER (AA-10A/C) missiles for beyond-visual-range combat. The combination of an active-radar seeker head on the AA-12B and the TWS capabilities of the N035 and N110M radars has also allowed Russian fighters to engage Ukrainian fighters and ground-attack jets without sacrificing situational awareness or giving a tracking lock or missile launch warning to their opponents. TWS also allows Russian pilots to guide multiple missiles simultaneously against multiple targets, and the active seeker on the AA-12B allows the launching fighter to turn away and break radar lock to maintain positional advantage or defend against any incoming shots once the missile has “gone active” and acquired the target for itself. By contrast, Ukrainian pilots have had to get much closer and illuminate Russian aircraft in a single-target-track (STT) lock before firing. An STT provides reflected radar energy to guide the semi active seeker on the AA-10A/C missile, but the lock must be maintained until missile impact. Furthermore, the amount of concentrated radar energy involved in an STT lock also generally ensures that Russian pilots receive warnings about locks and missile launches from their radar-warning receivers.

...[Russian fighters] have continued to pose a serious threat to Ukrainian fighter, ground-attack, helicopter, and TB-2 Bayraktar UAV sorties near the front lines, even at very low levels. The range at which Russian combat air patrols (CAPs) can take valid missile shots against Ukrainian aircraft has also significantly increased since September 2022. The key change has been the use of large numbers of the long-range R-37M (AA-13) air-to-air missiles by both Mig-31BM interceptors and modified Su-35S fighters. Better coordination has also been observed between Russian fighters on CAP and supporting A-50U and Il-20 command and control and surveillance aircraft as the war has progressed. Therefore, one area where the VKS can be assessed as having been reasonably successful is in its use of fighter CAPs to provide an enduring threat and deterrent against Ukrainian sorties close to the front lines.

...VKS training sorties have... almost always been flown in small formations or by single aircraft, and largely involve simple navigation sorties, unguided weapon deliveries on open ranges, ground-controlled interception tasks, and SAM-target simulation serials. Furthermore, the typical Russian fast jet pilot flew only around 80–100 hours per year before the invasion, and VKS regiments do not have access to the sort of modern simulator facilities that Western air forces increasingly rely on for complex synthetic training. Together, this lack of exposure to large formation tactics in training and previous operations, limited live flying training hours for frontline pilots, and a focus on relatively simple tasks during those training hours explains why the VKS was not able to fly [composite air operations] COMAOs in Ukraine.

...In terms of a threat to NATO nations in a medium-term context, the Russian airpower picture remains largely unchanged. The two major Russian military capability areas that threaten the ability of NATO to establish and exploit air superiority, and thereby credibly defend its territory in the event of Russian aggression, have always been the [integrated air defense systems] IADS and long-range precision strike capabilities. Both of these capabilities have performed very effectively in Ukraine. Russian SAM systems have proven extremely lethal against both Ukrainian aircraft and also, in many cases, munitions when emplaced and operating within the IADS as doctrinally intended. From very long-range S-400 launches against low-flying Ukrainian fighters and ground-attack aircraft guided by exotic radars like the 48Ya6-K1 to medium- and short-range engagements by SA-17s and SA-15s, Russian SAMs remain the primary killer of Ukrainian fast jets, helicopters, and UAVs. Furthermore, despite some success with the AGM-88 HARM missile since summer 2022, Russian SAM losses in Ukraine remain a small fraction of Russia’s total inventory. As such, the Russian IADS remains a serious threat to NATO’s ability to rapidly establish control of the air over the battlespace in any medium-term clash. The extent that this remains the case will depend on whether or not European NATO air forces prioritise the regeneration of the capability to conduct SEAD/DEAD against Russia’s modern, mobile SAM systems at scale in the coming years.

In terms of cruise and ballistic missiles, salvos from VKS LRA, ground-based Iskander systems, and naval platforms have consistently proven accurate enough hit their targets in quantity at great distances. The threat to NATO from the VKS was always primarily cruise missiles and air-launched quasi-ballistic missiles fired from the LRA Tu-95 and Tu-160 bombers and Mig-31K modified interceptors, respectively. These assets allow the VKS to credibly threaten NATO air forces with large salvos of accurate precision-guided missiles against the main operating bases lacking air defenses that are largely the norm in Europe following decades of uncontested Western air operations. Against Ukraine, the LRA fleets have consistently maintained solid readiness and a reliable launch tempo from the first waves of the invasion to the winter bombardment of Ukrainian power and water infrastructure. These bombardments have depleted stockpiles, but Russia maintains the ability to produce at least 6 9M723 Iskander ballistic missiles and around 40 cruise missiles per month, so even a pause of a few years would allow the VKS to rebuild a sufficient arsenal to cause major damage to NATO bases not protected by layered GBAD.
View Quote
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:41:23 PM EDT
[#32]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

We won’t give real allies F22 but sure let’s give some corrupt commies F35. You’re a real patriot.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

We won’t give real allies F22 but sure let’s give some corrupt commies F35. You’re a real patriot.


We aren't giving them to the Russians

Just the people fighting Communists.

Same folks tearing down communist monuments across eastern Europe.

Who said anything about giving Ukraine 35s? They can't handle them at the moment. In the future they would be a fantastic upgrade.

Quoted:


What personal experience do you have with the f35?


Chatting with a pilot and watching the F35B take off and land outside 14th Marines

Quoted:
What could the F-35 do vs waves of cruise missiles and one-way drone attacks? Don’t think there are too many dogfights to be had over Ukraine these days.


Hit the source of the cruise missiles and launch other PGMs targeting the airbases and bombers themselves.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:43:11 PM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


We aren't giving them to the Russians

Just the people fighting Communists.

Same folks tearing down communist monuments across eastern Europe.

Who said anything about giving Ukraine 35s? They can't handle them at the moment. In the future they would be a fantastic upgrade.



Chatting with a pilot and watching the F35B take off and land outside 14th Marines



Hit the source of the cruise missiles and launch other PGMs targeting the airbases and bombers themselves.
View Quote


Yes let’s hit bases inside Russia with F35. No mission creep there.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:49:28 PM EDT
[#34]
Israel bombed Syria unopposed using them and Syria had S400s. Lol
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:50:08 PM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Multiple ace in a day assumes 10 flying RuAF aircraft.
View Quote

I bet they still have Mig 3, Yak 9 and LA-5 plus Sturmoviks somewhere.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:50:44 PM EDT
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Too many variables to consider before you even scratch the surface on actual 5th gen capes.  Who is flying them? Who is providing planning info? How many are available? What restrictions (ROE) are there?

How successful was the F-117 in Kosovo?  Low observable is not invisible.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
I don't know much about fighter technology so please educate me.  Since it's a 5th Gen fighter, as Maverick would say, does that mean that missiles couldn't even lock onto them?  So, Fat Amy would basically have free reign over any battle space?

Too many variables to consider before you even scratch the surface on actual 5th gen capes.  Who is flying them? Who is providing planning info? How many are available? What restrictions (ROE) are there?

How successful was the F-117 in Kosovo?  Low observable is not invisible.
We have come a ways since then. Not flying the same path every time helps too.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:52:49 PM EDT
[#37]
I mean. Ukraine is running SEAD with mig29s and CAS with SU25s and they're surviving. I imagine an F-35 would fare even better.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:55:37 PM EDT
[#38]
F35 simulation starts at 12:30

USA vs Russia: Breaking the S-400 (with F-35s)
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:56:03 PM EDT
[#39]
Quoted:
I don't know much about fighter technology so please educate me.  Since it's a 5th Gen fighter, as Maverick would say, does that mean that missiles couldn't even lock onto them?  So, Fat Amy would basically have free reign over any battle space?
View Quote
Probably very well.  As long as they dont use the same routes over and over they could basically go unscathed for a long while.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 6:59:25 PM EDT
[#40]
This is where the ADA arm of the military has all of a sudden become relevant.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:00:32 PM EDT
[#41]
F-22 remains undetected on radar as it creeps up on a pair of Russian Su-33's in restricted airspace. Simulated on DCS

F-22 remains undetected on radar as it creeps up on a pair of Russian Su-33's in restricted airspace
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:06:52 PM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Too many variables to consider before you even scratch the surface on actual 5th gen capes.  Who is flying them? Who is providing planning info? How many are available? What restrictions (ROE) are there?

How successful was the F-117 in Kosovo?  Low observable is not invisible.
View Quote

In the F-117s defense, they were restricted to the same egress if I recall and the enemy missile commander was a righteous stud as well.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:09:38 PM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Too many variables to consider before you even scratch the surface on actual 5th gen capes.  Who is flying them? Who is providing planning info? How many are available? What restrictions (ROE) are there?

How successful was the F-117 in Kosovo?  Low observable is not invisible.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
I don’t know much about fighter technology so please educate me.  Since it’s a 5th Gen fighter, as Maverick would say, does that mean that missiles couldn’t even lock onto them?  So, Fat Amy would basically have free reign over any battle space?

Too many variables to consider before you even scratch the surface on actual 5th gen capes.  Who is flying them? Who is providing planning info? How many are available? What restrictions (ROE) are there?

How successful was the F-117 in Kosovo?  Low observable is not invisible.

It was extremely successful, except piss poor mission planning led to the same ingress (or egress) route being run far too many times.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:10:53 PM EDT
[#44]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:



I'm just here to comment on your avatar.   That's a rather obscure screenshot but I get it.    I liked that movie but as a young kid watching it the first time that was quite the surprising moment.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Quoted:
Quoted:
With US pilots that 40 mile convoy and everything  at the staging area would have never left Russian. And just about everyone there would be dead.



I'm just here to comment on your avatar.   That's a rather obscure screenshot but I get it.    I liked that movie but as a young kid watching it the first time that was quite the surprising moment.

That scene left me thinking WTF?
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:14:53 PM EDT
[#45]
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Quoted:
What would be the nationality of the pilot(s) of said F-35 in your question?
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This.
In our, or a serious ally’s hands? Really really well.

Rushed into Uke hands? Not as well.
Nothing against them, but they just don’t have the experience or infrastructure to use it to its full capabilities.

Honestly, 16’s would probably stomp the Ruskies. Esp if they had Israeli pilots somehow.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:24:33 PM EDT
[#46]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I mean. Ukraine is running SEAD with mig29s and CAS with SU25s and they're surviving. I imagine an F-35 would fare even better.
View Quote
Ukraine has done SEAD with tractors.


Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:26:41 PM EDT
[#47]
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Quoted:
Israel bombed Syria unopposed using them and Syria had S400s. Lol
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You’re assuming there wasn’t other issues in play that might have degraded that system.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:27:41 PM EDT
[#48]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

It was extremely successful, except piss poor mission planning led to the same ingress (or egress) route being run far too many times.
View Quote

That was my point, the F-117's success was limited by self imposed constraints along with some help from some of our "allies."
The OPs question is too vague to give much insight to without framing it more or just making a bunch of assumptions.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:31:47 PM EDT
[#49]
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Quoted:
Presuming a trained NATO pilot, I would imagine a few F-35s could establish air dominance in short order.

Not sure Air Supremacy is possible anymore with ALCMs and hypersonic, or how that strategic theorem works when the other side uses SRBMs and MRBMs in the same manner we use bombers and strike aircraft.  Doubly so when strikes are launched from non-combatant nations like Belarus.
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This would be the major challenge - where are they going to operate from that isn't in missile range of the Russians? Doesn't matter how good your aircraft are if the runways and support staff & equipment are vulnerable.

They would have to be part of NATO fully committing.
Link Posted: 4/26/2023 7:33:50 PM EDT
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

That was my point, the F-117's success was limited by self imposed constraints along with some help from some of our "allies."
The OPs question is too vague to give much insight to without framing it more or just making a bunch of assumptions.
View Quote

Much would depend on the survival of the AWACS.
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