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Posted: 8/23/2017 12:22:03 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The video I posted above FF to 2:18. I doubt they only have one lookout during a strait transit. They should be at sea and anchor detail. Blue water ops, sure. If Lippold only had one lookout posted during a SOM transit, he should have been fired. Either way. Lookout doctrine and WQSB is up to the Ship's Captain, not 7th Fleet. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 12:25:57 PM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryCool, more shit you found on twitter that has nothing to do with the fake news you posted earlier.
Good job, buddy. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 12:44:36 PM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gotcha. My ship does a pretty good job with nav rules. OODs get grilled virtually every watch by CO, XO, or OPS. Night orders almost always have a rule or section of a rule that the watch section must read aloud and discuss (even if we've been over that one 10 times before) and our CO requires OODs to take the closed book DWO exam annually. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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My version of "adequate" is the one I was held to for my 3/M license - memorized every Rule word for word in order to score 100% on the exam. My ship does a pretty good job with nav rules. OODs get grilled virtually every watch by CO, XO, or OPS. Night orders almost always have a rule or section of a rule that the watch section must read aloud and discuss (even if we've been over that one 10 times before) and our CO requires OODs to take the closed book DWO exam annually. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 12:48:35 PM EST
[#4]
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Down to only one lookout now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Does the Navy still post lookout? Talked with my dad who said many years ago they had four lookouts on watch. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 12:56:41 PM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cool, more shit you found on twitter that has nothing to do with the fake news you posted earlier. Good job, buddy. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good job, buddy. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 2:11:29 PM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So history repeated itself of the Andrea Doria collision in the 1950's. I'm sure that wasn't even the first collision or mishap due to radar scale errors. After all this time, haven't they made it super obvious what radar or map scale you're on? |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 2:29:30 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cool, more shit you found on twitter that has nothing to do with the fake news you posted earlier. Good job, buddy. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 3:07:32 PM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You know, if ya'll don't quote him the rest of us don't have to read his tripe. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 3:54:48 PM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Get back to us when you can find 10 fatalities from a Navy ship collision in the past fifty years besides the ones in 2017, broseph. You reading comprehension is terrible. 1) Navy ship collisions are rare 2) Fatalities from ship collisions are rarer. To have so many happen in such a short period of time is historically uncommon. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 4:59:41 PM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Get back to us when you can find 10 fatalities from a Navy ship collision in the past fifty years besides the ones in 2017, broseph. You reading comprehension is terrible. 1) Navy ship collisions are rare 2) Fatalities from ship collisions are rarer. To have so many happen in such a short period of time is historically uncommon. On USS Waddell (DDG-24), in the mid-1980's, you had to earn the SWO pin. Our CO was one of the best, Ed Kristensen. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 5:30:39 PM EST
[#11]
My dad was Navy and a commercial fisherman captain. I've spent my entire life on and in the water. Seeing these recent events with our Navy is really disheartening. I know as well as anyone that shit happens (I've sunk a boat - no fatalities). I think a lot of the discussion is because we expect better. I want to know that if I'm vaporized because of an icbm that my Navy is out there kicking ass.
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Posted: 8/23/2017 5:45:57 PM EST
[#12]
There were earlier comments concerning the amount of maintenance being performed while underway and how it increased availability. That's a double edged sword that can create it's own problems with incomplete testing and inspection as well as crew fatigue. No idea yet if that was a contributing factor, but it does raise some questions.
Bottom line is that there are 10 dead Americans and a compromised U.S. warship. The families, friends, shipmates, and loved ones of every one of them deserve honest answers. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 6:26:31 PM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There were earlier comments concerning the amount of maintenance being performed while underway and how it increased availability. That's a double edged sword that can create it's own problems with incomplete testing and inspection as well as crew fatigue. No idea yet if that was a contributing factor, but it does raise some questions. Bottom line is that there are 10 dead Americans and a compromised U.S. warship. The families, friends, shipmates, and loved ones of every one of them deserve honest answers. |
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Posted: 8/23/2017 6:33:22 PM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
17 dead and two warships. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There were earlier comments concerning the amount of maintenance being performed while underway and how it increased availability. That's a double edged sword that can create it's own problems with incomplete testing and inspection as well as crew fatigue. No idea yet if that was a contributing factor, but it does raise some questions. Bottom line is that there are 10 dead Americans and a compromised U.S. warship. The families, friends, shipmates, and loved ones of every one of them deserve honest answers. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 1:54:09 AM EST
[#15]
I saw this picture posted on pg 1. A question, I didn't see answered. Looked like some thought it was a photo of ships underway in the Straits of Malacca.
I see one wake/wheelwash. This looks like an anchorage to me, not a shit ton of ships making way. I've been through Houston and Mississippi/South West Pass Anchorages and seen this many, many times. As far as stopping a vessel underway goes, at 20:45:30, collision with a reef. Speed goes from 16kt to 7kts in seconds. Dead ship, engineering spaces flooded. Momentum carries the ship to 21:12:00. Ship comes to a stop, rotating broadside to the wind. Wind has it. Making .7kt, .8kt, 'till it wasn't.  Grounding of Costa Concordia - video made by Automatic Identification System (AIS) I've heard they tried to steer with thrusters, but they didn't do anything momentum and the wind didn't want them to.  Attached File34 years in the wheelhouse. Just started looking at this thread. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 2:11:42 AM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I saw this picture posted on pg 1. A question, I didn't see answered. Looked like some thought it was a photo of ships underway in the Straits of Malacca. http://a9.vietbao.vn/images/vn999/165/2015/05/20150518-tq-thai-lan-hop-tac-xay-kenh-dao-de-khong-phai-di-qua-eo-malacca-2.jpg I see one wake/wheelwash. This looks like an anchorage to me, not a shit ton of ships making way. I've been through Houston and Mississippi/South West Pass Anchorages and seen this many, many times. <snip> |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 6:55:06 AM EST
[#17]
This is an interesting piece relative to this discussion.
https://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2017-08/collisions-part-i%E2%80%94what-are-root-causes |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 10:01:56 AM EST
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is an interesting piece relative to this discussion. https://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2017-08/collisions-part-i%E2%80%94what-are-root-causes |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 10:08:10 AM EST
[#19]
Another This Is What the Navy Doesn't Want You to Know about Its Deadly Ship Crashes
Reputable commentators point out that the U.S. Navy fleet is overworked. The United States has taken on countless foreign commitments over the years while shedding ships, planes and armaments to save the taxpayers money. In short, the nation is living beyond its naval means.
Generational change is also at work in today’s navy. We oldtimers stood aghast in the early 2000s when the navy in its wisdom decided to shut down training for junior officers—also known as division officers—en route to their first ships. These are officers to whom skippers entrust the operation of vital systems. In yesteryear, division officers spent months at the Surface Warfare Officers School sites in Newport or Coronado, which is where they learned everything from the rudiments of navigation and piloting to the intricacies of engineering and weapons. After the training shutdown, though, division officers were issued a stack of CD-ROMs containing instructional materials, sent to sea, and told to learn it themselves under the tutelage of extraordinarily busy skippers. No passenger wants to board an airliner flown by a self-taught pilot—but in effect the navy expected newcomers to surface warfare to school themselves on topics of like technical sophistication. Guess where that generation of officers now stands in the naval hierarchy: they’re ship executive officers—in other words, commanding officers in waiting. It’s doubtful the reports on the USS Fitzgerald or USS McCain disasters will trace human problems back to those officers’ earliest days in uniform. Still, you have to wonder whether bad decisions back then are rippling into naval operations today. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 10:44:35 AM EST
[#20]
http://www.c7f.navy.mil/Media/News/Display/Article/1287947/us-navy-identifies-1-dead-and-9-missing-uss-john-s-mccain-sailors-as-search-and/
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Posted: 8/24/2017 2:28:05 PM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Josh Are Port and Starboard lookouts still posted? I assume they still have aft lookout during normal operations? Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Josh Are Port and Starboard lookouts still posted? I assume they still have aft lookout during normal operations? Quoted:
http://www.c7f.navy.mil/Media/News/Display/Article/1287947/us-navy-identifies-1-dead-and-9-missing-uss-john-s-mccain-sailors-as-search-and/ |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 2:50:39 PM EST
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
On a Burke you have fwd and aft typically with the fwd hanging out on the bridge wing. Lots of CE guys on that list, makes me wonder if Aft IC flooded out. Shitty. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 3:03:50 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why do you care so much? Just let it go. If one wishes to be mad about it, be mad about the navy forcing the ship to take old, improperly stored, and unstable ordnance. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 3:56:18 PM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hell, I think all of it is on film - there is no disputing it. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 3:57:28 PM EST
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So history repeated itself of the Andrea Doria collision in the 1950's. I'm sure that wasn't even the first collision or mishap due to radar scale errors. After all this time, haven't they made it super obvious what radar or map scale you're on? |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 4:12:13 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did that pretty much wipe out the whole geek squad? |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 5:58:28 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lots of CE guys on that list, makes me wonder if Aft IC flooded out. Shitty. |
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Posted: 8/24/2017 9:11:41 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It sure looks like that was CE Division's berthing space. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Lots of CE guys on that list, makes me wonder if Aft IC flooded out. Shitty. |
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Posted: 8/26/2017 5:35:33 AM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It sure looks like that was CE Division's berthing space. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Lots of CE guys on that list, makes me wonder if Aft IC flooded out. Shitty. 
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Posted: 8/26/2017 7:58:17 PM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It sure looks like that was CE Division's berthing space. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Lots of CE guys on that list, makes me wonder if Aft IC flooded out. Shitty. |
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Posted: 8/26/2017 8:53:29 PM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe half of the CE guys, most of the ITs (CC Div) are in radio. Makes me more curious about the alleged steering failure. They're all male names so it's also conceivable that they were all in that berthing next to Aft IC (4 I think). Too early to tell at this point. |
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Posted: 8/26/2017 10:57:51 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
JSM is an all male ship, with the exception of a few female officers. When would ETs' or ICs' be found below the main deck? When they are sleeping. |
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Posted: 8/26/2017 11:06:59 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It had to be the berthing. When would ETs' or ICs' be found below the main deck? When they are sleeping. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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JSM is an all male ship, with the exception of a few female officers. When would ETs' or ICs' be found below the main deck? When they are sleeping. |
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Posted: 8/26/2017 11:13:34 PM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Or in Aft IC. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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JSM is an all male ship, with the exception of a few female officers. When would ETs' or ICs' be found below the main deck? When they are sleeping. |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 2:23:50 PM EST
[#35]
Sounds like they have finally recovered the remains of all crew members.
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Posted: 8/28/2017 2:27:22 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sounds like they have finally recovered the remains of all crew members. |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 2:52:43 PM EST
[#37]
One thing for sure if this was terrorism we will know ten years from now. Also maybe the Chinese or Russians have a new weapon
than can distort GPS signals and weapon guidance systems. Clearly the quietness on latest events says alot |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:00:10 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sounds like they have finally recovered the remains of all crew members. 
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:01:09 PM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing for sure if this was terrorism we will know ten years from now. Also maybe the Chinese or Russians have a new weapon than can distort GPS signals and weapon guidance systems. Clearly the quietness on latest events says alot 
The collision alarm is supposed to sound before the collision, not afterward. 
Kharn |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:02:34 PM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing for sure if this was terrorism we will know ten years from now. Also maybe the Chinese or Russians have a new weapon than can distort GPS signals and weapon guidance systems. Clearly the quietness on latest events says alot |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:09:22 PM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That right there is a great example of the shit sandwich that's very easy to happen in crowded areas. IIRC, the Beks Halil was overtaking the other ship, got way too close, and the water being displaced by the Beks Halil forced the stern of the smaller ship to starboard (which would push the bow to port) The Beks Halil can't turn to port, they are in a head on situation with another ship. The smaller ship can't turn too hard to starboard, thier stern can get sucked in to the Beks Halil. Ultimately they decided to do (almost) nothing and they took the hit. The smaller ship could have tried a very (very) shallow turn to starboard, but that could put them in front of the ship the video is being taken from. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Here, same area, almost the same strike too. This is why you don't cross in front of ships.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmDybTIxrJcIIRC, the Beks Halil was overtaking the other ship, got way too close, and the water being displaced by the Beks Halil forced the stern of the smaller ship to starboard (which would push the bow to port) The Beks Halil can't turn to port, they are in a head on situation with another ship. The smaller ship can't turn too hard to starboard, thier stern can get sucked in to the Beks Halil. Ultimately they decided to do (almost) nothing and they took the hit. The smaller ship could have tried a very (very) shallow turn to starboard, but that could put them in front of the ship the video is being taken from. |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:19:38 PM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That was ego that led to the impact. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Here, same area, almost the same strike too. This is why you don't cross in front of ships. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmDybTIxrJcIIRC, the Beks Halil was overtaking the other ship, got way too close, and the water being displaced by the Beks Halil forced the stern of the smaller ship to starboard (which would push the bow to port) The Beks Halil can't turn to port, they are in a head on situation with another ship. The smaller ship can't turn too hard to starboard, thier stern can get sucked in to the Beks Halil. Ultimately they decided to do (almost) nothing and they took the hit. The smaller ship could have tried a very (very) shallow turn to starboard, but that could put them in front of the ship the video is being taken from. |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:29:53 PM EST
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing for sure if this was terrorism we will know ten years from now. Also maybe the Chinese or Russians have a new weapon than can distort GPS signals and weapon guidance systems. Clearly the quietness on latest events says alot |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 3:38:31 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing for sure if this was terrorism we will know ten years from now. Also maybe the Chinese or Russians have a new weapon than can distort GPS signals and weapon guidance systems. Clearly the quietness on latest events says alot |
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Posted: 8/28/2017 5:26:09 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Are they hacking watchstanders and making them not see huge, CBDR ships? |
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Posted: 8/30/2017 6:22:07 PM EST
[#46]
So just got back from meeting with some DESRON1 officers. Their opinion is that the current pace of deployment is unsustainable; they are stretched too thin and have to many requirements for training that is not relevant to surface operations. PC BS. Crews are over deployed, too thin, too new, and training for the wrong things.
Thanks Obama. |
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Posted: 8/30/2017 6:41:50 PM EST
[#47]
Not meaning to derail the thread, but the Navy made a video, detailing the disaster mentioned above. A fascinating watch.
 I Relieve you Sir (1975 training film about the USS Frank E. Evans DD754 Collision) |
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Posted: 8/30/2017 10:36:46 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So just got back from meeting with some DESRON1 officers. Their opinion is that the current pace of deployment is unsustainable; they are stretched too thin and have to many requirements for training that is not relevant to surface operations. Crews are over deployed, too thin, too new, and training for the wrong things. |
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Posted: 9/4/2017 6:33:54 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing for sure if this was terrorism we will know ten years from now. Also maybe the Chinese or Russians have a new weapon than can distort GPS signals and weapon guidance systems. Clearly the quietness on latest events says alot http://maritime-executive.com/editorials/mass-gps-spoofing-attack-in-black-sea |
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Posted: 9/4/2017 7:28:13 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So just got back from meeting with some DESRON1 officers. Their opinion is that the current pace of deployment is unsustainable; they are stretched too thin and have to many requirements for training that is not relevant to surface operations. PC BS. Crews are over deployed, too thin, too new, and training for the wrong things. Thanks Obama. Quote HistoryQuoted:
So just got back from meeting with some DESRON1 officers. Their opinion is that the current pace of deployment is unsustainable; they are stretched too thin and have to many requirements for training that is not relevant to surface operations. PC BS. Crews are over deployed, too thin, too new, and training for the wrong things. Thanks Obama. 
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Are they hacking watchstanders and making them not see huge, CBDR ships? Kharn |
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