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Posted: 10/2/2023 10:04:10 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you can install a P&S rail, pistol grip, and stock yourself the M4 marked Colt OEM1 is a better buy. May not be M4A1 profile but no one is going to choose a PSA gun over that, nor will the PSA be worth a fourth as much 20 years from now. It’s cool they’re doing all these clones don’t get me wrong, but this one is kind of meh. Who cares what something is worth in 20 years? I do not buy guns to sell them just like cars I do not buy a car and worry about resale value. I shoot my guns and drive the wheels off a car and will keep fixing it till it is expensive to fix or I really really want something else. I never understood this mentality you buy a gun and your thought is resale value not fun factor or just want? Colt does make a nice AR probably will buy one of those one day probably. |
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Posted: 10/2/2023 10:27:26 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you can install a P&S rail, pistol grip, and stock yourself the M4 marked Colt OEM1 is a better buy. May not be M4A1 profile but no one is going to choose a PSA gun over that, nor will the PSA be worth a fourth as much 20 years from now. It’s cool they’re doing all these clones don’t get me wrong, but this one is kind of meh. Forgot about Colt’s OEM series… $750, plus the cost of a rail, stock, and rear sight. Plus the side sling swivel, if that’s your thing. So around the same price. But better if you’re going to slap different parts instead of the basic stock and MaTech sight anyway. Unless, of course, you want a 14” barrel instead of a 16” |
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Posted: 10/2/2023 10:40:34 PM EST
[#3]
Is it a SOCOM barrel under there or not?
“M4A1” makes me think yes, but does anyone have one yet to confirm it? |
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Posted: 10/2/2023 11:02:55 PM EST
[#4]
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Posted: 10/2/2023 11:05:25 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who cares what something is worth in 20 years? I do not buy guns to sell them just like cars I do not buy a car and worry about resale value. I shoot my guns and drive the wheels off a car and will keep fixing it till it is expensive to fix or I really really want something else. I never understood this mentality you buy a gun and your thought is resale value not fun factor or just want? Colt does make a nice AR probably will buy one of those one day probably. How many pictures of well used clones do you see versus dust collectors? Do you think the PSA will outperform the Colt at its cost? Shooter or collector the Colt is the better buy. There’s not much logic behind going clone crazy and buying a PSA for authenticity. Otherwise the configuration is a bit dated and one could have something a bit more capable. Nostalgia and authenticity is the biggest selling point here, and this one falls short for both at an equal or even higher price. ETA: I’m not hating on PSA or saying it’s a bad rifle, but if you look at their M110 and Mk12 clones they’re considerably cheaper than the real deal. That’s not the case for this example and I think that makes it a really hard sell for a lot of the clone enthusiasts and people on a budget that want to get as close as they can. |
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Posted: 10/2/2023 11:38:54 PM EST
[#6]
Not exactly clone correct, but PSA. CL CHF from back when PSA offered the FN barrels. Was my first M4 ish awhile ago.
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:10:30 AM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/58648/m4_wrong-2974548.jpg Edit: PSA installed the rail wrong. No they did not. That is an 11 rib panel on the top rail. It is one slot forward because of the screw. You can see it clearly in other pictures they posted. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:14:54 AM EST
[#8]
What is the rollmark on the lower? Is it the M-4 one PSA already has?
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:16:30 AM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No they did not. That is an 11 rib panel on the top rail. It is one slot forward because of the screw. You can see it clearly in other pictures they posted. Yeah they did. He's talking about the little spring tab on the front of the top rail that's supposed to go under the top of the handguard cap. It's clearly on top of the cap (though I'm an armorer and I would never have noticed that from the picture in a million years without him pointing it out  )
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:17:08 AM EST
[#10]
Will probably be buying one once the bank account recovers some.
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:27:09 AM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is a breath of fresh air. ..... I appreciate that the parts look deliberate and faithful. all the above love seeing these different configurations offered |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:31:24 AM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Were military M4A1s ever offered or seen with barrel lengths other than 14.5"? |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:39:40 AM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many pictures of well used clones do you see versus dust collectors? Do you think the PSA will outperform the Colt at its cost? Shooter or collector the Colt is the better buy. There’s not much logic behind going clone crazy and buying a PSA for authenticity. Otherwise the configuration is a bit dated and one could have something a bit more capable. Nostalgia and authenticity is the biggest selling point here, and this one falls short for both at an equal or even higher price. ETA: I’m not hating on PSA or saying it’s a bad rifle, but if you look at their M110 and Mk12 clones they’re considerably cheaper than the real deal. That’s not the case for this example and I think that makes it a really hard sell for a lot of the clone enthusiasts and people on a budget that want to get as close as they can. My A4 clone has been well used but I deviated again from the rail it should have and put an DD Omega rail on it. The rifle is a real shooter but I also do not have a clone correct optic. I am not 100% has to be perfect clone just something close enough in appearance. I think the CHF barrel is driving the cost up which is something I would pay a little extra to have. I already have a Spike FN Optimum profile barrel stowed in my safe and one in my end of the world AR. It has been an absolutely great barrel and shoots better than I can shoot it and with almost any type of ammo. I get that everyone likes Colt and they make good stuff but just because Colt is good does not mean that PSA is less or more. Things can be equal or who knows these PSA rifles could be better. PSA is doing something that not many makers are doing which is making cool fun options that the average guy can afford. No way I could ever afford a real M110 well I could afford it if I wanted to but no way I would spend that kind of coin I guess is a better way of putting it. I am just not that elite and I would rather have a SCAR 20s which I could afford 2 for the price of 1 M110. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 8:42:09 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No. There has been pictures of dudes using what was presumably their uppers from their personally owned rifles in the field so those could be 16" theoretically. But never on issued weapons. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Were military M4A1s ever offered or seen with barrel lengths other than 14.5"? The 14.7 is to easily comply with the stupid NFA laws and a A2 flash hider. 14.5 would require a longer A2 and the .2" just makes more sense I think making it look more correct. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:03:43 AM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is the rollmark on the lower? Is it the M-4 one PSA already has? I sure hope it's the m4a1 one |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:14:36 AM EST
[#16]
I bought a PSA for $329 when they were on sale, added spare parts from my bin, and have the same thing with an Aimpoint for leas than that. Cool they are doing it, though.
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:24:34 AM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It’s government Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It says M4 profile barrel. I really don’t know what that means exactly. It’s government Well that’s disappointing if it is. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 9:32:15 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many pictures of well used clones do you see versus dust collectors? Do you think the PSA will outperform the Colt at its cost? Shooter or collector the Colt is the better buy. There’s not much logic behind going clone crazy and buying a PSA for authenticity. Otherwise the configuration is a bit dated and one could have something a bit more capable. Nostalgia and authenticity is the biggest selling point here, and this one falls short for both at an equal or even higher price. ETA: I’m not hating on PSA or saying it’s a bad rifle, but if you look at their M110 and Mk12 clones they’re considerably cheaper than the real deal. That’s not the case for this example and I think that makes it a really hard sell for a lot of the clone enthusiasts and people on a budget that want to get as close as they can. The only popl that care about all that crap are old Fudd collectors that think somehow colt still makes decent guns. Colt assemblers. have and always been assenlers. This appeals to the tons of vets that want what they carried. This does exactly that. Complete gun that checks the boxes. But I'm sure psa needs more people telling them what to sell |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 10:07:14 AM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only popl that care about all that crap are old Fudd collectors that think somehow colt still makes decent guns. Colt assemblers. have and always been assenlers. This appeals to the tons of vets that want what they carried. This does exactly that. Complete gun that checks the boxes. But I'm sure psa needs more people telling them what to sell Well said and exactly why I want one. Plus I like to support PSA I am far from a fanboi but PSA has done me right every single time I have dealt with them. I fucked up something on my PSA PA10 when I was changing the muzzle device I had my barrel clamped in blocks. When I applied torque the barrel being nitride was so slippery it turned the whole upper and my blocks sheared off the gas block adjustment screw. 100% MY FAULT and I contacted PSA to buy a new gas block and guess what PSA asked me to send it in and took care of me. 100% beyond a reasonable doubt my fault and my fuck up and they still took care of me. Hate on PSA all you want but they are a customer oriented company and want you to be happy with what you buy from them. Thank you @PalmettoStateArmory |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 10:13:09 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Its just an engraving |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 12:54:06 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only popl that care about all that crap are old Fudd collectors that think somehow colt still makes decent guns. Colt assemblers. have and always been assenlers. This appeals to the tons of vets that want what they carried. This does exactly that. Complete gun that checks the boxes. But I'm sure psa needs more people telling them what to sell So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? The point is whether there’s a difference in what you said (which there’s not), you can get the Colt for the same price. There is no value to this clone, versus their whole approach of value packed clones. A $600 Freedom clone would have made a lot more sense. This has no savings over the original. The only major difference is the roll marks, and no one in their right mind wanting an M4 clone is going to prefer a PSA stamp over a Colt logo if they’re looking for this level of authenticity. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:02:14 PM EST
[#22]
That ain't bad looking at all.
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:04:33 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No. There has been pictures of dudes using what was presumably their uppers from their personally owned rifles in the field so those could be 16" theoretically. But never on issued weapons. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Were military M4A1s ever offered or seen with barrel lengths other than 14.5"? I was thinking shorter, not longer. As in 10.3" or 10.5". @Alaskanforfreedom |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:11:02 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only popl that care about all that crap are old Fudd collectors that think somehow colt still makes decent guns. Colt assemblers. have and always been assenlers. This appeals to the tons of vets that want what they carried. This does exactly that. Complete gun that checks the boxes. But I'm sure psa needs more people telling them what to sell Except the thing is they carried a Colt. Why clone something that is available? |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:12:50 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? The point is whether there’s a difference in what you said (which there’s not), you can get the Colt for the same price. There is no value to this clone, versus their whole approach of value packed clones. A $600 Freedom clone would have made a lot more sense. This has no savings over the original. The only major difference is the roll marks, and no one in their right mind wanting an M4 clone is going to prefer a PSA stamp over a Colt logo if they’re looking for this level of authenticity. You can't get a colt for the same price. The Colt with a 16" barrel if you can find them for the oem 1 are 730.00 - 800.00 but usually out of stock. So the everywhere. So right off the bat the barrel is too long. Then you have to add a ras. So add 200+ to that. Then shortening the barrel to 14.5 or 14.7 and p& w or replacing the barrel. Hell to build a mostly colt, the barrel is 350, upper, gas tube, and delta ring are 200 alone. Colt Bcg is 200. Kac ras is 250-300. The real colt collectors 14.5 is 1500.00 and the fn 14.7 is 1900. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:23:42 PM EST
[#26]
KindaWant.gif
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:26:37 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You can't get a colt for the same price. The Colt with a 16" barrel if you can find them for the oem 1 are 730.00 - 800.00 but usually out of stock. So the everywhere. So right off the bat the barrel is too long. Then you have to add a ras. So add 200+ to that. Then shortening the barrel to 14.5 or 14.7 and p& w or replacing the barrel. Hell to build a mostly colt, the barrel is 350, upper, gas tube, and delta ring are 200 alone. Colt Bcg is 200. Kac ras is 250-300. The real colt collectors 14.5 is 1500.00 and the fn 14.7 is 1900. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? The point is whether there’s a difference in what you said (which there’s not), you can get the Colt for the same price. There is no value to this clone, versus their whole approach of value packed clones. A $600 Freedom clone would have made a lot more sense. This has no savings over the original. The only major difference is the roll marks, and no one in their right mind wanting an M4 clone is going to prefer a PSA stamp over a Colt logo if they’re looking for this level of authenticity. You can't get a colt for the same price. The Colt with a 16" barrel if you can find them for the oem 1 are 730.00 - 800.00 but usually out of stock. So the everywhere. So right off the bat the barrel is too long. Then you have to add a ras. So add 200+ to that. Then shortening the barrel to 14.5 or 14.7 and p& w or replacing the barrel. Hell to build a mostly colt, the barrel is 350, upper, gas tube, and delta ring are 200 alone. Colt Bcg is 200. Kac ras is 250-300. The real colt collectors 14.5 is 1500.00 and the fn 14.7 is 1900. A colt socom is what $1400 +-? Honestly I wouldn’t even consider PSA’s m4a1 without a socom profile barrel. If it had a socom it’s a buy now. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:30:32 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? The point is whether there’s a difference in what you said (which there’s not), you can get the Colt for the same price. There is no value to this clone, versus their whole approach of value packed clones. A $600 Freedom clone would have made a lot more sense. This has no savings over the original. The only major difference is the roll marks, and no one in their right mind wanting an M4 clone is going to prefer a PSA stamp over a Colt logo if they’re looking for this level of authenticity. A Freedom line version would be cool it would lower the cost because the PSA one does have a FN CHF barrel where as the Colt is not it is a standard CMV CL barrel. Not everyone is hung up on the details down to the last nuts and bolts otherwise they would not be buying the PSA version. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:31:26 PM EST
[#29]
I should clone the M4 I carried in Iraq. Knight's rail, no covers, no forgrip, no Aimpoint just a black MBUS. That thing was a Sergeant Major magnet. My Platoon Sergeant would just shake his head.
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:32:32 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A colt socom is what $1400 +-? Honestly I wouldn’t even consider PSA’s m4a1 without a socom profile barrel. If it had a socom it’s a buy now. Has anyone confirmed it is govt I know some said it was but Jman did not actually say govt or socom. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:35:10 PM EST
[#31]
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:38:08 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Has anyone confirmed it is govt I know some said it was but Jman did not actually say govt or socom. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A colt socom is what $1400 +-? Honestly I wouldn’t even consider PSA’s m4a1 without a socom profile barrel. If it had a socom it’s a buy now. Has anyone confirmed it is govt I know some said it was but Jman did not actually say govt or socom. IIRC the description says government… but the descriptions have been off before. I haven’t seen it verified. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:38:09 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A colt socom is what $1400 +-? Honestly I wouldn’t even consider PSA’s m4a1 without a socom profile barrel. If it had a socom it’s a buy now. Yes the colt socom collectors is around 1400-1500 |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 1:50:41 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes the colt socom collectors is around 1400-1500 Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A colt socom is what $1400 +-? Honestly I wouldn’t even consider PSA’s m4a1 without a socom profile barrel. If it had a socom it’s a buy now. Yes the colt socom collectors is around 1400-1500 So |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:01:32 PM EST
[#35]
Guys, its ok to be a cloner and also ok to not care about the minute details but want something representative of a specific thing. We can have both.
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:05:52 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So $500 more for a US property marked colt with socom profile barrel, KAC RAS & broomstick and schmid parts.. that’s a tough decision if you’re on a budget but If one had the extra $500 the colt is a no brainer imho. Now if the PSA has a Fn socom profile barrel it closes the gap for sure. This. In some cases it's not even $500. Locked and Loaded has Colt M4A1 SOCOM's right now for $1310. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:06:37 PM EST
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Guys, its ok to be a cloner and also ok to not care about the minute details but want something representative of a specific thing. We can have both. Blasphemy. 
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:06:39 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes the colt socom collectors is around 1400-1500 Yup here is one for 1450 https://armsunlimited.com/colt-m4a1-socom-carbine-us-govt-property-marked/ |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:09:20 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Guys, its ok to be a cloner and also ok to not care about the minute details but want something representative of a specific thing. We can have both. I think PSA makes a fine rifle (I’ve had several and still have lowers, bcg’s etc) and my opinion doesn’t come from a cloning perspective. I’m looking at this from a value perspective. A Colt US government marked lower, KAC marked RAS/broomstick, socom profile barrel, schmid parts = much more than a $500 street value difference in price of those items. Not to mention the other colt marked parts like the upper, bcg and so on. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:10:16 PM EST
[#40]
Isnt an actual Colt socom only a couple hundred more?
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:14:32 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isnt an actual Colt socom only a couple hundred more? Couple hundred, no.. 400-500 more, yes. This all comes down to a persons budget.. Is the colt worth it.. Yes.. If a person doesn't want to spend more than that, there are other options. Hell Im building one and spending far more all because I didnt want an a2 flash hidder pin and welded. I wanted surefire can capabilities. So it is taking me time to buy all the colt parts for my upper and i am using a stripped psa m4 lower as that is what I was issued when we first transitioned from the m16a2 to the block 1 when I got to group. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:30:30 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Couple hundred, no.. 400-500 more, yes. This all comes down to a persons budget.. Is the colt worth it.. Yes.. If a person doesn't want to spend more than that, there are other options. Hell Im building one and spending far more all because I didnt want an a2 flash hidder pin and welded. I wanted surefire can capabilities. So it is taking me time to buy all the colt parts for my upper and i am using a stripped psa m4 lower as that is what I was issued when we first transitioned from the m16a2 to the block 1 when I got to group. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Isnt an actual Colt socom only a couple hundred more? Couple hundred, no.. 400-500 more, yes. This all comes down to a persons budget.. Is the colt worth it.. Yes.. If a person doesn't want to spend more than that, there are other options. Hell Im building one and spending far more all because I didnt want an a2 flash hidder pin and welded. I wanted surefire can capabilities. So it is taking me time to buy all the colt parts for my upper and i am using a stripped psa m4 lower as that is what I was issued when we first transitioned from the m16a2 to the block 1 when I got to group. Sounds like a nice build. I’ve got a few PSA m4a1 & m4 carbine lowers. One is on a block ii. It appears the difference between the PSA m4a1 and Colt socom is down around $360 if bought from locked&loaded. How much do the US gov property marked colt lowers go for on the secondary market? I know a while ago it seemed they were going for around $800 iirc. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:38:06 PM EST
[#43]
I bought a Colt Socom for $1308 and now they’re about six bucks cheaper, $1302.31. Closes the gap in price just a bit more.
https://dahlonegaarmory.com/product/colt-mfg-le6920socom-le6920-carbine-socom-semi-automatic-5.56-nato-14.5-mb-301-4-position-black-stk-black |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:47:56 PM EST
[#44]
   Source quality parts and roll your own. And then get an ACOG. You'll appreciate it more. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 2:49:19 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounds like a nice build. I’ve got a few PSA m4a1 & m4 carbine lowers. One is on a block ii. It appears the difference between the PSA m4a1 and Colt socom is down around $360 if bought from locked&loaded. How much do the US gov property marked colt lowers go for on the secondary market? I know a while ago it seemed they were going for around $800 iirc. Ive never seen the colt property marked lowers being sold, so I have no idea. Thats one of the reasons I spent 50.00 on my psa one. Ill put a geissele trigger in there and all quality parts, so it really doesnt matter to me. Just like on my block II build with Fn socom barrel and upper. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 3:04:28 PM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? The point is whether there’s a difference in what you said (which there’s not), you can get the Colt for the same price. There is no value to this clone, versus their whole approach of value packed clones. A $600 Freedom clone would have made a lot more sense. This has no savings over the original. The only major difference is the roll marks, and no one in their right mind wanting an M4 clone is going to prefer a PSA stamp over a Colt logo if they’re looking for this level of authenticity. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The only popl that care about all that crap are old Fudd collectors that think somehow colt still makes decent guns. Colt assemblers. have and always been assenlers. This appeals to the tons of vets that want what they carried. This does exactly that. Complete gun that checks the boxes. But I'm sure psa needs more people telling them what to sell So the only people who care about that crap are old Fudd collectors, but guys who carried them and care about that crap are different how in your insinuation? The point is whether there’s a difference in what you said (which there’s not), you can get the Colt for the same price. There is no value to this clone, versus their whole approach of value packed clones. A $600 Freedom clone would have made a lot more sense. This has no savings over the original. The only major difference is the roll marks, and no one in their right mind wanting an M4 clone is going to prefer a PSA stamp over a Colt logo if they’re looking for this level of authenticity. Link to cheaper colt? Or one of the same price? |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 3:20:05 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yup here is one for 1450 https://armsunlimited.com/colt-m4a1-socom-carbine-us-govt-property-marked/ Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Yes the colt socom collectors is around 1400-1500 Yup here is one for 1450 https://armsunlimited.com/colt-m4a1-socom-carbine-us-govt-property-marked/ It states it has a 14.5" barrel withan A2 flash hider for a 16.1" oal. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 4:04:11 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It states it has a 14.5" barrel withan A2 flash hider for a 16.1" oal. Looks like a longer A2 or spacer to extend it to 16 with the 14.5 barrel. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 4:16:20 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Looks like a longer A2 or spacer to extend it to 16 with the 14.5 barrel. The Colt uses an extended a2. |
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Posted: 10/3/2023 4:24:49 PM EST
[#50]
Off to the gun room to find that extra matech sight and KAC rail and accessories.
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