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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:42:49 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You have stated why you're angry, and I agree with you on those things. You didn't define how a tea party of sorts would change that. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Fire and or prosecute every politician, mayor, LE, etc. that is circumventing laws of the United States. Immigration - We have clear laws passed by congress and they are not enforced. Crime - Flash mobs looting or small groups and nothing is done. Inflation - Gov printing money that devalues earned dollars and adding real debt on top of it. Time for another tea party of sorts / burn it down if you prefer. You have stated why you're angry, and I agree with you on those things. You didn't define how a tea party of sorts would change that. Maybe an armed Million Man March on Washington would get people's attention. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:47:02 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To me it means people are delusional and idiots. They think if they burn something all the way down, ie destroy most of it, that something better will magically replace it with even less effort that it would have taken to fix the initial problems they were complaining about. Well stated...! |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:50:05 AM EDT
[#3]
"burn it all down" means that someone is an overgrown petulant child, they are upset, they are losing the game as they see it, so they want to kick over the blocks and overturn the checkerboard. There is no real thought beyond making everyone else as miserable as they are.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:28:48 AM EDT
[#4]
It means to restore the United States Constitution and purge government of bureaucracies. Remind our public servants of their duties and obligations to the people they serve and not corporate interests.
By bloodshed if necessary. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:30:11 AM EDT
[#5]
 
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Posted: 11/15/2023 9:35:52 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "burn it all down" means that someone is an overgrown petulant child, they are upset, they are losing the game as they see it, so they want to kick over the blocks and overturn the checkerboard. There is no real thought beyond making everyone else as miserable as they are. How do you intend to wrest power from those who rule your state? Are you willing to follow them on their path? |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 9:41:17 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How do you intend to wrest power from those who rule your state? Are you willing to follow them on their path? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: "burn it all down" means that someone is an overgrown petulant child, they are upset, they are losing the game as they see it, so they want to kick over the blocks and overturn the checkerboard. There is no real thought beyond making everyone else as miserable as they are. How do you intend to wrest power from those who rule your state? Are you willing to follow them on their path? A lot of people are perfectly content being slaves or trustees allowed to beat the other slaves. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 9:56:39 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: When someone says that’s what they want, it’s a sure sign they’re a fucking moron that doesn’t understand the consequences of what they want. The act of burning it all down would be a leap of faith for those who do it. They would never see the other side. Victory, if it came, would belong to the future; it would belong to people they would never meet, to people whose names they would never know. It is precisely because burning it all down would be so awful, that I know it is still a long ways off. I’ll certainly never see it. In fact, I don’t believe anyone alive today will see it. I often say, no one alive today will ever see things get "better." There are dark, dark, times ahead. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 10:03:53 AM EDT
[#9]
Political Arson
Jay |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 10:30:37 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is no denying, "burning it all down" would be hell on earth. There is also no denying that it’s the only way anything changes. The act of burning it all down would be a leap of faith for those who do it. They would never see the other side. Victory, if it came, would belong to the future; it would belong to people they would never meet, to people whose names they would never know. I read the OP yesterday and have read a bunch of replies but held off on replying. I think the above sums up what I'd like to say. Let me die on my feet so that some future generation might not have to live on its knees. None of us want to give up our nice domestic lives with 3br/2ba houses and deer hunting every weekend and bowling on Tuesday nights or whatever routine thing you do. But there's something I want more than I want that - even if I have to lose it so that my kids/grandkids might taste it. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 10:47:35 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I read the OP yesterday and have read a bunch of replies but held off on replying. I think the above sums up what I'd like to say. Let me die on my feet so that some future generation might not have to live on its knees. None of us want to give up our nice domestic lives with 3br/2ba houses and deer hunting every weekend and bowling on Tuesday nights or whatever routine thing you do. But there's something I want more than I want that - even if I have to lose it so that my kids/grandkids might taste it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There is no denying, "burning it all down" would be hell on earth. There is also no denying that it’s the only way anything changes. The act of burning it all down would be a leap of faith for those who do it. They would never see the other side. Victory, if it came, would belong to the future; it would belong to people they would never meet, to people whose names they would never know. I read the OP yesterday and have read a bunch of replies but held off on replying. I think the above sums up what I'd like to say. Let me die on my feet so that some future generation might not have to live on its knees. None of us want to give up our nice domestic lives with 3br/2ba houses and deer hunting every weekend and bowling on Tuesday nights or whatever routine thing you do. But there's something I want more than I want that - even if I have to lose it so that my kids/grandkids might taste it. This. I think the reason so many don't understand how someone could embrace a hardship like "burning it down" is because they're the same folks who say "I got mine". To me, my life is for my progeny. Whatever happens to me is temporary. All my joys, my suffering, my pain, it is all just my problems, and that matters very little. So, if my life is full of hardships so that my kids can have something better, I would relish the chance, because as it is, I only see my kids, grandkids, and great grandkids having a worse life than mine. To that end, I feel like I've failed as a man. My highest priority is to do better for them than what I had. I don't see that happening without radical change to the status quo. And yes, it's gonna hurt me, but like I said, that matters so incredibly little as to be almost immaterial. It's actually the least important thing. I am for more pre-occupied with what would come after, what I'd be leaving to them. That's where my hope lies. As for myself, I have no hope and I don't think I should. Our lives aren't worth much on their own. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:05:37 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think the reason so many don't understand how someone could embrace a hardship like "burning it down" is because they're the same folks who say "I got mine". There are two kinds of people in this debate: People who want things to be better; and people who want things to be better for them. My point has always been, there is no way to make things better for us... or our children... or even our children's children, most likely. (Yes, things are that bad... and we're not even uncomfortable yet.) Again, IMO, no one alive today will ever see America better. All we can possibly do is help set the stage for the future. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 12:59:01 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thank you. I was trying to figure out how to put into words what I was feeling, and then you summed it up perfectly. There are two kinds of people in this debate: People who want things to be better; and people who want things to be better for them. My point has always been, there is no way to make things better for us... or our children... or even our children's children, most likely. (Yes, things are that bad... and we're not even uncomfortable yet.) Again, IMO, no one alive today will ever see America better. All we can possibly do is help set the stage for the future. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:03:45 PM EDT
[#14]
I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:03:59 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: such little faith in their country. What does that phrase even mean? If there's enough of us that are like-minded enough to 'put our faith in' each other, then what's the worry about burning it all down? We'd be finished and rebuilding in two weeks, if there's that many of us left.  ETA: Logically, you're saying there's enough mass left to preserve our nation's better aspects, but not enough mass to fix any of our problems. I don't see how you math that out. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:35:03 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. Holy caricatures batman. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:37:46 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. Its putting your faith in Darwinian pressures. That no matter who wins, the weak, indecisive and doughy will be consumed by the flames and all that will be left will be Gigachads who will bring about a new American empire. Women will be put in their place and all the clowns in clownworld will be crucified as an example to others that this kind of silliness will never be tolerated ever again. Or it all turns into Venezuela. Most people seem to think that's the more likely outcome. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:38:32 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It means to restore the United States Constitution and purge government of bureaucracies. Remind our public servants of their duties and obligations to the people they serve and not corporate interests. By bloodshed if necessary. Just waiting for the Purge to start. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:40:39 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The easiest and least destructive “fire” would be Balkanization. But, that has its own set of problems. The ‘management’ of this country has brought us to a point that we can’t pull back from. There will be a “fire”. How it starts had yet to be determined. It will spontaneously combust if left untended. The management thinks they can keep it smoldering and continue benefiting from its warmth. I don’t have the same level of confidence. This about nails it. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:51:02 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. I think I may understand your confusion. You're conflating government and country. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:55:55 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I disagree and I am saddened that people have such little faith in their country. Apparently, only the people who want to burn it down are paragons of virtue while everyone else is merely out to save their own advantage. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Thank you. I was trying to figure out how to put into words what I was feeling, and then you summed it up perfectly. There are two kinds of people in this debate: People who want things to be better; and people who want things to be better for them. My point has always been, there is no way to make things better for us... or our children... or even our children's children, most likely. (Yes, things are that bad... and we're not even uncomfortable yet.) Again, IMO, no one alive today will ever see America better. All we can possibly do is help set the stage for the future. I disagree and I am saddened that people have such little faith in their country. Apparently, only the people who want to burn it down are paragons of virtue while everyone else is merely out to save their own advantage. There's no need to burn all of this straw, Zhukov. What gives you "faith" in our country? |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 1:59:01 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Holy caricatures batman. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. Holy caricatures batman. What's ironic, is given his position, the Revolution shouldn't have happened. The American Colonies were, for their time, some of the best places to live, and the Revolution was led mostly by well educated, well to do people. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 2:02:39 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Victory, if it came, would belong to the future; it would belong to people they would never meet, to people whose names they would never know. I think with that knowledge, the people who go ahead with the plan are doing so because they know life is on a hopeless path and they don't want to die an ignoble death without having at least punished the people who forced the shit upon them in the first place. It's goes back to the whole "I just wanted to be left alone" thing. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 2:03:38 PM EDT
[#24]
It means to erase and start a new from the ground up.
During the 2020 summer of love when I first heard that term I thought it literally meant to start on fire. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 3:28:30 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To me it means people are delusional and idiots. They think if they burn something all the way down, ie destroy most of it, that something better will magically replace it with even less effort that it would have taken to fix the initial problems they were complaining about. So you really think you can stop inevitability? Do you think this cycle can be broken?  Nothing can stop it. Pushing it off to the next generation is a shitty and selfish thing to do. I am part of the mess I should be one of the ones to feel the pain. Not my grandkids. I say get it here now while I am still here. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:01:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think I may understand your confusion. You're conflating government and country. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:03:19 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not confused. The government is a representation of its citizens. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:10:43 PM EDT
[#28]
To me it would mean that anyone who had an official position would be ineligible to serve in office ever again, but that's a bit extreme I realize. And human nature being what it is, it wouldn't take long until the HOA ladies do their thing.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:14:50 PM EDT
[#29]
They founding fathers burnt it all down and started from scratch
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:21:21 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you really think you can stop inevitability? Do you think this cycle can be broken? https://i.postimg.cc/bJVYWHk9/download.jpg Nothing can stop it. Pushing it off to the next generation is a shitty and selfish thing to do. I am part of the mess I should be one of the ones to feel the pain. Not my grandkids. I say get it here now while I am still here. The Left has utter control over: The Federal government Most state governments (certainly the ones in the most populated states) The educational system from kindergarten through the doctorate level Almost every news outlet The entertainment industry Social media The Right controls nothing of any consequence in America. We are fucking irrelevant. And, all the left has to do is keep importing Turd Worlders, and we will grow increasingly more irrelevant. (If that's possible.) But hey, next time we go vote, if we make this face  when we pull the lever, everything will be okay.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:26:43 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So in your opinion, when people say "burn it all down" they DO mean they're basically calling for the destruction of our country as it exists today? I guess my interpretation was correct then. Destruction in the sense of a forest fire that takes old growth to allow the new growth to rejuvenate it. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:36:24 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So in your opinion, when people say "burn it all down" they DO mean they're basically calling for the destruction of our country as it exists today? I guess my interpretation was correct then. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:44:49 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not confused. The government is a representation of its citizens. Politicians are a convenient target, but people forget that those politicians represent the views of other Americans. To claim you want to burn down the government implies you hate the people who sent the politicians that oppose your ideas. Any attempt to destroy the government will not stop there. It actually CAN'T stop there. By necessity, it involves the population as a whole. I'm sorry but that is simply not the case and rarely throughout history has it ever been the case. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 4:58:35 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think with that knowledge, the people who go ahead with the plan are doing so because they know life is on a hopeless path and they don't want to die an ignoble death without having at least punished the people who forced the shit upon them in the first place. It's goes back to the whole "I just wanted to be left alone" thing. QFT  Attached File |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:01:34 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. By saying we "pine for a total societal collapse" is moving the goalpost from the original OP in my opinion. I took your question to be "what does "burn it all down" mean to me. My answer is according to what I believe others mean by it. To define my opinion of it doesn't mean I agree or even use the term. I think most people use that term out of extreme frustration with the current situation and a sense of helplessness. I can't afford to see it all burned to the ground. I have too many family members that are of all ages, some just born to watch them live a life of horror or die young. But yeah, my answer still stands for what I see it meaning. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:13:02 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. You're like that dude in the tavern back in 1775 poopoo'ing everything the founding fathers were talking about. I think they called them Tories. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:15:54 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Our country is irredeemable. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: So in your opinion, when people say "burn it all down" they DO mean they're basically calling for the destruction of our country as it exists today? I guess my interpretation was correct then. A lot of people are still confused and think we are the good guy. We aren't as bad as some countries, but we sow chaos just about everywhere we are, and we are everywhere. @Zhukov, since you posed the question and expressed have your disappointment about our apparent lack of faith in our fellow Americans, help us out, win us over, tell us where your optimism springs forth eternal from, and why we should be optimistic and think a renewal and revival is just around the corner, and the right is about to start it's long march through the institutions. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:16:01 PM EDT
[#38]
I typed a response to this thread and deleted it-cause I love my dogs.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:16:14 PM EDT
[#39]
I think it's a phrase used by one of the following;
(1) Basement dwellers with nothing to lose except Hot Pockets, Cheese puffs and a PS4. (2) It's ideology conceived from playing too many death and destruction video games. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:17:44 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not confused. The government is a representation of its citizens. Politicians are a convenient target, but people forget that those politicians represent the views of other Americans. To claim you want to burn down the government implies you hate the people who sent the politicians that oppose your ideas. Any attempt to destroy the government will not stop there. It actually CAN'T stop there. By necessity, it involves the population as a whole. that's so illogical it's silly. come on. the federal gov doesn't really "represent" any of the citizens, and that's the problem. that's why it needs to be reset. it used to reasonably. it doesn't now. a constitutional convention and fresh start is the only way to fix it. "fixing it" DOES require fixing the population as a whole ,but that does not mean destroying them, as in, literally killing the zombie hordes / genocide. more appropriately it means stopping entitlements, which will incentivize a change in behavior. removing the current incentives which drive single-parent families, multi-generational welfare, etc. it also means returning to the education we had in the 50s, and removing the completely one-sided communist indoctrination from k-12 and moving away from the multi-culturalism and back to the melting pot |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:20:58 PM EDT
[#41]
Curious you can’t rate this thread troll.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:21:42 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: By saying we "pine for a total societal collapse" is moving the goalpost from the original OP in my opinion. I took your question to be "what does "burn it all down" mean to me. My answer is according to what I believe others mean by it. To define my opinion of it doesn't mean I agree or even use the term. I think most people use that term out of extreme frustration with the current situation and a sense of helplessness. I can't afford to see it all burned to the ground. I have too many family members that are of all ages, some just born to watch them live a life of horror or die young. But yeah, my answer still stands for what I see it meaning. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. By saying we "pine for a total societal collapse" is moving the goalpost from the original OP in my opinion. I took your question to be "what does "burn it all down" mean to me. My answer is according to what I believe others mean by it. To define my opinion of it doesn't mean I agree or even use the term. I think most people use that term out of extreme frustration with the current situation and a sense of helplessness. I can't afford to see it all burned to the ground. I have too many family members that are of all ages, some just born to watch them live a life of horror or die young. But yeah, my answer still stands for what I see it meaning. Exactly. I don't pine for total societal collapse. I see that as the very direction that the left has steered the country towards and locked the steering wheel in the process. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:26:45 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let the inevitable happen, but accelerate it. Its coming anyway. Lets get it over with and see where things go after. It if happens incrementally the reaction will too late as people will be comfortable. Accelerate it and many will be shocked into taking appropriate action. Burn it all down Pretty much this. Ideally we would have fair trials then execute every politician that broke their oath to be Constitution and every foreigner and citizen acting against the country for globalist goals and complete dissolution of all federal agencies. The military should be reformed as state guard until we reelect representatives that stay in and lead from their home state. No more ruling from some little enclave of unapproachable unaccountability. No more world police. A return to the best Constitutional Republic that has ever been. Don’t think I’ve advocated for burn it all down but it seems like the least bad outcome. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:44:37 PM EDT
[#44]
Personally i picture Nuremberg trials 2.0, 10x bigger than 1.0, , with a side of voluntary mass deportation, of illegals, as well as lefties, because they dont feel safe here anymore and know they have no future if they stay. I also see a lot of blood and violence getting those things accomplished.
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:47:46 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not confused. The government is a representation of its citizens. Politicians are a convenient target, but people forget that those politicians represent the views of other Americans. To. Any attempt to destroy the government will not stop there. It actually CAN'T stop there. By necessity, it involves the population as a whole. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I think I may understand your confusion. You're conflating government and country. I'm not confused. The government is a representation of its citizens. Politicians are a convenient target, but people forget that those politicians represent the views of other Americans. To. Any attempt to destroy the government will not stop there. It actually CAN'T stop there. By necessity, it involves the population as a whole. "The government is a representation of its citizens" Usually starts out that way(but not always)...then it goes off the rails(pretty much always), and no longer serves the people. Pretty much a key tenet of the DoI. " claim you want to burn down the government implies you hate the people who sent the politicians that oppose your ideas" I, personally don't bare any hate. Sounds like this might be projection on your part. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 5:58:55 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am completely flabbergasted by the people who truly do pine for a total societal collapse when they say 'burn it down". The widespread death and destruction notwithstanding, there is no guarantee that what rises out of the ashes will resemble the utopia they envision. Actually, it's almost a guarantee that things will be catastrophically worse. It's hard to fathom hating your country any more than that, all while cloaking yourself in the mantle of patriotism. I think its a matter of paradigm. There are a lot of folks still personally doing well right now despite biden, etc. Many “middle class” are seeing things go to hell (this is likely a majority-regardless of how they will vote). Those on bottom are leas affected, bottom is still bottom under biden, just with more new mexican neighbors to share it with. If your doing well its hard to understand the angst of someone who is aware their ship is sinking. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:04:00 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: that's so illogical it's silly. come on. the federal gov doesn't really "represent" any of the citizens, and that's the problem. that's why it needs to be reset. it used to reasonably. it doesn't now. a constitutional convention and fresh start is the only way to fix it. "fixing it" DOES require fixing the population as a whole ,but that does not mean destroying them, as in, literally killing the zombie hordes / genocide. more appropriately it means stopping entitlements, which will incentivize a change in behavior. removing the current incentives which drive single-parent families, multi-generational welfare, etc. it also means returning to the education we had in the 50s, and removing the completely one-sided communist indoctrination from k-12 and moving away from the multi-culturalism and back to the melting pot If everyone is so fed up with their pols, why do incumbents win election 905% of the time? Is someone twisting the arms of the voters to prevent them from voting for someone else that isn't connected to the establishment? Gimme a break. The government we get is exactly the government WE voted for. To deny that reality is to live in a fantasy world, mental gymnastics notwithstanding. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:06:40 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm sorry but that is simply not the case and rarely throughout history has it ever been the case. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I'm not confused. The government is a representation of its citizens. Politicians are a convenient target, but people forget that those politicians represent the views of other Americans. To claim you want to burn down the government implies you hate the people who sent the politicians that oppose your ideas. Any attempt to destroy the government will not stop there. It actually CAN'T stop there. By necessity, it involves the population as a whole. I'm sorry but that is simply not the case and rarely throughout history has it ever been the case. If the politicians really did represent the will of the people, we'd have had term limits for congress decades ago. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:11:07 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How illogical is it? Several people have jumped up to say that the government doesn't represent the people. Well, if that were the case, then why do they keep getting elected? Did the person who represents your district steal the election? Did MTG steal her election? Was Pelosi not elected by the liberal nutjobs in San Francisco? Everyone loves to blame politicians, but don't polls show that everyone loves their own representative (He totally represents me!) but the overall approval of Congress is in the single digits (It's all the OTHER guys that are the problem). Do you deny that AOC represents exactly the kind of liberals that voted for her in NYC, and do you think the people in NYC are just itching to get on with a Constitutional Convention because they would love to embrace conservative ideals and embrace our ideals when it all burns down? If everyone is so fed up with their pols, why do incumbents win election 905% of the time? Is someone twisting the arms of the voters to prevent them from voting for someone else that isn't connected to the establishment? Gimme a break. The government we get is exactly the government WE voted for. To deny that reality is to live in a fantasy world, mental gymnastics notwithstanding. That 95% are the low info voters who push the straight ticket party line easy button at the polls. That's all it means. That's not what they really want if you ask them. But just because they can't be bothered to understand who they are voting for doesn't mean they actually WANT those policies enacted. ETA also when the only people running for a seat are just "less bad" than the opposition party, they will get a vote no matter how far they diverge from their constituents' wants. |
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Posted: 11/15/2023 6:15:01 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How illogical is it? Several people have jumped up to say that the government doesn't represent the people. Well, if that were the case, then why do they keep getting elected? Did the person who represents your district steal the election? Did MTG steal her election? Was Pelosi not elected by the liberal nutjobs in San Francisco? Everyone loves to blame politicians, but don't polls show that everyone loves their own representative (He totally represents me!) but the overall approval of Congress is in the single digits (It's all the OTHER guys that are the problem). Do you deny that AOC represents exactly the kind of liberals that voted for her in NYC, and do you think the people in NYC are just itching to get on with a Constitutional Convention because they would love to embrace conservative ideals and embrace our ideals when it all burns down? If everyone is so fed up with their pols, why do incumbents win election 905% of the time? Is someone twisting the arms of the voters to prevent them from voting for someone else that isn't connected to the establishment? Gimme a break. The government we get is exactly the government WE voted for. To deny that reality is to live in a fantasy world, mental gymnastics notwithstanding. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: that's so illogical it's silly. come on. the federal gov doesn't really "represent" any of the citizens, and that's the problem. that's why it needs to be reset. it used to reasonably. it doesn't now. a constitutional convention and fresh start is the only way to fix it. "fixing it" DOES require fixing the population as a whole ,but that does not mean destroying them, as in, literally killing the zombie hordes / genocide. more appropriately it means stopping entitlements, which will incentivize a change in behavior. removing the current incentives which drive single-parent families, multi-generational welfare, etc. it also means returning to the education we had in the 50s, and removing the completely one-sided communist indoctrination from k-12 and moving away from the multi-culturalism and back to the melting pot How illogical is it? Several people have jumped up to say that the government doesn't represent the people. Well, if that were the case, then why do they keep getting elected? Did the person who represents your district steal the election? Did MTG steal her election? Was Pelosi not elected by the liberal nutjobs in San Francisco? Everyone loves to blame politicians, but don't polls show that everyone loves their own representative (He totally represents me!) but the overall approval of Congress is in the single digits (It's all the OTHER guys that are the problem). Do you deny that AOC represents exactly the kind of liberals that voted for her in NYC, and do you think the people in NYC are just itching to get on with a Constitutional Convention because they would love to embrace conservative ideals and embrace our ideals when it all burns down? If everyone is so fed up with their pols, why do incumbents win election 905% of the time? Is someone twisting the arms of the voters to prevent them from voting for someone else that isn't connected to the establishment? Gimme a break. The government we get is exactly the government WE voted for. To deny that reality is to live in a fantasy world, mental gymnastics notwithstanding. What you just described is the tyranny of the majority. It's a common issue with democracies, which the US is closer to due to the direct election of senators and huge US Representative districts, then when it started out. Your position amounts to: There are 100 people. 51 vote one way, 49 vote the other. Because the 49 lost, they just need to shut up and deal with consequences, after all, it doesn't matter that the government is acting against the foundational principles of the country, those 49 voted. |
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