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Posted: 3/14/2022 2:14:36 PM EDT
[#1]
What to know about the role Javelin antitank missiles could play in Ukraine’s fight against Russia
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/03/12/javelins-ukraine-russia/ |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 2:29:51 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I've noticed in some pics the Russians have welded steel canopies to the tops of their tank turrets, an obvious countermeasure to Javelins. It will be interesting to see if how effective they are. https://i0.wp.com/cms.sofrep.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/FMsQbJMXEAAnp7j.jpg?fit=1080%2C720&ssl=1&w=800  Is that just one javelin hit? Ho lee fuk if so. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 2:50:47 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Javelin has two warheads. https://www.inetres.com/gp/military/infantry/antiarmor/Javelin/Javelin_warhead.gif https://www.thedrive.com/content/2021/12/Javelin_hits_tank_target_Ukraine.jpg?quality=85&width=1440&quality=70 https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/43648/ukrainian-troops-test-javelin-missile-against-russian-cage-style-improvised-tank-armor |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 2:58:05 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: News flash…we’ve already been training with Poland, and they’re interested in buying Abrams from us. Not to mention, we already have propositioned stock in Europe right now—just have to put them on a train to move them to their needed location, or put them on a HETT and drive them in. No Ukrainians would be driving our equipment, unless we admit to NATO and sell them our equipment. I don’t see this happening in the near future. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: So ya I get it the javelin can kill a T72 But how about this … How much is a 40 + year old Cold War era Soviet MBT worth vs how much do these Modern Javelin missiles cost the US Tax payer ?? Plus maybe transport even ?? Follow the Money . Who really wins ?. Ps Screw Putin . How much does it cost to not take out the tank? Or the alternative of flying an Abrams over there and driving it up to the area to do the job? Javelins save money. Do you really think we are going to fly one of our main battle tanks over there and let some potato farmers drive it around? News flash…we’ve already been training with Poland, and they’re interested in buying Abrams from us. Not to mention, we already have propositioned stock in Europe right now—just have to put them on a train to move them to their needed location, or put them on a HETT and drive them in. No Ukrainians would be driving our equipment, unless we admit to NATO and sell them our equipment. I don’t see this happening in the near future. Are Abrams proof against Javelins or similar munitions? Serious question. Or is the Age of the Tank over? |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 3:06:32 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are Abrams proof against Javelins or similar munitions? Serious question. Or is the Age of the Tank over? Most Abrams in service could be called almost impervious to a direct attack by a missile landing in the front of the tank. The newest model as an APS to shoot down direct attack missiles. Whether or not the APS works against top attack missiles is unknown. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 3:09:58 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are Abrams proof against Javelins or similar munitions? Serious question. Or is the Age of the Tank over? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: So ya I get it the javelin can kill a T72 But how about this … How much is a 40 + year old Cold War era Soviet MBT worth vs how much do these Modern Javelin missiles cost the US Tax payer ?? Plus maybe transport even ?? Follow the Money . Who really wins ?. Ps Screw Putin . How much does it cost to not take out the tank? Or the alternative of flying an Abrams over there and driving it up to the area to do the job? Javelins save money. Do you really think we are going to fly one of our main battle tanks over there and let some potato farmers drive it around? News flash…we’ve already been training with Poland, and they’re interested in buying Abrams from us. Not to mention, we already have propositioned stock in Europe right now—just have to put them on a train to move them to their needed location, or put them on a HETT and drive them in. No Ukrainians would be driving our equipment, unless we admit to NATO and sell them our equipment. I don’t see this happening in the near future. Are Abrams proof against Javelins or similar munitions? Serious question. Or is the Age of the Tank over? No, basically no tank is significantly armored on its roof. Active protection systems are about the only viable protection from top attack. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 3:33:56 PM EDT
[#7]
There is work underway for top attack protective APS. The problem is similar to the current situation when using a system for ballistic missile defense, it can only really look up and not take care of non-high angle threats.
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:03:37 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted: So ya I get it the javelin can kill a T72 But how about this … How much is a 40 + year old Cold War era Soviet MBT worth vs how much do these Modern Javelin missiles cost the US Tax payer ?? Plus maybe transport even ?? Follow the Money . Who really wins ?. Ps Screw Putin . You kill a tank, regardless of if it is a 1980s version of the T-72 or a more modern T-72 or T-80, and they die all the same. But you kill the crew. At a minimum likely the two dudes in the turret, and possibly the driver. How much does the tank cost? How much did it cost to put it in operation in the Ukraine? How much did it cost to train the 2 or 3 dudes who got killed when their tank was destroyed? And how much did it cost a country with an economy the size of Texas versus the #1 economy on the planet? |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:08:03 PM EDT
[#9]
A wonderful force multiplier.
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:10:29 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Russian 72's are primarily an export tank for them. A decent tank when you are talking one middle eastern country battling another, but not when faced with modern weapon systems. I think that some folks do not realize that Russia never gets rid of military equipment like the U.S. They keep weapons "in case." I am sure that they have many t-54/55s, T-62's, T-72's in stock in case. Their T-64 tank while older is a pretty decent tank and some would say superior to the T-72. Russian doctrine against NATO in the event of WWIII was to send in third tier armor and units first (T-54/55's and T-62's), then second tier units (T-64's and T-72's) and then finally first tier units with the best trained and equipped soldiers. It was a process of weakening NATO with numbers and then giving NATO a knock-out punch with top units. Also feels like Russia is using 2nd and 3rd tier units in Ukraine. This is bullshit. The Soviets plan was to push their premier units in first to create a breakthrough. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:12:47 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How much does it cost Russia to replace those tanks, if they even can? How much is it worth to bleed Russia's military dry and show the world that they're a paper tiger? How much is it worth to show the world that invading neighbors is going to be expensive? I'm not a strategic expert by any stretch of the imagination, just musing. At this point I'm sure the 72 is enough of an antique model that the Russians would rather replace it with a newer tank. I'm pretty sure they built the 72 in the thousands. Still nice to eliminate each one from the battlefield its on. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:18:20 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted: So ya I get it the javelin can kill a T72 But how about this … How much is a 40 + year old Cold War era Soviet MBT worth vs how much do these Modern Javelin missiles cost the US Tax payer ?? Plus maybe transport even ?? Follow the Money . Who really wins ?. Ps Screw Putin . You aren't figuring in the deaths and damages not caused by the killed tank. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:43:38 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: At this point I'm sure the 72 is enough of an antique model that the Russians would rather replace it with a newer tank. I'm pretty sure they built the 72 in the thousands. Still nice to eliminate each one from the battlefield its on. |
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Posted: 3/14/2022 4:49:23 PM EDT
[#14]
I feel bad for the guys in the tanks that get hit, though I guess it is instant death like a light going off.
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