The one that gets 2500fps out of my 16" barrel, and isn't even hot. (46,500psi)

Factory 120gr Federal Match is doing 2384fps at 15ft from the muzzle out of my 12" Grendel.

I haven't even shot any of the high BC projectiles from my 12" Grendel yet.  It's all been factory ammo with some of the lowest BCs available in 120 and 123gr for 6.5mm, and I'm getting boring hits at 800yds with a 1-4x scope.

Like I said, in 2018, if you're still considering 6.8 as a new customer, it just doesn't make any sense.  For the guys that already have it and it's doing everything they want, there's no shame in that.

I would suggest to update the old mantra about "no advantage until 400yds, 500yds, paper punching only", and the set of false statements that were made after the Blackwater demo put the 6.8 to shame.

You can hot load a 6.8 and shoot them side by side on steel and hear which one impacts louder, then as the distance increases, see which one has to compensate more for wind and impact with less energy.  Within 200yds, POI will be practically the same between all centerfire cartridges with the same zero, and this is generally true at 300yds as well, with .22-250 and .30-30 Win being the outliers on the top and bottom.

Grendel will have more retained energy on target, even if it's slight from 75-100yds on out, then clearly have more retained energy at 150yds, 200yds, and so forth.

Of all the 12.5” G data on the web, I have never seen those speeds posted. That looks like 18” speeds.

Arf thread

A 3R 18” 6.8II with the same loads gains 200 FPS.

I had a 12.5G barrel from the Grendel forum group buy, but sold it; I’ve read your stuff and the G forums for years. Not that the G is inferior, but in my SBR and hunting (not banging steel) it didn’t offer an advantage.

But, whatever.

ETA: unlike the G, The 6.8 does have the advantage of excellent 28 round mags. When my SBR isn’t hunting, it makes and excellent camp defense gun.

So what is the recipe? I’d like to try it.

I have a 6.8 I pieced together.  It's lights out/drt for anything I shoot with it at short/medium ranges.

But based on your second criteria, I'd lean more towards 6.5G.  It will have less drop/drift than 6.8 at 500 & more yards.

The "ammo availability" debate is just that.  In some areas of the country, you'll find more 6.8 on shelves than 6.5G, and in other areas of the country, it's the reverse, more 6.5G than 6.8.

Regardless of which round you choose, you would be best served by hand loading to ring the utmost accuracy out of the rifle.  If you're not going to handload, then I'd likely lean 6.5G and buy ammo online.

Having said all of the above, if I had it to do over again, I'd likely go with a 12" upper on a pistol braced lower & LPVO in 6.5G, due to current market/ammo availability vs. distance/range & LR accuracy potential.  That's not to say 6.8 is "bad" as it's been perfect for everything I've asked of it to this point (Hogs, Deer, coyotes, etc. <200 yds), and it does very well in short barrels for sub <500 yd ranges.  For 500 and longer, 6.5G wins in the drop & drift categories.

JMO & YMMV.

At 500 yards the 6.8 has about 617 foot pounds of energy left.  While that would certainly kill small game, and eventually kill larger game with a good hit, I'm not sure I would want to shoot at animals much bigger than a coyote, or 2 legged varmints with that low of energy.    I was under the impression that most ethical hunters want more than 700-800 foot pounds of energy for taking game like deer, and antelope.  I suppose it all depends on what one is hunting, and one's own decision about what constitutes ethical hunting.

In my 16", I did pressure ladders with CFE223 and 123gr AMAX many years ago. 1x Lapua brass, Rem 7 1/2 SRPs, loaded to 2.275" COL.

CFE223 formulation in more recent lots seems more energetic to me, so I wouldn't use this data, but start with start loads like I did previous to these ladders.  These were all speeds at 15ft from the muzzle over a Chrony Beta.

31.1gr 2489fps (45,711psi)
31.4gr 2520fps
31.7gr 2532fps
32.0gr 2553fps (50,484psi)

18" Grendel with 123gr Hornady factory ammo across multiple rifles has always been in the 2440-2490fps range for me and many others.  Not sure what was going on with that thread in the ammo section, but the numbers are hundreds of fps slower than anything I've seen.  If you free-recoil the gun and let it move rearward, you'll get slower recorded velocities, but not 200fps slower.

Factory 123gr Scenar from AA did 2330fps from David Fortier's first 12.5" Grendel, at sub-freezing temps.

With CFE223 or Leverevolution, hitting 2410fps with 123gr isn't hard.  Like I said, the Federal 120gr Match is already averaging 2384fps at 15ft from the muzzle, and that's a factory load.  Some of the readings were 2411fps and 2406fps in that string.

I don't need to push it though, with the BC doing the most of the work, so I personally like it when my brass comes out looking new, like my 31.2gr CFE223 load does with 123gr AMAX from Lapua brass.  Whether my retained energy overtakes a hot-loaded 120gr 6.8 at 75yds or 100yds, I don't care, because either will kill at those ranges.

The factory ammo has been doing so well and is so affordable, I haven't been loading anywhere near as much as I used to.  Just got a bunch of 123gr ELD-M for $16.49/box shipped over the holidays.  Sportsman's has 123gr American Gunner for 70cpr in 200rd ammo boxes.  They sell it like crack.

It might just as easily have 700 or 400ftlbs.  Foot pounds don't make an ethical kill.  If I take a 60 yard shot with a 357 Magnum it might have 400ftlbs or 120 yard shot with a 30-30 carbine at 700 I expect either to do fine if I do my part.  You have to know where to put the bullet to do the most good, place it accordingly and it has function as you expect.

That’s a nice load.

ETA: I am going to have to get a 12.5 G again and try that load; are those velocities taken at sea level or the 7000+ ft you usually shoot? Can on or off?  Because those speeds simply are not matching up with anything I am seeing online.

I didn't know I was wading into the deep part of the pool with this topic. I'm very new to this idea of "a different cartridge in an AR platform."

When I was young, my dad was Mr. 308, and my grandpa was Mr. 30.06. There was nothing else as far as I knew. Then when I got older, my dad was on a .338 Rem Mag kick, & that was what we hunted with for many years. So for a long time, it was you can shoot anything you think you can hit under 1000 yds because the .338 can take it down. Of course this was ridiculous, as I didn't practice enough to do that, so I never shot at anything. And the only time I was ever successful was stalking an animal I had seen, & the longest shot I ever took and was successful was 300 yds at a Pronghorn. I took my Oryx from 50 yds with a 30.06 (it took 4 shots to get him on the ground.) My FIL has a cabin near Datil, NM which is very close to VLA, it's as flat as a pancake out there. I plan on hunting out there in the next few years, & a long shot out there would be 500yrds if not more. So, obviously I need rethink the yardage or cartridge.

Anyway, the .338 rifle was heavy, kicked like a mule, & ammo was expensive, so I go rid of it. Very shortly after my hunting days became fewer & fewer, with the birth of my son & moving to a new state. I got into black rifles in the years after, they were cool, but I couldn't see myself hunting with it. My son is of hunting age now, & I'd like to take him. But I want a MSR vs a bolt action. Something light, handy, maneuverable, & packs a punch. Hence my now curiosity of something different in an AR platform. I figured 500 yds was the max for these rounds for animals under 200+lbs, so I'm not opposed to shaving that figure down to match what I can afford or want to shoot.

Main thing is I want something I can take into the woods, that fits the above criteria. And I'm absolutely all for teaching my son to hunt ethically with tools that are made for the job. My dads idea of hunting was canyon blasting. Which is, sit up high, glass, glass, glass, see something, range it, aim, shoot at it. Not how I want to do it.

This thread has given me much to think about. I appreciate everyone's input

6.5 Grendel with the 129gr ABLR is plenty capable at 500yds, as long as you get trigger time with it and use successful approaches to making predictable hits at 500yds.

I would recommend at least an 18" barrel for that.  I personally can make those shots with regularity, but I've been shooting long range for a long time on a frequent basis.  For a newer shooter who was planning on regularly hunting from 300-500yds, I would suggest stalking closer to your prey.

If the terrain is such that you expect to encounter a lot of 300-500yd shots, then go with a longer barrel and train, train, train.

A 6.5CM will do better in that range, as it adds about 200yds effective reach.

Since you mention wanting to teach your son, I would lean back on the Grendel again.  He can get a lot of trigger time with the Grendel as you spot, and you'll become a much more effective hunting pair.  I would strongly recommend taking a precision rifle course, and there are several Nationally-renowned instructors and locations in Texas.  Rifles Only is one of them.  Todd Hodnett is another.

Lol, LRRPF52, Mr. 33,000 posts himself finally showed up, copy-and-paste diatribes loaded up and FIRE! Surprised it took you this long.

Welp, there goes the thread. No one can compete with the sheer volume of verbal ammunition this guy has. He's already expounding the virtues of his $2.14 per round ABLR wonder round that we'll all shoot at 900 yards. Next he'll be talking about how cheap it is to shoot with Wolf steel cased ammo.

Since we're in General this time...

Do you have data that contradicts his or something? Srs question

Yes, as do many others, and has been posted a dozen times but Mr. 33,000 posts just beats everyone into submission with his mile long posts of tortured rationale.

We've all posted our chrono data, barrel lengths, hunting results, ammo availability, etc, etc, time and time again.

-Stooxie

I went 6.8 years ago. Have used pretty exclusively for deer and pig. I just bagged 2 whitetail last weekend. Attached File


ETA: I just built a 6.5g. Haven't shot it yet.

We all have opinions, many from real world experience over time.

LRRPF52 has done exceptional work with the info he has shared on long range shooting, and the use of the Grendel in that role.  I was a 6.8 user before I saw his reloading data using CFE got me on the 6.5G train.

The above quote has lots of wisdom, and some group think(Alinsky Democratic drivel), when someone says in 2018 6.8 isn't worth it, I chuckle, sounds Like obama stating that climate change is our biggest fear, and 97% of scientists agree, lol

The Grendel is good enough to stand alone by it self, the Grendel doesn't need the propaganda!!!!!!!!!!

Both the 6.8 and Grendel ROCK, and both made each other better!

The 6.8 had a rough start, but with AR*, Art of SSA and a TX Dr hog hunter it grew.  What can a 6.8 do better than a Grendel, for me, Six8 14.5 pinned, 30 rd pmags and SSA 85 TSX ammo, PREMIERE PDW, I think Pmags and PRI mags are prime time, other 6.8 mags and 6.5G mags SUCK.

Loosing SSA, really has sucked for the 6.8, SSA Brass very good(pre Nosler), the 95 TTSX doesn't suck and blem bullets(oh the gold dots) for the reloader are around.

The Grendel is peaking now, LRRPF52 and the grendel forum has lots of info, no need to go it alone.  My first barrels in G were 6.5 Garps, 18 inch stainless, with factory Hornady ammo 123 gr at less than$1 a round.  They grouped well.  I was a little concerned about the MV at 2450 fps, but after the first prairie shoot in windy WY, damm that is a good round in the AR-15.  I shot out both those barrels, 15k rounds combined shooting the nosler 123 CCs, and lost to many LaPua cases :(

At the same time I was also rocking a 20 inch 6.8 shooting 115 CCs, over 10k rounds later, that nitride barrel still gets it done(I ran out of cheap CCs, lol) The cheap once fired cases from LWRCi were key here, loosing brass didn't hurt as bad!

This is funny, but I also brought a 300 BLK, 18 inch Nitride barrel, shooting 125 Nosler BT Blems at 2300fps (total blast spinning knobs)  The 300 Hamr looks nice, loosing 5.56 cases shooting 147FMJs or 125 blems won't suck.

Ya, BC does matter in the wind, but overall the wind won, suckage.  Past 700 yards, shooting up to 30mph full value the G even suffered(0 to 300 yards, the 107 scenars were EASY to score hits).  The G did show an improvement over the 115 CCs in the 6.8(rocking AA2200 powder), and the 6.8 and G was huge improvement over the BLK except the giggle factor. Sometimes right at dawn, no wind, the G is a hoot to shoot long range, and with no wind, you could hear hits on steel and rocks past 1000 yards.

For hunting or general shooting, the 6.8 110 AB doesn't suck, I then moved to the 130gr Scirocco for hunting in the G, wow.  the 129 ABLR I think is also a game changer.  Hunting is more the hunter vs gear, the G and 6.8 get it done in the AR, we are lucky to have them.  Is the G twice as good, lol, no, but it does have slightly better hunting ballistics, but the hunter is the key, not the cartridge. G bullet tech is still advancing in the heavies!!!!!!!!!!

For someone to get into the game now, ya I think 6.5G has the edge, but weight some factors.

do you have family or friends that reload or you hunt with either the 6.8 or G?
Long range steel shooter or practicing long range?
Availability of ammo at local shops?
Availability of barrels and bolts?

Currently I don't have a Grendel,  LRRPF52 is currently testing and sharing data on a 12 inch Grendel build, it doesn't suck, I think I'll go 14.5 pinned next(has to be Nitride), or a 16 lol. My Daughters next rifle will be a Grendel to.  Not for PDW, but as great shooters and we like long range shooting(I'm still living in my daughters basement in Utah, stroke recovery, and shooting and reloading is STROKE recovery!!) We ride dirt bikes to, but I can't ride for shit on the dirt yet.

I still use 6.8 on hogs, I like more hammer than the BLK has, I still want a better hog 5.56 cased round, loosing 5.56 brass is a non issue, I've resisted the big bores, still want 30 rounds on tap in case I'm sucking and missing, lol.

On a side note, the 77gr in a 5.56 ROCKS, but in the WY wind at range, it's not G good!!!!!!!!!!!

OP, build the rifle of your dreams, don't skimp and enjoy.  building another upper in the opposing caliber won't suck either(the ARF way, buy both)

In the end, The G needs a better mag! ( I had great luck loading Gs in a 6.8 PRI mag, 4 to 5 at a time, no jams, lol)

Still on the fence in the 6mm dept, I'm waiting for more development.

We have it Soooooo good now, in 2 to 4 years will we still have caliber debates as we are converting our semi's into pump actions?  Of course we will !!

tldr:  lol

To all that promoted, tested, produced and shared about the 6.8 and 6.5G, I salute you.

100% typical LR bullshit.  You sir are not the only one here with behind-the-scenes knowledge.  However, you do stand out in promoting incorrect info...and have for years and years.
Oh, I'm sorry, I mistakenly thought this was a 6.8 thread.

He has to promote his 6.5 Grendel reloading guides (Volumes I and II), classes, and whatever other financial interests that only seem to get the 6.8 guy banned for life. Why else do you think he has 33,000 posts in just the last couple years? (Which you can tell by looking at the post count from older threads). Who the fuck has that kind of time and vested interest in promoting product? The very definition of shilling.

Sorry, you have to buy his book to find out.

-Stooxie

Ooooooooh now we are cooking with gas. Let’s get this party started!

A substantial portion of those posts are helping people troubleshooting their various AR10 problems, Retro AR15 discussions, The Fast & Furious Thread, Discussions on Machinegunnery, and many other subjects in the tech forums.

Sorry you got tricked into buying into a mongoloid retard cartridge pimped by guys who had to rely on fraud and lies to get it promoted.

Ooooo, dang, we touched a nerve! Yes, we've exposed that your real mission is to increase your own customer base. Mine is just to have people understand fact from fiction. Your arguments fail every high school debate class test. Apples compared to oranges, old data compared to new, SINGULAR examples extrapolated into generalizations (as excerpts from your own book caution several times), waiving off obvious differences in favor of your narrative, etc, etc.

Whatever... I really don't care what people shoot. It's just too bad that folks can't get honest information and then the rest of us have to deal with it.

ETA: I should add that there's nothing wrong with trying to increase your customer base, but I believe arfcom has a designation for clearly indicating vendors. Then people will know the understandable bias behind the posts.

-Stooxie

Why can't you name a single example from what I talk about above as being incorrect?

Is it that you refuse to do it, don't know, or what?

Of course I'm not the only one who saw behind-the-scenes ongoings of the failure and fraud being perpetrated with 6.8 SPC.  It was documented by:

AMU: Ammunition purchasing and transfer fraud resulting in the firing of one particular employee
FBI: Attempts to hoodwink the senior FBI ballistics lab tech with a varmint bullet passed off as OTM
****:  Pyramid testing showed multiple pressure containment failures.
USASOC: Promoters were told to pound sand and had to be escorted off post.
Western Powders:  They conducted and documented pressure testing between SAAMI and SPC II chambers, finding no considerable difference and only 19fps change in mv from a 24" barrel.
USMC:  6.8 promoters attempted to rig testing against 6.5 Grendel by setting up purchases of pallets of 123gr PPU soft point ammo and AA 10.5" Grendel uppers.
UK MoD:  After being booted from every professional circle in the US within DoD, they flew to the UK to meet up with MoD small arms development people and told them, "This is going to be the next NATO service rifle cartridge, so you had better get your tooling and industry set up for manufacture or you're going to get left behind."
SHOT Show:  "Shhhhhhhhhh!!!!  We can't talk about it because it's a top secret SOCOM project, but there's this new cartridge called the 6.8x43 that fixes all the weakness of 5.56 NATO.  It's being adopted as we speak by some of the most secret personnel you've never heard of, killing people downrange.  We can't tell you this, but if you want to be on the forefront, you better start making guns now.   Oh, by the way.  There's this other cartridge called 6.5 Grendel.  Avoid it like the plague.  It's a crappy target round that isn't good for anything but punching paper.  Stay AWAY!  We warned you."

It's not just one thing here and there.  It's a laundry list of egregious behavior that defies comprehension as to why someone would conduct themselves like this to promote a product.  Then when called out on it, it's someone else's fault.  Adults were doing this.

I have nothing to add to the never ending purse swinging fight between 6.8 and 6.5.

At LEAST 80% of shooters will not know a difference, because 80% will not shoot beyond 200 yards. Of the 80%, maybe half will confirm their zero and shoot to 200 at the range once a year. Otherwise they're likely shooting a deer at 100 or less. They love the SHTF pipe dream of pulling out their 6.5g and popping deer and bad guys at 3,4,5, 600 yards while eating a twinkie in their box blind.

That is all.

What I don't do is publicly list customer info "to punish them" on an open forum, which is what got your buddy banned for life here.

There was an incident where that guy sent a bunch of 7.62x39 bolts to a customer that learned about him via AR15.com.

There was some kind of snafu with the credit card, so instead of handling it like a grown adult, the customer's info was posted and he warned everybody not to do business with that customer.  It came to the attention of moderators, and he was banned for insane conduct that only a mental patient would do.  Then he tried to come back with a dealer account and get around the ban, and got that account banned as well.

Then he kept showing up with retread accounts, always with the same angle, steering people towards 6.8 SPC II revision 5 with the special throat that gives you magic 200fps more mv.  When those accounts were all burned, he made open promotions on 6.8 forums for AR15.com members to come here and shill for him.  First shill that got a sale wins a muzzle brake.  This was posted in the open over there, if you can believe it.

So to equate that with me as a site-approved trainer and my legitimate conduct shows what level of mental capacity we're dealing with here.  Again, chalk it up to the trend in behavior I've seen from guys like this going on for well over a decade.  It's like watching juveniles in adult bodies who never thought past 7th grade.

"mongoloid retard cartridge"... But it's not personal

I'm in a similar position of trying to figure what hunting gun to put together next. It will probably be a 12" Grendel. The reality is there isn't as much difference in hunting cartridges as people like to make it out to be. Most of them will kill  most of them just as dead. You will likely never notice a difference in the field between a 6.5 Grendel or a 6.8 SPC. Of all the variables in the field, cartridge is pretty far down the list.

If you think reloading handbooks are a great way to make money, you clearly know nothing about book sales and revenue.

I have products that are actual money makers that I never mention here because they're mostly B2B.  I sell them by the pallet load and you've never heard a peep about them.

If the performance advantage was in favor of 6.8, I would have jumped on the wagon and done 6.8 SPC handbooks.  There is no money, at least for me, in reloading handbooks.  A complete ignoramus would have to believe that someone was trying to enrich themselves with a reloading handbook scheme.  If you do even an unrealistic sales volume projection, you'll always come up short.

So that leaves your shill accusation out flapping in the wind like a .36 BC .227" bullet struggling to find a target.

I picked up a 12.5" woa 6.8 barrel, bolt, a couple of mags and a set of dies over time in the ee here.

I wanted to build a ~200 yard and in hunting rifle for deer.  I haven't assembled it or bought any components yet. Lol

I figured that for my purpose, it didn't matter much 6.8 vs 6.5. I kind of wish that I'd have found deals on Grendel stuff first, as I kind of want a light bolt gun chambered in 6.5 now.

Has anyone killed anything bigger than a deer with a 6.8?  I've heard of an elk kill with the 6.5, but nothing with the 6.8 besides hogs and deer

I was on 68 forums and here back 10 years ago.  At that time, the velocity and energy of the 6.8 smoked the 6.5.  It was not even close.  If, as you state, LR, that the 6.5 wasn't fairly tested, it wouldn't mattered.  The 6.5G was downright anemic in comparison.

How did things turn around?  SSA quit making TAC loads after Nosler bought them.  I suppose the lawyers in the ammo industry are still scared to assume all SAAMI spec chambers are not out of service, so they download the commercial ammo.

The 6.8 has always performed way better with handloads.  Heck, the difference between Art's (SSA) regular and TAC loads was about 1 grain, which gave appox another 100 fps.

I vividly remember H spanking you on here and 68forums with ballistics charts 10 years ago.  I also remember that you would not accept his challenge:  6.8SPC v. 6.5G at distance.

Both catridges went through various chamber designs.  The 6.5G even saw 2 different bolt designs.  Was Western Powder's testing done with a correct chamber instead of the original with the cone angle error?  It does seem that the 1 in 10 twist didn't affect velocity as much as thought when group of regular guys did the experiments to improve the original 6.8 over 10 years ago.  The apparent myth about 6.5G needing long barrels was started by the creator, Bill Alexander, himself.

I don't remember shitting on any 6.5G threads.  However, you seems to seek 6.8 threads out to tout your beloved cartridge and bury newcommers with cut and paste.

We occaisionly cross paths helping others on 308 AR issues.  You are very helpful and we've not had any disagreements regarding 308s.  However, in 6.8 threads, that's a different story.

Newcommers, don't listen to us, do your own research.

Both are intermediate cartridges, so they aren't the right tool for larger game.  I have heard black bear taken with 6.8.

I built a Recce-style 6.8 SPC about 5 years ago. I've hunted with it exclusively (my two brothers have snagged it when able) and have taken deer, hog, black bear, and all vary of predators. It drops everything. Furthest shot was 335 yards.

I like it. And I certainly plan on continuing to use it.

H has never "spanked me with ballistics charts".  You're talking about a guy who openly posted how he had to pull brass fragments from his chin when shooting his hand loads.

The retard challenge of showing up to a single person's place of choosing is easily settled in open competitions run by third parties.  You can hot load a 6.8 until brass fragments out of the split receivers, and it still is going to lose to BC.  Why not show up to an open LR fun event with a 6.8 SPC?  Because it will not connect with targets well at all.

Only someone with a mental disorder would suggest meeting you at their property for a challenge as to which one will out-do the other.

The comparisons back then were based on the premise that 6.8 did better than 6.5 Grendel from shorter barrels. Since the majority of people with 6.5 Grendel had 20-24" barrels, the 16" barrel velocities didn't get much attention.

In all honesty, not much has changed in terms of velocity either.  It just wasn't recognized or understood, because most of the arguments are still stuck in an mv mindset, instead of what the velocity is at 50yds, 75yds, 100yds, 150yds, or 200yds...distances where it actually matters.

People couldn't see that the 6.8 was overtaken not too far from the muzzle, because they only knew to compare based on muzzle velocity, which was normally within 20-80fps from the same barrels with the same bullet.

Once a person graduates from the mv comparison mindset as I had to, you'll see what I'm talking about.

6.8 soft points mushroom bigger than a comparable 6.5 does.  I could care less about performance past 200m, I live in the Ozarks.

In a self defense scenario, I cannot justify shooting someone 200 yards away, or probably 75 yards away for that matter.  I would not take a shot at a game animal greater than 200 yards away, not ethically anyways.  I could give a damn about shooting paper, just not my thing.  Anything beyond 200 just does not matter.

6.8 SPC is great for hunting less than 200yrds in brush due to bullet weight and ballistics. For a defense / military weapon its superior to the 5.56. There are a few USA Mfr's that picked up on the military advantages and have made huge money. when it comes to rifle sales and polymer magazines.  I have a 6.8SPC and a 6.5G AR, each has their purpose  and given a choice I'd take a 6.5G for what I do which is open country shooting/hunting.

My 6.8 does everything I could want out to 400yds in an AR15 package. Would do again.

I took a wander through 65grendel.com to ejumicate myself on the magic of the round. I found myself wading through the Troubleshooting forum and I definitely found the magic!

Almost 9 years worth of broken bolts, broken extractors, FTFs, FTEs, bad mags, FTRTB, accuracy problems, stuck rounds, stuck bolts, short stroking, single round feed vs mag feed, etc, etc.

Two things are amazingly consistent:
1. Over all 23 pages, 10,000 replies, and 11 years, the same problems are posted on page 1 as on page 23. Seems like nothing has changed over all this time.
2. Mr. 33,000+6000 posts is there every single time to say "Wah? No, no, that's not the problem. It must be something else."

Then I took a look through 68forums to compare. There isn't a Troubleshooting section, specifically, so I combed through the technical 6.8 forum. I'll leave it to the reader to make the comparison, if that's even possible.

Maybe I'm just jealous

-Stooxie

I can't vouch for #2, but the rest conforms to my view of the situation (even if I might have phrased it differently).

I think much of the bolt breakage are people trying to load to meet optimistic velocites.

I don't really think that is a fair read on the situation.

First, the internet bias.  People go to forums with problems, but the 1,000's of people that are happy generally don't post up happy outcomes.  Just like here.

Read this board, and one would think we are all angry, bitter divorced men that never get to see our kids because our ex-wives are lying whores, when the reality is that many of us are happily married to stable women.

Second, while I love the 6.5 Board, there are some true nuts over there.  Bad reloading practices and trying to make the 6.5 perform like a .260.  Even after Bill A. told us not to trust a certain reloading software package, people would use the software and put together very hot rounds.  If it did not blow up their gun, they called it good, published it, and others followed blindly with some bad outcomes.

Some of those folks did not understand the differences b/w AK brass and G brass, so that too led some into choppy waters.

Similarly, in the early days, there was only Bill A/AA as a source of reloading data.  Meanwhile, after Obama, many powders were tough to find.  So, folks were using somewhat similar powders and "educated" guesses.  Or, to save powder, they would load to max. charges as a starting load.  Again, this led to some bad outcomes.

And, many of those folks came from reloading weapons with long throats. Rem 700's and the 5.56. Typically, reloading everything to max mag length.  With the compound throat, this too lead to issues with some of the bullets.  Mag length placed the bullets into the lands.  I personally made some "belted mag" brass by failing to control OAL.  This is not a caliber problem, its a reloading practices problem.

Third, some companies tried to jump on this band wagon, with poorly made products.  That's not a defect in the round, its a manufacturing defect.

I have two 6.5G's.  One has over 5K rounds.  I've had exactly one FTF.  It was the second round fired.  I've had zero mag problems, FTE problems, bolt problems, or accuracy problems.  But, neither of my weapons were "budget" builds with the lowest cost products available or from questionable sources.

Fourth, as illustrated by this thread, there is way too much cloak and dagger, conspiracy nonsense involving both rounds.

Both are good rounds that will perform wonderfully for the vast majority of users when used within their limitations.

honestly the price and amount of 6.8 ammo I'm seeing online isn't terrible

Not going to lie it's silly but I want a 20in A4 barreled upper.

Essentially something like this
Attached File

When put like that I agree completely, as I think most would. The dispute is only with the messianic worship of 6.5 and those that proselytize it like their handing out pamphlets outside a cat house.

-Stooxie

I bought a Stag 6.8 16 inch upper several years ago and I've been really happy with the cartridge. I bought several hundred rounds of the Federal Gold Dot ammo when it was available and it has worked perfectly on several coyotes and one deer.  I've also picked up at least a box or two of most commercial loadings on the market and picked up a set of dies recently.

I picked up an 18 inch stainless upper from PSA also and use that upper for hunting currently with an AAC suppressor. As soon as my next form 4 is finally approved the Stag upper will be suppressed as well.

I live in a heavily wooded area so 250 yards is the upper range limit for me and the 6.8 has been very effective with little recoil,weight or blast.(suppressed)

I'm really thinking about building another in SBR form for easier handling with a can.

I have a 6.8 and I really like it.  That rifle has been in the woods more than any other gun I own.  It is very accurate with 120gr SSTs and I have killed quite a few deer with it.  It is a great medium sized game gun.

6.5G makes considerably more sense out West.  Here, you're seldom getting a shot over 150 yards, even places to zero over 100 yards are few and far between.  I built a 6.8 back when quality 6.5G parts were extremely limited, and have zero regrets.  For shooters who typically buy ammunition locally, 6.8 has been much more available when I look at various local and chain stores.  I'm still working through some SSA 115gr SMK ammunition I bought before Nosler bought them out, after which I'll start reloading for it.  But I'm also starting to accumulate parts for a 6.5G build, so don't think someone is wrong or foolish for building one.

Agreed, makes perfect sense. If your AO is limited what difference does high BC make? I can understand making the compromise if long distance shooting is a likely possibility, but if it's not then trading velocity & energy for higher BC is a total waste.

-Stooxie

If you had to pick one bullet/load to be hand loaded to be a to do it all in 6.8, what would it be?

It'd be used in a 12" barrel, mostly for hunting.

What's a good factory do it all load?

Hand load would be a 95ttsx over 29gr of RL7, win primers in ssa brass at 2.295 coal. Work up to that load from 27.5gr, as it was safe in my gun but primer flow started around 29.5grs, swipes at 30.2.
Expect 2650ish fps with that load.

Factory, sorry I have been out of the 68 for too long.

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