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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:32:25 PM EST
 The National Guard’s ongoing security mission on the southern U.S. border provides “no military training value” to the troops stationed there and adds significant stress to their families, the head of the force told lawmakers on Tuesday. In testimony before the Senate Appropriations Committee, Gen. Daniel Hokanson, chief of the National Guard Bureau, said roughly 2,500 guardsmen are currently stationed along the southern border in support of Department of Homeland Security missions related to immigration issues. https://www.militarytimes.com/news/pentagon-congress/2024/06/18/southern-border-mission-has-no-military-value-guard-chief-warns/ |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:36:04 PM EST
[#1]
Why can't DHS do it?
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:36:31 PM EST
[#2]
I'll have another beer.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:36:49 PM EST
[#3]
No "military training value" isn't exactly the same as "no military value" or "no security value."
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:37:11 PM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why can't DHS do it? To busy laying out the red welcome carpet and handing out phones/gift cards. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:38:15 PM EST
[#5]
If only we had some uniformed force that Patrols the Border.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:38:50 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why can't DHS do it? They'll have the Coasties replace the NG. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:38:55 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To busy laying out the red welcome carpet and handing out phones/gift cards. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Why can't DHS do it? To busy laying out the red welcome carpet and handing out phones/gift cards. Sucking and meat slapping sounds in the background and everything.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:38:59 PM EST
[#8]
Isn't that what the national guard is for, to respond to domestic emergencies such as our Southern border being invaded?
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:39:57 PM EST
[#9]
In a just world he would be dishonorably discharged.
Quoted: Isn't that what the national guard is for, to respond to domestic emergencies such as our Southern border being invaded? |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:41:33 PM EST
[#10]
LOL, ignorant clowns. I guess he forgot 9/11. And sadly IMO the threats are tenfold greater today. Everyone wants press time, no matter how stupid the shit is they wanna spew.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:41:54 PM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In a just world he would be dishonorably discharged. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:42:12 PM EST
[#12]
What is the role of the military again?
He's probably not wrong. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:42:44 PM EST
[#13]
He also noted that even though the deployment is within the United States, guardsmen “might as well be deployed to Kuwait or somewhere overseas, because they’re still away from their families.”  What a fucking retard.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:43:16 PM EST
[#14]
I mean...he's not wrong. I'll add that I am skeptical that the NG troops stationed there are allowed to do anything actually useful like apprehend and deport illegals. I don't know for sure though.
"This is a law enforcement mission. They're doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries." |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:43:54 PM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is the role of the military again? He's probably not wrong. That's exactly the argument that he's making. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:43:56 PM EST
[#16]
As they’re currently being used, there is zero military value or reason for them to be there.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:44:14 PM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No "military training value" isn't exactly the same as "no military value" or "no security value." |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:44:33 PM EST
[#18]
I suspect there isn't a country anywhere in the last hundred years who has even contemplated invading the US.
Part of that is undoubtedly because of our military, but even if they were to succeed, occupying us would be impossible. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:45:43 PM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I suspect there isn't a country anywhere in the last hundred years who has even contemplated invading the US. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:45:46 PM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No "military training value" isn't exactly the same as "no military value" or "no security value." But it doesn't allow for the histrionics and derp now, does it? |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:45:51 PM EST
[#21]
Their damn job is to guard. So fucking guard.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:46:04 PM EST
[#22]
Well it’s not exactly applicable to a war on the Korean Peninsula or islands in the Pacific against China or fighting in the Mideast if Europe and Israel continue pressing as they have this month on Iran’s nuclear program
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:46:15 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What a fucking retard.Quote HistoryQuoted: He also noted that even though the deployment is within the United States, guardsmen "might as well be deployed to Kuwait or somewhere overseas, because they're still away from their families." What a fucking retard.Again...he's not really wrong. Deployed to some shitty desert in the US away from family or some shitty desert in the ME...I don't see where he's wrong, particularly since I've done both. Gone is gone. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:46:50 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isn't that what the national guard is for, to respond to domestic emergencies such as our Southern border being invaded? You would think our military would protect our nation instead of being world police. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:47:06 PM EST
[#25]
The National Guard Chief can go and suck on my balls!
Probably like that shit too.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:47:10 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Their damn job is to guard. So fucking guard. I’m surprised by the characterization as most of the personnel I knew who went on border duty liked it. I don’t recall any complaints |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:47:25 PM EST
[#27]
It would have value if they were actually defending the border instead serving as a welcoming committee, speak out, locate, close with, and destroy the enemy will to act against the country’s will.
Cho Bi Den and his political thugs are the real problem. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:48:19 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Their damn job is to guard. So fucking guard. Soooooo, yes, but they're still bound to obey the orders of their Command(er in Chief). The next step is to disobey orders and do the job they're supposed to do, not what they're being told to do. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:49:51 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is the role of the military again? He's probably not wrong. Hand out water, give directions and make sure the illegals don't get hurt when they illegally cross the border. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:50:09 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why can't DHS do it? Between 7 and 10,000 border crossers/ day already has DHS spread pretty thin. Those are just the ones that want to be caught. The actual bad guys crossing, only God and the cartels know how many they are. I agree there’s very little military or training value there other than S&R or hunter training, which they’re not allowed to do. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:50:12 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You would think our military would protect our nation instead of being world police. Probably strain on the Guard now that’s it’s shrunk from 360,000 to 330,000 but missions have increased from Kosovo, Djibouti and Iraq to Poland and the Pacific islands. OPTEMPO is probably generating complaints |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:50:42 PM EST
[#32]
Click bait title that's worked.
There isn't a training value that you would gain by having there. Solution is simple....it's not a training exercise....and make it a national security mission |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:52:26 PM EST
[#33]
If it was secured we wouldn't need the guard there
All the guys at work who've gone said it's a joke. We miss them at work and causes stress on the shifts being down men |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:52:50 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I mean...he's not wrong. I'll add that I am skeptical that the NG troops stationed there are allowed to do anything actually useful like apprehend and deport illegals. I don't know for sure though. "This is a law enforcement mission. They're doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries." Maybe MP’s would garner some tactical training? But definitely not artillery, infantry and armor units |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:53:03 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isn't that what the national guard is for, to respond to domestic emergencies such as our Southern border being invaded? This included needing to be trained up in all the latest COIN MOUT etc...requiring lots of trips to FIG and NTC etc...so the guard boss is very used to using active duty time for that kind of training or being deployed. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:54:21 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I mean...he's not wrong. I'll add that I am skeptical that the NG troops stationed there are allowed to do anything actually useful like apprehend and deport illegals. I don't know for sure though. "This is a law enforcement mission. They're doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries." |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:54:30 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: LOL, ignorant clowns. I guess he forgot 9/11. And sadly IMO the threats are tenfold greater today. Everyone wants press time, no matter how stupid the shit is they wanna spew. Definitely a national security issue but I think he’s probably referring to Battalion, Brigade and Division level training for near peer adversaries given all the war talk going on worldwide |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:54:39 PM EST
[#38]
Title states “no military value” but that’s clearly not what he said; the statement is “no military training value”.
Entirely different. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:55:25 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: an unorganized invasion is still an invasion. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I suspect there isn't a country anywhere in the last hundred years who has even contemplated invading the US. True. We need them there to pass out water bottles. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:56:58 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You would think our military would protect our nation instead of being world police. And this is where I would make some strong changes if I were in charge. Pull our troops out of third world shit holes that hate us and provide no real benefits to being there. I would also cut funding to those same countries that hate us and use those funds to fortify our own borders and our internal security. I'm sick of seeing the US being the world police and being everyone's cash cow. People can argue that we pay these countries for XY or Z and we have troops in these countries to thwart terrorism and have a strategic advantage when and if a war breaks out, but at what costs to the tax payers? It's time to worry about us, fuck everyone else. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 2:57:34 PM EST
[#41]
DHS and the Border Patrol can do this job but need to be directed to do so. Tools, authority and the ability to physically remove illegals to our borders.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:00:57 PM EST
[#42]
Change the mission and ROE and they would add some value.
“The primary mission of the Infantry battalion is to close with the enemy by means of fire and maneuver. Its purpose is to destroy or capture him, to repel his assaults by fire, close combat, and counterattack, or all of these…” |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:01:00 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Title states “no military value” but that’s clearly not what he said; the statement is “no military training value”. Entirely different. The narrative has been set. Five years from now we'll see references to how the national guard doesn't think it's important that our borders are secured. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:07:59 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The narrative has been set. Five years from now we'll see references to how the national guard doesn't think it's important that our borders are secured. And yet there’s Law Enforcement Agencies that have guidance specifically prohibiting their officers from “interfering” with illegal migration. Some go so far as to require non-compliance with Fed agencies on deportation but this is somehow the NG’s fault. Illegal Immigration is 100% a national security disaster waiting to happen IMO. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:08:35 PM EST
[#45]
Actual Quote:
“There is no military training value in what we do there,” he said. “This is a law enforcement mission. … They’re doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries.” This is total bullshit. In 2022 when I was teaching pistol safety and marksmanship to NG deployed on the border, most didn't have any experience with pistol and there had been some prior issues with NDs. Pistol safety and marksmanship skills carry over to other firearms. I also trained a good number of soldiers before they deployed to the border on pistol and rifle, as deployment can be a significant motivator to get additional training. Gen. Daniel Hokanson acts like a major deployment isn't in itself useful military experience for guardsman who may only train ~40 days/year Honestly the General is outing himself as a traitor as he doesn't consider defending our border as worthy of the NG's time. WTF??? If defending our border isn't worthy of NG's time, what is? |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:08:45 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe MP's would garner some tactical training? But definitely not artillery, infantry and armor units Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I mean...he's not wrong. I'll add that I am skeptical that the NG troops stationed there are allowed to do anything actually useful like apprehend and deport illegals. I don't know for sure though. "This is a law enforcement mission. They're doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries." Maybe MP's would garner some tactical training? But definitely not artillery, infantry and armor units Yeah, if they're actually allowed to conduct an LE mission which I am doubtful of. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:09:47 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But it doesn't allow for the histrionics and derp now, does it?  Russians are motivating us to feel this way about our Sovereignty.
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:10:51 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The guard has MPs. They just sent a bunch to the baltics to actually do MP shit for the first time in anyones guard career. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I mean...he's not wrong. I'll add that I am skeptical that the NG troops stationed there are allowed to do anything actually useful like apprehend and deport illegals. I don't know for sure though. "This is a law enforcement mission. They're doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries." Right, and fair enough. The argument that he's making is basically that his guys are down at the border, not really doing any good meanwhile their MOS proficiency is deteriorating and they will be mission incapable should the balloon go up. I hear what he's saying. Thread title is rage bait. One can disagree with him, but calling him a traitor over this and wishing him a DD is fucking absurd. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:14:17 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actual Quote: This is total bullshit. In 2022 when I was teaching pistol safety and marksmanship to NG deployed on the border, most didn't have any experience with pistol and there had been some prior issues with NDs. Pistol safety and marksmanship skills carry over to other firearms. I also trained a good number of soldiers before they deployed to the border on pistol and rifle, as deployment can be a significant motivator to get additional training. Gen. Daniel Hokanson acts like a major deployment isn't in itself useful military experience for guardsman who may only train ~40 days/year Honestly the General is outing himself as a traitor as he doesn't consider defending our border as worthy of the NG's time. WTF??? If defending our border isn't worthy of NG's time, what is? Quote HistoryQuoted: Actual Quote: "There is no military training value in what we do there," he said. "This is a law enforcement mission. They're doing mission sets that are not directly applicable to their military skill sets. That time, I think, would be better used building readiness to deter our adversaries." This is total bullshit. In 2022 when I was teaching pistol safety and marksmanship to NG deployed on the border, most didn't have any experience with pistol and there had been some prior issues with NDs. Pistol safety and marksmanship skills carry over to other firearms. I also trained a good number of soldiers before they deployed to the border on pistol and rifle, as deployment can be a significant motivator to get additional training. Gen. Daniel Hokanson acts like a major deployment isn't in itself useful military experience for guardsman who may only train ~40 days/year Honestly the General is outing himself as a traitor as he doesn't consider defending our border as worthy of the NG's time. WTF??? If defending our border isn't worthy of NG's time, what is? There's a SHIT TON more to being an infantryman or artilleryman than weapons safety classes. You hit the nail on the head without meaning to. With ~40 days of training a year it's imperative that NG and reservists maintain basic MOS proficiency, so when they do a workup they aren't starting from scratch. The Chief is saying they are losing that, and that the border patrol mission should be done by...well...the Border Patrol. Calling him a traitor for wanting his guys prepared for large scale combat operations is dumb. |
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Posted: 6/18/2024 3:20:10 PM EST
[#50]
At this point it shouldn’t surprise me when morons post a click-baitsy title in GD that is absolutely not what was actually said, and then more morons in GD follow right along with the faux outrage by only reading the click-baity title and in no way reading the actual news and seeing what was actually said
And yet here we are |
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