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Posted: 12/14/2022 9:47:11 AM EDT
All,
Before you begin reading the below, have a time keeping device ready. Upon completion of reading the scenario you have two minutes to compose your answer. Please post your answer in this thread, and tag in friends. We can discuss answers as they are posted. 
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:01:35 AM EDT
[#1]
Team Fall Back. A-10 - Do your thing.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:03:01 AM EDT
[#2]
Not sure. Bump in hopes that others will answer. And fast, because they’re about to be on top of us.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:06:56 AM EDT
[#3]
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:08:54 AM EDT
[#4]
Good morning. *yawn*.
Hold, let them get within 35m, FT Leader initiates with grenades followed closely by the SAW and subsequent fire/grenades of individual riflemen. Edit: one of my rifleman gets told to cap that RTO. A decent squad leader would put the remaining fireteams teams on line that can secure the flank and/or catch enemy trying to squirt out. Regardless, Sqd actions on contact prior to the objective ought to have been briefed during the OPORD. Doesn’t matter if I’m wrong, we’ve been living a simulation since 2012 anyway. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:09:22 AM EDT
[#5]
What is our team and larger unit comm structure?
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:12:09 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've got a full year to plan so let me get back to you. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/4019/0DD32392-167B-4852-8651-A326D6CA70FD_jpe-2634766.JPG My brain is working in FY23...sorry. Fixed. 
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:13:08 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is our team and larger unit comm structure? You have no radios. Your squad leaders and platoon commander have radios. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:15:28 AM EDT
[#8]
FRAGO? Fuck that.
 SAW gunner is getting an ADDRAC and a boner from that enfilade... and I'm marking the enemy radioman with a 40mm. 2nd team leader is smart enough to maneuver to my rifleman for his SA or I'm using intrasquad comms to advise the other elements of the contact. It's the least bad option. I could hold my team but then the enemy moves into our formation and discovery means a lot of fucked fields of fire and friendly fire. The enemy patrol cannot penetrate my line of movement and then buttfuck the company in the rear via fires or intelligence. Time for the company commander to call an audible on me. I can recover from the unfavorable fitrep. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:15:34 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You have no radios. Your squad leaders and platoon commander have radios. Well, I guess the shooting will let everyone else know that something is going on. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:15:49 AM EDT
[#10]
It's 30 meters with excellent visibility. If we're not blown already it's because they are blind. Do I have a parachute flare or other distractive/ illumination device that will highlight them to other friendlies in the area without pinpointing my position?
Eta: 30 meters with excellent visibility is close enough that somebody is about to start shooting either way and I want to minimize blue on blue while also alerting everyone that I have no communication with where to shoot. Verbal commands are going to go to shit as soon as the first trigger is pulled and I don't have any radios. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:30:42 AM EDT
[#11]
I'm not tactical. How far away are we from the main group we're assaulting? Assuming I haven't been spotted, hide quietly and carefully. Observe what direction enemy team takes. If in the direction of the rest of the group, make a move to engage. If in my direction, wait. Depending on hiding position and their gear (NV or thermal) determine if we should engage as they get close or let them pass by.
I suck at these. I'm an in the moment guy and really would want to see conditions in real time. Then probably make the wrong decision.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:33:48 AM EDT
[#12]
First thing I would do is have my fireteam hold fire and maintain position/cover until it can be verified that the suspected enemy movement isn't actually the 2nd fire team.
If, and only if, enemy element is actually confirmed, open up from current positions. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:34:40 AM EDT
[#13]
Take out my 1911 and begin shooting the bad guys from the back to the front without the leading men noticing.
Trust me, it works! |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:36:06 AM EDT
[#14]
Without comms, I'd do my best charades to order my team to hold fire, let the enemy push up a little further because I don't want dudes in the rear to easily fall back into cover. Let them all cross the stream and that gives my asst gunner a great angle.
I drop the radioman and hopefully my men are decent shooters so we can kill the others with minimal shenanigans. They're all bunched up so I can probably get another one in addition to the radioman at that range before they take cover. We are obviously smart enough to equip everyone with suppressors so the element of surprise on the objective isn't blown. If we don't have suppressors and the objective is fucked anyway, I toss gernaydes after dropping the radio dude. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:38:31 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: First thing I would do is have my fireteam hold fire and maintain position/cover until it can be verified that the suspected enemy movement isn't actually the 2nd fire team. If, and only if, enemy element is actually confirmed, open up from current positions. Why u no trust your rifleman? Movement has gone well, good vis. Just because you don't see the 2nd team, doesn't mean that the rifleman doesn't. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:40:53 AM EDT
[#16]
Are there verbal sign/countersign procedures in place?
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:42:25 AM EDT
[#17]
Let them pass and continue onto the attack. Try to keep tabs on the enemy patrol.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:49:16 AM EDT
[#18]
Let them all cross the river.
Hit the radioman and their point first. I am not sure what the fields of fire were limited to in order to signal shifts in fire or maneuvers. Maybe Seems like you are compromised. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:49:22 AM EDT
[#19]
Have my team hold position. Open up on enemy forces after they've crossed targeting RTO first. Use any explosives that are available. Fix in place with high volume of fire.
Squad leader should move back to team in contact and assess. With a full squad we've got them outnumbered and fixed. He should move back to and lead remainder of squad in a flanking maneuver down the river using the trees as concealment. Use visual or whistle commands for shift and lift fire and assault through the enemy position from the large clump of trees to the north. Basically Battle Drill 1 A. Might not be perfect but running that on the fly with limited comms should be second nature to everyone.  |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:50:34 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not tactical. How far away are we from the main group we're assaulting? Assuming I haven't been spotted, hide quietly and carefully. Observe what direction enemy team takes. If in the direction of the rest of the group, make a move to engage. If in my direction, wait. Depending on hiding position and their gear (NV or thermal) determine if we should engage as they get close or let them pass by. I suck at these. I'm an in the moment guy and really would want to see conditions in real time. Then probably make the wrong decision. Are there any potential hazards you can identify with waiting to engage until the enemy passes by and is moving in the direction of your unit? @chargerkid5 |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 10:57:03 AM EDT
[#21]
do we have nods?
do we have thermals? does the enemy have nods? do we have IR markers? first I would probably have the AG and MG form a "mini" L shape ambush until we figure out if that's actually the enemy. If we have nods and the enemy doesn't then turn on some IR markers. The "enemy" might turn out to be 2D that got lost by a 2nd LT that knew the way. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:01:04 AM EDT
[#22]
I spent my 2 minutes frozen with indecision.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:03:03 AM EDT
[#23]
Note: Answer under assumption that we haven't been issued individual radios, and communication with 2d Fire Team will require sending my rifleman north to make visual/audible contact. Also assuming that fire team leaders, including my character, are issued an M203.
Priority 1, exploit tight formation and produce casualties right now SAW gunner take up position behind treeline and go cyclic. Prioritize radioman. I immediately fire M203 into center of formation. Rifleman move north and signal enemy contact to 2d Fire Team, then try to move west around that treeline to flank. Prioritize signature reduction over volume of fire until backup from 2d Fire Team gets there. Since the area between myself and my Rifleman has no cover, I move south-west and join my Saw gunner and Assistant gunner behind that treeline. If they survive to begin pushing east at us, then myself, SAW, and Assistant move south-east to the further back treeline for cover, and to bait the enemy into using our previous treeline which gets them trapped between Leader/SAW/Assist and Rifleman/2dBackup. If backup from 2d doesn't arrive and they continue surviving and maneuvering, continue trying to fall back east rather than south, since they might have another group further south moving to flank us. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:06:45 AM EDT
[#24]
I need to know the gender identities prior to any decisions.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:09:41 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are there any potential hazards you can identify with waiting to engage until the enemy passes by and is moving in the direction of your unit? @chargerkid5 Oh tons. I'd be shooting toward my own guys and them towards me. However, I frame my answer from 2 possibilities. 1. The enemy team has come from a generally northern direction. Either we're already discovered and they're moving to flank. In which case surprise is already lost and it and we'll need to start shooting anyway. 2. They're patrolling from the north, have no idea we're there, and will likely continue basically any direction except back north. And we have the opportunity to still meet the mission assignment. I'm also assuming trees are like what I'm used to here and if I'm 100yds from the rest of my group, and can't see them, there's strong likelihood my bullets won't get that far. Like I say you probably don't want me in charge of the tactical decisions.  |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:10:04 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why u no trust your rifleman? Movement has gone well, good vis. Just because you don't see the 2nd team, doesn't mean that the rifleman doesn't. As stated by xLucidx, the LT leading the other team might be lost/disoriented/retreating from a suspected ambush/etc. As leader of my team, I hopefully would be able to trust my guys, but would try to verify with my own eyes before taking that risk. My real reason is that the entire scenario painted by the OP seems like the perfect set-up for a friendly-fire incident to weed out the trigger-happy. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:12:07 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As stated by another poster below, the LT leading the other team might be lost/disoriented/etc. As leader of my team, I hopefully would be able to trust my guys, but would try to verify with my own eyes. My real reason is that the entire scenario painted by the OP seems like the perfect set-up for a friendly-fire incident to weed out the trigger-happy. this was the reason for my indecision. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:18:32 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: this was the reason for my indecision. I feel your pain. If it is the other team, you could compromise the entire op element by hosing friendlies. I do have to admit, I have trust issues...I work in the medical field, and always assume the worst-case scenario is active. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:20:09 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: this was the reason for my indecision. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: As stated by another poster below, the LT leading the other team might be lost/disoriented/etc. As leader of my team, I hopefully would be able to trust my guys, but would try to verify with my own eyes. My real reason is that the entire scenario painted by the OP seems like the perfect set-up for a friendly-fire incident to weed out the trigger-happy. this was the reason for my indecision. They'd have to be lost as a MOFO to be moving south on the west side of the river considering the movement is generally north with the target on the east side of the river. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:24:22 AM EDT
[#30]
First, wonder why contact/compromise prior to final objective wasn't briefed in the warning order/PLO.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:26:09 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They'd have to be lost as a MOFO to be moving south on the west side of the river considering the movement is generally north with the target on the east side of the river. More common than one might think |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:28:35 AM EDT
[#32]
If I can see them well enough to count them and make out a radio operator, I can probably make out whether they're friendly.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:29:48 AM EDT
[#33]
Wait for the last enemy to get on my side of the creek.
If I can communicate quietly enough, tell rifleman to prepare to fire immediately, SAW man to hold for 5 seconds in case we can get them all without completely raising hell Shoot the enemy that looks like a radioman first (Edit) before they are in a position that my rifleman and sawman could be shooting each other Rifleman and I shoot the other guys, hopefully before sawman has to Edit: Rechecking the scale, I guess enemy point is going to be on me before last enemy crosses the creek. gonna shoot the guy closest to me first |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:30:10 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: More common than one might think Oh I know. That river gives them a great reference point though. They should immediately know something is wrong and unfuck themselves before they crossed that stream to the west side. The squad leader should have enough control of his element to halt movement and get everything sorted before his lead fire team had time to cross a stream that shouldn't be crossed and move the opposite direction long enough to bump into the trail team. That stream is basically a natural western limit for the friendly elements moving north. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:39:22 AM EDT
[#35]
You role is to provide security to the flank of the attacking force. Surprise is secondary.
1. Signal hasty ambush to team members in view. You are already almost in position for an L shaped ambush. 2. If you have radio comms with your squad and platoon let them know. If time permits inform them to target the radio operator first. If not, you concentrate fire on the radioman. 3. Initiate ambush 4. Radio Higher 5. Prepare to maneuver back in the direction of your main force if pressed by a larger attack or if the ambush is unsuccessful. In my limited understanding, the thing worse than losing the element of surprise for an attack would be to have a (potentially) large enemy force on top of your main force in a surprising situation. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:42:11 AM EDT
[#36]
OP's rules should be a clue, as well. It is a thought-exercise, so you can always assume there's a catch.
- Your element already has the perfect ambush position. No real need to move at all. - He imposed a time-constraint on your answer to add pressure. - No comms, out of contact with other team. - Perfect environmental conditions that could either lead to a positive ID with a little patience, or tempt someone to jump the gun by assuming it's the enemy. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:42:37 AM EDT
[#37]
The idea that a friendly element has not only crossed the stream/river,but then gotten so fucked up to have to cut back south to cross back over just defies all reasoning.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:44:00 AM EDT
[#38]
If I can identify it's an enemy unit for 100% we'd expell govt ammo and the cyclic rate, hitting the RTO first. If there was time direct the M32 to drop on both ends of the enemy unit to bunch them together in the middle. A SAW gunner that's worth a shit wouldn't need it by then but he'd get an ADDRAC as the rounds started flying.
If I couldn't be sure it wasn't a lost friendly unit I'd risk throwing out the challenge and wait for the password. It's night so that should be as simple as initiating a simple 3,2,1 with the IR on my 14's. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:44:11 AM EDT
[#39]
i'm a total amateur at this but if possible to give somewhat detailed instructions, and making some assumptions about the terrain (green areas are thick enough to provide concealment, there's a small hill or hole in front of saw gunner, ground naturally slopes down to stream on both sides meaning clear line of sight with no cover for enemy on far side of bank, but enemy on our side can prob get pretty low to ground) and assuming we have a 2 minutes. I'd instruct the following
1. tell A to quietly move left so he has shots on enemy on our side of stream and down the stream itself, and saw gunner to get to cover behind hill, then wait 2. tell rifleman to pop radio and run behind trees and attempt to encircle 3. assumption is enemy will move to cover facing rifleman, then saw shoots enemy on far side of stream while A shoots on near side 4. i'd wait for it to start playing out and move where needed |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:51:17 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: i'm a total amateur at this but if possible to give somewhat detailed instructions, and making some assumptions about the terrain (green areas are thick enough to provide concealment, there's a small hill or hole in front of saw gunner, ground naturally slopes down to stream on both sides meaning clear line of sight with no cover for enemy on far side of bank, but enemy on our side can prob get pretty low to ground) and assuming we have a 2 minutes. I'd instruct the following 1. tell A to quietly move left so he has shots on enemy on our side of stream and down the stream itself, and saw gunner to get to cover behind hill, then wait 2. tell rifleman to pop radio and run behind trees and attempt to encircle 3. assumption is enemy will move to cover facing rifleman, then saw shoots enemy on far side of stream while A shoots on near side 4. i'd wait for it to start playing out and move where needed I think the 2 minutes is for us sitting here on the internet to come up with an answer because we haven't been planning this assault all day. In the scenario, the enemy rifleman is 30 meters away in the open, almost closer than my own rifleman. This thing is probably going to pop off in 10 seconds one way or another. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 11:54:14 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The idea that a friendly element has not only crossed the stream/river,but then gotten so fucked up to have to cut back south to cross back over just defies all reasoning. You're speaking from experience. However, there is always the outlier. When I was an instructor at the schoolhouse we had someone get so lost during night land nav (no NVGs) that they ended up on the opposite side of a major highway about a kilometer outside the training area. He was a second lieutenant...who was a prior enlisted sergeant.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:00:59 PM EDT
[#42]
My final answer is that since the suspected enemy is already moving towards my location, I would hold my position to make the final ID.
I'd signal to my team to maintain their already near-perfect L-shaped ambush positions, and to hold fire unless/until I open fire. I'd make the final ID myself, even if it means issuing a verbal challenge. I keep the radio-man in my sights, and drop him at the first hint of being an enemy. If it does turn out to be enemy soldiers, at least I am the only one in direct danger if they open up on me. My team is kept safe, and they can take down any hostiles with a few short bursts or a grenade. If the suspected enemy turns out to be the 2nd team, I just saved the whole element from opening up on each other. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:01:02 PM EDT
[#43]
Choose your weapon!
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:03:36 PM EDT
[#44]
I would send in the EM-50 with our best men inside.
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:07:07 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My final answer is that since the suspected enemy is already moving towards my location, I would hold my position to make the final ID. I'd signal to my team to maintain their already near-perfect L-shaped ambush positions, and to hold fire unless/until I open fire. I'd make the final ID myself, even if it means issuing a verbal challenge. I keep the radio-man in my sights, and drop him at the first hint of being an enemy. If it does turn out to be enemy soldiers, at least I am the only one in direct danger if they open up on me. My team is kept safe, and they can take down any hostiles with a few short bursts or a grenade. If the suspected enemy turns out to be the 2nd team, I just saved the whole element from opening up on each other. What prevents the enemy element from IDing you first in that scenario? Their vote matters. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:11:33 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What prevents the enemy element from IDing you first in that scenario? Their vote matters. Their vote then confirms the info my team needs to know. I go down with a clear conscience, at least. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:21:30 PM EDT
[#47]
I wouldn't know how to communicate my plan in the dark with enemys at 15m so I would try and lead by example and hope my team knows what they are expected to be doing.
I would target the radio man and engage with effective and suppressive fire so the saw gunner can attack from the defilade. As the SAW and assistant SAW Gunner engage the enemy I would move up to my riflemans position in the cover where we would engage the enemy until they're dead. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:21:34 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You're speaking from experience. However, there is always the outlier. When I was an instructor at the schoolhouse we had someone get so lost during night land nav (no NVGs) that they ended up on the opposite side of a major highway about a kilometer outside the training area. He was a second lieutenant...who was a prior enlisted sergeant. A tad different than a coordinated company sized movement on an objective, we will both agree. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:26:48 PM EDT
[#49]
The radioman might not be the most important target in that element. Might be the leader the radioman is following.
Just saying. |
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Posted: 12/14/2022 12:27:32 PM EDT
[#50]
Call in a napalm strike on my own position.....then run like hell
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