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I used to watch 16 And Pregnant with a lady friend of mine.  I'm not ashamed of it, I rather enjoyed watching it.

Anyway, I always hear people talking about the show like it's some horrible thing that is the spearhead of the destruction of our society (especially on arfcom), and I wonder if any of the people talking about it so terribly have ever sat and watched an episode?

It doesn't glorify teen pregnancy, at all.  In fact it's usually kind of depressing.  These young kids are basically fucked, most of them are pretty dumb (who isn't at that age?) and they were careless, and they normally don't have the tools or resources to deal with it and you have to sit and watch them struggle and fight just to keep their heads above water.  

Most of these kids were already screwed in life to begin with (almost always due to shitty parenting, most common denominator is an absentee father and a crazy mom), so they are already kinda fucked, and then little Suzy gets knocked up so now her shitty life just got 10 times shittier, and whatever teenage douche bag planted the seed can't be counted on for a whole lot either, so now we get another generation of fail.

Amongst all the fail there is some goodness to be found, a couple of episodes have teenage fathers willing to step up and take ownership for what happened and move the earth to do whatever it takes for mom and baby.  Most of the girls are pretty retarded acting, but some of them have their heads screwed on straight.

No person with two brain cells to rub together would watch the show and say "Hey this is great, I'm 16, and I'd love to get pregnant this is pretty cool!"  

Almost every episode is pretty much a documentary on how much life sucks ass for everybody involved when a young girl gets pregnant.
 
 

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You assume he had these feelings before he enlisted. Many troops lose it later on.  Also, the questions involve known terrorist organizations.  Disgruntlement is not one of them.

Sedition and treason have specific definitions and they do not apply in this case.

WHen you spouted "I'm a DEP, I know recruiters" military and knowlege came into the picture and it is obvious you have none. Not only do you have no clue about recruiters, what they do, how they are selected, and what their quotas are.  My bonafides in my experience and education (Naval Academy) are an attempt to educate you.

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Sorry...but dude you need to buy a shovel if you're planning on digging very much deeper any faster than you already are.

Doc's telling you how it is and you're holding hard to how you want it to be.

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And you assume he didn't. In my experience no one this bat shit becomes this bat shit in a short manner of time.

I didn't say "I'm a DEP, I know recruiters" you said "you obviously have no experience with recruiters" at which point I stated that I do.
Again, I said they CAME CLOSE, not that they ACTUALLY WERE ACTS OF TREASON OR SEDITION.
If you're going to try to slam me, make sure it's for points I was actually making.

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"In your experience."  What experience? Deployment? Nope? Boot camp? Nope. What is this oodles of military experience you talk about?   You are a civilian with a piece of paper you signed, you have no experience.   How does talking like an idiot rise to treason and why have not Rosanne Bar been tried for the same treason? Mrs Obama, by the same token, since she said very similar things from a different political angle.

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My experience in life, military experience isn't the only kind of experience there is. The only time I've seen someone go nuts quickly was from drugs.

And, again, I said CAME CLOSE. Saying you are going to stage a revolt and threatening the lives of officers comes close.

Quit being willfully dense.

Do you know why the American people will win the civil war that is coming? Because we are Americans.

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My experience in life, military experience isn't the only kind of experience there is. The only time I've seen someone go nuts quickly was from drugs.

And, again, I said CAME CLOSE. Saying you are going to stage a revolt and threatening the lives of officers comes close.

Quit being willfully dense.

He's not talking about being displeased with the government, he flat out stated that he was planning to stage a rebellion, even if he wasn't serious or was too stupid to actually pull it off.
Saying you are going to commit terrorist acts and making written threats against officers is pretty damn close to sedition and not far off from treason.
This guy shouldn't have even gotten past the "are you a terrorist" questionnaire with his recruiter.

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I didn't see his posts about committing treason but still interesting.



"The Revolution will come for me. Men will be at my door soon to pick me up to lead it. ;)"

"The Revolution is here. And I will lead it."

"I'm starting the Revolution. I'm done waiting."

"This is the part where I tell the Federal Government to go fuck itself. This is the part where I tell Generals, training our young men to fight Americans, I am coming for you. The Veterans will be with me."

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Another FB gem from this douche's page:



If you serve in the military and talk of civil war... well I got no sympathy for you

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Is there a reason you shouldn't?

Friends,
You deserve to kow the truth. There has been an overwhelming amount of evil enacted and planned against you, your children, and your countrymen. It is great in scope. Your government evil. It is as simple as that.
And the calvary is coming.

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Vrasky, i hope you still talk like this to people when you finally put on that uniform. You will get a harsh fucking reality check, trust me. Your best bet right now is you keep your mouth shut. The internet is probably the last place you want to run your mouth about thing you know nothing about. Listen to your superiors more often, you will learn things you can add to your "life experiences".

Its amazing how much balls people have behind a computer screen.

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Y'all have to look up the definition of treason. Talking smack on FB is not one of them.

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First of all, you said a bit more than you claim:



YOu certainly implied that his statements were treasonous, but you have been backing away from that as you have been corrected. Good , you can learn.  However, it is not being willfully dense, as you disrespectfully claim, but rather having the legalistic and precise mind that is expected as an officer. If you stand before your captain for an article fifteen, you want him to have  legalistic mind, not just "going with what he feels man" and charge you with the letter of the law. That is what trained, discerning officers do and you might learn that some day.

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My experience in life, military experience isn't the only kind of experience there is. The only time I've seen someone go nuts quickly was from drugs.

And, again, I said CAME CLOSE. Saying you are going to stage a revolt and threatening the lives of officers comes close.

Quit being willfully dense.

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Best of luck in basic, sounds like you're going to need it.   You should ask to have your screen name changed to 'that guy'.

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NavyDoc, how is leading a revolution against the US government not a treasonous act?  It certainly meets the definition in the Constitution.  If this idiot is talking about leading a revolution, then he is talking about committing treason.

(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuse, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;

(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or other disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;

(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.

(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct."


Elements.

(1) Mutiny by creating violence or disturbance.


(a) That the accused created violence or a disturbance; and

(b) That the accused created this violence or disturbance with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority.

(2) Mutiny by refusing to obey orders or perform duty.


(a) That the accused refused to obey orders or otherwise do the accused's duty;

(b) That the accused in refusing to obey orders or perform duty acted in concert with another person or persons; and

(c) That the accused did so with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority.

(3) Sedition.


(a) That the accused created revolt, violence, or disturbance against lawful civil authority;

(b) That the accused acted in concert with another person or persons; and

(c) That the accused did so with the intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of that authority.

(4) Failure to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition.



(a) That an offense of mutiny or sedition was committed in the presence of the accused; and

(b) That the accused failed to do the accused's utmost to prevent and suppress the mutiny or sedition.

(5) Failure to report a mutiny or sedition.


(a) That an offense of mutiny or sedition occurred;

(b) That the accused knew or had reason to believe that the offense was taking place; and

(c) That the accused failed to take all reasonable means to inform the accused's superior commissioned officer or commander of the offense.

(6) Attempted mutiny.


(a) That the accused committed a certain overt act;

(b) That the act was done with specific intent to commit the offense of mutiny;

(c) That the act amounted to more than mere preparation; and

(d) That the act apparently tended to effect the commission of the offense of mutiny.


Explanation.

(1) Mutiny. Article 94( a)(1) defines two types of mutiny, both requiring an intent to usurp or override military authority.


(a) Mutiny by creating violence or disturbance. Mutiny by creating violence or disturbance may be committed by one person acting alone or by more than one acting together.

(b) Mutiny by refusing to obey orders or perform duties. Mutiny by refusing to obey orders or perform duties requires collective insubordination and necessarily includes some combination of two or more persons in resisting lawful military authority. This concert of insubordination need not be preconceived, nor is it necessary that the insubordination be active or violent. It may consist simply of a persistent and concerted refusal or omission to obey orders, or to do duty, with an insubordinate intent, that is, with an intent to usurp or override lawful military authority. The intent may be declared in words or inferred from acts, omissions, or surrounding circumstances.

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My experience in life, military experience isn't the only kind of experience there is. The only time I've seen someone go nuts quickly was from drugs.

And, again, I said CAME CLOSE. Saying you are going to stage a revolt and threatening the lives of officers comes close.

Quit being willfully dense.

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No, I take orders well.
When someone puts words in my mouth I get understandably upset.

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NavyDoc ain't just a screen name, it's also the job title of the poster you're arguing with; so don't you think that trying to pit your "experience in life" against his is rather meager in regards to military matters, or even your vaunted "life experience?"

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If what I said was wrong, I would have conceded it.

And it doesn't really take "balls" to try to point out that someone read your post wrong, but okay.

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<definition>

What violence or disturbance did he create posting videos of him acting an idiot?
What orders did he refuse?
What others did he work in concert with?
What overt act was done?

Ceretainly he committed conduct unbecoming and could be charged under Article 134, but being an asshole in public does not fit the sedition charge.

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You are going to hate your DI then, son.

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"vaunted"? I claimed in my life, not in my "vast and glorious" life.
I said that I have never personally seen someone go crazy that fast unless they were on drugs.

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No, I take orders well.
When someone puts words in my mouth I get understandably upset.

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Its not that you were pointing out what was wrong or what you said was wrong, its that you come off as disrespectful and cannot talk or debate in a respectful manner and even when that was pointed out, you continued to do so.

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Which, in all due respect, shows that you have no experience in life. I saw a guy go crasy like that in an ambush in OEF where we lit up a villiage and killed several children. He ended up sounding exactly like that guy. Perhpas his way of dealing withthe guilt was to externalize it. Again, son, you really have no sort of basis to comprehend what we are talking about.

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LOL Good luck in the military then. Im just glad you are not joining the Corps.

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Where did I use the word sedition?  Maybe you're thinking about kudzu?

Is he or is he not talking about committing treason?

“(1) Any person subject to this chapter who, with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation, communicates, delivers, or transmits, or attempts to communicate, deliver, or transmit, to any entity described in paragraph (2), either directly or indirectly, anything described in paragraph (3) shall be punished as a court-martial may direct, except that if the accused is found guilty of an offense that directly concerns (A) nuclear weaponry, military spacecraft or satellites, early warning systems, or other means of defense or retaliation against large scale attack, (B) war plans, (C) communications intelligence or cryptographic information, or (D) any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy, the accused shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct.
(2) An entity referred to in paragraph (1) is—

(A) a foreign government;
(B) a faction or party or military or naval force within a foreign country, whether recognized or unrecognized by the United States; or

(C) a representative, officer, agent, employee, subject, or citizen of such a government, faction, party, or force.

(3) A thing referred to in paragraph (1) is a document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, note, instrument, appliance, or information relating to the national defense.

(b)

(1) No person may be sentenced by court-martial to suffer death for an offense under this section (article) unless—
(A) the m bers of the court-martial unanimously find at least one of the aggravating factors set out in subsection (c); and
(B) the members unanimously determine that any extenuating or mitigating circumstances are substantially outweighed by any aggravating circumstances, including the aggravating factors set out under subsection (c).

(2) Findings under this subsection may be based on— (A) evidence introduced on the issue of guilt or innocence; (B) evidence introduced during the sentencing proceeding; or

(C) all such evidence. (3) The accused shall be given broad latitude to present matters in extenuation and mitigation.
(c) A sentence of death may be adjudged by a court-martial for an offense under this section (article) only if the members unanimously find, beyond a reasonable doubt, one or more of the following aggravating factors:

(1) The accused has been convicted of another offense involving espionage or treason for which either a sentence of death or imprisonment for life was authorized by statute.
(2) In the commission of the offense, the accused knowingly created a grave risk of substantial damage to the national security.

(3) In the commission of the offense, the accused knowingly created a grave risk of death to another person.

(4) Any other factor that may be prescribed by the President by regulations under section 836 of this title (Article 36).”

Elements.

(1) Espionage.

(a) That the accused communicated, delivered, or transmitted any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, note, instrument, appliance, or information relating to the national defense;
(b) That this matter was communicated, delivered, or transmitted to any foreign government, or to any faction or party or military or naval force within a foreign country, whether recognized or unrecognized by the United States, or to any representative, officer, agent, employee, subject or citizen thereof, either directly or indirectly; and

(c) That the accused did so with intent or reason to believe that such matter would be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation.

(2) Attempted espionage.

(a) That the accused did a certain overt act;
(b) That the act was done with the intent to commit the offense of espionage;

(c) That the act amounted to more than mere preparation; and

(d) That the act apparently tended to bring about the offense of espionage.

(3) Espionage as a capital offense.

(a) That the accused committed espionage or attempted espionage; and
(b) That the offense directly concerned (1) nuclear weaponry, military spacecraft or satellites, early warning systems, or other means of defense or retaliation against large scale attack, (2) war plans, (3) communications intelligence or cryptographic information, or (4) any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy.

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My experience in life, military experience isn't the only kind of experience there is. The only time I've seen someone go nuts quickly was from drugs.

And, again, I said CAME CLOSE. Saying you are going to stage a revolt and threatening the lives of officers comes close.

Quit being willfully dense.

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I never claimed I did.
I was saying that I thought he was probably mentally unhinged for a while, not that I'm an expert on metal health.

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Sorry. Trying to balance several arguements. Lets take on treason then:


Treason specifically deals with support and assistance to the enemy. Sedition or mutiny deals with specific acts against ones own command but not specific support to the enemy. An insane dude running his mouth off on the internet fits neither sedition nor treason, but does fit conduct unbecoming and should get an article 134 and get the big chicken dinner and kicked out back into civilian life.

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Life experience and military experience are in two completely different ballparks. As someone who is relatively new in the military I will tell you this. I'm 21 and have lived out on my own and had been in college before I joined. For the most part very little of that translated over to the military in a useful capacity.

Mouthing off to your superiors and being disrespectful will terminate your career very quickly. It's so fucking easy to make it in the military it really is. If your respectful and do what your supposed to do the rest will come in time. Right place, right uniform, right time, and right mindset. This is what you need to worry about at your level.

There are people who get paid to do certain jobs in the military. Even if they suck at it it is still not your place to take their job as they get paid to do it. In the military people earn their rank and put their time in to get where they are. They have the experience at least most of them so don't try to do their job either. It's not your place but will be eventually in time once you have put the time in and work to get there.

Remember your still not in the military yet.

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"vaunted"? I claimed in my life, not in my "vast and glorious" life.
I said that I have never personally seen someone go crazy that fast unless they were on drugs.

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The definition I was referring to was in the Constitution, but this one seems to include the necessary parts.  So, yes, you appear to agree that he was talking about committing treason.

Note that neither of us have claimed that talking about committing treason is treason.

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I agree that you are not an expert in mental health as well. That is quite true.

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Sorry. Trying to balance several arguements. Lets take on treason then:


Treason specifically deals with support and assistance to the enemy. Sedition or mutiny deals with specific acts against ones own command but not specific support to the enemy. An insane dude running his mouth off on the internet fits neither sedition nor treason, but does fit conduct unbecoming and should get an article 134 and get the big chicken dinner and kicked out back into civilian life.

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When your tone is bragging about your life experience in comparison to someone who not only has been BTDT, but also has much greater real knowledge of both the law and its application in this instant discussion of potential violation of the UCMJ, you are being boastful regarding your "experience" which is synonymous to "vaunted." Grab a college thesaurus and look it up.

As to your second sentence; don't you think that maybe a medical doctor might have personally seen someone go crazy for reasons other than drugs?

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I guess I'll stay home and vote for Romney
I mean...Obama.
I mean, wait...what?

Whiff whifff weed?

I'm so confused
Who are we hating in here?

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I apologize if I came off as disrespectful, I was just frustrated at the communication foul up.

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And I'm sorry if I came off as a total dick. What I was trying to to was enlighten you from one old timer to a new cherry.

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Is it because he's a white box supremacist?

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And I'm sorry if I came off as a total dick. What I was trying to to was enlighten you from one old timer to a new cherry.