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Posted: 7/14/2014 10:04:56 AM EDT
[#1]
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Sure did. Fought their fucking asses off at Xuan Loc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Xu%C3%A2n_L%E1%BB%99c Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The South Vietnamese actually fought. What is saving Iraq - as it exists- is that there aren't enough ISIS to go around. Many of their Iraqi Sunni supporters only want Malaki gone but aren't willing to go all in to spread jihad and do that whole Caliphate thing so their support is only local.Why they think they're going to be left alone by ISIS is a question most haven't yet asked themselves I don't reckon. I honestly thought that the IA would find it's footing by now,just on weight of numbers + Shia militia and Iranians allowing it to find fighting form. I sure didn't think they'd have retaken Fallujah already but was expecting that ISIS would have mostly burned itself out by now. It would never,ever,ever be allowed to happen but I think I know who could have turned the IA around: rehabilitate this guy http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra'ad_al-Hamdani but ain't noooooooo waaaaaaaaaaaaaay that'd happen. The lack of leadership and experience is a top down problem but the Catch 22 is the experienced and relatively capable guys sort of have some unacceptable blood on their hands. IMO the only thing that could have saved Iraq from this was creating a new sense of Iraqi nationalism over local and sectarian loyalties. This would have meant getting rehabbed Baathists and former regime supporters onboard though. Read up on the Shia general who was "leading" the troops defending Mosul...The prime example of everything that went wrong with rebuilding the IA. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Sure did. Fought their fucking asses off at Xuan Loc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Xu%C3%A2n_L%E1%BB%99c From the beginning of 1975, North Vietnam's military forces swept through the northern provinces of South Vietnam virtually unopposed. In the Central Highlands, South Vietnam's II Corps Tactical Zone was completely destroyed, whilst attempting to evacuate to the Mekong Delta region. In the cities of Hu? and Da Nang, ARVN units simply dissolved without putting up resistance.[6] The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 10:12:38 AM EDT
[#2]
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How long before those jet engines for sale on the open market? I bet China and some other countries would be interested in looking at those. 
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Question: How many miles or time would you expect out of some of those vehicles before lack of maintenance stops it for good? Ball Park figure? It has a jet engine in it. How long do think it can go for before it needs maint?  How long before those jet engines for sale on the open market? I bet China and some other countries would be interested in looking at those.
ATG1500? been out for a while.. its no secret.. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 11:00:28 AM EDT
[#3]
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The IDF got their butts kicked initially because they underestimated their enemy. They rushed towards the suez with their armor without infantry support and ran right into massive amounts of prepared anti tank defences. It wasnt a sucker punch why they incurred huge losses, it was hubris. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Don't worry,they torched those tracks. Yes,really. http://sf.uploads.ru/C1LkN.jpg That armored column was defeated by a bunch of assholes equipped with flipflops and AKs. The Iraqis simply have no heart and no leadership. When the officers run,the NCOs follow,the jundis realize that dying for the cowards running away isn't worth it...It's entirely cultural why Arabs suck at war. The egyptians put some hurt out during the yom kipur war. I'll give you that one,with acknowledging that there was absolutely nothing stopping Israel from going all the way to Cairo. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Israel faced a surprise attack and encountered Soviet technology they hadn't been prepared for, primarily Sagger AT missiles and SAM-7 Surface to Air Missiles. They organized their defenses, adapted tactics, reduced their losses and in the space of 8 days, turned the tide on that front, delivered the Egyptians heavy losses of tanks and aircraft and drove so deeply into Egypt that the Soviet Union threatened military intervention. Egypt and Syria landed sucker punches and were routed by Israel's superior military. The IDF got their butts kicked initially because they underestimated their enemy. They rushed towards the suez with their armor without infantry support and ran right into massive amounts of prepared anti tank defences. It wasnt a sucker punch why they incurred huge losses, it was hubris. New technology will fuck up a game plan of immediate retaliation. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 11:20:16 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The South Vietnamese actually fought. What is saving Iraq - as it exists- is that there aren't enough ISIS to go around. Many of their Iraqi Sunni supporters only want Malaki gone but aren't willing to go all in to spread jihad and do that whole Caliphate thing so their support is only local.Why they think they're going to be left alone by ISIS is a question most haven't yet asked themselves I don't reckon. I honestly thought that the IA would find it's footing by now,just on weight of numbers + Shia militia and Iranians allowing it to find fighting form. I sure didn't think they'd have retaken Fallujah already but was expecting that ISIS would have mostly burned itself out by now. It would never,ever,ever be allowed to happen but I think I know who could have turned the IA around: rehabilitate this guy http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra'ad_al-Hamdani but ain't noooooooo waaaaaaaaaaaaaay that'd happen. The lack of leadership and experience is a top down problem but the Catch 22 is the experienced and relatively capable guys sort of have some unacceptable blood on their hands. IMO the only thing that could have saved Iraq from this was creating a new sense of Iraqi nationalism over local and sectarian loyalties. This would have meant getting rehabbed Baathists and former regime supporters onboard though. Read up on the Shia general who was "leading" the troops defending Mosul...The prime example of everything that went wrong with rebuilding the IA. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Sure did. Fought their fucking asses off at Xuan Loc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Xu%C3%A2n_L%E1%BB%99c From the beginning of 1975, North Vietnam's military forces swept through the northern provinces of South Vietnam virtually unopposed. In the Central Highlands, South Vietnam's II Corps Tactical Zone was completely destroyed, whilst attempting to evacuate to the Mekong Delta region. In the cities of Hu? and Da Nang, ARVN units simply dissolved without putting up resistance.[6] The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. I'm not saying that they were like the Wehrmacht, but they were significantly more capable than the IA.
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Posted: 7/14/2014 11:29:57 AM EDT
[#5]
This isn't surprising at all
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Posted: 7/14/2014 11:33:17 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The IDF got their butts kicked initially because they underestimated their enemy. They rushed towards the suez with their armor without infantry support and ran right into massive amounts of prepared anti tank defences. It wasnt a sucker punch why they incurred huge losses, it was hubris. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Don't worry,they torched those tracks. Yes,really. http://sf.uploads.ru/C1LkN.jpg That armored column was defeated by a bunch of assholes equipped with flipflops and AKs. The Iraqis simply have no heart and no leadership. When the officers run,the NCOs follow,the jundis realize that dying for the cowards running away isn't worth it...It's entirely cultural why Arabs suck at war. The egyptians put some hurt out during the yom kipur war. I'll give you that one,with acknowledging that there was absolutely nothing stopping Israel from going all the way to Cairo. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Israel faced a surprise attack and encountered Soviet technology they hadn't been prepared for, primarily Sagger AT missiles and SAM-7 Surface to Air Missiles. They organized their defenses, adapted tactics, reduced their losses and in the space of 8 days, turned the tide on that front, delivered the Egyptians heavy losses of tanks and aircraft and drove so deeply into Egypt that the Soviet Union threatened military intervention. Egypt and Syria landed sucker punches and were routed by Israel's superior military. The IDF got their butts kicked initially because they underestimated their enemy. They rushed towards the suez with their armor without infantry support and ran right into massive amounts of prepared anti tank defences. It wasnt a sucker punch why they incurred huge losses, it was hubris. Being unprepared for a new weapon the enemy possesses is not the same as hubris. Being able to adapt and overcome a superior weapons system and rout a numerically greater enemy in the span of a week is a sign of an army that has its act together. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 12:22:53 PM EDT
[#7]
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New technology will fuck up a game plan of immediate retaliation. Running tanks in without infantry support has been bad tactics since the germans had the panzerfausts and panzershrieks. The israeli armor was getting tore up by rpgs and saggar missiles, nothing really new. The tow missile had been around since nam'. IDF airforce got slaughtered trying to attack a well established air defense network. Simply put israeli commanders didnt believe arabs could fight and rushed in foolhardely and paid the price. Technology only played a small part, as unsound tactics will always be your downfall. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 12:30:00 PM EDT
[#8]
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Being unprepared for a new weapon the enemy possesses is not the same as hubris. Being able to adapt and overcome a superior weapons system and rout a numerically greater enemy in the span of a week is a sign of an army that has its act together. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Their tank colums charged in without infantry support. The egyptians could have been armed with outdated anti tank weapons and the result would have been the same. Tanks need infantry support to hold ground and route out anti tank threats......armor 101. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 12:31:26 PM EDT
[#9]
we are certainly our own worst enemy over there...
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Posted: 7/14/2014 12:34:04 PM EDT
[#10]
The SEAD learning curve was awful steep but consider what they were able to apply during Mole Cricket 19 in 1982. Israel has been able to fly over Arab countries with impunity since.
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Posted: 7/14/2014 12:34:47 PM EDT
[#11]
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The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? PROTIP: When you spout leftie propaganda, you sound like a leftie propagandist. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 12:38:22 PM EDT
[#12]
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ISIS get a new ride http://www.longwarjournal.org/assets_c/2014/07/IS-Anbar-Armor-ambush9-thumb-560x356-3403.jpg They store their AK's like we do? 
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Posted: 7/14/2014 1:32:13 PM EDT
[#13]
doing some quick reading, it appears that the US supplied the Iraqis 140 refurbished Abrams between 2010 and 2012.
Janes from June 20 (old out of date information at this point) states at least 28 were damaged/destroyed here... http://www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed It would be interesting to know just how many have been knocked out by now since I recall reading a few days ago someone's propaganda (ISIS I'm guessing) was 'the end of the US Abrams tank in Iraq is here" or something along those lines. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 1:37:25 PM EDT
[#14]
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doing some quick reading, it appears that the US supplied the Iraqis 140 refurbished Abrams between 2010 and 2012. Janes from June 20 (old out of date information at this point) states at least 28 were damaged/destroyed here... http://www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed It would be interesting to know just how many have been knocked out by now since I recall reading a few days ago someone's propaganda (ISIS I'm guessing) was 'the end of the US Abrams tank in Iraq is here" or something along those lines. A nearly perfect combat record... Completely ruined. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 1:44:24 PM EDT
[#15]
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A nearly perfect combat record... Completely ruined. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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doing some quick reading, it appears that the US supplied the Iraqis 140 refurbished Abrams between 2010 and 2012. Janes from June 20 (old out of date information at this point) states at least 28 were damaged/destroyed here... http://www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed It would be interesting to know just how many have been knocked out by now since I recall reading a few days ago someone's propaganda (ISIS I'm guessing) was 'the end of the US Abrams tank in Iraq is here" or something along those lines. A nearly perfect combat record... Completely ruined. I don't think we can blame the tank itself on this one. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 1:50:23 PM EDT
[#16]
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I don't think we can blame the tank itself on this one. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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doing some quick reading, it appears that the US supplied the Iraqis 140 refurbished Abrams between 2010 and 2012. Janes from June 20 (old out of date information at this point) states at least 28 were damaged/destroyed here... http://www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed It would be interesting to know just how many have been knocked out by now since I recall reading a few days ago someone's propaganda (ISIS I'm guessing) was 'the end of the US Abrams tank in Iraq is here" or something along those lines. A nearly perfect combat record... Completely ruined. I don't think we can blame the tank itself on this one. Agreed, but it sucks anyway. It's a mark of pride that your nations symbols of power have perfect or nearly perfect combat records. I'm just glad that, last I heard, the Iraqis weren't getting those F-16s after all. They would doubtlessly ruin its combat record too. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 2:16:30 PM EDT
[#17]
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Didn't the Germans do that with some Panther and Tiger turrets in WWII? Turn them into pillboxes? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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ISIS will take the turret off and mount onto something. They certainly put captured French artillery and maybe some tank turrets in Normandy as static defenses. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 2:26:54 PM EDT
[#18]
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They certainly put captured French artillery and maybe some tank turrets in Normandy as static defenses. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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ISIS will take the turret off and mount onto something. They certainly put captured French artillery and maybe some tank turrets in Normandy as static defenses. http://westwall.elvamie.nl/images/stories/OTstaaltek.jpg 0 |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 3:06:53 PM EDT
[#19]
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By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? PROTIP: When you spout leftie propaganda, you sound like a leftie propagandist. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? PROTIP: When you spout leftie propaganda, you sound like a leftie propagandist. PROTIP: When you end every comment with a tag line and no substantive commentary you look like a douche-nozzle. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 3:52:39 PM EDT
[#20]
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Thank you. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No. Bin Laden not only never got US support,he was antagonistic from the get-go. He was opposed to the West's support of the mujahideen and the deployment of coalition forces to KSA was one of the things that he used to justify attacking the west: infidels in the holy land. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Thank you. But that's not what Noam Chomsky said! |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 4:06:11 PM EDT
[#21]
Shia v. Sunni.
Let 'em duke it out and bleed each other. Just enough fucks given to make this post. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 4:09:39 PM EDT
[#22]
I'm going to seriously make some calls. We have some groups that have been working with the Iraqis. Wondering how much they would want for an Abrams?
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Posted: 7/14/2014 4:31:02 PM EDT
[#23]
What...The...Fuck!
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Posted: 7/14/2014 4:41:17 PM EDT
[#24]
What an incompetent bunch of fools we have leading our government now.
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Posted: 7/14/2014 5:29:35 PM EDT
[#25]
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I'm going to seriously make some calls. We have some groups that have been working with the Iraqis. Wondering how much they would want for an Abrams? The Iraqis probably agreed to no resale with the US Government. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 5:50:08 PM EDT
[#26]
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The Iraqis probably agreed to no resale with the US Government. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I'm going to seriously make some calls. We have some groups that have been working with the Iraqis. Wondering how much they would want for an Abrams? The Iraqis probably agreed to no resale with the US Government. Inshallah. Sell that fucking thing. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 6:57:34 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Agreed, but it sucks anyway. It's a mark of pride that your nations symbols of power have perfect or nearly perfect combat records. I'm just glad that, last I heard, the Iraqis weren't getting those F-16s after all. They would doubtlessly ruin its combat record too. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: doing some quick reading, it appears that the US supplied the Iraqis 140 refurbished Abrams between 2010 and 2012. Janes from June 20 (old out of date information at this point) states at least 28 were damaged/destroyed here... http://www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed It would be interesting to know just how many have been knocked out by now since I recall reading a few days ago someone's propaganda (ISIS I'm guessing) was 'the end of the US Abrams tank in Iraq is here" or something along those lines. A nearly perfect combat record... Completely ruined. I don't think we can blame the tank itself on this one. Agreed, but it sucks anyway. It's a mark of pride that your nations symbols of power have perfect or nearly perfect combat records. I'm just glad that, last I heard, the Iraqis weren't getting those F-16s after all. They would doubtlessly ruin its combat record too. They got Cessna 172's, that is probably about all they can handle. |
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Posted: 7/14/2014 11:10:59 PM EDT
[#28]
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PROTIP: When you end every comment with a tag line and no substantive commentary you look like a douche-nozzle. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? PROTIP: When you spout leftie propaganda, you sound like a leftie propagandist. PROTIP: When you end every comment with a tag line and no substantive commentary you look like a douche-nozzle. By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? Try harder, next time. |
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Posted: 7/15/2014 10:16:43 AM EDT
[#29]
A short clip from an hour-long video showing ISIS forces attacking Iraqi armored vehicles.
In order of appearance the vehicles are: 1. Abrams 2. Abrams 3. T-62 4. Abrams 5. BMP-1 6. T-72 7. M-577 http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f88_1402790352 |
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Posted: 7/15/2014 10:18:38 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
A short clip from an hour-long video showing ISIS forces attacking Iraqi armored vehicles.
In order of appearance the vehicles are: 1. Abrams 2. Abrams 3. T-62 4. Abrams 5. BMP-1 6. T-72 7. M-577 http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f88_1402790352 Was that first missile a TOW? |
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Posted: 7/15/2014 10:25:00 AM EDT
[#31]
ISIS terrorists beheading a magician
this man was practicing magic and he's from Aleppo. so according to their sharia law, this man should be beheaded by a sword. http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=092_1405396353 Alrighty then...
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Posted: 7/15/2014 10:26:24 AM EDT
[#32]
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Was that first missile a TOW? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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A short clip from an hour-long video showing ISIS forces attacking Iraqi armored vehicles.
In order of appearance the vehicles are: 1. Abrams 2. Abrams 3. T-62 4. Abrams 5. BMP-1 6. T-72 7. M-577 http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f88_1402790352 Was that first missile a TOW? This one is a TOW vs. T-62. http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b70_1404500087 |
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Posted: 7/15/2014 10:29:39 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Oh for fucks sake |
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Posted: 7/15/2014 10:33:01 AM EDT
[#34]
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Monkey Models...........Steel armor not Chobham. Does the Iraqi Army have no fight at all in it? They make the ARVN look ferocious. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I cannot believe we gave those fuckers Abrams Monkey Models...........Steel armor not Chobham. Does the Iraqi Army have no fight at all in it? They make the ARVN look ferocious. 
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:13:00 PM EDT
[#35]
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Try harder, next time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? PROTIP: When you spout leftie propaganda, you sound like a leftie propagandist. PROTIP: When you end every comment with a tag line and no substantive commentary you look like a douche-nozzle. By whom were the ARVN's trained, equipped, advised and supported? Try harder, next time. PROTIP: If you have nothing substantive to add, repeatedly using the same nonsensical line is not a replacement for actual knowledge. |
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:15:43 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not saying that they were like the Wehrmacht, but they were significantly more capable than the IA. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The South Vietnamese actually fought. What is saving Iraq - as it exists- is that there aren't enough ISIS to go around. Many of their Iraqi Sunni supporters only want Malaki gone but aren't willing to go all in to spread jihad and do that whole Caliphate thing so their support is only local.Why they think they're going to be left alone by ISIS is a question most haven't yet asked themselves I don't reckon. I honestly thought that the IA would find it's footing by now,just on weight of numbers + Shia militia and Iranians allowing it to find fighting form. I sure didn't think they'd have retaken Fallujah already but was expecting that ISIS would have mostly burned itself out by now. It would never,ever,ever be allowed to happen but I think I know who could have turned the IA around: rehabilitate this guy http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra'ad_al-Hamdani but ain't noooooooo waaaaaaaaaaaaaay that'd happen. The lack of leadership and experience is a top down problem but the Catch 22 is the experienced and relatively capable guys sort of have some unacceptable blood on their hands. IMO the only thing that could have saved Iraq from this was creating a new sense of Iraqi nationalism over local and sectarian loyalties. This would have meant getting rehabbed Baathists and former regime supporters onboard though. Read up on the Shia general who was "leading" the troops defending Mosul...The prime example of everything that went wrong with rebuilding the IA. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Sure did. Fought their fucking asses off at Xuan Loc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Xu%C3%A2n_L%E1%BB%99c From the beginning of 1975, North Vietnam's military forces swept through the northern provinces of South Vietnam virtually unopposed. In the Central Highlands, South Vietnam's II Corps Tactical Zone was completely destroyed, whilst attempting to evacuate to the Mekong Delta region. In the cities of Hu? and Da Nang, ARVN units simply dissolved without putting up resistance.[6] The South Vietnamese had some solid units, but were unreliable overall. There was too much corruption and politicking going on just like in Iraq. Throwing money men and material at a government won't magically make it stable. I'm not saying that they were like the Wehrmacht, but they were significantly more capable than the IA. No argument here. |
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:19:13 PM EDT
[#37]
Did we forget to give the Iraqis ammo or what? These Abrams cant blast a few Toyotas or what?
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:20:16 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did we forget to give the Iraqis ammo or what? These Abrams cant blast a few Toyotas or what? We gave them ammo, we forgot to give them balls. |
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:25:15 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How about the Arabs that seem to be winning...do they suck? I'd argue the Syrians are hanging in there, against the odds anyone would have put on them before the war. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: ..It's entirely cultural why Arabs suck at war. How about the Arabs that seem to be winning...do they suck? I'd argue the Syrians are hanging in there, against the odds anyone would have put on them before the war. The only time Arab's win is when they are fighting other Arabs. Even in those times it's not generally overwhelming victory. |
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:36:24 PM EDT
[#40]
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:54:42 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Didn't we actually work with and support bin laden at some point, or is that just random bullshit people spew? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: This is entertainment at this point. I don't see any great threat from ISIS anyway. They will never take over the Kurdish or Shia/Iran-supported majority areas, etc so they are essentially boxed in. Plus, to the extent that Iran is occupied propping up Assad and their surrogates in Iraq, ISIS serves some useful purpose. Guarantee you at least one person at the CIA has had the "bright idea" to try to work with ISIS to push Maliki out, over throw Assad, and undermine Iran's influence. Wouldn't be the first time the CIA worked hand in hand with Islamic nutjobs to fight a proxy war against a rival (see Afghanistan / Russia). Whether or not anyone in the CIA would be stupid enough to go forward with such a plan is another matter. Didn't we actually work with and support bin laden at some point, or is that just random bullshit people spew? No. Some CIA type met him once, and it didn't take long to figure that OBL already had the crazy. The people we worked with more or less formed what we would call the northern alliance when we went back into 'stan. The Taliban was always a paki thing.
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:56:56 PM EDT
[#42]
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I cannot believe we gave those fuckers Abrams That's it. I've lost all faith in anyone in power in our country having the slightest bit of sense.... |
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Posted: 7/16/2014 1:59:26 PM EDT
[#43]
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We gave them the best equipment that American ingenuity could build and American dollars could buy, we made sure that they were paid and trained, and this is how they perform when they're called on to put all that technology and training to use: they abandon their brand new equipment, throw down their weapons (unfired) and flee at the first sign of the enemy. Gutless, incompetent, wasteful, disgusting and stupid. You'd almost think they were French! |
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Posted: 7/16/2014 2:01:45 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The South Vietnamese actually fought. What is saving Iraq - as it exists- is that there aren't enough ISIS to go around. Many of their Iraqi Sunni supporters only want Malaki gone but aren't willing to go all in to spread jihad and do that whole Caliphate thing so their support is only local.Why they think they're going to be left alone by ISIS is a question most haven't yet asked themselves I don't reckon. I honestly thought that the IA would find it's footing by now,just on weight of numbers + Shia militia and Iranians allowing it to find fighting form. I sure didn't think they'd have retaken Fallujah already but was expecting that ISIS would have mostly burned itself out by now. It would never,ever,ever be allowed to happen but I think I know who could have turned the IA around: rehabilitate this guy http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra'ad_al-Hamdani but ain't noooooooo waaaaaaaaaaaaaay that'd happen. The lack of leadership and experience is a top down problem but the Catch 22 is the experienced and relatively capable guys sort of have some unacceptable blood on their hands. IMO the only thing that could have saved Iraq from this was creating a new sense of Iraqi nationalism over local and sectarian loyalties. This would have meant getting rehabbed Baathists and former regime supporters onboard though. Read up on the Shia general who was "leading" the troops defending Mosul...The prime example of everything that went wrong with rebuilding the IA. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile If Paul fucking Bremmer is running anything bigger than a lemonade stand, he's out of his depth. He's pretty much directly responsible for this shit.
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Posted: 7/16/2014 2:16:27 PM EDT
[#45]
Iraqi "Army."
*snort* |
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Posted: 7/18/2014 8:17:46 PM EDT
[#46]
ISIS seems to like to burn captured equipment more than take it.
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Posted: 7/18/2014 10:19:46 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Agreed, but it sucks anyway. It's a mark of pride that your nations symbols of power have perfect or nearly perfect combat records. I'm just glad that, last I heard, the Iraqis weren't getting those F-16s after all. They would doubtlessly ruin its combat record too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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doing some quick reading, it appears that the US supplied the Iraqis 140 refurbished Abrams between 2010 and 2012. Janes from June 20 (old out of date information at this point) states at least 28 were damaged/destroyed here... http://www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed It would be interesting to know just how many have been knocked out by now since I recall reading a few days ago someone's propaganda (ISIS I'm guessing) was 'the end of the US Abrams tank in Iraq is here" or something along those lines. A nearly perfect combat record... Completely ruined. I don't think we can blame the tank itself on this one. Agreed, but it sucks anyway. It's a mark of pride that your nations symbols of power have perfect or nearly perfect combat records. I'm just glad that, last I heard, the Iraqis weren't getting those F-16s after all. They would doubtlessly ruin its combat record too. Give me a 10k sniper rifle and if I fail to hit the target at a 150 yards, probably not the rifle's fault. Anyone who blames this on the tanks is probably an Iraqi General trying to cover his own ass. |
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Posted: 7/19/2014 11:20:24 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
PROTIP: If you have nothing substantive to add, repeatedly using the same nonsensical line is not a replacement for actual knowledge. Tell me about the Easter Offensive in 1972. What is your basis for comparing the ARVN to the IA? Or, is this more gun show knowledge? |
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Posted: 7/19/2014 11:22:36 AM EDT
[#49]
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The only time Arab's win is when they are fighting other Arabs. Even in those times it's not generally overwhelming victory. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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..It's entirely cultural why Arabs suck at war. How about the Arabs that seem to be winning...do they suck? I'd argue the Syrians are hanging in there, against the odds anyone would have put on them before the war. The only time Arab's win is when they are fighting other Arabs. Even in those times it's not generally overwhelming victory. LH fought well against Israel in 2008, and the Egyptians were doing well in '73 until the Israelis got lucky, and the Israelis got REALLY lucky on the Golan at the same time. |
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Posted: 7/19/2014 11:43:20 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ISIS get a new ride http://www.longwarjournal.org/assets_c/2014/07/IS-Anbar-Armor-ambush9-thumb-560x356-3403.jpg Is the garbage can on top where they store their AKs when they aren't using them? |
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