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Posted: 3/14/2021 1:57:45 PM EDT
 Wehrmacht Crimes against Women WW2 Not excusing or justifying what the Soviets did at all. Both sides were brutal and committed atrocities on an unimaginable scale. However, much of the Germans did in regards to sex crimes and mass rapes in the East were hushed by Cold War politics, and only really now are getting studied. |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 6:34:10 PM EDT
[#1]
I watched that. His stuff is always good.
Funny how much alike the Wehraboos and the Sovieboos sound so much alike in their dishonesty. Google "Oskar Dirlewanger" to see what National Socialism is REALLY all about... to this day. |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 8:27:38 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I watched that. His stuff is always good. Funny how much alike the Wehraboos and the Sovieboos sound so much alike in their dishonesty. Google "Oskar Dirlewanger" to see what National Socialism is REALLY all about... to this day. I never understand the finger pointing. Both sides were brutal and we're headed by evil regimes. The German were whitewashed heavily though after the war. Familiar with the Direwanger brigade. Nothing like criminals who are state sponsored to rape, murder and pillage... |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:03:40 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. TIK is good, and well sourced. I never understand the finger pointing. Both sides were brutal and we're headed by evil regimes. The German were whitewashed heavily though after the war. Familiar with the Direwanger brigade. Nothing like criminals who are state sponsored to rape, murder and pillage... I read a biography about a u-boat captain in high school and it was all "chivalrous knight of the seas!" glorious honor etc., and I was like, who the fuck wrote this, Donitz? But it was an American author, written in the 50's. I got to the last chapter and it was about how he was now an officer in the new West German Navy, "facing the real foe of Germany and freedom, the Soviet Union" or something to the effect, and it clicked. |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:10:26 PM EDT
[#4]
Why can he not say rape? Seriously, whats the deal?
 This brave new world bothers me. 
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:12:24 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why can he not say rape? Seriously, whats the deal? This brave new world bothers me. Youtube faggotree. He is trying to keep the video from getting banned for the site. |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:33:13 PM EDT
[#6]
If the Germans thought they were rapey on the way East, they got schooled on it when the Russians finally headed West, and stayed in Berlin.
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:36:50 PM EDT
[#7]
Great info...!!!
Read what the Japanese did to women in Nanking... Even the Germans who were there complained. |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:40:34 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Great info...!!! Read what the Japanese did to women in Nanking... Even the Germans who were there complained. If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks “Evil Nazi” first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It’s whitewashed because we are a part of the western “Christian/European” world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered “uncivilized/backwards/foreign” and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same “Asians over there”. |
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Posted: 3/14/2021 11:58:52 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks “Evil Nazi” first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It’s whitewashed because we are a part of the western “Christian/European” world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered “uncivilized/backwards/foreign” and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same “Asians over there”. I agree, I can't quite put my finger on the Japanese as far as their collective mindset. Having been to Japan, I walked through Tokyo looking at the people and wondering WTF happened to them. Those folks are into strange shit, not walking around with newborns on bayonets but the other end of the spectrum; pooping on one another and having used women's panties for sale in kiosks type barbarism. They have some odd quirks about them. Very polite on the outside, just wonder what they really feel. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 12:01:46 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I read a biography about a u-boat captain in high school and it was all "chivalrous knight of the seas!" glorious honor etc., and I was like, who the fuck wrote this, Donitz? But it was an American author, written in the 50's. I got to the last chapter and it was about how he was now an officer in the new West German Navy, "facing the real foe of Germany and freedom, the Soviet Union" or something to the effect, and it clicked. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 12:45:11 AM EDT
[#11]
Interesting video.
The Soviet Union banned prostitution, its still legal in Germany. Human Trafficking is an ongoing problem all over. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:19:23 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I agree, I can't quite put my finger on the Japanese as far as their collective mindset. Having been to Japan, I walked through Tokyo looking at the people and wondering WTF happened to them. Those folks are into strange shit, not walking around with newborns on bayonets but the other end of the spectrum; pooping on one another and having used women's panties for sale in kiosks type barbarism. They have some odd quirks about them. Very polite on the outside, just wonder what they really feel. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks “Evil Nazi” first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It’s whitewashed because we are a part of the western “Christian/European” world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered “uncivilized/backwards/foreign” and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same “Asians over there”. I agree, I can't quite put my finger on the Japanese as far as their collective mindset. Having been to Japan, I walked through Tokyo looking at the people and wondering WTF happened to them. Those folks are into strange shit, not walking around with newborns on bayonets but the other end of the spectrum; pooping on one another and having used women's panties for sale in kiosks type barbarism. They have some odd quirks about them. Very polite on the outside, just wonder what they really feel. Politisms are a front, generally. I had a good friend, Japanese student, in the mid-late 90’s that she’d quite the light on their then culture. I imagine it as exponentially devolved since then. When their societal God proved to be human their society was doomed to collapse. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:28:28 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Politisms are a front, generally. I had a good friend, Japanese student, in the mid-late 90’s that she’d quite the light on their then culture. I imagine it as exponentially devolved since then. When their societal God proved to be human their society was doomed to collapse. Maybe your onto something but I'd too be polite and odd if my grandparents were nuked twice. But in all seriousness they have always loved war, always believed they were a force to be reckoned with and now they are a shell. At least from an outsider's viewpoinr. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:51:35 AM EDT
[#14]
I did not watch the whole video. I did look at the pdf copy of his main source, the PhD dissertation by Wendy Joe Gertjejanssen, that is linked on Youtube. Unfortunately the pdf is incomplete and only includes the first 28 pages, so I cannot read it or review the bibliography that lists Ms. Gertjejanssen's sources.
At 3:23 in the video, he states that 1.4 to 1.9 million German women were victims of Soviet rape. He also states 10 million Soviet women were victims of German rape. 1. I don't believe the clean hands of the Wehrmacht myth, but I do not believe the Germans raped 5x as many women as the Soviets. 2. I suspect many of the "sources" are Soviet or Warsaw Pact and believe the intentionally suppressed the documentation of rapes by Soviets in what became Soviet-occupied East Germany and the Eastern Bloc, while over-reporting the rape of Soviet women. I suspect the truth is that both armies were equally brutal. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 2:03:27 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did not watch the whole video. I did look at the pdf copy of his main source, the PhD dissertation by Wendy Joe Gertjejanssen, that is linked on Youtube. Unfortunately the pdf is incomplete and only includes the first 28 pages, so I cannot read it or review the bibliography that lists Ms. Gertjejanssen's sources. At 3:23 in the video, he states that 1.4 to 1.9 million German women were victims of Soviet rape. He also states 10 million Soviet women were victims of German rape. 1. I don't believe the clean hands of the Wehrmacht myth, but I do not believe the Germans raped 5x as many women as the Soviets. 2. I suspect many of the "sources" are Soviet or Warsaw Pact and believe the intentionally suppressed the documentation of rapes by Soviets in what became e Soviet-occupied East Germany and the Eastern Bloc, while over-reporting the rape of Soviet women. I suspect the truth is that both armies were equally brutal. I suspect you’re right. Be extremely difficult to do an accurate accounting of given the circumstances of the war. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 2:06:21 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did not watch the whole video. I did look at the pdf copy of his main source, the PhD dissertation by Wendy Joe Gertjejanssen, that is linked on Youtube. Unfortunately the pdf is incomplete and only includes the first 28 pages, so I cannot read it or review the bibliography that lists Ms. Gertjejanssen's sources. At 3:23 in the video, he states that 1.4 to 1.9 million German women were victims of Soviet rape. He also states 10 million Soviet women were victims of German rape. 1. I don't believe the clean hands of the Wehrmacht myth, but I do not believe the Germans raped 5x as many women as the Soviets. 2. I suspect many of the "sources" are Soviet or Warsaw Pact and believe the intentionally suppressed the documentation of rapes by Soviets in what became Soviet-occupied East Germany and the Eastern Bloc, while over-reporting the rape of Soviet women. I suspect the truth is that both armies were equally brutal. If you added in Soviet rapes or women in what became the Warsaw Pact I think you’d match or exceed numbers. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 2:24:48 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Great info...!!! Read what the Japanese did to women in Nanking... Even the Germans who were there complained. Read the book "Rampage". The Imperial Japanese Navy in Manila said to the Imperial Japanese Army in Nanking, "Hold my sake!". The things the Japanese did in Manila read like bad internet torture porn. The bad thing is that almost none of them were prosecuted after the war. The good thing is that it was because most of them were killed with flamethrowers and direct 155mm fire. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:03:24 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Read the book "Rampage". The Imperial Japanese Navy in Manila said to the Imperial Japanese Army in Nanking, "Hold my sake!". The things the Japanese did in Manila read like bad internet torture porn. The bad thing is that almost none of them were prosecuted after the war. The good thing is that it was because most of them were killed with flamethrowers and direct 155mm fire. I know the japs had a few free days. I have a few books about Nanking, I'll got to Amazon and pick this up. Thank you |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:22:55 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did not watch the whole video. I did look at the pdf copy of his main source, the PhD dissertation by Wendy Joe Gertjejanssen, that is linked on Youtube. Unfortunately the pdf is incomplete and only includes the first 28 pages, so I cannot read it or review the bibliography that lists Ms. Gertjejanssen's sources. At 3:23 in the video, he states that 1.4 to 1.9 million German women were victims of Soviet rape. He also states 10 million Soviet women were victims of German rape. 1. I don't believe the clean hands of the Wehrmacht myth, but I do not believe the Germans raped 5x as many women as the Soviets. 2. I suspect many of the "sources" are Soviet or Warsaw Pact and believe the intentionally suppressed the documentation of rapes by Soviets in what became Soviet-occupied East Germany and the Eastern Bloc, while over-reporting the rape of Soviet women. I suspect the truth is that both armies were equally brutal. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:32:36 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks “Evil Nazi” first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It’s whitewashed because we are a part of the western “Christian/European” world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered “uncivilized/backwards/foreign” and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same “Asians over there”. Quote HistoryQuoted: If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks “Evil Nazi” first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It’s whitewashed because we are a part of the western “Christian/European” world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered “uncivilized/backwards/foreign” and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same “Asians over there”. Germans killed Jews, who control the media, the banks, big tech, and own most of our government and politicians. Hence the disproportinate response... Quoted: I agree, I can't quite put my finger on the Japanese as far as their collective mindset. Having been to Japan, I walked through Tokyo looking at the people and wondering WTF happened to them. Those folks are into strange shit, not walking around with newborns on bayonets but the other end of the spectrum; pooping on one another and having used women's panties for sale in kiosks type barbarism. They have some odd quirks about them. Very polite on the outside, just wonder what they really feel. I wonder what they think when they come here and so many Americans are disgustingly obese pig humans. I bet they find that odd. My European relatives find it shocking. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:38:39 AM EDT
[#21]
How do they know how many women German soldiers raped? Soviet propaganda numbers?
Both sides were horrible. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:42:07 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks "Evil Nazi" first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It's whitewashed because we are a part of the western "Christian/European" world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered "uncivilized/backwards/foreign" and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same "Asians over there". Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Great info...!!! Read what the Japanese did to women in Nanking... Even the Germans who were there complained. If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks "Evil Nazi" first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It's whitewashed because we are a part of the western "Christian/European" world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered "uncivilized/backwards/foreign" and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same "Asians over there". There's not many of them left alive, but I know a lot of people that wouldn't buy a Japanese car or TV for the rest of their lives, they didn't have as much of an issue with Germany. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:47:20 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Youtube faggotree. He is trying to keep the video from getting banned for the site. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Why can he not say rape? Seriously, whats the deal? This brave new world bothers me. Youtube faggotree. He is trying to keep the video from getting banned for the site. Or getting flagged as needing age verification and account sign in. I've noticed on some WW2 Week By Week episodes - and not just War Against Humanity - are flagged if they mention FDR's domestic actions against Japanese Americans. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:53:06 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Or getting flagged as needing age verification and account sign in. I've noticed on some WW2 Week By Week episodes - and not just War Against Humanity - are flagged if they mention FDR's domestic actions against Japanese Americans. I wonder when they'll start covering for Woodrow Wilson, the Great Segregator and fan of Birth of a Nation. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 8:57:29 AM EDT
[#25]
During the war the Germans occupied some part of the Soviet Union much longer, from June 1941 to the summer of 1944. The Soviets got a toehold in East Prussia in October 1944, didn't really take a decent bite out of German territory until spring 1945, and the war ended May 8 1945. There were 3 years of German occupation vs. 6 months Soviet, and a chunk of the German occupation was downtime while the Soviet invasion of Germany was on average higher intensity with Stalin whipping them on to Berlin ahead of the Americans and Brits. So the Germans had six times as much opportunity, maybe more. ETA: the population of East Germany when occupied was 18 million, I can't find a solid number for peak Soviet population under German occupation, but IIRC it was in the neighborhood of 50 million. ETA2: peak occupied Soviet areas pre-war population was 85 million (need to subtract deaths and refugees that escaped east).
After the war is technically outside the subject being discussed, the Soviets weren't perfect gentlemen but they did reassert discipline fairly quickly after allowing (or being unable to prevent) a brief celebratory outburst of rape and pillage. After that East Germany and its people belonged to Stalin, and Stalin didn't want idiots wrecking the place while he squeezed them systematically. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:03:49 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did not watch the whole video. I did look at the pdf copy of his main source, the PhD dissertation by Wendy Joe Gertjejanssen, that is linked on Youtube. Unfortunately the pdf is incomplete and only includes the first 28 pages, so I cannot read it or review the bibliography that lists Ms. Gertjejanssen's sources. At 3:23 in the video, he states that 1.4 to 1.9 million German women were victims of Soviet rape. He also states 10 million Soviet women were victims of German rape. 1. I don't believe the clean hands of the Wehrmacht myth, but I do not believe the Germans raped 5x as many women as the Soviets. 2. I suspect many of the "sources" are Soviet or Warsaw Pact and believe the intentionally suppressed the documentation of rapes by Soviets in what became Soviet-occupied East Germany and the Eastern Bloc, while over-reporting the rape of Soviet women. I suspect the truth is that both armies were equally brutal. Yeah. I dont believe it either. From my family's anecdotal accounts from surviving the E. front, the Germans were very decent and professional while the Russians were always and universally intoxicated, primitive and brutal. I'm 100% sure that the Germans systematically executed more civilians on the E. Front while the Russians raped 100X more. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:04:17 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Or getting flagged as needing age verification and account sign in. I've noticed on some WW2 Week By Week episodes - and not just War Against Humanity - are flagged if they mention FDR's domestic actions against Japanese Americans. I’m glad they brought interment up. FDR was a leftist, and despite the popular myth the parties did not flip-flop. The democrats of today and the same as the democrats of FDR and Wilson’s day. I feel a little bad for Spartacus, he gets all the heavy content while Indy can keep his mostly light hearted and directly related to battles. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:05:47 AM EDT
[#28]
If you like history WW2 and TimeGhost History are worth subscribing to.
 U.S. Detention, Nazi Deportation, Eastern Death – War Against Humanity 029 – February 1942, Pt. 2 |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:11:43 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I agree, I can't quite put my finger on the Japanese as far as their collective mindset. Having been to Japan, I walked through Tokyo looking at the people and wondering WTF happened to them. Those folks are into strange shit, not walking around with newborns on bayonets but the other end of the spectrum; pooping on one another and having used women's panties for sale in kiosks type barbarism. They have some odd quirks about them. Very polite on the outside, just wonder what they really feel. That's what happens when you get nuked. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:14:40 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's not many of them left alive, but I know a lot of people that wouldn't buy a Japanese car or TV for the rest of their lives, they didn't have as much of an issue with Germany. I guess it depends on where you lived. I had grandparents on both coasts. My dad's parents in WV hated the Germans and my mom's parents in CA hated the Japanese. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:17:11 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. TIK is good, and well sourced. I never understand the finger pointing. Both sides were brutal and we're headed by evil regimes. The German were whitewashed heavily though after the war. Familiar with the Direwanger brigade. Nothing like criminals who are state sponsored to rape, murder and pillage... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I watched that. His stuff is always good. Funny how much alike the Wehraboos and the Sovieboos sound so much alike in their dishonesty. Google "Oskar Dirlewanger" to see what National Socialism is REALLY all about... to this day. I never understand the finger pointing. Both sides were brutal and we're headed by evil regimes. The German were whitewashed heavily though after the war. Familiar with the Direwanger brigade. Nothing like criminals who are state sponsored to rape, murder and pillage... After some time, even Dirlewanger and his crew had become abhorrent to the SS....... there were even some plans to eliminate them |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:24:16 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I watched that. His stuff is always good. Funny how much alike the Wehraboos and the Sovieboos sound so much alike in their dishonesty. Google "Oskar Dirlewanger" to see what National Socialism is REALLY all about... to this day. The Wiki page for Dr. Oskar Dirlewanger has been sanitized. He was a Ph. D. Doctor. Like Jill Biden. Just saying. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:33:37 AM EDT
[#33]
Here is a link to the full PDF version of the dissertation by Wendy Joe Gertjejanssen Click me
Warning - May not be safe for some work environments, it contains pictures. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:38:32 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: After some time, even Dirlewanger and his crew had become abhorrent to the SS....... there were even some plans to eliminate them But they were never carried out. Dirlewanger had friends in high places, including Gottlob Berger. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:39:37 AM EDT
[#35]
We were too easy to forgive the Germans for all sorts of nasty shit they did before and during the War. The Russians were a threat after the war and we let a bunch of card carrying Nazis ( not the bullshit people think Nazis are today, but the real deal pipe hittin' gangbangers) into the US scot-free. We whitewashed post war Germany to help justify it. We should have hung them all. Von Braun included.
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:40:47 AM EDT
[#36]
Impossible - GD has made it clear that the Soviets did all the raping and that what the Germans did wasn't "that bad."
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:46:11 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But they were never carried out. Dirlewanger had friends in high places, including Gottlob Berger. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: After some time, even Dirlewanger and his crew had become abhorrent to the SS....... there were even some plans to eliminate them But they were never carried out. Dirlewanger had friends in high places, including Gottlob Berger. Himmler really liked him. Globocnik too. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:54:33 AM EDT
[#38]
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Posted: 3/15/2021 9:58:25 AM EDT
[#39]
I'm not thoroughly convinced that the Germans raped ten million Soviet women because, unless my estimate is wrong, that would have been one rape for every single member of the entire German armed forces. That would seem a tall order, even for fanatical Nazis. That being said, the Germans actually prosecuted soldiers and others for crimes like rape, looting and other things, and had whole battalions of penal troops doing hard labor throughout their area of operations. I suspect it depended on the local command guidance as to whether the rape of a "subhuman" was a prosecutable offense, but I think, by and large, most commanders were more interested in maintaining good order and discipline in order to more effectively accomplish the mission than sending out rape gangs to subjugate the local populace in occupied territories.
I don't know much detail about the Red Army's policies (if any) on good order and discipline, but I have never been very impressed by the professionalism (*snort*) of the Soviet Armed Forces. More reading is necessary for me on this subject, no doubt, but even today's Russian Army is littered with rapists, criminals and other renegade elements, some of whom are selling their incoming trainees into prostitution at the unit level, so I can't imagine the WWII Russian Army was all that much better in terms of discipline and professionalism. As far as the statistics, no one REALLY knows the hard numbers from that war, and the numbers keep changing, depending on who's telling the story and what their political leanings might be. My bottom line is, the Nazis and the Commies should have been allowed to bleed each other white, and then the West should have rolled in and cleaned up the ones who were left spreading their filthy, murderous ideologies. The world would be a better place without either of them. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:02:20 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is pretty much exactly opposite the views during the war. Japanese atrocities (Nanking, Bataan death march after 1944, etc) were pretty well known. There's not many of them left alive, but I know a lot of people that wouldn't buy a Japanese car or TV for the rest of their lives, they didn't have as much of an issue with Germany. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Great info...!!! Read what the Japanese did to women in Nanking... Even the Germans who were there complained. If your talking about whitewashed then look to the Japanese. Everyone in the western word thinks "Evil Nazi" first but the brutality of the Japanese made the Nazis look like amateur hour. It's whitewashed because we are a part of the western "Christian/European" world with Germans and judged them harsher. The Japanese at the time were considered "uncivilized/backwards/foreign" and the brutality was written off as it was MOSTLY against the same "Asians over there". There's not many of them left alive, but I know a lot of people that wouldn't buy a Japanese car or TV for the rest of their lives, they didn't have as much of an issue with Germany. I know a man that will run you off if you show up in a VW, and burns every Beetle engine block that crosses his path. . |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:05:35 AM EDT
[#41]
Wehrmacht controlled brothels.
Sex slaves. Yes, there were rapes and torture too. Not new but just not discussed. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:13:37 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:My bottom line is, the Nazis and the Commies should have been allowed to bleed each other white, and then the West should have rolled in and cleaned up the ones who were left spreading their filthy, murderous ideologies. Which was NEVER going to happen. ONE of them was going to win, and without Lend Lease to keep them in the fight, probably NOT the Soviets. The Germans failed largely due to fuel starvation. It's what kneecapped the Luftwaffe in the last year of the war. Without Western assistance, the Soviets probably couldn't have kept the Germans out of the oil fields. On NO acid trip is the Germans with Romanian AND Soviet oil fields a GOOD thing... unless you think the wrong side won. And YET AGAIN, we need to recall who declared war on whom. Hitler fucked up by declaring war on the United States. Sucks to be him. Sucks to be a German in the path of the Red Army. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:13:40 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A lot of those guys ended up in the West German military, working not very indirectly for the US against the USSR. The vast majority of Bundeswehr high ranking army officers in the 50's were ex-Wehrmacht. A "clean hands Wehrmacht" myth was of course necessary. I read a biography about a u-boat captain in high school and it was all "chivalrous knight of the seas!" glorious honor etc., and I was like, who the fuck wrote this, Donitz? But it was an American author, written in the 50's. I got to the last chapter and it was about how he was now an officer in the new West German Navy, "facing the real foe of Germany and freedom, the Soviet Union" or something to the effect, and it clicked. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Yes. TIK is good, and well sourced. I never understand the finger pointing. Both sides were brutal and we're headed by evil regimes. The German were whitewashed heavily though after the war. Familiar with the Direwanger brigade. Nothing like criminals who are state sponsored to rape, murder and pillage... I read a biography about a u-boat captain in high school and it was all "chivalrous knight of the seas!" glorious honor etc., and I was like, who the fuck wrote this, Donitz? But it was an American author, written in the 50's. I got to the last chapter and it was about how he was now an officer in the new West German Navy, "facing the real foe of Germany and freedom, the Soviet Union" or something to the effect, and it clicked. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:15:31 AM EDT
[#44]
I think those numbers are not accurate. Simple statistics would say those are either equal or the Soviets with greater miss-treatment of women.
Peak troop strengths: 1- Soviet with 13,200,000 2- Germany with 9,500,000 Total troop strengths: 1- Soviet with 21,000,000 2- Germany with 17,900,000 There is also the fact that German troops ceased near the end of the war, while Soviet troops continued on and occupied Germany and other countries. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:29:49 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Which was NEVER going to happen. ONE of them was going to win, and without Lend Lease to keep them in the fight, probably NOT the Soviets. The Germans failed largely due to fuel starvation. It's what kneecapped the Luftwaffe in the last year of the war. Without Western assistance, the Soviets probably couldn't have kept the Germans out of the oil fields. On NO acid trip is the Germans with Romanian AND Soviet oil fields a GOOD thing... unless you think the wrong side won. And YET AGAIN, we need to recall who declared war on whom. Hitler fucked up by declaring war on the United States. Sucks to be him. Sucks to be a German in the path of the Red Army. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted:My bottom line is, the Nazis and the Commies should have been allowed to bleed each other white, and then the West should have rolled in and cleaned up the ones who were left spreading their filthy, murderous ideologies. Which was NEVER going to happen. ONE of them was going to win, and without Lend Lease to keep them in the fight, probably NOT the Soviets. The Germans failed largely due to fuel starvation. It's what kneecapped the Luftwaffe in the last year of the war. Without Western assistance, the Soviets probably couldn't have kept the Germans out of the oil fields. On NO acid trip is the Germans with Romanian AND Soviet oil fields a GOOD thing... unless you think the wrong side won. And YET AGAIN, we need to recall who declared war on whom. Hitler fucked up by declaring war on the United States. Sucks to be him. Sucks to be a German in the path of the Red Army. Are you attempting to call me a neo-Nazi or a sympathizer? Genuinely curious. Even with those oilfields, the Germans would have lost. I would gladly have traded more years of war for a world without Nazis or Communists in any measure of power, anywhere in the world. The Communists blighted every part of the world they ever touched, and for far longer, with more banal, primitive cruelty than the Nazis ever managed in twelve years. Eastern Europe will still be recovering from Communism a hundred years in the future, and yet people still think the Nazis were (and still are) the greater threat. They were both some of the vilest people humanity ever produced, and I despise them all. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 10:46:25 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you attempting to call me a neo-Nazi or a sympathizer? Genuinely curious. Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you attempting to call me a neo-Nazi or a sympathizer? Genuinely curious. Are you? You brought it up. Quoted:Even with those oilfields, the Germans would have lost. I would gladly have traded more years of war for a world without Nazis or Communists in any measure of power, anywhere in the world. More years of the Holocaust, mass starvation and mass slavery too. Some see that as a feature, not a bug. And again, we oh so conveniently forget that German declaration of war. Maybe we should have treated it as a "prank", the MovieTone News version of "Crank Yankers"... |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:03:31 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/327887/brave_SbKQWxnYRY_jpg-1866391.JPG That is the same rational used against Americans who take a wife while overseas. I saw that and had a similar reaction. Let's completely ignore the fact that women are genetically predisposed to seek out dominant males, of which an occupying force certainly appears to be composed of. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:44:00 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you? You brought it up. I seem to recall something you asking me if I thought "the wrong side won?" How is that a case of ME bringing this up? More years of the Holocaust, mass starvation and mass slavery too. Some see that as a feature, not a bug. Mass starvation, mass murder and slavery would have continued for as long as either the Communist or Nazi systems were in place and functioning, and in fact DID continue in the Soviet sphere of influence until the 1990s, so I would personally consider several extra years of hot war, with all its attendant horrors, a small price to pay in order to wipe out the two worst political systems in all human history for good. And again, we oh so conveniently forget that German declaration of war. Maybe we should have treated it as a "prank", the MovieTone News version of "Crank Yankers"... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Are you attempting to call me a neo-Nazi or a sympathizer? Genuinely curious. Are you? You brought it up. I seem to recall something you asking me if I thought "the wrong side won?" How is that a case of ME bringing this up? Quoted:Even with those oilfields, the Germans would have lost. I would gladly have traded more years of war for a world without Nazis or Communists in any measure of power, anywhere in the world. More years of the Holocaust, mass starvation and mass slavery too. Some see that as a feature, not a bug. Mass starvation, mass murder and slavery would have continued for as long as either the Communist or Nazi systems were in place and functioning, and in fact DID continue in the Soviet sphere of influence until the 1990s, so I would personally consider several extra years of hot war, with all its attendant horrors, a small price to pay in order to wipe out the two worst political systems in all human history for good. And again, we oh so conveniently forget that German declaration of war. Maybe we should have treated it as a "prank", the MovieTone News version of "Crank Yankers"... I'm still tying to puzzle out where you got the idea that I am sympathizing with the Nazis after I clearly said multiple times that I would gladly see the Nazis and Communists wiped off the face of the earth forever.  |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:55:32 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess it depends on where you lived. I had grandparents on both coasts. My dad's parents in WV hated the Germans and my mom's parents in CA hated the Japanese. My grandfather, right smack in the middle of the country, hated the Japanese until he passed. He was too young to serve but a couple of his brothers did. I've heard stories of one of them's time in New Guinea. Was pretty rough. Grandpa would not buy ANYTHING made in Japan and would cuss people who did. Didn't care a lick about the Germans. But...we are German/Swiss American(immigrated late 1800's) so that probably played a roll as well. |
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Posted: 3/15/2021 1:56:19 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I saw that and had a similar reaction. Let's completely ignore the fact that women are genetically predisposed to seek out dominant males, of which an occupying force certainly appears to be composed of. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/327887/brave_SbKQWxnYRY_jpg-1866391.JPG That is the same rational used against Americans who take a wife while overseas. I saw that and had a similar reaction. Let's completely ignore the fact that women are genetically predisposed to seek out dominant males, of which an occupying force certainly appears to be composed of. Can't fight the lizard brain. |
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