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Link Posted: 3/27/2023 10:20:34 AM EST
[#1]
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Quoted:


I don’t dispute your statement.

But, other than what we know to be”customary,” and the date posted to LIS, I’d like to see the text of the actual rule of law that drives today’s date as being actually the witching hour.

I should be able to find it. But I apparently suck at legal research.
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Quoted:


I don’t dispute your statement.

But, other than what we know to be”customary,” and the date posted to LIS, I’d like to see the text of the actual rule of law that drives today’s date as being actually the witching hour.

I should be able to find it. But I apparently suck at legal research.


Article V, Section 6 of the Constitution of Virginia.

Link

Article V. Executive
Section 6. Presentation of bills; powers of Governor; vetoes and amendments
(a) Every bill which passes the Senate and House of Delegates, before it becomes law, shall be presented to the Governor.
(b) During a regular or special session, the Governor shall have seven days in which to act on the bill after it is presented to him and to exercise one of the three options set out below. If the Governor does not act on the bill, it shall become law without his signature.
(i) The Governor may sign the bill if he approves it, and the bill shall become law.
(ii) The Governor may veto the bill if he objects to it by returning the bill with his objections to the house in which the bill originated. The house shall enter the objections in its journal and reconsider the bill. The house may override the veto by a two-thirds vote of the members present, which two-thirds shall include a majority of the members elected to that house. If the house of origin overrides the Governor's veto, it shall send the bill and Governor's objections to the other house where the bill shall be reconsidered. The second house may override the Governor's veto by a two-thirds vote of the members present, which two-thirds shall include a majority of the members elected to that house. If both houses override the Governor's veto, the bill shall become law without his signature. If either house fails to override the Governor's veto, the veto shall stand and the bill shall not become law.
(iii) The Governor may recommend one or more specific and severable amendments to a bill by returning it with his recommendation to the house in which it originated. The house shall enter the Governor's recommendation in its journal and reconsider the bill. If both houses agree to the Governor's entire recommendation, the bill, as amended, shall become law. Each house may agree to the Governor's amendments by a majority vote of the members present. If both houses agree to the bill in the form originally sent to the Governor by a two-thirds vote of all members present in each house, which two-thirds shall include a majority of the members elected to that house, the original bill shall become law. If the Governor sends down specific and severable amendments then each house may determine, in accordance with its own procedures, whether to act on the Governor's amendments en bloc or individually, or any combination thereof. If the house of origin agrees to one or more of the Governor's amendments, it shall send the bill and the entire recommendation to the other house. The second house may also agree to one or more of the Governor's amendments. If either house fails to agree to the Governor's entire recommendation or fails to agree to at least one of the Governor's amendments agreed to by the other house, the bill, as originally presented to the Governor, shall be returned to the Governor. If both houses agree to one or more amendments but not to the entire recommendation of the Governor, the bill shall be reenrolled with the Governor's amendments agreed to by both houses and shall be returned to the Governor. If the Governor fails to send down specific and severable amendments as determined by the majority vote of the members present in either house, then the bill shall be before that house, in the form originally sent to the Governor and may be acted upon in accordance with Article IV, Section 11 of this Constitution and returned to the Governor. The Governor shall either sign or veto a bill returned as provided in this subsection or, if there are fewer than seven days remaining in the session, as provided in subsection (c).
(c) When there are fewer than seven days remaining in the regular or special session from the date a bill is presented to the Governor and the General Assembly adjourns to a reconvened session, the Governor shall have thirty days from the date of adjournment of the regular or special session in which to act on the bills presented to him and to exercise one of the three options set out below. If the Governor does not act on any bill, it shall become law without his signature.
(i) The Governor may sign the bill if he approves it, and the bill shall become law.
(ii) The Governor may veto the bill if he objects to it by returning the bill with his objections to the house in which the bill originated. The same procedures for overriding his veto are applicable as stated in subsection (b) for bills vetoed during the session.
(iii) The Governor may recommend one or more specific and severable amendments to a bill by returning it with his recommendation to the house in which it originated. The same procedures for considering his recommendation are applicable as stated in subsection (b) (iii) for bills returned with his recommendation. The Governor shall either sign or veto a bill returned to him from a reconvened session. If the Governor vetoes the bill, the veto shall stand and the bill shall not become law. If the Governor does not act on the bill within thirty days after the adjournment of the reconvened session, the bill shall become law without his signature.
(d) The Governor shall have the power to veto any particular item or items of an appropriation bill, but the veto shall not affect the item or items to which he does not object. The item or items objected to shall not take effect except in the manner provided in this section for a bill vetoed by the Governor.
(e) In all cases set forth above, the names of the members voting for and against the bill, the amendment or amendments to the bill, or the item or items of an appropriation bill shall be entered on the journal of each house.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 11:08:30 AM EST
[#2]
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Quoted:


Article V, Section 6 of the Constitution of Virginia.

Link

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Yeah.

I read that.

I even posted links to it, and part of the text above.

I still don't see how they get from March 13, to today's date, in that language.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 11:11:57 AM EST
[#3]
Maybe today is special because today is the first business day that is 30 days after adjournment of the House.

Even though the bill was "communicated" only two weeks ago.

Apparently "adjournment" is not synonymous, in the Legislature, with "done doing shit."

Attachment Attached File


Link Posted: 3/27/2023 11:45:21 AM EST
[#4]
So when this actually is in effect, remember...

No Dirks or Daggers!

And definitely NO STILETTOS!

Got that?… Makes complete sense?

If your thing pokes out the front, does that make it a stiletto?
I heard that at least one Democrat in Richmond thinks that’s the test.

If it comes out from the side, and it’s only sharpened on one side, are you golden?
Right out the side… a little more to the left…

Except if it’s a “like kind” to the other forbidden weapons?
I mean, if its sharp enough to shave, its “like” a RAZOR isn’t it?
Is it an aggravating factor, and indicative of criminal intent, if you carry it in your shoe?

Is it "like" a dirk or a dagger if its a TANTO blade?... What about CLIP point?
Does it help if I have it laser-engraved "BUTTER KNIFE?"
What was that assassin series TV show where the handler of the rookie assasin always orders coffee with a full stick of butter?

I have so many questions!

Attachment Attached File

Link Posted: 3/27/2023 11:55:35 AM EST
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Maybe today is special because today is the first business day that is 30 days after adjournment of the House.

Even though the bill was "communicated" only two weeks ago.

Apparently "adjournment" is not synonymous, in the Legislature, with "done doing shit."

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/105614/971544F3-E72E-4763-A90F-15BF5ECE45FA_jpe-2760614.JPG

View Quote


I believe it is 30 days from adjournment to a reconvened session which was on 2/25 per your post.  They are reconvening in April for the veto session.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 11:57:09 AM EST
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
So when this actually is in effect, remember...

No Dirks or Daggers!

And definitely NO STILETTOS!

Got that?… Makes complete sense?

If your thing pokes out the front, does that make it a stiletto?
I heard that at least one Democrat in Richmond thinks that’s the test.

If it comes out from the side, and it’s only sharpened on one side, are you golden?
Right out the side… a little more to the left…

Except if it’s a “like kind” to the other forbidden weapons?
I mean, if its sharp enough to shave, its “like” a RAZOR isn’t it?
Is it an aggravating factor, and indicative of criminal intent, if you carry it in your shoe?

Is it "like" a dirk or a dagger if its a TANTO blade?... What about CLIP point?
Does it help if I have it laser-engraved "BUTTER KNIFE?"
What was that assassin series TV show where the handler of the rookie assasin always orders coffee with a full stick of butter?

I have so many questions!

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/105614/z_jpg-2760652.JPG
View Quote


There are several reported cases from the Court of Appeals and the Supreme Court of Virginia that attempt to make sense of the knife par of this statute.  I'll post some links if I can find them in the public domain.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 12:01:10 PM EST
[#7]
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 12:11:51 PM EST
[#8]
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Quoted:
Looking at the Benchmade AFO II and haven't found a cooperative on-line dealer yet.  Not really a knife guy so not familiar with all the potential sellers.
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All the usual suspects that sell Chinese knives will send you as many automatics as you care to buy right now. I've got a drawer full of them. They never wanted anything except my credit card number.
Looking at the Benchmade AFO II and haven't found a cooperative on-line dealer yet.  Not really a knife guy so not familiar with all the potential sellers.

KnifeCenter ships out of Fredericksburg.  I had no issues placing and receiving an order.

Blade HQ may ship out of Marion, but someone else will need to comment as I have no experience with them (yet).
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 12:27:39 PM EST
[#9]
Harris v. Commonwealth, Supreme Court of Virginia 2007 (Box cutter not a weapon of like kind)
Link

Farrakan v. Commonwealth, Supreme Court of Virginia 2007 (kitchen knife not a weapon of like kind)
Link

Thompson v. Commonwealth, Supreme Court of Virginia 2009 (Butterfly knife not a weapon of like kind)
Link

Williams v. Commonwealth, Court of Appeals 2020 (knuckle knife was a weapon of like kind)
Link
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 12:30:28 PM EST
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
So when this actually is in effect, remember...

No Dirks or Daggers!

And definitely NO STILETTOS!

Got that?  Makes complete sense?

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/105614/z_jpg-2760652.JPG
View Quote
VA knife laws are completely tarded, no question.

On the plus side, I've never met a single cop who gave a crap what you were carrying, except wanting to know what brand it was.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 12:38:35 PM EST
[#11]
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Quoted:
VA knife laws are completely tarded, no question.

On the plus side, I've never met a single cop who gave a crap what you were carrying, except wanting to know what brand it was.
View Quote


One thing worth keeping in mind is that 18.2-308 only regulates concealed carry.  You can open carry any kind of blade you want.  Bowie knife, dagger, etc.  Obviously depending on context, this might earn you some odd looks.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 1:02:20 PM EST
[#12]
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Quoted:

KnifeCenter ships out of Fredericksburg.  I had no issues placing and receiving an order.

Blade HQ may ship out of Marion, but someone else will need to comment as I have no experience with them (yet).
View Quote
On order.  That was super helpful, did not even know they're in my hometown.  Thanks!
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 3:23:16 PM EST
[#13]
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Quoted:
On order.  That was super helpful, did not even know they're in my hometown.  Thanks!
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Yep - BladeHQ recently set up shop in Blue Ridge Knives old...old...old building.  Most people aren't even aware of Blue Ridge Knives either and the fact they are the largest knife distributor in the world.  Pretty cool.  They have a really nice facility, and apparently treat their employees very well.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 3:40:53 PM EST
[#14]
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Quoted:


Yep - BladeHQ recently set up shop in Blue Ridge Knives old...old...old building.  Most people aren't even aware of Blue Ridge Knives either and the fact they are the largest knife distributor in the world.  Pretty cool.  They have a really nice facility, and apparently treat their employees very well.
View Quote
BladeHQ has a better price on the AFO but currently out of stock.
Link Posted: 3/27/2023 7:06:13 PM EST
[#15]
Looks like it was approved  by the governor yesterday.

"03/26/23  Governor: Approved by Governor-Chapter 611 (effective 7/1/23)"

Link Posted: 3/28/2023 8:08:37 AM EST
[#16]
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Quoted:
Looks like it was approved  by the governor yesterday.

"03/26/23  Governor: Approved by Governor-Chapter 611 (effective 7/1/23)"

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Interesting.  Now, like everyone else I'm sure, we can try to figure out what the difference between a switchblade and stiletto is....
Link Posted: 3/28/2023 8:25:56 AM EST
[#17]
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Quoted:
I never understood any of these items banned from carry by a CCW permit holder.  I can carry a pistol that will allow me defend myself at a distance but carrying a switchblade/nunchuck/knuckles that require me to be up close is forbidden.
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I carried a auto for years before they were legal here. Figured I'd laugh my ass all the way to jail. If the state doesn't mind the loaded handgun on my hip, they best ignore the knife.
Link Posted: 3/28/2023 8:45:21 AM EST
[#18]
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Quoted:


Interesting.  Now, like everyone else I'm sure, we can try to figure out what the difference between a switchblade and stiletto is....
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks like it was approved  by the governor yesterday.

"03/26/23  Governor: Approved by Governor-Chapter 611 (effective 7/1/23)"



Interesting.  Now, like everyone else I'm sure, we can try to figure out what the difference between a switchblade and stiletto is....

I believe the stiletto is always double-edged while a switchblade knife could have a single or double edged blade.  The stiletto blade is narrow and designed for stabbing.
Link Posted: 3/28/2023 8:54:50 AM EST
[#19]
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Quoted:

I believe the stiletto is always double-edged while a switchblade knife could have a single or double edged blade.  The stiletto blade is narrow and designed for stabbing.
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So…like a knife.
Link Posted: 3/28/2023 9:06:13 AM EST
[#20]
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Quoted:

I believe the stiletto is always double-edged while a switchblade knife could have a single or double edged blade.  The stiletto blade is narrow and designed for stabbing.
View Quote


So a stiletto can be a switchblade, and a switchblade could be a stiletto, but both are illegal when they're a stiletto?  Switchblades are legal as long as they are not stilettos, how about dirk or dagger switchblades?

How narrow?  What if it is designed for pointing at objects, and not stabbing?

LOL - see where this all goes...in the trash, like this BS law should be to begin with.

Link Posted: 3/28/2023 10:00:42 AM EST
[#21]
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Quoted:


Interesting.  Now, like everyone else I'm sure, we can try to figure out what the difference between a switchblade and stiletto is....
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Quoted:


Interesting.  Now, like everyone else I'm sure, we can try to figure out what the difference between a switchblade and stiletto is....


"Stiletto" is a term almost entirely undefined in Virginia law.  The Court of Appeals and the Supreme Court of Virginia have frequently resorted to dictionary definitions to determine what the knife types listed in 18.2-308 mean.  The only reference I know of in the case law to a definition of stiletto is in  McMillan v Comm., 55 Va. App. 392 (2009).  Props to @HokieEric for pointing this out in the thread on the Virginia HomeTown forum.  McMillan involved a defendant charged for having a dive knife riveted to the inside of the driver's door on his vehicle.  His conviction was reversed by the Court of Appeals.  They determined that it was not one of the types of knives listed in 18.2-308, nor was it a weapon of like kind.  They reached the latter conclusion by finding it was not a weapon at all.

What does that have to do with Stilettos?  Well, in the course of the opinion, they discuss the dictionary definition of "stiletto," which is a term otherwise undefined in Virginia law.

A "dagger" is "a short knife used for stabbing," and its definition refers to a "stiletto." Webster's Third New International Dictionary 570 (1993). However, the definition of a "stiletto" is not particularly helpful, as it is defined as "a slender dagger with a blade that is thick in proportion to its breadth."
McMillan v. Commonwealth, 55 Va. App. 392, 397, 686 S.E.2d 525, 527 (2009)(quoting Webster's Third New International Dictionary 2243 (1993)).

This is certainly something we could cite to in defending a case, but in my view it is dicta and not binding authority.

If you accept this definition and choose to rely on it, then it is hard to see how a folding knife of any type can be a stiletto.
Link Posted: 3/28/2023 8:37:28 PM EST
[#22]
So there is a length-to-girth ratio we should apply?

Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File


Link Posted: 3/28/2023 8:46:27 PM EST
[#23]
Sad for a state that prides itself on freedom. Should have happened long ago.

Link Posted: 3/30/2023 8:29:46 AM EST
[#24]
Just found this thread.

I had no idea BladeHQ had a store 1.5hrs away
Link Posted: 3/30/2023 8:59:39 AM EST
[#25]
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Quoted:
Just found this thread.

I had no idea BladeHQ had a store 1.5hrs away
View Quote


It's a pretty recent acquisition/move.
Link Posted: 3/30/2023 9:04:43 AM EST
[#26]
Make Sharks and Jets Shark and Jet Again.
Link Posted: 3/31/2023 8:34:49 AM EST
[#27]
KnifeCenter was pretty quick!



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