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Posted: 12/18/2019 1:52:55 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: CVN 79 was christened, not commissioned. She'll not be commissioned until 2022. Chinese shipbuilding over the last 10 years. http://cdrsalamander.blogspot.com/2018/06/keeping-eye-on-long-game-part-lxxiv.html In 2009 they had 0 carriers. Now they have two. In the same time period we also did 2 (Bush and Ford). They've done a lot of other stuff too. Have we fixed our new CVNs yet? |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 1:53:02 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why spend money on a military when the invaders are living there for free, and getting paid while planning terrorist attacks. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: The Brits are stricken with a tiny military budget relatively speaking and don't desire to have much force projection. Their submarine force seems particularly overworked and under-equipped. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 2:01:48 PM EDT
[#3]
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I think the bigger question is why are all these navies going with the ski jump method.. just to save a few bucks? It's not like steam catapults and the arresting systems are top secret, I'm sure they were stolen decades ago.. so why not use them? to build a smaller boat? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Because they suck. We figured out in the 40's that catapults allowed heavier takeoff weights which helps in tons of ways. We didn't need to worry about how much money we'd save by having a carrier with short range aircraft. It's not like steam catapults and the arresting systems are top secret, I'm sure they were stolen decades ago.. so why not use them? to build a smaller boat? The ski jumps didn't save a few bucks; the cats would have almost doubled the cost of their carriers and increased crew size. As a result they can only operate one type of fixed wing, the F35B, and no fixed wing AWACS or refueling. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 3:53:41 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In this thread the armchair admirals are laughing at the CCP newly acquired naval capability while on the other hand can't figure out why the US still has problem fighting goatfuckers living in caves. Five years ago PLAN didn't have any carriers. The two carriers they do have might be useful for training, but there is an inherent problem with training your aviators on a ski-jump carrier when you intend your actual go-to-war carriers to be of the CATOBAR variety. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 4:13:08 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And today they now have ... ZERO operational carriers, with ZERO carrier qualified air wings to put upon them. The two carriers they do have might be useful for training, but there is an inherent problem with training your aviators on a ski-jump carrier when you intend your actual go-to-war carriers to be of the CATOBAR variety. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 4:31:51 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And today they now have ... ZERO operational carriers, with ZERO carrier qualified air wings to put upon them. The two carriers they do have might be useful for training, but there is an inherent problem with training your aviators on a ski-jump carrier when you intend your actual go-to-war carriers to be of the CATOBAR variety. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
In this thread the armchair admirals are laughing at the CCP newly acquired naval capability while on the other hand can't figure out why the US still has problem fighting goatfuckers living in caves. Five years ago PLAN didn't have any carriers. The two carriers they do have might be useful for training, but there is an inherent problem with training your aviators on a ski-jump carrier when you intend your actual go-to-war carriers to be of the CATOBAR variety. What they're doing is building a little, testing a little, and learning a lot. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 5:02:04 PM EDT
[#7]
The Chinese already have their third carrier under construction, they just haven't made an official news release about it yet.
The satellite photos show something very similar to a Nimitz carrier, just a little smaller. It's expected to have catapults, no one is yet sure about nuclear power. I think it will still be conventionally powered, the nuclear power will come in the fourth or fifth carrier they build. Yes, everyone is sure the Chinese will be building many more as the shipyard that they are building these carriers in is being tripled in size. The first two carriers are simply training ships, needed to figure out how to sail a carrier, how to do flight operations at all, train escort ships & subs that are typically part of a carrier task force. The third one will also be mostly a training ship, needed to train in how to do catapult flight operations. It''s expected that the fourth carrier will be the first one intended to be a combat vessel, but I am betting it will be nuclear powered and also mostly used as a training ship at first - teaching crews how to run a nuclear reactor powered ship. Then after the Chinese build several more it will join it's sisters in being a combat ship. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 6:38:36 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Chinese already have their third carrier under construction, they just haven't made an official news release about it yet. The satellite photos show something very similar to a Nimitz carrier, just a little smaller. It's expected to have catapults, no one is yet sure about nuclear power. I think it will still be conventionally powered, the nuclear power will come in the fourth or fifth carrier they build. Yes, everyone is sure the Chinese will be building many more as the shipyard that they are building these carriers in is being tripled in size. The first two carriers are simply training ships, needed to figure out how to sail a carrier, how to do flight operations at all, train escort ships & subs that are typically part of a carrier task force. The third one will also be mostly a training ship, needed to train in how to do catapult flight operations. It''s expected that the fourth carrier will be the first one intended to be a combat vessel, but I am betting it will be nuclear powered and also mostly used as a training ship at first - teaching crews how to run a nuclear reactor powered ship. Then after the Chinese build several more it will join it's sisters in being a combat ship. Until the Japanese start producing big battle robots, it's all kinda boring anyway. 
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Posted: 12/18/2019 7:07:07 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Didn't a Saudi terrorist trained by your own gov shoot up a USN base a few weeks ago? But, it was apparently THEIR fault for hurting his feelings. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 7:11:11 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Didn't a Saudi terrorist trained by your own gov shoot up a USN base a few weeks ago? |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 7:22:59 PM EDT
[#11]
It'll be interesting to see how they modify the Flanker series to work with catapults.
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Posted: 12/18/2019 7:37:46 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
An officer of the Saudi military. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 7:46:00 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And we keep shooting ourselves in the foot with broken CVNs and the LCS program. Have we fixed our new CVNs yet? |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 7:50:23 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The US converted a collier into their first Aircraft Carrier in 1920. 25 years later the US had built 36 dedicated Aircraft Carriers not to mention the 122 CVEs the US built. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: And today they now have ... ZERO operational carriers, with ZERO carrier qualified air wings to put upon them. The two carriers they do have might be useful for training, but there is an inherent problem with training your aviators on a ski-jump carrier when you intend your actual go-to-war carriers to be of the CATOBAR variety. 2. China is not the United States. Chinese come HERE to learn engineering and aeronautics - not the other way around. 3. 25 years after our first carrier, we were STILL developing and refining carrier air wing operations, night carrier operations, underway replenishment, and carrier based close air support. Were it not for being at war, that process would have taken still longer. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 8:46:57 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Plus, there's nothing stopping them from chopping off the ski ramp and putting in cats at a later date. They'll throw 100k workers at it, kill a couple hundred in the process, and have it finished inside a month. I think there was talk of plans for doing something similar to the Brit carriers, minus the 100k workers, death and a month. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Have they figured out how to make the powerplant work in this one? And it's still a shitty ski jump CV. Wake me up when they have CATOBAR and the training to use it effectively. Quoted:
The next one reportedly has catapults. They bought the HMAS Melbourne for scrapping in 1985 and finally got around to it sometime in 2000, after giving it a good going over. The Aussies reportedly left all the flight ops equipment in place. Allegedly some ChiCom pilots got some training on a land-based mock-up. From 2018: China's Next Aircraft Carrier Will Be a Massive Leap Forward From 2017: Analysis: Chinese aircraft carrier program progressing substantially into the new year -------------------- The limitations of STOBAR have prompted China to continuing to pursue the development of catapults for launching its carrier-based aircraft. Satellite photos of the air base at Huludao show that China has constructed two parallel catapults, and analysts tell Defense News that it appears one of the catapults is an Electromagnetic Aircraft Launch System while the other is a conventional steam catapult, based on satellite photos of the inside of the catapults during construction. Construction of the catapults was completed sometime between June and October 2016, with a satellite photo published by DigitalGlobe in mid-October showing a J-15 preparing to line up on one of the catapults. A photo of a PLAN J-15 with what appears to be a catapult launch bar on its nose wheel used to couple the aircraft to the catapult of the carrier during the launch sequence had surfaced the month before, adding further weight to the evidence that PLAN intends to switch to catapult-assisted takeoff but arrested recovery (CATOBAR) aircraft operations onboard its future carriers. https://www.armytimes.com/resizer/D8uLWs2tMXVAiYzNhBWVdz8EPF4=/600x0/filters:quality(100)/arc-anglerfish-arc2-prod-mco.s3.amazonaws.com/public/X6LWE5LOU5BJBIZ7HAIABEBBOU.jpg China has built two land-based catapult systems at a PLAN base near Huludao, Liaoning province. It is believed they became operational by October 2016. The construction of both types of catapults at Huludao suggests that China is exploring both technologies and has yet to decide on which type of catapult it will install on its future carriers. Chinese state media reported in 2014 that the country had reverse-engineered a land-based replica of the steam catapult and landing system from the Australian aircraft carrier HMAS Melbourne, which had been sold for scrap to a Chinese company in 1985. Rear Adm. Song Xue, then-deputy chief of staff of the PLAN, had already confirmed as far back as 2013 that China would build more carriers that would be larger and with more aircraft-carrying capacity than the Liaoning. The first of these carriers, tentatively designated the Type 002, is expected to be able to conduct CATOBAR operations. https://i.imgur.com/KjQTXTO.jpg I think there was talk of plans for doing something similar to the Brit carriers, minus the 100k workers, death and a month. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 9:30:38 PM EDT
[#16]
For the last time will you guys knock it off with the CATOBAR, STOVL and STOBAR shit?
No on in the Navy ever uses those terms. It's a ski-jump carrier, an angled deck carrier or some sort of a Marine gator-freighter. |
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Posted: 12/18/2019 9:38:58 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Curious what they'll use as a E-2 type aircraft https://americanmilitarynews.com/2018/08/china-secretly-building-its-copy-of-us-navys-e-2-hawkeye-says-will-be-a-game-changer/ |
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