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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:24:37 PM EDT
[#1]
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Olympic lifts are the most important lifts IMO. But I also know they take years to master with proper training. I was lucky enough to have world class strength coaches for a long time so I have the benefit of experiencing the proper way to do it. Most of what I see in cross fit is wrong and down right dangerous. I cant count the times Ive cringed while watching someone try to save a snatch which is completely stupid. I dont doubt that there are some that have the experience, i just havent seen it Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People like it and that's all that matters. I do wish that they would lay off some of the Olympic lifts though. The stuff that i've seen is pretty scary. You can hurt yourself pretty bad without the proper training and not a whole lot of people know how to do it properly. Performing a lift properly takes a lot of practice. Lifts like the snatch, really take a lot of practice. 
The Olympic lifts are probably my favorite thing about Crossfit...we perform them in some capacity every week. Sorry, but there's no chance they're going away....they're the foundation of Crossfit.
How often do you think the gym Bros in this thread that are bitching about Crossfit actually perform Olympic lifts? I'll bet never.......which is sad, because Olympic lifts actually do a lot for people in terms of strength, balance, mobility, etc. Olympic lifts are the most important lifts IMO. But I also know they take years to master with proper training. I was lucky enough to have world class strength coaches for a long time so I have the benefit of experiencing the proper way to do it. Most of what I see in cross fit is wrong and down right dangerous. I cant count the times Ive cringed while watching someone try to save a snatch which is completely stupid. I dont doubt that there are some that have the experience, i just havent seen it I have yet to see, in person, anyone get injured at the Crossfit gym......and we perform cleans, clean and Jerk, snatch, or some variation every week. YMMV. As always, whether you're an olympic lifter, power lifter, or a Crossfit athlete, having a good coach is critical. Oh, and I've seen plenty of Olympic lifters try to save a lift.....don't kid yourself. 
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:26:27 PM EDT
[#2]
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I don't think Ive ever seen a cross fit person do a proper clean, jerk or snatch. If you cant do it with a bar then you definitely shouldn't do it with a kettle bell or dumbbell. That's just asking for problems and i would wager that is where the majority of the injuries come from. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Crossfit is a fake exercise program designed to injure you as quickly and severely as possible. It also melts your renal system as your body poisons itself trying to repair the damage. Not sure if it is fake or not there are some seriously jacked folks who swear by it. My best friend is a physical therapist, according to them a significantly large portion of people who come through the clinic come because of crossfit injuries. Apparently, it's one of the worst things you can do to your body (work out wise) long term and they suggest no one should do it. What exactly is a crossfit injury? 95% of a crossfit workout is some type of squat or lifting something over your head. I don't think Ive ever seen a cross fit person do a proper clean, jerk or snatch. If you cant do it with a bar then you definitely shouldn't do it with a kettle bell or dumbbell. That's just asking for problems and i would wager that is where the majority of the injuries come from. There are actually a lot of respectable totals coming from Crossfit, they could even be better were they to focus on Olympic lifting. They were the reason for the spike in American Open attendance over the past few years as well as the increase in the qualifying total. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:26:36 PM EDT
[#3]
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Another key difference between normal people and crossfitters. Normal people use porn to jerk off, crossfitters use videos of some roided out chick doing overly complicated exercises. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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 Another key difference between normal people and crossfitters. Normal people use porn to jerk off, crossfitters use videos of some roided out chick doing overly complicated exercises. I Google image searched her name after he poster that and saw nothing fapworthy. Chicks with huge biceps and medicine balls... eh, I've only got so many loads I can shoot in a day. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:26:57 PM EDT
[#4]
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Call it a kip up. A cheat up. Don't include the word pull up, you haven't earned it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Why? If I enjoy kipping pullups as an explosive exercise and they work for that purpose, what is wrong with doing them? I'm not saying you're not allowed to do them. But don't do them and then tell people that you did a pullup, because you didn't. You used momentum to get your chin over a bar, you sure didn't use the muscles intended when God designed the pullup. By doing them, you are also failing to demonstrate whether you are strong, in shape, or anything else. You crossfitters should be forced to use quotation marks and asterisks whenever you discuss an exercise. You: 'I went to the box today and did 40x3 "pullups", totally best by all time record.*' * Disclaimer This exercise report is strictly for private and entertainment purposes. Reports of repetitions and weight are the sole claim of the individual reporting them and in no way reflect any factual representation of exercises actually accomplished. These exercises were not to any known standard and do not actually confirm to any human notion of strength or endurance. OR I could just qualify with "kipping" Call it a kip up. A cheat up. Don't include the word pull up, you haven't earned it. LOL. Coaches at my crossfit gym won't even allow you to do kipping pull-ups until you can do 10 strict (deadhang) pull-ups. Some of the wods call for strict pullups specifically, some don't. Honestly though, if you're not strong enough to do strict pull-ups you'll probably have a hard time kipping. The kip requires an explosive hollow hold in addition to the lat pull. Its not "cheating" its just a variation of the exercise. It still requires the same amount of energy to get your body from the lowest point to chin over the bar. With strict you're isolating the energy expenditure to the lats (and biceps, to a lesser degree). When kipping, you're utilizing an additional, explosive, hollow-body reflex (contraction of the abs and front-side muscles) with the lats to generate the upwards movement of the body. This allows for a "pull-up type" exercise that utilizes more muscles in a HIIT format. Do a set of 20....you'll feel like you just ran a mile. Either way you do it, you still have to move "x" amount of weight upwards to the bar. It ain't gonna move itself, and there's no cheating gravity. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:27:18 PM EDT
[#5]
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Well, that's interesting, since BOTH high rep and low rep training is critical to building strength....it doesn't matter if you're a Crossfit athlete or not. Serious question- Have you ever trained with, or know a competitive Olympic or Power Lifter? How do they train? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If you enjoy them then great but dont fool yourself into thinking that using momentum to get more reps will increase explosive power. For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. I'm not sure why you and others are bitching about the kipping or butterfly pull-up. They'll different exercises and they each serve a different purpose. At my gym we train them separately. Butterfly pull-ups are a lot more dynamic and do a lot more for "explosive" power than you think. I dont think you understand what explosive power is. You dont improve explosive power with high reps and using momentum Well, that's interesting, since BOTH high rep and low rep training is critical to building strength....it doesn't matter if you're a Crossfit athlete or not. Serious question- Have you ever trained with, or know a competitive Olympic or Power Lifter? How do they train? Thats not what you said originally. You said it was for explosive power. I absolutly agree that higher rep training is important. Serious Answer-No Well maybe yes This is me last summer 
Last week I pulled 455x7, the week before 495x4. My PR was 585. Ive been a competitive pl since I was 16 and have competed in several countries. eta this was my mentor in HS
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:31:15 PM EDT
[#6]
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There are actually a lot of respectable totals coming from Crossfit, they could even be better were they to focus on Olympic lifting. They were the reason for the spike in American Open attendance over the past few years as well as the increase in the qualifying total. I posted this same thing earlier in the thread. Many of the top Crossfit athletes found their beginning in Olympic lifting. Some even still compete.
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:32:09 PM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:32:18 PM EDT
[#8]
My cousin in upstate NY who I've seen like 5 times in my life owns a crossfit gym up there.
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:34:08 PM EDT
[#9]
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I have yet to see, in person, anyone get injured at the Crossfit gym......and we perform cleans, clean and Jerk, snatch, or some variation every week. YMMV. As always, whether you're an olympic lifter, power lifter, or a Crossfit athlete, having a good coach is critical. Oh, and I've seen plenty of Olympic lifters try to save a lift.....don't kid yourself. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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People like it and that's all that matters. I do wish that they would lay off some of the Olympic lifts though. The stuff that i've seen is pretty scary. You can hurt yourself pretty bad without the proper training and not a whole lot of people know how to do it properly. Performing a lift properly takes a lot of practice. Lifts like the snatch, really take a lot of practice.
The Olympic lifts are probably my favorite thing about Crossfit...we perform them in some capacity every week. Sorry, but there's no chance they're going away....they're the foundation of Crossfit.
How often do you think the gym Bros in this thread that are bitching about Crossfit actually perform Olympic lifts? I'll bet never.......which is sad, because Olympic lifts actually do a lot for people in terms of strength, balance, mobility, etc. Olympic lifts are the most important lifts IMO. But I also know they take years to master with proper training. I was lucky enough to have world class strength coaches for a long time so I have the benefit of experiencing the proper way to do it. Most of what I see in cross fit is wrong and down right dangerous. I cant count the times Ive cringed while watching someone try to save a snatch which is completely stupid. I dont doubt that there are some that have the experience, i just havent seen it I have yet to see, in person, anyone get injured at the Crossfit gym......and we perform cleans, clean and Jerk, snatch, or some variation every week. YMMV. As always, whether you're an olympic lifter, power lifter, or a Crossfit athlete, having a good coach is critical. Oh, and I've seen plenty of Olympic lifters try to save a lift.....don't kid yourself. Well, if you enjoy it, are getting the gains you want and no one is getting hurt then this has been's observations might not apply
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:35:20 PM EDT
[#10]
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Thats not what you said originally. You said it was for explosive power. I absolutly agree that higher rep training is important. Serious Answer-No Well maybe yes This is me last summer  https://youtu.be/g92Lz5Xe9co
Last week I pulled 455x7, the week before 495x4. My PR was 585. Ive been a competitive pl since I was 16 and have competed in several countries. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If you enjoy them then great but dont fool yourself into thinking that using momentum to get more reps will increase explosive power. For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. I'm not sure why you and others are bitching about the kipping or butterfly pull-up. They'll different exercises and they each serve a different purpose. At my gym we train them separately. Butterfly pull-ups are a lot more dynamic and do a lot more for "explosive" power than you think. I dont think you understand what explosive power is. You dont improve explosive power with high reps and using momentum Well, that's interesting, since BOTH high rep and low rep training is critical to building strength....it doesn't matter if you're a Crossfit athlete or not. Serious question- Have you ever trained with, or know a competitive Olympic or Power Lifter? How do they train? Thats not what you said originally. You said it was for explosive power. I absolutly agree that higher rep training is important. Serious Answer-No Well maybe yes This is me last summer https://youtu.be/g92Lz5Xe9co
Last week I pulled 455x7, the week before 495x4. My PR was 585. Ive been a competitive pl since I was 16 and have competed in several countries. Nice lifts! Maybe there is a break in communication. Kipping pull-ups do allow for more reps, which will/does lead to more explosive pull-ups. When you kip a pull up or butterfly them you're using more core. That's why you'll find that people that can actually butterfly (not just kip) pull-ups are no slouch when it comes to strict pull-ups.
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:35:53 PM EDT
[#11]
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I posted this same thing earlier in the thread. Many of the top Crossfit athletes found their beginning in Olympic lifting. Some even still compete. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are actually a lot of respectable totals coming from Crossfit, they could even be better were they to focus on Olympic lifting. They were the reason for the spike in American Open attendance over the past few years as well as the increase in the qualifying total. I posted this same thing earlier in the thread. Many of the top Crossfit athletes found their beginning in Olympic lifting. Some even still compete. Id never rag on the top tier athletes. Its the beginners who cant shut up with bad coaches that ruined xfit. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:36:49 PM EDT
[#12]
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For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. I'm not sure why you and others are bitching about the kipping or butterfly pull-up. They'll different exercises and they each serve a different purpose. At my gym we train them separately. Butterfly pull-ups are a lot more dynamic and do a lot more for "explosive" power than you think. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If you enjoy them then great but dont fool yourself into thinking that using momentum to get more reps will increase explosive power. For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. I'm not sure why you and others are bitching about the kipping or butterfly pull-up. They'll different exercises and they each serve a different purpose. At my gym we train them separately. Butterfly pull-ups are a lot more dynamic and do a lot more for "explosive" power than you think. I'm sure they do a lot for dislocated shoulders as well. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:40:01 PM EDT
[#13]
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I'm sure they do a lot for dislocated shoulders as well. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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If you enjoy them then great but dont fool yourself into thinking that using momentum to get more reps will increase explosive power. For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. I'm not sure why you and others are bitching about the kipping or butterfly pull-up. They'll different exercises and they each serve a different purpose. At my gym we train them separately. Butterfly pull-ups are a lot more dynamic and do a lot more for "explosive" power than you think. I'm sure they do a lot for dislocated shoulders as well. I have never seen or heard of anyone that dislocated their shoulder by performing any variation of a pull-up. YMMV. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:42:52 PM EDT
[#14]
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Id never rag on the top tier athletes. Its the beginners who cant shut up with bad coaches that ruined xfit. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are actually a lot of respectable totals coming from Crossfit, they could even be better were they to focus on Olympic lifting. They were the reason for the spike in American Open attendance over the past few years as well as the increase in the qualifying total. I posted this same thing earlier in the thread. Many of the top Crossfit athletes found their beginning in Olympic lifting. Some even still compete. Id never rag on the top tier athletes. Its the beginners who cant shut up with bad coaches that ruined xfit. You think that Powerlifting and Olympic Lifting are immune to bad coaching? You don't think that power lifters talk a big game? I certainly know some that like to brag.....
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:42:57 PM EDT
[#15]
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:44:05 PM EDT
[#16]
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For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. --- Nice lifts! Maybe there is a break in communication. Kipping pull-ups do allow for more reps, which will/does lead to more explosive pull-ups. When you kip a pull up or butterfly them you're using more core. That's why you'll find that people that can actually butterfly (not just kip) pull-ups are no slouch when it comes to strict pull-ups. You dont build explosive power with cardio or high reps Sorry Thats not to say higher rep training isnt important. Just dont say high rep kipping pullups builds explosive power because it doesnt |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:47:27 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryWait a minute, which side of the argument are pushing here........?
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:49:14 PM EDT
[#18]
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Oly lifts are also notorious, as they perfect the momentum aspect, it allows more weight, instead of just focusing on getting over the strength aspect (what a progression of the different Oly lift movements over years on youtube). Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It just seems like a bunch of exercises thrown together like a crazy workout obstacle course or something. go. Oly lifts are also notorious, as they perfect the momentum aspect, it allows more weight, instead of just focusing on getting over the strength aspect (what a progression of the different Oly lift movements over years on youtube). We've been over this before, and the end result of the discussion was that you don't know anything about Oly lifting. Where do you think that momentum comes from? (hint: your own body ie strength) Also, saying kipping is cheating is like saying a 100m sprint is cheating because you're not running a mile. It's a different exercise, performed in a different way, for a different reason. It's not for everyone (I don't do them) and most people don't need them, but there IS a time and a place. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:50:12 PM EDT
[#19]
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You dont build explosive power with cardio or high reps Sorry Thats not to say higher rep training isnt important. Just dont say high rep kipping pullups builds explosive power because it doesnt Quote HistoryQuoted:
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For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. --- Nice lifts! Maybe there is a break in communication. Kipping pull-ups do allow for more reps, which will/does lead to more explosive pull-ups. When you kip a pull up or butterfly them you're using more core. That's why you'll find that people that can actually butterfly (not just kip) pull-ups are no slouch when it comes to strict pull-ups. You dont build explosive power with cardio or high reps Sorry Thats not to say higher rep training isnt important. Just dont say high rep kipping pullups builds explosive power because it doesnt Ugg, variation in movements is key.... |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:50:20 PM EDT
[#20]
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It's rare that anyone brings up the military/crossfit connection, guess it wouldn't be that funny trying to shit talk Murph? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It was a concept that total, functional fitness is a base for performance. Gymnasts have the best flexibility and body weight use strength. You should do some gymnast skills like muscle ups, mini parallels, etc. Olympic lifters have the most explosive strength. Do some Olympic lifts. Power lifters are the strongest. Do dead lift, squat, and bench. Sprinters and longer distance runners have niches in capacity, Do some of each. Old school stuff like rope climbs, medicine balls, etc. we're great functional fitness things even though old fashioned. Shiny nautilus machines and stuff were not. It made for a good well rounded base of fitness you could add your specialty stuff on top off. SOF guys found that in general, Doing a combination of body building exercises and running as they had been doing for decades did not optimize performance. Functional programs such as cross fit could. Then everyone thought cross fit was cool and it became a fucktarded mix of competitions, edgy, cool to do, stupid stuff getting added into, who could come up with the coolest, edgiest, most outlandish exercise to add to it, etc. Instead of being scaled to individuals some did not scale and got hurt, etc. Every five for tall 100 pound check can now think she works out like a seal, etc. It's rare that anyone brings up the military/crossfit connection, guess it wouldn't be that funny trying to shit talk Murph? Pretty good run down of what it is really. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:51:52 PM EDT
[#21]
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You think that Powerlifting and Olympic Lifting are immune to bad coaching? You don't think that power lifters talk a big game? I certainly know some that like to brag..... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are actually a lot of respectable totals coming from Crossfit, they could even be better were they to focus on Olympic lifting. They were the reason for the spike in American Open attendance over the past few years as well as the increase in the qualifying total. I posted this same thing earlier in the thread. Many of the top Crossfit athletes found their beginning in Olympic lifting. Some even still compete. Id never rag on the top tier athletes. Its the beginners who cant shut up with bad coaches that ruined xfit. You think that Powerlifting and Olympic Lifting are immune to bad coaching? You don't think that power lifters talk a big game? I certainly know some that like to brag..... Not at all. You dont seem to know my opinion on xfit. I only gave you my numbers because you asked. Besides the sd&f forum and my wife I dont talk about my lifts |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:55:04 PM EDT
[#22]
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You dont build explosive power with cardio or high reps Sorry Thats not to say higher rep training isnt important. Just dont say high rep kipping pullups builds explosive power because it doesnt Quote HistoryQuoted:
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For me, butterfly pull-up are more cardio than anything. --- Nice lifts! Maybe there is a break in communication. Kipping pull-ups do allow for more reps, which will/does lead to more explosive pull-ups. When you kip a pull up or butterfly them you're using more core. That's why you'll find that people that can actually butterfly (not just kip) pull-ups are no slouch when it comes to strict pull-ups. You dont build explosive power with cardio or high reps Sorry Thats not to say higher rep training isnt important. Just dont say high rep kipping pullups builds explosive power because it doesnt Why doesn't it? |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:55:40 PM EDT
[#23]
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We've been over this before, and the end result of the discussion was that you don't know anything about Oly lifting. Where do you think that momentum comes from? (hint: you're own body ie strength) Also, saying kipping is cheating is like saying a 100m sprint is cheating because you're not running a mile. It's a different exercise, performed in a different way, for a different reason. It's not for everyone (I don't do them) and most people don't need them, but there IS a time and a place. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It just seems like a bunch of exercises thrown together like a crazy workout obstacle course or something. go. Oly lifts are also notorious, as they perfect the momentum aspect, it allows more weight, instead of just focusing on getting over the strength aspect (what a progression of the different Oly lift movements over years on youtube). We've been over this before, and the end result of the discussion was that you don't know anything about Oly lifting. Where do you think that momentum comes from? (hint: you're own body ie strength) Also, saying kipping is cheating is like saying a 100m sprint is cheating because you're not running a mile. It's a different exercise, performed in a different way, for a different reason. It's not for everyone (I don't do them) and most people don't need them, but there IS a time and a place. I think cheating can be very useful used at ends of sets etc. Unfortunately there are lots and lots of videos on youtube with lots and lots of kipping. If the only videos posted on youtube were of the pro's then there wouldnt be a disconnect between what xfit is and what the yahoos make it look like |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:56:02 PM EDT
[#24]
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Not at all. You dont seem to know my opinion on xfit. I only gave you my numbers because you asked. Besides the sd&f forum and my wife I dont talk about my lifts Quote HistoryQuoted:
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There are actually a lot of respectable totals coming from Crossfit, they could even be better were they to focus on Olympic lifting. They were the reason for the spike in American Open attendance over the past few years as well as the increase in the qualifying total. I posted this same thing earlier in the thread. Many of the top Crossfit athletes found their beginning in Olympic lifting. Some even still compete. Id never rag on the top tier athletes. Its the beginners who cant shut up with bad coaches that ruined xfit. You think that Powerlifting and Olympic Lifting are immune to bad coaching? You don't think that power lifters talk a big game? I certainly know some that like to brag..... Not at all. You dont seem to know my opinion on xfit. I only gave you my numbers because you asked. Besides the sd&f forum and my wife I dont talk about my lifts I didn't mean you. We have a PL that comes to the Crossfit gym to workout- my coach is the owner of the gym and is also an Oly lifting/PL coach. He's a cool guy....but kind of a Bro if you know what I mean.....likes to brag He's funny, if the coach programs sets with greater than 5 reps he bitches and moans about it being a cardio workout.
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:57:22 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryThat's why you'll find that people that can actually butterfly (not just kip) pull-ups are no slouch when it comes to strict pull-ups. I can usually hit 35 using butterfly kip. Strict deadhangs were over 20 consistently at that time. There isn't anybody who can do a boatload of kipping pull ups that couldn't also bust out a respectable number of dead hangs. But I think there are a lot of people with a hell of a lot to say that couldn't do even one right now. Like I said before, there's good and bad in crossfit. For me, it was the barbell shit that was dangerous for me and had to get left behind. The bodyweight stuff, and learning how to use kb's properly were worth the trip for me. I don't do organized crossfit anymore, but I still do some of the wods from it that helped me a lot. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 7:57:31 PM EDT
[#26]
I've been doing crossfit for about 3 months now. I'm considerably stronger and faster than when I started.
I was very hesitant because I've heard a lot of people getting hurt. Our coach is awesome though. He subs in different workouts for you in your WOD if your technique isn't yet where he thinks it should be. I've started to catch up on that front, and I usually leave the gym feeling torn apart. I don't drive my fast car anymore because I struggle to keep the clutch in after an hour at that gym. We never have a repeated set of workouts. It's always a new combination. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:01:16 PM EDT
[#27]
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It started out as a pretty good workout routine designed by a guy who was a former gymnastics guru, that also incorporated a bunch of Oly lifts and other high intensity workouts, that later became franchised, very expensive, its own language (gyms=box), and the basis of what most outsiders would consider a cult like status. Its very big on quantifiable improvement, which makes it about getting good at doing the movements, mastering technique to achieve more repetitions/more weight, over the basis of doing the exercise in the first place. The most egregious is the kipping pullup, an exercise designed to strengthen the back and arms by repeatedly pulling the body weight up to a bar. In Crossfit, they introduce methods of cheating, called kipping, where a very taught technique utilizing momentum is used to achieve more repetitions, which = winning in Crossfit, regardless if it violates the tenets of doing the exercise in the first place. Oly lifts are also notorious, as they perfect the momentum aspect, it allows more weight, instead of just focusing on getting over the strength aspect (what a progression of the different Oly lift movements over years on youtube). They are also notorious with having barely qualified instructors having novices doing very dangerous movements using bad form. Meaning Crossfit ensures orthopedic surgeons always make their boat payments. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It just seems like a bunch of exercises thrown together like a crazy workout obstacle course or something. go. It started out as a pretty good workout routine designed by a guy who was a former gymnastics guru, that also incorporated a bunch of Oly lifts and other high intensity workouts, that later became franchised, very expensive, its own language (gyms=box), and the basis of what most outsiders would consider a cult like status. Its very big on quantifiable improvement, which makes it about getting good at doing the movements, mastering technique to achieve more repetitions/more weight, over the basis of doing the exercise in the first place. The most egregious is the kipping pullup, an exercise designed to strengthen the back and arms by repeatedly pulling the body weight up to a bar. In Crossfit, they introduce methods of cheating, called kipping, where a very taught technique utilizing momentum is used to achieve more repetitions, which = winning in Crossfit, regardless if it violates the tenets of doing the exercise in the first place. Oly lifts are also notorious, as they perfect the momentum aspect, it allows more weight, instead of just focusing on getting over the strength aspect (what a progression of the different Oly lift movements over years on youtube). They are also notorious with having barely qualified instructors having novices doing very dangerous movements using bad form. Meaning Crossfit ensures orthopedic surgeons always make their boat payments. It doesn't violate the tenet of doing the exercise because it's a different exercise. It's not a shoulder/lat exercise, it's a core body exercise with the butterfly motion. Some WOD workouts call for dead hang pullups. Some don't. They're not the same thing. It's not cheating anymore than it's cheating to move more weight in a bench press because it's not an incline press. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:02:02 PM EDT
[#28]
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LOL. Coaches at my crossfit gym won't even allow you to do kipping pull-ups until you can do 10 strict (deadhang) pull-ups. Some of the wods call for strict pullups specifically, some don't. Honestly though, if you're not strong enough to do strict pull-ups you'll probably have a hard time kipping. The kip requires an explosive hollow hold in addition to the lat pull. Its not "cheating" its just a variation of the exercise. It still requires the same amount of energy to get your body from the lowest point to chin over the bar. With strict you're isolating the energy expenditure to the lats (and biceps, to a lesser degree). When kipping, you're utilizing an additional, explosive, hollow-body reflex (contraction of the abs and front-side muscles) with the lats to generate the upwards movement of the body. This allows for a "pull-up type" exercise that utilizes more muscles in a HIIT format. Do a set of 20....you'll feel like you just ran a mile. Either way you do it, you still have to move "x" amount of weight upwards to the bar. It ain't gonna move itself, and there's no cheating gravity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Why? If I enjoy kipping pullups as an explosive exercise and they work for that purpose, what is wrong with doing them? I'm not saying you're not allowed to do them. But don't do them and then tell people that you did a pullup, because you didn't. You used momentum to get your chin over a bar, you sure didn't use the muscles intended when God designed the pullup. By doing them, you are also failing to demonstrate whether you are strong, in shape, or anything else. You crossfitters should be forced to use quotation marks and asterisks whenever you discuss an exercise. You: 'I went to the box today and did 40x3 "pullups", totally best by all time record.*' * Disclaimer This exercise report is strictly for private and entertainment purposes. Reports of repetitions and weight are the sole claim of the individual reporting them and in no way reflect any factual representation of exercises actually accomplished. These exercises were not to any known standard and do not actually confirm to any human notion of strength or endurance. OR I could just qualify with "kipping" Call it a kip up. A cheat up. Don't include the word pull up, you haven't earned it. LOL. Coaches at my crossfit gym won't even allow you to do kipping pull-ups until you can do 10 strict (deadhang) pull-ups. Some of the wods call for strict pullups specifically, some don't. Honestly though, if you're not strong enough to do strict pull-ups you'll probably have a hard time kipping. The kip requires an explosive hollow hold in addition to the lat pull. Its not "cheating" its just a variation of the exercise. It still requires the same amount of energy to get your body from the lowest point to chin over the bar. With strict you're isolating the energy expenditure to the lats (and biceps, to a lesser degree). When kipping, you're utilizing an additional, explosive, hollow-body reflex (contraction of the abs and front-side muscles) with the lats to generate the upwards movement of the body. This allows for a "pull-up type" exercise that utilizes more muscles in a HIIT format. Do a set of 20....you'll feel like you just ran a mile. Either way you do it, you still have to move "x" amount of weight upwards to the bar. It ain't gonna move itself, and there's no cheating gravity. You're talking to someone who was s member of a organization that created kipping pullups as a way of getting a higher score on the physical fitness test, where weak fat bodies would nearly uproot a cemented pullup station by kipping out 20 disgusting cheat ups. I was also in when they changed it to dead hangs and those same people who maxed it out suddenly couldn't do 5. If you're bragging about exercising and you can't do way more than 10 dead hands you shouldn't be bragging at all. Like bragging about running a 9 minute mile. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:02:34 PM EDT
[#29]
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Wait a minute, which side of the argument are pushing here........?
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Wait a minute, which side of the argument are pushing here........?
No arguing......just fapping 
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:13:13 PM EDT
[#30]
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:16:16 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryThe guy struggling with the 465lb deadlift at :58 into the video is a former Navy SEAL. He was also director of training for Crossfit at one time and there was an article about him coming in from ops in Afghanistan and getting on a laptop and doing Crossfit programming for back home.  |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:18:13 PM EDT
[#32]
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It doesn't violate the tenet of doing the exercise because it's a different exercise. It's not a shoulder/lat exercise, it's a core body exercise with the butterfly motion. Some WOD workouts call for dead hang pullups. Some don't. They're not the same thing. It's not cheating anymore than it's cheating to move more weight in a bench press because it's not an incline press. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It just seems like a bunch of exercises thrown together like a crazy workout obstacle course or something. go. It started out as a pretty good workout routine designed by a guy who was a former gymnastics guru, that also incorporated a bunch of Oly lifts and other high intensity workouts, that later became franchised, very expensive, its own language (gyms=box), and the basis of what most outsiders would consider a cult like status. Its very big on quantifiable improvement, which makes it about getting good at doing the movements, mastering technique to achieve more repetitions/more weight, over the basis of doing the exercise in the first place. The most egregious is the kipping pullup, an exercise designed to strengthen the back and arms by repeatedly pulling the body weight up to a bar. In Crossfit, they introduce methods of cheating, called kipping, where a very taught technique utilizing momentum is used to achieve more repetitions, which = winning in Crossfit, regardless if it violates the tenets of doing the exercise in the first place. Oly lifts are also notorious, as they perfect the momentum aspect, it allows more weight, instead of just focusing on getting over the strength aspect (what a progression of the different Oly lift movements over years on youtube). They are also notorious with having barely qualified instructors having novices doing very dangerous movements using bad form. Meaning Crossfit ensures orthopedic surgeons always make their boat payments. It doesn't violate the tenet of doing the exercise because it's a different exercise. It's not a shoulder/lat exercise, it's a core body exercise with the butterfly motion. Some WOD workouts call for dead hang pullups. Some don't. They're not the same thing. It's not cheating anymore than it's cheating to move more weight in a bench press because it's not an incline press. No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:20:29 PM EDT
[#33]
Was this not posted yet?
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:21:49 PM EDT
[#34]
It's something you "do" mostly by posting to facebook, instagram and twitter while wearing workout clothes
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:23:11 PM EDT
[#35]
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:25:26 PM EDT
[#36]
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Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Get out of here with your well thought out arguments and facts. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:27:20 PM EDT
[#37]
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Get out of here with your well thought out arguments and facts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Get out of here with your well thought out arguments and facts. Yeah I know. CF threads are no place for thinking. You either hate it with all your heart and no critical thinking because the only thing trendier than crossfit is hating crossfit...or...you love it with all your heart and no critical thinking. There is no middle ground! |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:28:11 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What I'd do, instead of doing a 5 second google search that actually explains it, is ask GD where Crossfit is a cultural punching bag...because then the answers will conform to my predetermined viewpoint. <not a Crossfit person, btw> Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It just seems like a bunch of exercises thrown together like a crazy workout obstacle course or something. go. What I'd do, instead of doing a 5 second google search that actually explains it, is ask GD where Crossfit is a cultural punching bag...because then the answers will conform to my predetermined viewpoint. <not a Crossfit person, btw> |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:35:27 PM EDT
[#39]
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Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:38:13 PM EDT
[#40]
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Yeah I know. CF threads are no place for thinking. You either hate it with all your heart and no critical thinking because the only thing trendier than crossfit is hating crossfit...or...you love it with all your heart and no critical thinking. There is no middle ground! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Get out of here with your well thought out arguments and facts. Yeah I know. CF threads are no place for thinking. You either hate it with all your heart and no critical thinking because the only thing trendier than crossfit is hating crossfit...or...you love it with all your heart and no critical thinking. There is no middle ground! I just like the women so Im forced to not hate it too much. Rita Benevidez...
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:38:16 PM EDT
[#41]
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It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away Well...I never argued that, because it's obviously not true. Like I said, no middle ground. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:46:10 PM EDT
[#42]
It's a repackaging of the old "circuit training" workout derived from a cult like programming system.
It's mostly nonsense and a great way to get injured. And they use words like "functional strength" like they are magic. How the fuck is deadlifting 500 lbs. not "functional?" Stick with real strength/bodybuilding training. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 8:58:34 PM EDT
[#43]
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It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away I'll be your friend, but only on leg day. I'm not going to start curling and benching now... |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:00:58 PM EDT
[#44]
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Well...I never argued that, because it's obviously not true. Like I said, no middle ground. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away Well...I never argued that, because it's obviously not true. Like I said, no middle ground. Oh I know that. I think we're it for opposing sides of crossfit in the middle. I really just like making fun of xfitters. Now i know how soldiers feel when they make fun of Marines for drawing dicks 
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:00:59 PM EDT
[#45]
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Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Yeah, I'm sure kipping pull ups is for your heart rate. Lol, I love reading you cultist who focus on cheating exercise. And i don't care how good shape you are, keep doing fucked up pullups, you deserve all the scorn. Especially being a former Marine... |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:01:52 PM EDT
[#46]
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Yeah I know. CF threads are no place for thinking. You either hate it with all your heart and no critical thinking because the only thing trendier than crossfit is hating crossfit...or...you love it with all your heart and no critical thinking. There is no middle ground! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Get out of here with your well thought out arguments and facts. Yeah I know. CF threads are no place for thinking. You either hate it with all your heart and no critical thinking because the only thing trendier than crossfit is hating crossfit...or...you love it with all your heart and no critical thinking. There is no middle ground! One cultist telling another cultist that they are the normal ones. rofl |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:02:36 PM EDT
[#47]
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I'll be your friend, but only on leg day. I'm not going to start curling and benching now... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. It must be when xfitters argue that kipping is for building explosive power I argue that a pullup with less then a 45lbs plate doesnt count. But i have no friends so Im just talking to myself. Least it keeps the crazy xfitters away I'll be your friend, but only on leg day. I'm not going to start curling and benching now... Only if you show me your snatch 
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:04:17 PM EDT
[#48]
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It makes you throw up. Atleast the one time I tried it I did. I had people pulling over on the side of the highway to make sure I was okay. Never again Lucky you. The one time I did it, I got rhabdomyolysis and spent 6 days in the hospital. |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:05:23 PM EDT
[#49]
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Yeah, I'm sure kipping pull ups is for your heart rate. Lol, I love reading you cultist who focus on cheating exercise. And i don't care how good shape you are, keep doing fucked up pullups, you deserve all the scorn. Especially being a former Marine... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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No, it's a back exercise. It doesnt stop until someone challenges you and says cheat ups aren't doing shit for back and arm strength compared to dead hangs. Then suddenly its about explosive force, until someone explains that high reps isn't how you build explosive force. Then it's about core strength, which is a catch all for every exercise ever created where the abs might play a part. Well I think you're cheating if you do deadhangs without added weight. See how that works? Sometime when there's pullups in workouts it's not for strength. You can do pullups with added weight for strength, but then if you have to do a whole bunch and you're trying to keep heart rate high because you're working on conditioning, it doesn't really make sense to do deadhangs now does it? No, you want to get them done quickly because you're not working on strength at that time, you're working on conditioning. It's not that complicated. Yeah, I'm sure kipping pull ups is for your heart rate. Lol, I love reading you cultist who focus on cheating exercise. And i don't care how good shape you are, keep doing fucked up pullups, you deserve all the scorn. Especially being a former Marine... And there it goes Ill be in the corner doing deadhang pullups and my plate singing the Marine Corps Hymn |
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Posted: 2/29/2016 9:06:13 PM EDT
[#50]
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http://crossfit-games.edgesuite.net/sites/default/files/2014_CamilleLeblancBazinet_floater3.jpg Look at those traps and shoulders...are we positive there isn't a weiner under those short shorts? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Another key difference between normal people and crossfitters. Normal people use porn to jerk off, crossfitters use videos of some roided out chick doing overly complicated exercises. http://crossfit-games.edgesuite.net/sites/default/files/2014_CamilleLeblancBazinet_floater3.jpg Look at those traps and shoulders...are we positive there isn't a weiner under those short shorts? This is a certified HE-BITCH! I know a couple who own a crossfit and they're douche bags. I hate most the humans walking around this planet but crossfit fuckers are their own breed of positive attitude types that make me sick. If you take offense to what I've said cause you just love to flip tires over and over and over and over, then flip over some more tires. |
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