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Posted: 2/19/2018 5:52:19 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When Arts can pay as much as the others then they can add. But I don't think that will ever happen. I know another guy who works in the arts, makes $190k per year and drives two Porches, but he's an absolute, royal ass hole. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 5:58:49 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know a guy who works in the arts, makes about $175k per year and drives a Lamborghini. Actually, he was getting ready to buy his second Lamborghini last time I talked to him a couple months ago. I know another guy who works in the arts, makes $190k per year and drives two Porches, but he's an absolute, royal ass hole. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
When Arts can pay as much as the others then they can add. But I don't think that will ever happen. I know another guy who works in the arts, makes $190k per year and drives two Porches, but he's an absolute, royal ass hole. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:03:32 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been arguing for the arts up until this point, but now you've changed my mind. $175k/yr is not enough to drive a Lamborghini, much less two of them. He needs some STEM in his life And he bought his first Lambo used.
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:06:00 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
STEM = technicians who obey those with vision. A = those with vision. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:07:47 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Can you think of any non STEM that has put anything into space? Vision, wouldn't it be cool if.. STEM, I'm going to do this, just because I can. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:13:11 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can you think of any non STEM that has put anything into space? Vision, wouldn't it be cool if.. STEM, I'm going to do this, just because I can. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
STEM = technicians who obey those with vision. A = those with vision. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:27:59 PM EDT
[#7]
We wouldn't be dealing with this dreck if we had voluntary, free market education. Parents wouldn't pay to have their kid's brains neutered. Schools would probably have meaningful security as well. Compulsory education is the very model of the totalitarian state (Charlotte Iserbyt).
In product development it's a lot easier for engineers to get style support from artists than it is for artists to get (what they imagine is) engineering support from engineers. That's because physics and nature pretty much dictates that form follows function. Artists who work with actual physical forms and materials don't have this problem as much as the concept infatuated fantasists. This STEAM movement is just a commie diversity push to take an objective field and pussify it. Whenever you have a diverse group of people dialoging to consensus the stress relieving tendency is to move from conscience (Latin for with knowledge, facts) to consensus ( with sensation/emotions). Classic Frankfurt School commie dialectic subversion. Diversity is the energy to drive groups from positional orientation (patriarchal, didactic, factual) to relationship orientation (matriarchal, ambiguous, emotional) in order to keep the peace. It's what moms do. And the nanny state. Occupations that are fact based are an impediment to social transformation. This doesn't bode well for critical infrastructure SLEP or replacement. The bridge to the future will likely have some seriously pathological resonances. What do I know? Math is just a Northern European hegemonic tool of patriarchal oppression. Going back to the loading bench now....F=m*A. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:29:49 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They still have their vision because they didn't spend their time doing all that math homework. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:32:10 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Delusions is more like it.  |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:32:36 PM EDT
[#10]
Gotta include the blue hairs or they will cry. Science and math are hard. Throw some period blood on a canvas and call it deviant art.
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:35:17 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Would we even think about going into space if it weren't for the imaginations of writers and artists from time immemorial ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Can you think of any non STEM that has put anything into space? Vision, wouldn't it be cool if.. STEM, I'm going to do this, just because I can. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:35:48 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gotta include the blue hairs or they will cry. Science and math are hard. Throw some period blood on a canvas and call it deviant art. http://blonlee.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/apo-blue.jpg |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:39:40 PM EDT
[#13]
The drama between technicians and artists is getting old.
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:44:45 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He's divorced, no kids, has no house, lives on the road as a touring sound guy for Broadway theatre shows. All he does is pocket his money. Has been on the road for over 20 years, and never went to college so he has no student loans. And he bought his first Lambo used. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I've been arguing for the arts up until this point, but now you've changed my mind. $175k/yr is not enough to drive a Lamborghini, much less two of them. He needs some STEM in his life And he bought his first Lambo used. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:46:12 PM EDT
[#15]
TL;DR
The A was added to STEM because the Leftist Educational Establishment (most of whom couldn’t earn a post-grad degree in ANY STEM discipline if they pooled their entire family’s talent in that area) couldn’t stand the fact that their cherished Liberal Arts curriculum was being shown to be, well, worthless in the real world. TC |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:46:35 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The drama between technicians and artists is getting old. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:50:14 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: and @999monkeys I guess y'all are right, the globe was not navigated by someone looking at the stars, a guy understanding physics, they never would have thought to go up or down if it weren't for a fictional book. Arts are cool, but secondary to getting the job done. Did an artist think about a big mushroom cloud or an engineer figure out how to make one first. The pictures taken with cameras are very nice, art didn't design the camera though. The sea is beautiful, do you want to sail in a shipnbuilt by an artist or engineer? on a different note, as @Bohr_Adam points out, the USSR placed an overwhelming emphasis on STEM and were deeply afraid of the arts and humanities, because the technical guys were easy to control while the arts threatened the foundations of communism. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 6:57:53 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
everything in life begins and ends as a story. STEM is merely the toolbox. the arts--all the different forms of storytelling, in all the different senses--are why we do what we do. on a different note, as @Bohr_Adam points out, the USSR placed an overwhelming emphasis on STEM and were deeply afraid of the arts and humanities, because the technical guys were easy to control while the arts threatened the foundations of communism. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: and @999monkeys I guess y'all are right, the globe was not navigated by someone looking at the stars, a guy understanding physics, they never would have thought to go up or down if it weren't for a fictional book. Arts are cool, but secondary to getting the job done. Did an artist think about a big mushroom cloud or an engineer figure out how to make one first. The pictures taken with cameras are very nice, art didn't design the camera though. The sea is beautiful, do you want to sail in a shipnbuilt by an artist or engineer? on a different note, as @Bohr_Adam points out, the USSR placed an overwhelming emphasis on STEM and were deeply afraid of the arts and humanities, because the technical guys were easy to control while the arts threatened the foundations of communism. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:12:51 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
and @999monkeys I guess y'all are right, the globe was not navigated by someone looking at the stars, a guy understanding physics, they never would have thought to go up or down if it weren't for a fictional book. Arts are cool, but secondary to getting the job done. Did an artist think about a big mushroom cloud or an engineer figure out how to make one first. The pictures taken with cameras are very nice, art didn't design the camera though. The sea is beautiful, do you want to sail in a shipnbuilt by an artist or engineer? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: Can you think of any non STEM that has put anything into space? Vision, wouldn't it be cool if.. STEM, I'm going to do this, just because I can. For example, people first imagine a building, then they build it. It is impossible to build anything meaningful unless it is first imagined. Even if I were to pick up a box of legos and just start building, I would need visualize how the next pieces should come together to result in anything but an abstract mess. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:14:07 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That makes him one of the T's in STEM. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:29:38 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A being Agriculture is the only use I've ever heard of. Ag definitely fits into the STEM fields. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:33:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: and @999monkeys I guess y'all are right, the globe was not navigated by someone looking at the stars, a guy understanding physics, they never would have thought to go up or down if it weren't for a fictional book. Arts are cool, but secondary to getting the job done. Did an artist think about a big mushroom cloud or an engineer figure out how to make one first. The pictures taken with cameras are very nice, art didn't design the camera though. The sea is beautiful, do you want to sail in a shipnbuilt by an artist or engineer? on a different note, as @Bohr_Adam points out, the USSR placed an overwhelming emphasis on STEM and were deeply afraid of the arts and humanities, because the technical guys were easy to control while the arts threatened the foundations of communism. come to the dark side! 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:40:12 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are confusing your order of operations. For example, people first imagine a building, then they build it. It is impossible to build anything meaningful unless it is first imagined. Even if I were to pick up a box of legos and just start building, I would need visualize how the next pieces should come together to result in anything but an abstract mess. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: Can you think of any non STEM that has put anything into space? Vision, wouldn't it be cool if.. STEM, I'm going to do this, just because I can. For example, people first imagine a building, then they build it. It is impossible to build anything meaningful unless it is first imagined. Even if I were to pick up a box of legos and just start building, I would need visualize how the next pieces should come together to result in anything but an abstract mess. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:56:20 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
you're right--pussy is also a motivator. if you're a STEM guy, you've probably heard stories about guys from other departments getting pussy. come to the dark side! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: and @999monkeys I guess y'all are right, the globe was not navigated by someone looking at the stars, a guy understanding physics, they never would have thought to go up or down if it weren't for a fictional book. Arts are cool, but secondary to getting the job done. Did an artist think about a big mushroom cloud or an engineer figure out how to make one first. The pictures taken with cameras are very nice, art didn't design the camera though. The sea is beautiful, do you want to sail in a shipnbuilt by an artist or engineer? on a different note, as @Bohr_Adam points out, the USSR placed an overwhelming emphasis on STEM and were deeply afraid of the arts and humanities, because the technical guys were easy to control while the arts threatened the foundations of communism. come to the dark side! 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 7:59:59 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The drama between technicians and artists is getting old. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:00:41 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know a guy who works in the arts, makes about $175k per year and drives a Lamborghini. Actually, he was getting ready to buy his second Lamborghini last time I talked to him a couple months ago. I know another guy who works in the arts, makes $190k per year and drives two Porches, but he's an absolute, royal ass hole. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
When Arts can pay as much as the others then they can add. But I don't think that will ever happen. I know another guy who works in the arts, makes $190k per year and drives two Porches, but he's an absolute, royal ass hole. My wife makes more than both of them with a biology degree She drives a 2008 Nissan Rogue |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:03:19 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was in a science, engineering, architecture fraternity. Got lots of tang related to the house and outside of the house. Got lots of tang before even getting into college. I shit you not, I'm surprised I made it out of that fuck fest with my dick intact. You ever do two chicks at once? I have lived a good life, and can calculate a lot of things too. 
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:05:52 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No disrespect, do you really think engineers don't think about what they want to create? Erything I build is imagined and designed in my head before starting. All engineers poses this ability, the same can not be said for the A that want to put an idea into reality. I'm glade y'all exist, it allows me to decorate my stuff with things of interest. My favorite class in school was physics. Art can't answer the questions answered in the, if I throw this ball with this much force, at this angle, where exactly will it land? Simple math tells me the answer. Art, I buy it if I like it, hang it where I like. An infinite mirror, research it, build my own because I understand exactly how it works, or just buy one. Build a high HP car, I did it because I could. legos |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:06:42 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No disrespect, do you really think engineers don't think about what they want to create? Erything I build is imagined and designed in my head before starting. All engineers poses this ability, the same can not be said for the A that want to put an idea into reality. I'm glade y'all exist, it allows me to decorate my stuff with things of interest. My favorite class in school was physics. Art can't answer the questions answered in the, if I throw this ball with this much force, at this angle, where exactly will it land? Simple math tells me the answer. Art, I buy it if I like it, hang it where I like. An infinite mirror, research it, build my own because I understand exactly how it works, or just buy one. Build a high HP car, I did it because I could. legos Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: Can you think of any non STEM that has put anything into space? Vision, wouldn't it be cool if.. STEM, I'm going to do this, just because I can. For example, people first imagine a building, then they build it. It is impossible to build anything meaningful unless it is first imagined. Even if I were to pick up a box of legos and just start building, I would need visualize how the next pieces should come together to result in anything but an abstract mess. Engineering is useless in a vacuum. Note, I'm not an artist (my skillset is universally despised by both the STEM and the A), but it's an interesting discussion
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:11:32 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote History
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:15:31 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I like anything Big Bang, but art is much cooler here http://conceptartworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/netflix-spectral-movie-concept-art-SpectralRun_Side2.jpg 
that's awesome! |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 8:29:54 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
that's awesome! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I like anything Big Bang, but art is much cooler here http://conceptartworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/netflix-spectral-movie-concept-art-SpectralRun_Side2.jpg
that's awesome! |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 10:56:27 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Technician? |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 10:59:13 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Cool. My wife makes more than both of them with a biology degree She drives a 2008 Nissan Rogue |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:01:12 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
With a BS? Or a graduate degree? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Cool. My wife makes more than both of them with a biology degree She drives a 2008 Nissan Rogue
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:02:24 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: BS and does nothing related to biology
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:06:56 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Kind of an important detail Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: BS and does nothing related to biology |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:08:11 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That makes him one of the T's in STEM. I can teach you how to push all the buttons on a mixing console, but I can't teach you how to make the show sound good. Just like I can teach you how to play all the notes on a saxophone, but I can't teach you how to actually make it sound like music. Art is intrinsic to the human soul, and some people have more of it than others. And some don't have any of it. We call those people engineers. |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:10:45 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, but a STEM degree can get your foot in the door a basket weaving degree can't. She started in this field straight out of college |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:14:03 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have a degree in political science and a STEM job. They fired the guy with the civil engineering job and kept me. I find that my degree is useful here too. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Yes, but a STEM degree can get your foot in the door a basket weaving degree can't. She started in this field straight out of college If you were coming straight out of school your resume would have been sorted to the trashcan |
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Posted: 2/19/2018 11:18:57 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Probably something to do with competence and prior work history. If you were coming straight out of school your resume would have been sorted to the trashcan |
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Posted: 2/20/2018 12:24:25 AM EDT
[#42]
Funding.
With the art departments that I’m use to. There’s no money in hosting the vagina monologues or menstruating on a canvas and calling it “art”. They cannot even put together a basic tile mosaic. Something artists have been doing for the better part of 3000 years. Their great however at screaming their heads off, living “alternative” lives where they fuck anything they want and have more piercings and tattoos than a motorcycle club and will roll out the hysteria “patriarchy is oppressing me” machine to keep their lifestyle going. Being an artist used to come with the understanding that the shit your doing needs to appeal to your sponsors and at least be easy on the eyes. You also needed to be versed in different materials and processes. Now that’s so not the case. |
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Posted: 2/20/2018 12:35:33 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Technician? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
That makes him one of the T's in STEM. I will also add, if you take something like an I-phone, for every industrial designer there are a bunch of engineers to make it work*, and a bunch of people making the tooling to make the parts and even more people making the raw materials needed. That and industrial design isn't really considered "art". ETA *based on science, math, rules of thumb and experience. |
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Posted: 2/20/2018 12:52:55 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No. Mixing shows is an art. I can teach you how to push all the buttons on a mixing console, but I can't teach you how to make the show sound good. Just like I can teach you how to play all the notes on a saxophone, but I can't teach you how to actually make it sound like music. Art is intrinsic to the human soul, and some people have more of it than others. And some don't have any of it. We call those people engineers. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
That makes him one of the T's in STEM. I can teach you how to push all the buttons on a mixing console, but I can't teach you how to make the show sound good. Just like I can teach you how to play all the notes on a saxophone, but I can't teach you how to actually make it sound like music. Art is intrinsic to the human soul, and some people have more of it than others. And some don't have any of it. We call those people engineers. |
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Posted: 2/20/2018 3:47:04 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They still have their vision because they didn't spend their time doing all that math homework. 
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Posted: 2/20/2018 4:16:47 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bingo. Science, Technology, and Math are all closely related. Art? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Funding. The “arts” didn’t want to get left out of the money pool. Science, Technology, and Math are all closely related. Art? 
 
 
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Posted: 2/20/2018 5:24:11 AM EDT
[#47]
I know this is an unpopular position, but I do think that art and humanities related degrees are important.
You're gonna have a hard time arguing that linguistics, economics, archaeology, and history majors are bullshit. |
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Posted: 2/20/2018 6:22:26 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know this is an unpopular position, but I do think that art and humanities related degrees are important. You're gonna have a hard time arguing that linguistics, economics, archaeology, and history majors are bullshit.
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Posted: 2/20/2018 10:33:42 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I know this is an unpopular position, but I do think that art and humanities related degrees are important. You're gonna have a hard time arguing that linguistics, economics, archaeology, and history majors are bullshit. Archaeology isn’t even a field, it’s a sub-discipline
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Posted: 2/20/2018 12:16:14 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: lol Archaeology isn’t even a field, it’s a sub-discipline
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