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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:28:49 AM EDT
[#1]
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Whew! For a second there I thought Selma wrote that.  You had one job... http://i.imgur.com/go5rMi5.jpg ...thread...something about...conservatism...something... ...very large breasts...the breasts...yes...very large and succulent... <--Trails off mumbling. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:29:27 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Apparently, this guy was in on the Libertarian conspiracy as well: http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003705245/437671508_XfV3sb6_xlarge.jpeg Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Libertarianism is more dangerous, and less honest about it's intentions than Communism. Apparently, this guy was in on the Libertarian conspiracy as well: http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003705245/437671508_XfV3sb6_xlarge.jpeg Sure, everyone wants less government. Everyone wants lower taxes. Everyone wants less regulation. But if Ronald Reagan was such a big Libertarian, then why didn't he close our bases in Europe and cede Europe to the Russians? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian, then why did he declare war on drugs? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian then why did he use tarrifs to protect American motorcycles from import competition? Why did he protect American corn and sugar with import tarrifs? Why did he stand up for restrictions on abortion? Why didn't he promote gay rights and gay marriage? Why did he do so many things that Libertarians declare to be fundamental rights? He doesn't sound much like a Libertarian to me! |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:31:19 AM EDT
[#3]
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In general, it can probably be said that the conservative does not object to coercion or arbitrary power so long as it is used for what he regards as the right purposes. Sure... it can be said by morons that don't know what the fuck they're talking about. If we just get to define the terms as we see fit now, I say that all liberals are Satan-worshipping lizard people bent on human annihilation. 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:33:02 AM EDT
[#4]
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Sure, everyone wants less government. Everyone wants lower taxes. Everyone wants less regulation. But if Ronald Reagan was such a big Libertarian, then why didn't he close our bases in Europe and cede Europe to the Russians? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian, then why did he declare war on drugs? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian then why did he use tarrifs to protect American motorcycles from import competition? Why did he protect American corn and sugar with import tarrifs? Why did he stand up for restrictions on abortion? Why didn't he promote gay rights and gay marriage? Why did he do so many things that Libertarians declare to be fundamental rights? He doesn't sound much like a Libertarian to me! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Libertarianism is more dangerous, and less honest about it's intentions than Communism. Apparently, this guy was in on the Libertarian conspiracy as well: http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003705245/437671508_XfV3sb6_xlarge.jpeg Sure, everyone wants less government. Everyone wants lower taxes. Everyone wants less regulation. But if Ronald Reagan was such a big Libertarian, then why didn't he close our bases in Europe and cede Europe to the Russians? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian, then why did he declare war on drugs? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian then why did he use tarrifs to protect American motorcycles from import competition? Why did he protect American corn and sugar with import tarrifs? Why did he stand up for restrictions on abortion? Why didn't he promote gay rights and gay marriage? Why did he do so many things that Libertarians declare to be fundamental rights? He doesn't sound much like a Libertarian to me! Nixon declared the war on drugs. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:34:18 AM EDT
[#5]
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Actually, that's the description of a leftist. a conservative will say that gov shouldn't have the power to overwhelm peoples' lives. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:36:12 AM EDT
[#6]
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GD isn't attacking Hayek. GD is attacking anyone who would try to use Hayek's Austrian definition of "conservative" to describe contemporary American Conservatives. THAT is retarded. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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GD attacking Hayek. Can't say I'm surprised. You need to understand that Hayek being Austrian uses the terms "liberal" and "conservative" different than we do. GD isn't attacking Hayek. GD is attacking anyone who would try to use Hayek's Austrian definition of "conservative" to describe contemporary American Conservatives. THAT is retarded. You're doing that (and thanks!). GD on the other hand is just talking past one another, as usual. 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:38:00 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nixon declared the war on drugs. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Libertarianism is more dangerous, and less honest about it's intentions than Communism. Apparently, this guy was in on the Libertarian conspiracy as well: http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003705245/437671508_XfV3sb6_xlarge.jpeg Sure, everyone wants less government. Everyone wants lower taxes. Everyone wants less regulation. But if Ronald Reagan was such a big Libertarian, then why didn't he close our bases in Europe and cede Europe to the Russians? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian, then why did he declare war on drugs? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian then why did he use tarrifs to protect American motorcycles from import competition? Why did he protect American corn and sugar with import tarrifs? Why did he stand up for restrictions on abortion? Why didn't he promote gay rights and gay marriage? Why did he do so many things that Libertarians declare to be fundamental rights? He doesn't sound much like a Libertarian to me! Nixon declared the war on drugs. The Reagan should have ended it, if he was such a big Libertarian. Why didn't he? How many times did he ask Congress to decrease funding for drug enforcement? How many times did he lobby Congress to close the DEA, ATF, INS or ICE? |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:41:07 AM EDT
[#8]
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The Reagan should have ended it, if he was such a big Libertarian. Why didn't he? How many times did he ask Congress to decrease funding for drug enforcement? How many times did he lobby Congress to close the DEA, ATF, INS or ICE? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Libertarianism is more dangerous, and less honest about it's intentions than Communism. Apparently, this guy was in on the Libertarian conspiracy as well: http://images.sodahead.com/polls/003705245/437671508_XfV3sb6_xlarge.jpeg Sure, everyone wants less government. Everyone wants lower taxes. Everyone wants less regulation. But if Ronald Reagan was such a big Libertarian, then why didn't he close our bases in Europe and cede Europe to the Russians? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian, then why did he declare war on drugs? If Ronald Reagan was such a Libertarian then why did he use tarrifs to protect American motorcycles from import competition? Why did he protect American corn and sugar with import tarrifs? Why did he stand up for restrictions on abortion? Why didn't he promote gay rights and gay marriage? Why did he do so many things that Libertarians declare to be fundamental rights? He doesn't sound much like a Libertarian to me! Nixon declared the war on drugs. The Reagan should have ended it, if he was such a big Libertarian. Why didn't he? How many times did he ask Congress to decrease funding for drug enforcement? How many times did he lobby Congress to close the DEA, ATF, INS or ICE? Because he was a progressive. Every POTUS since Eisenhower and JFK have been progressives. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:42:12 AM EDT
[#9]
This thread is a great example of people not knowing what conservative actually means and not being able to apply it to other nations.
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:47:32 AM EDT
[#10]
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:48:22 AM EDT
[#11]
What did Conservative mean to Hayak at the time?
Words are now just babble, and nothing means what it used to mean, what it will mean tomorrow, or what you pin your hopes,dreams,contracts, and constitutions to. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 10:59:22 AM EDT
[#12]
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Actually, that's the description of a leftist. a conservative will say that gov shouldn't have the power to overwhelm peoples' lives. Actually, it's the description of any form of government. Left, right both sides of the same coin. Both believe they are doing the correct thing by using the force of government to force their will on others who do not share their beliefs. The only kind of persona who thinks government shouldn't have the power to overwhelm peoples' lives would be, by definition, an anarchist, since any amount of government will equal intrusion to some extent. You're only "conservative" or "leftist" depending upon how and on whom you want the government to intrude. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:00:10 AM EDT
[#13]
Make counter accusations.
Be the first to accuse your enemies of doing what it is you are actually doing. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:05:40 AM EDT
[#14]
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Is this post another example of your brilliant critical thinking skills? You aren't a contemporary American conservative, because an Austrian guy (just 15 years after WWII) associated "conservatives" in HIS home country with Nazis. That's impressive. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So...In ARFland. Bill O'Rilely = good Friedrich Hayek = moron Is this post another example of your brilliant critical thinking skills? You aren't a contemporary American conservative, because an Austrian guy (just 15 years after WWII) associated "conservatives" in HIS home country with Nazis. That's impressive. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:14:05 AM EDT
[#15]
Austrian Conservative =/= USA Conservative.
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:24:14 AM EDT
[#16]
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Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So...In ARFland. Bill O'Rilely = good Friedrich Hayek = moron Is this post another example of your brilliant critical thinking skills? You aren't a contemporary American conservative, because an Austrian guy (just 15 years after WWII) associated "conservatives" in HIS home country with Nazis. That's impressive. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? Really? You started a thread called "Why I am not a conservative", posted an argument in favor of that position, never stated that you didn't agree with that position, and you're upset that people think you favor that position? 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:40:04 AM EDT
[#17]
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Really? You started a thread called "Why I am not a conservative", posted an argument in favor of that position, never stated that you didn't agree with that position, and you're upset that people think you favor that position? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Is this post another example of your brilliant critical thinking skills? You aren't a contemporary American conservative, because an Austrian guy (just 15 years after WWII) associated "conservatives" in HIS home country with Nazis. That's impressive. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? Really? You started a thread called "Why I am not a conservative", posted an argument in favor of that position, never stated that you didn't agree with that position, and you're upset that people think you favor that position? I posted the title of, and an excerpt from an essay. Similar to other posters who post the headline of an article and then an excerpt from the article. American conservatives are not Austrian conservatives just like American liberals arent European liberals. Non of that makes this sentence any less valid. ] Like the socialist, he is less concerned with the problem of how the powers of government should be limited than with that of who wields them; and, like the socialist, he regards himself as entitled to force the value he holds on other people. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:44:02 AM EDT
[#18]
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GD attacking Hayek. Can't say I'm surprised. You need to understand that Kayek being Austrian uses the terms "liberal" and "conservative" different than we do. How is pointing that out "attacking Hayek?"
The OP doesn't grasp that notion, hence the ridicule, as his knowledge of things political is as deep as the edge of a razor blade. 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:46:31 AM EDT
[#19]
F. A. Hayek was a brilliant man as others have pointed out the word Conservative in Europe had a different meaning at the time.
If someone said they had a gay time back then it in no way implied homosexuality. Read the “Road to Serfdom” it defiantly applies to current economics. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:49:33 AM EDT
[#20]
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Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So...In ARFland. Bill O'Rilely = good Friedrich Hayek = moron Is this post another example of your brilliant critical thinking skills? You aren't a contemporary American conservative, because an Austrian guy (just 15 years after WWII) associated "conservatives" in HIS home country with Nazis. That's impressive. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? YOU start a thread with the title,"Why I am not a Conservative." Except YOU did not use quotation marks. Quotation marks are very useful. And you are surprised that someone would think the YOU are saying what YOU said? You're joking, right? |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 11:50:31 AM EDT
[#21]
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F. A. Hayek was a brilliant man as others have pointed out the word Conservative in Europe had a different meaning at the time. If someone said they had a gay time back then it in no way implied homosexuality. Read the “Road to Serfdom” it defiantly applies to current economics. Most Serfs paid less to their leal lords then the average american. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 12:00:55 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is pointing that out "attacking Hayek?" The OP doesn't grasp that notion, hence the ridicule, as his knowledge of things political is as deep as the edge of a razor blade. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: GD attacking Hayek. Can't say I'm surprised. You need to understand that Kayek being Austrian uses the terms "liberal" and "conservative" different than we do. How is pointing that out "attacking Hayek?" The OP doesn't grasp that notion, hence the ridicule, as his knowledge of things political is as deep as the edge of a razor blade. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 12:01:32 PM EDT
[#23]
do you even political theory, bro?
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Posted: 7/7/2015 12:04:08 PM EDT
[#24]
The Hayek comments seem retarded but I find it best not to label myself politically least you be taken for granted like the Dems do the blacks and the GOP does the religious right. I won't be slaved to a particular party. Politicians should have to put in the work to gain your favor.
If there were no groups to pander to then perhaps a politician's true colors would come out sooner rather than after they are elected and it's too late.
Disclaimer: It's easier for me to do so because I live in a open primary state. Those that have to pick a side well before the primaries to be able to vote are in a different boat. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 12:06:13 PM EDT
[#25]
It's funny how people fight over words and labels that are ill defined. There are probably dozens of different variations of what being conservative means to people, and quite a few people that call themselves conservative do conform to Hayak's description of what being a conservative means. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 12:08:01 PM EDT
[#26]
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Wat?. I wasn't talking about those correctly pointing that out, I was speaking of those who think the text is referring to modern American Conservatives. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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GD attacking Hayek. Can't say I'm surprised. You need to understand that Kayek being Austrian uses the terms "liberal" and "conservative" different than we do. How is pointing that out "attacking Hayek?"
The OP doesn't grasp that notion, hence the ridicule, as his knowledge of things political is as deep as the edge of a razor blade. Me too--the OP. What is your beef with me then?
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Posted: 7/7/2015 1:24:28 PM EDT
[#27]
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I posted the title of, and an excerpt from an essay. Similar to other posters who post the headline of an article and then an excerpt from the article. American conservatives are not Austrian conservatives just like American liberals arent European liberals. Non of that makes this sentence any less valid. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Is this post another example of your brilliant critical thinking skills? You aren't a contemporary American conservative, because an Austrian guy (just 15 years after WWII) associated "conservatives" in HIS home country with Nazis. That's impressive. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? Looks to me like I only used the essay title as the thread title. You seem to be good at assigning meaning to others actions. Hows that mind reading thing working out for you? Really? You started a thread called "Why I am not a conservative", posted an argument in favor of that position, never stated that you didn't agree with that position, and you're upset that people think you favor that position? I posted the title of, and an excerpt from an essay. Similar to other posters who post the headline of an article and then an excerpt from the article. American conservatives are not Austrian conservatives just like American liberals arent European liberals. Non of that makes this sentence any less valid. ] Like the socialist, he is less concerned with the problem of how the powers of government should be limited than with that of who wields them; and, like the socialist, he regards himself as entitled to force the value he holds on other people. You posted a subjective piece about a personal belief, not a news report. Next time, make it clear that you don't agree with something if you don't agree with it... Considering that's he's referring to Austrian conservatives and not American conservatives, it certainly does make that sentence less valid if you're trying to apply it to American conservatives. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 1:38:46 PM EDT
[#28]
I don't think Hayek referred to either American or Austrian conservatives but to the British. Much of Hayek's postwar economic, social and political writing was based on his experiences in wartime Britain. That at least is the case with The Road to Serfdom.
But by all means, carry on with the derp. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 1:41:42 PM EDT
[#29]
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I don't think Hayek referred to either American or Austrian conservatives but to the British. Much of Hayek's postwar economic, social and political writing was based on his experiences in wartime Britain. That at least is the case with The Road to Serfdom. But by all means, carry on with the derp. Then he could be writing about British conservatives. The point is, American conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Continental conservatives, or even British ones. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 1:50:54 PM EDT
[#30]
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Then he could be writing about British conservatives. The point is, American conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Continental conservatives, or even British ones. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think Hayek referred to either American or Austrian conservatives but to the British. Much of Hayek's postwar economic, social and political writing was based on his experiences in wartime Britain. That at least is the case with The Road to Serfdom. But by all means, carry on with the derp. Then he could be writing about British conservatives. The point is, American conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Continental conservatives, or even British ones. I would go even further and claim that British conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Austrian conservatives. Conservatism is almost synonymous with particularism. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 1:53:48 PM EDT
[#31]
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I would go even further and claim that British conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Austrian conservatives. Conservatism is almost synonymous with particularism. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think Hayek referred to either American or Austrian conservatives but to the British. Much of Hayek's postwar economic, social and political writing was based on his experiences in wartime Britain. That at least is the case with The Road to Serfdom. But by all means, carry on with the derp. Then he could be writing about British conservatives. The point is, American conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Continental conservatives, or even British ones. I would go even further and claim that British conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Austrian conservatives. Conservatism is almost synonymous with particularism. The definition changes with each political system, and even within time frames--completely reversing itself on occasion. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 1:58:14 PM EDT
[#32]
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The definition changes with each political system, and even within time frames--completely reversing itself on occasion. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I don't think Hayek referred to either American or Austrian conservatives but to the British. Much of Hayek's postwar economic, social and political writing was based on his experiences in wartime Britain. That at least is the case with The Road to Serfdom. But by all means, carry on with the derp. Then he could be writing about British conservatives. The point is, American conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Continental conservatives, or even British ones. I would go even further and claim that British conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Austrian conservatives. Conservatism is almost synonymous with particularism. The definition changes with each political system, and even within time frames--completely reversing itself on occasion. The definition for identifying Conservatives doesn't change, but the beliefs and positions that Conservatives hold do. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 2:05:27 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The definition for identifying Conservatives doesn't change, but the beliefs and positions that Conservatives hold do. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I don't think Hayek referred to either American or Austrian conservatives but to the British. Much of Hayek's postwar economic, social and political writing was based on his experiences in wartime Britain. That at least is the case with The Road to Serfdom. But by all means, carry on with the derp. Then he could be writing about British conservatives. The point is, American conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Continental conservatives, or even British ones. I would go even further and claim that British conservatives do not hold the same beliefs as Austrian conservatives. Conservatism is almost synonymous with particularism. The definition changes with each political system, and even within time frames--completely reversing itself on occasion. The definition for identifying Conservatives doesn't change, but the beliefs and positions that Conservatives hold do. Agreed, conservatives across time and political systems are those who defend traditions within those societies. What traditions those conservatives defend tell you a lot about what kind of people they are or were. The old Southern Democrats were considered conservative and they defended some pretty horrible shit. Modern American conservatives (should) uphold and defend republicanism, the rule of law and individual liberty. These concepts are often considered "liberal" and certainly were when our country was founded. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 2:05:49 PM EDT
[#34]
OP is a liberal with a mental disorder.
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Posted: 7/7/2015 2:58:25 PM EDT
[#35]
How many people on this site call themselves conservatives yet believe
he is less concerned with the problem of how the powers of government should be limited than with that of who wields them; and, like the socialist, he regards himself as entitled to force the value he holds on other people. How many loved the Patriot act under Bush yet hate it under Obama? How many would be crying about NSA under McCain or Romney vs how many cry about it under Obama? This may not describe the definition of Conservative, but it describes a fuck load of people who define themselves as Conservatives. That is the point of this thread. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:02:12 PM EDT
[#36]
Everyone should read the whole passage from Hayek instead of judging the entirety of his point based on a four-sentence excerpt. The "Why I Am Not A Conservative" essay is only 10 pages long. For most, TL/DR I am sure, but for those interested in actually considering his point, you can find the full text HERE.
Enjoy. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:03:47 PM EDT
[#37]
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Actually, that's the description of a leftist. a conservative will say that gov shouldn't have the power to overwhelm peoples' lives. Actually, that's more of a Libertarian viewpoint. To be fair, some conservatives are all to happy to use the force of government to enforce their idea of morality. The left is obviously guilty as well. Of course, this article was also written from an entirely different viewpoint. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:05:21 PM EDT
[#38]
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Everyone should read the whole passage from Hayek instead of judging the entirety of his point based on a four-sentence excerpt. The "Why I Am Not A Conservative" essay is only 10 pages long. For most, TL/DR I am sure, but for those interested in actually considering his point, you can find the full text HERE. Enjoy. Nah brah, that fact that this is about an English swallow and not an American swallow totally negates the fact that the mentality he speaks of is pervasive in a lot of SELF DESCRIBED American Conservatives. Hayak is such a newb. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:05:37 PM EDT
[#39]
LOL, and liberals never want more government power
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:07:45 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
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Whew! For a second there I thought Selma wrote that. You had one job... http://i.imgur.com/go5rMi5.jpg 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:17:54 PM EDT
[#41]
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Nah brah, that fact that this is about an English swallow and not an American swallow totally negates the fact that the mentality he speaks of is pervasive in a lot of American Conservatives. Hayak is such a newb. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone should read the whole passage from Hayek instead of judging the entirety of his point based on a four-sentence excerpt. The "Why I Am Not A Conservative" essay is only 10 pages long. For most, TL/DR I am sure, but for those interested in actually considering his point, you can find the full text HERE. Enjoy. Nah brah, that fact that this is about an English swallow and not an American swallow totally negates the fact that the mentality he speaks of is pervasive in a lot of American Conservatives. Hayak is such a newb. You?-- Quoted:
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. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? <snip> It's funny watching you flail. 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:25:46 PM EDT
[#42]
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You?-- It's funny watching you flail. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone should read the whole passage from Hayek instead of judging the entirety of his point based on a four-sentence excerpt. The "Why I Am Not A Conservative" essay is only 10 pages long. For most, TL/DR I am sure, but for those interested in actually considering his point, you can find the full text HERE. Enjoy. Nah brah, that fact that this is about an English swallow and not an American swallow totally negates the fact that the mentality he speaks of is pervasive in a lot of American Conservatives. Hayak is such a newb. You?-- Quoted:
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. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? <snip> It's funny watching you flail. "But what he really meant was..." |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:36:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Op has conservative and crony capitalist confused.
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:39:22 PM EDT
[#44]
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LOL, and liberals never want more government power Today's liberals are liberal with other people's money. They're not "liberal", at all, they're authoritarians. Someone who wants more violence, force, and coercion can't be liberal. I guess they might be leftist authoritarians. But you'll find authoritarians on both the left and right. They believe in having lots of government, and for the most part they agree on a great many issues. They just don't agree on a few very contentious issues. As a libertarian my more conservative nature really doesn't play much of a role in my politics. I can work with a libertarian whose nature is much different than my own, because we both want substantially less government. It's only as you start to move towards the authoritarian end of the spectrum when personal or social nature starts to really matter. Because authoritarians want more government. They want to use the force and violence that is government to get things done. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:42:05 PM EDT
[#45]
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You?-- It's funny watching you flail. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone should read the whole passage from Hayek instead of judging the entirety of his point based on a four-sentence excerpt. The "Why I Am Not A Conservative" essay is only 10 pages long. For most, TL/DR I am sure, but for those interested in actually considering his point, you can find the full text HERE. Enjoy. Nah brah, that fact that this is about an English swallow and not an American swallow totally negates the fact that the mentality he speaks of is pervasive in a lot of SELF DESCRIBED American Conservatives. Hayak is such a newb. You?-- Quoted:
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. Where did I say I wasn't a conservative? <snip> It's funny watching you flail. I'll put in a caveat for those here who are unable to understand simple theory. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:43:43 PM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
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. <snip> But you'll find authoritarians on both the left and right. They believe in having lots of government, and for the most part they agree on a great many issues. They just don't agree on a few very contentious issues. <snip> How come you "libertarians" never list the various things "conservatives" (blech!, ptui!) want to use government to force on everyone else? You love to claim the commies and conservatives are "the same" but you NEVER list the ways, or otherwise back up your ridiculous assertion. Funny that.
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:49:29 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many people on this site call themselves conservatives yet believe How many loved the Patriot act under Bush yet hate it under Obama? How many would be crying about NSA under McCain or Romney vs how many cry about it under Obama? This may not describe the definition of Conservative, but it describes a fuck load of people who define themselves as Conservatives. That is the point of this thread. Quote HistoryQuoted:
How many people on this site call themselves conservatives yet believe he is less concerned with the problem of how the powers of government should be limited than with that of who wields them; and, like the socialist, he regards himself as entitled to force the value he holds on other people. How many loved the Patriot act under Bush yet hate it under Obama? How many would be crying about NSA under McCain or Romney vs how many cry about it under Obama? This may not describe the definition of Conservative, but it describes a fuck load of people who define themselves as Conservatives. That is the point of this thread. The point actually seems to be your undying love for the straw man. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:49:29 PM EDT
[#48]
Quoted:
exerp of an essay by Hayak In general, it can probably be said that the conservative does not object to coercion or arbitrary power so long as it is used for what he regards as the right purposes. He believes that if government is in the hands of decent men, it ought not to be too much restricted by rigid rules. Since he is essentially opportunist and lacks principles, his main hope must be that the wise and the good will rule - not merely by example, as we all must wish, but by authority given to them and enforced by them.[7] Like the socialist, he is less concerned with the problem of how the powers of government should be limited than with that of who wields them; and, like the socialist, he regards himself as entitled to force the value he holds on other people. essay here. I can't hot link from my iPotato lately. http://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/articles/hayek-why-i-am-not-conservative.pdf Sounds like he is applying objective descriptions to a subjective moniker "conservative" which doesn't really have much of a solid definition in the minds of most self-decribed "conservatives." If he is upset about authoritarian stances on people who describe themselves as "conservatives" then he really isn't necessarily describing conservatives is he. |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 3:51:59 PM EDT
[#49]
I agree, this is not the definition of a conservative. This is the definition of a Republican and/or Democrat. 
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Posted: 7/7/2015 4:06:22 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryMister_H will fap to that. |
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