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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:01:18 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If a person diddled with kids, they should be executed. That is a different discussion |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:07:06 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Finding of individually dangerous should be the standard. Otherwise they will just make everything a felony. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Even if the person had kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." things here, but if the person diddles with kids, still feel the same? Finding of individually dangerous should be the standard. Otherwise they will just make everything a felony. Which they've already done. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:09:23 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? What does a gun have to do with pedo's? Is it just the disgust for perverts that you hope wins people to your argument? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:09:55 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Another thread where the fonzies bend over backwards to state their support for gun control without having the balls to say they support gun control. Quote HistoryQuoted: Another thread where the fonzies bend over backwards to state their support for gun control without having the balls to say they support gun control. Should we remove ALL background checks from firearm purchases where people can just buy guns without even presenting ID? Quoted: Maybe there's a significant disconnect between crime and punishment in America that can't be fixed by banning people from doing things while not in prison. If you send someone to prison and they come out a worse person, you are either fucking people up in prison, or letting people out who should not be let out. The problem is that recidivism occurs not because of the programs offered in jail, but there a cultural and socio-economic behavior that jail/prison cannot override. I don’t have an issue with folks getting their rights restored of they turned their life around. I think a mandatory restoration period like staying out of trouble for x year(s) would be better option. Sort of a medium between what exists and what’s being proposed. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:11:31 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good, if they did their time and aren't violent then let them have it. Too many people getting caught up with stupid felonies over white collar crimes or casual drug use. you wanna do a "carve out" to exclude pedophiles from rights fine then do a carve out for those called pedophiles who were 18 yr olds with 16 yr old girlfriends... that'd be fair |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:12:48 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How can they discriminate against violent felons? Quote HistoryQuoted: How can they discriminate against violent felons? Did they? The Government offered no evidence demonstrating that a former non-violent convict forever forfeited his legal status as one of “the people” merely because he sustained a criminal conviction.11 Sure they say 'non-violent', but I have yet to see any evidence that draws a distinction for the type of criminal conviction that is historically based. For most of this countries history, no amount of permission was required to obtain or posses a weapon. It didn't even matter if you had a warrant for your arrest. You were either in custody, or not. So how can there be a bias towards a type of crime, that meets the historical burden? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:15:17 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should we remove ALL background checks from firearm purchases where people can just buy guns without even presenting ID? Yes. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:15:43 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good, if they did their time and aren't violent then let them have it. Too many people getting caught up with stupid felonies over white collar crimes or casual drug use. Does casual drug use mean accompanied with occasional crime, or occasional driving while impaired? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:16:35 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, if you define gun control as an absolute and limit it to a simple a “yes or no” topic, I suppose you’re right. Let’s try it out with a hypothetical… Should we remove ALL background checks from firearm purchases where people can just buy guns without even presenting ID? Yes. What now? What kind of woman do you think I am? We’ve already established that. Now we’re just haggling over the price. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:16:43 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? Such a person should never be out of prison......so try another hypothetical. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:17:44 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I mean, fuck pedophiles and all, but they should be executed or imprisoned, or they should have gun rights. So now they are armed to kill their victims? There is no cure for perverts. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:20:19 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The system needs revamped if your not safe in public with arms that means your not safe in public. Then the vast majority of criminals would be life sentences. Are you sure you want to pay for that? Here I thought you hated taxes, now you want to give the govt. a blank check. 
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:20:29 AM EDT
[#13]
Felonies have consequences beyond jail time. Just because a felon is released from prison, or done with parole, doesn't mean they immediately return to the same level of citizenship as those of us who haven't engaged in serious criminality. Should child molesters be able to avoid registration and other restrictions once their time is up?
Justice Barrett disagrees with felon gun prohibitions though in a pretty thoughtful dissent https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2020/10/amy-coney-barrett-on-guns |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:24:45 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well, if you define gun control as an absolute and limit it to a simple a “yes or no” topic, I suppose you’re right. Let’s try it out with a hypothetical… Should we remove ALL background checks from firearm purchases where people can just buy guns without even presenting ID? The problem is that recidivism occurs not because of the programs offered in jail, but there a cultural and socio-economic behavior that jail/prison cannot override. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Another thread where the fonzies bend over backwards to state their support for gun control without having the balls to say they support gun control. Well, if you define gun control as an absolute and limit it to a simple a “yes or no” topic, I suppose you’re right. Let’s try it out with a hypothetical… Should we remove ALL background checks from firearm purchases where people can just buy guns without even presenting ID? Quoted: Maybe there's a significant disconnect between crime and punishment in America that can't be fixed by banning people from doing things while not in prison. If you send someone to prison and they come out a worse person, you are either fucking people up in prison, or letting people out who should not be let out. The problem is that recidivism occurs not because of the programs offered in jail, but there a cultural and socio-economic behavior that jail/prison cannot override. Identity documents are very much a 20th century concept and implementation, no law that requires a historical connection beyond 100yrs could withstand such a requirement. They literally didn't exist back then. Buying guns should be akin to practically every other transaction, the only requirement being willing participants exchanging goods or services. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:24:50 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. What now? Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. What now? Good, so now that we have established you support removing ID requirements from gun sales and they are 100% unregulated…how do prevent active criminals , children, illegals, etc etc from purchasing guns? (Rhetorical) My point is/was that is a complicated issue with secondary and tertiary effects that make it impossible to reasonably look at it as a yes/no issue. Quoted: Identity documents are very much a 20th century concept and implementation, no law that requires a historical connection beyond 100yrs could withstand such a requirement. They literally didn't exist back then. Neither did seat belts. But in all sincerity my point was that many people would agree that presenting id to confirm age/citizenship is reasonable while technically a form of “gun-control” per definition. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:26:05 AM EDT
[#16]
We sure 2 of them meant what they marked? I mean good but, awkward.
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:27:40 AM EDT
[#17]
Article about rights commonly lost by felons
https://thelawdictionary.org/article/what-rights-do-convicted-felons-lose/#:~:text=In%20addition%20to%20not%20being,food%20stamps%2C%20among%20other%20benefits |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:28:31 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good, so now that we have established you support removing ID requirements from gun sales and they are 100% unregulated…how do prevent active criminals , children, illegals, etc etc from purchasing guns? (Rhetorical) My point is/was that is a complicated issue with secondary and tertiary effects that make it impossible to reasonably look at it as a yes/no issue. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Yes. What now? Good, so now that we have established you support removing ID requirements from gun sales and they are 100% unregulated…how do prevent active criminals , children, illegals, etc etc from purchasing guns? (Rhetorical) My point is/was that is a complicated issue with secondary and tertiary effects that make it impossible to reasonably look at it as a yes/no issue. They can clearly get them anyway What difference does it make? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:29:06 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Felonies have consequences beyond jail time. Just because a felon is released from prison, or done with parole, doesn't mean they immediately return to the same level of citizenship as those of us who haven't engaged in serious criminality. Should child molesters be able to avoid registration and other restrictions once their time is up? Justice Barrett disagrees with felon gun prohibitions though in a pretty thoughtful dissent https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2020/10/amy-coney-barrett-on-guns But should they be? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:29:28 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For every 1 person who committed non violent felony and straightens their life out, there are 10 who progress to more violent crime. It’s easy to think of the cherry picked “good guy” case but the reality is these “non-violent” felons progress in their criminal career. I personally disagree with this, but obviously ymmv. Yes but that is an easy standard to fix. Do all your time, and so many years after that you get your rights back if you dont get convicted again. Maryland has it pretty well thought out, for some misdemeanors you wait 3 years ( limited ones ) , some 5, some 10 and 15 years for felonies and then you can get it expunged. ( not everything is expungable ) You do something stupid when 19, get disqualified. You keep your nose clean for 10-15 years and you can get your rights back. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:31:20 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? Absolutely. If they are dangerous and are going to commit crimes with a gun they're going to have one anyway. Why give the government a tool to disarm decent people by railroading them with a felony conviction? I don't understand why people trust the government so much to allow them this power. You think everybody protesting at the capital deserves to lose their rights? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:32:43 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Felonies have consequences beyond jail time. Just because a felon is released from prison, or done with parole, doesn't mean they immediately return to the same level of citizenship as those of us who haven't engaged in serious criminality. Should child molesters be able to avoid registration and other restrictions once their time is up? Justice Barrett disagrees with felon gun prohibitions though in a pretty thoughtful dissent https://firearmslaw.duke.edu/2020/10/amy-coney-barrett-on-guns A- why do people think child rapists are "non-violent" B- why do we accept the notion that releasing child rapists is normal behavior. C- does the possibility exist that there are actual non-violent felonies that don't involve raping children. D- does the possibility exist that paroling actual non-violent felons could include a voluntary contract between the state and the felon that doesn't include annoying the crap out of the rest of us? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:34:29 AM EDT
[#23]
How about those that have misdemeanor convictions and are "prohibited persons" under Lautenberg?
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:35:30 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But should they be? Being a felon doesn't just "go away" because the felon is no longer jailed. Part of a felony conviction is an acknowledgment that the criminal has engaged in serious wrong doing and isn't on an equal footing with law abiding citizens. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:36:13 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes but that is an easy standard to fix. Do all your time, and so many years after that you get your rights back if you dont get convicted again. Maryland has it pretty well thought out, for some misdemeanors you wait 3 years ( limited ones ) , some 5, some 10 and 15 years for felonies and then you can get it expunged. ( not everything is expungable ) You do something stupid when 19, get disqualified. You keep your nose clean for 10-15 years and you can get your rights back. Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes but that is an easy standard to fix. Do all your time, and so many years after that you get your rights back if you dont get convicted again. Maryland has it pretty well thought out, for some misdemeanors you wait 3 years ( limited ones ) , some 5, some 10 and 15 years for felonies and then you can get it expunged. ( not everything is expungable ) You do something stupid when 19, get disqualified. You keep your nose clean for 10-15 years and you can get your rights back. Absolutely agree. To me the original premise is akin to the wave of decriminalizing things to lower crime rate rather then reduce the crime. In other words, rather then just remove the penalty, modify it so it actually works and has mechanisms like you suggested. Quoted: How about those that have misdemeanor convictions and are "prohibited persons" under Lautenberg? The notion of misdemeanor vs felony to me is semantical. It should just matter what the crime was, how long ago it was, and what the person has done since then. In my vision of a perfect world that is the three pronged approach to right restoration. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:39:12 AM EDT
[#26]
Why wouldn't they?
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:39:41 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes but that is an easy standard to fix. Do all your time, and so many years after that you get your rights back if you dont get convicted again. Maryland has it pretty well thought out, for some misdemeanors you wait 3 years ( limited ones ) , some 5, some 10 and 15 years for felonies and then you can get it expunged. ( not everything is expungable ) You do something stupid when 19, get disqualified. You keep your nose clean for 10-15 years and you can get your rights back. Pennsylvania (and other states) have the same lifting of restrictions and right to having your rights restored after a set period of time, in PA's case, 20 years. But the problem is not the availability of the process, it's the unlikelyhood of being able to actually succeed... For example, in PA, the board for rights restoration is chaired by the Vice-Governor, who has absolute authority to deny for any reason at all. Even if you did get to the board review, the process goes through the regular court system, and is stymied at every turn by the PSP and their dedicated team of attorneys who are vehement in their opposition to firearms rights restoration. So there is no automatic rights restoration after a set period of time. You must petition the courts and a review board (which doesn't want to do it in the best of circumstances) and you must have the financial resources to do so (typically 20 to 30k to see the process through), whether you are successful or not. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:42:28 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pennsylvania (and other states) have the same lifting of restrictions and right to having your rights restored after a set period of time, in PA's case, 20 years. But the problem is not the availability of the process, it's the unlikelyhood of being able to actually succeed... For example, in PA, the board for rights restoration is chaired by the Vice-Governor, who has absolute authority to deny for any reason at all. Even if you did get to the board review, the process goes through the regular court system, and is stymied at every turn by the PSP and their dedicated team of attorneys who are vehement in their opposition to firearms rights restoration. So there is no automatic rights restoration after a set period of time. You must petition the courts and a review board (which doesn't want to do it in the best of circumstances) and you must have the financial resources to do so (typically 20 to 30k to see the process through), whether you are successful or not. That’s dumb. If x amount of years have passed, petition court and if clean background check is presented since then, should be automatic. That’s def an issue if their stance on guns can impact likelihood of restoration. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:43:24 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's a lot of felon prohibitions beyond guns, sort of depending on state laws. Conviction of a felon involves more than not owning guns. Should a felon be able to apply for a police officer job? Should he get food stamps and live in public housing? Can he be a notary? Felons often can be on a jury. Being a felon doesn't just "go away" because the felon is no longer jailed. Part of a felony conviction is an acknowledgment that the criminal has engaged in serious wrong doing and isn't on an equal footing with law abiding citizens. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: But should they be? Being a felon doesn't just "go away" because the felon is no longer jailed. Part of a felony conviction is an acknowledgment that the criminal has engaged in serious wrong doing and isn't on an equal footing with law abiding citizens. Traditionally, criminals are pressed into military service to relieve them of their transgressions. 
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:47:48 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Then the vast majority of criminals would be life sentences. Are you sure you want to pay for that? Here I thought you hated taxes, now you want to give the govt. a blank check. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The system needs revamped if your not safe in public with arms that means your not safe in public. Then the vast majority of criminals would be life sentences. Are you sure you want to pay for that? Here I thought you hated taxes, now you want to give the govt. a blank check. I believe you missed my point I’m in no way saying all crimes should be a mandatory life sentences. Or that anyone who’s potentially going to reoffend ever should be held. How many people are currently locked up for things that are non violent yet we have people who have committed crimes which are violent in nature who are free to walk the streets after trivial sentences. Others we see who have not one but multiple violent crimes in there records who reoffend over and over. My point is we need to set down and reevaluate some of the sentencing as well as the after. What that looks like I don’t have a good answer but I don’t believe the current is working. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:48:58 AM EDT
[#31]
I love that they used the dude's nickname in the court case filing.
Shorty!!!!! His priors were vandalism, ex-felon with a gun, PCS, and 2 evading convictions. Now, the 9th calls these on non-violent. The gun charge is a wobbler on that and so is evading, considering deadly force can be used to stop the offense. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:51:58 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I love that they used the dude's nickname in the court case filing. Shorty!!!!! His priors were vandalism, ex-felon with a gun, PCS, and 2 evading convictions. Now, the 9th calls these on non-violent. The gun charge is a wobbler on that and so is evading, considering deadly force can be used to stop the offense. What cops can use deadly force for is about as meaningful as a an acorn. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 11:59:16 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? Yes. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:00:21 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? This here. About 85% of child porn users are also contact offenders. I would argue that child porn possession is a violent crime though since it involved the physical victimization of the child to produce, and the child is revictimized every time anyone views it. I have zero sympathy for pedophiles. They deserve no rights. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:00:27 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Article about rights commonly lost by felons https://thelawdictionary.org/article/what-rights-do-convicted-felons-lose/#:~:text=In%20addition%20to%20not%20being,food%20stamps%2C%20among%20other%20benefits https://perma.cc/9AUQ-9B8N Not seeing anything historical there, it appears to deal solely with modern interpretations. Have you found any evidence of a law keeping a firearms dealer, or even an individual, from providing a firearm to a felon? |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:02:04 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pennsylvania (and other states) have the same lifting of restrictions and right to having your rights restored after a set period of time, in PA's case, 20 years. But the problem is not the availability of the process, it's the unlikelyhood of being able to actually succeed... For example, in PA, the board for rights restoration is chaired by the Vice-Governor, who has absolute authority to deny for any reason at all. Even if you did get to the board review, the process goes through the regular court system, and is stymied at every turn by the PSP and their dedicated team of attorneys who are vehement in their opposition to firearms rights restoration. So there is no automatic rights restoration after a set period of time. You must petition the courts and a review board (which doesn't want to do it in the best of circumstances) and you must have the financial resources to do so (typically 20 to 30k to see the process through), whether you are successful or not. In maryland pardons are basically non existent, sure the process is there, but on average 5 are granted a year. The expungement process is pretty simple, wait until it can be expunged, file the paperwork and pay 35 bucks, then wait about 2 months. One thing they did that I like, is you cant get something expunged if something else is not expungable. Be it time or the charge it self, aka 20 year old charge would not be expungable if you had something that was expungable after 10 years but its only been 5. So if you keep getting in trouble, the older stuff cant be expunged. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:03:39 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: California has a list of misdemeanors that result in a 10-year ban on firearms ownership. Michigan prohibits you from owning guns if you use someone else’s ice fishing shanty So this ruling could potentially correct some of those abuses. Its worth celebrating Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: And the non violent felons of GD rejoiced! California has a list of misdemeanors that result in a 10-year ban on firearms ownership. Michigan prohibits you from owning guns if you use someone else’s ice fishing shanty So this ruling could potentially correct some of those abuses. Its worth celebrating Completely disagree. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:04:22 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Good, so now that we have established you support removing ID requirements from gun sales and they are 100% unregulated…how do prevent active criminals , children, illegals, etc etc from purchasing guns? (Rhetorical) My point is/was that is a complicated issue with secondary and tertiary effects that make it impossible to reasonably look at it as a yes/no issue. You don't. The nation managed to survive up until the 1968GCA, and all of the gun control attempts since then have pretty much failed to keep criminals unarmed. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:04:45 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? Yes. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:05:59 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: you wanna do a "carve out" to exclude pedophiles from rights fine then do a carve out for those called pedophiles who were 18 yr olds with 16 yr old girlfriends... that'd be fair Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Good, if they did their time and aren't violent then let them have it. Too many people getting caught up with stupid felonies over white collar crimes or casual drug use. you wanna do a "carve out" to exclude pedophiles from rights fine then do a carve out for those called pedophiles who were 18 yr olds with 16 yr old girlfriends... that'd be fair LOL. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:06:52 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I hope this makes it to the SC ASAP. I know multiple people who have been denied their rights for silly shit. One that got caught growing a single marijuana plant in college... etc. For a while drag racing was a felony in PA. Yes. I met someone that was denied gun rights over this stupidity. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:08:03 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @Chisum I believe you missed my point I’m in no way saying all crimes should be a mandatory life sentences. Or that anyone who’s potentially going to reoffend ever should be held. How many people are currently locked up for things that are non violent yet we have people who have committed crimes which are violent in nature who are free to walk the streets after trivial sentences. Others we see who have not one but multiple violent crimes in there records who reoffend over and over. My point is we need to set down and reevaluate some of the sentencing as well as the after. What that looks like I don’t have a good answer but I don’t believe the current is working. @Gunnie357 I understand your point but I see where this will end up. Most criminals start out small but if you look at their wrap sheet, they grow in boldness and violence. Over 80% of inmates are repeat offenders. Judges and juries are going to give longer sentences if they perceive a slap on the wrist and all is forgiven doesn't work. I know a guy in my church who's entire family were criminals and did time. One got sent back twice and is now still there. he is a classic example of why criminals need to earn their rights back. As for the guy in my church, it took Christ to really set him free. He now works for my son. On the side he works with a prison ministry. I would trust him now that is been 12 years. It would have been truly tragic for his son. He was back in prison within a year both times. His daughter cleaned herself up and got her kids back. She got out 3 years ago and in another 9 years we will see how it goes. With some of the people she hangs with it will go well. Dad has heard the jive talk and act before so is the first one who says wait and see what she does not what she says. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:14:47 PM EDT
[#43]
One town in NJ wanted to make it a felony to leave your trash can on the street for too long.
Imagine losing your gun rights for somethin like this. When everything is a crime |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:14:52 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I should've worded it differently. Physical molestation is and always had been violent in referring to the mingling/possession/distribution of kiddie porn. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Even if the person had kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." things here, but if the person diddles with kids, still feel the same? Do you think diddling kids is considered "non-violent?" I should've worded it differently. Physical molestation is and always had been violent in referring to the mingling/possession/distribution of kiddie porn. No gun rights in jail or prison. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:16:10 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For a while drag racing was a felony in PA. Yes. I met someone that was denied gun rights over this stupidity. Exactly people always want to talk about pedophiles and armed robbers while forgetting our government labels countless seemingly minor or low-level crime felonies. Blame them for the problem maybe if they had kept a felony to be a very serious crime and not something that some people will accidentally commit people wouldn't be so concerned about felons being disenfranchised. Amazing how many people don't trust the government but want to give them the power to remove all your rights for life. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:17:22 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @Gunnie357 I understand your point but I see where this will end up. Most criminals start out small but if you look at their wrap sheet, they grow in boldness and violence. Over 80% of inmates are repeat offenders. Judges and juries are going to give longer sentences if they perceive a slap on the wrist and all is forgiven doesn't work. I know a guy in my church who's entire family were criminals and did time. One got sent back twice and is now still there. he is a classic example of why criminals need to earn their rights back. As for the guy in my church, it took Christ to really set him free. He now works for my son. On the side he works with a prison ministry. I would trust him now that is been 12 years. It would have been truly tragic for his son. He was back in prison within a year both times. His daughter cleaned herself up and got her kids back. She got out 3 years ago and in another 9 years we will see how it goes. With some of the people she hangs with it will go well. Dad has heard the jive talk and act before so is the first one who says wait and see what she does not what she says. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: @Chisum I believe you missed my point I’m in no way saying all crimes should be a mandatory life sentences. Or that anyone who’s potentially going to reoffend ever should be held. How many people are currently locked up for things that are non violent yet we have people who have committed crimes which are violent in nature who are free to walk the streets after trivial sentences. Others we see who have not one but multiple violent crimes in there records who reoffend over and over. My point is we need to set down and reevaluate some of the sentencing as well as the after. What that looks like I don’t have a good answer but I don’t believe the current is working. @Gunnie357 I understand your point but I see where this will end up. Most criminals start out small but if you look at their wrap sheet, they grow in boldness and violence. Over 80% of inmates are repeat offenders. Judges and juries are going to give longer sentences if they perceive a slap on the wrist and all is forgiven doesn't work. I know a guy in my church who's entire family were criminals and did time. One got sent back twice and is now still there. he is a classic example of why criminals need to earn their rights back. As for the guy in my church, it took Christ to really set him free. He now works for my son. On the side he works with a prison ministry. I would trust him now that is been 12 years. It would have been truly tragic for his son. He was back in prison within a year both times. His daughter cleaned herself up and got her kids back. She got out 3 years ago and in another 9 years we will see how it goes. With some of the people she hangs with it will go well. Dad has heard the jive talk and act before so is the first one who says wait and see what she does not what she says. The above I think reiterates my point precisely. There is no one stop solution blanket that works across the board. There’s also some crimes that people probably shouldn’t get to commit and then walk free in society. You also can’t let a guy out and expect him to have zero options and not go back to the old life. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:19:27 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In maryland pardons are basically non existent, sure the process is there, but on average 5 are granted a year. The expungement process is pretty simple, wait until it can be expunged, file the paperwork and pay 35 bucks, then wait about 2 months. One thing they did that I like, is you cant get something expunged if something else is not expungable. Be it time or the charge it self, aka 20 year old charge would not be expungable if you had something that was expungable after 10 years but its only been 5. So if you keep getting in trouble, the older stuff cant be expunged. In PA, the process in not expungement at all. The original offense is still on the record, but your firearms rights are simply restored via the restoration process. Now if you did commit any other crime (other than a summary violation) in the time between the disqualifying event and the start of the expungement process, you might as well not start the process at all, as the Common Courts (first stage of process) would deny the application in the first place. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:25:09 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even if the person has/distributes kiddie porn? I always hear the "they did their time..." still feel the same? Sure, they can own a gun. After they're chemically castrated. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:49:06 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How about those that have misdemeanor convictions and are "prohibited persons" under Lautenberg? Friend had a shouting match with a drunk ex, he pushed her out of his doorway. Cops arrested him for DV, ex did not want charges. DA pushed anyway. In 1990 it happened. Guy has never been arrested, drugs, etc since, but cannot buy guns. Seems the DV charge is worse than a felon. |
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Posted: 5/10/2024 12:53:40 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Friend had a shouting match with a drunk ex, he pushed her out of his doorway. Cops arrested him for DV, ex did not want charges. DA pushed anyway. In 1990 it happened. Guy has never been arrested, drugs, etc since, but cannot buy guns. Seems the DV charge is worse than a felon. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: How about those that have misdemeanor convictions and are "prohibited persons" under Lautenberg? Friend had a shouting match with a drunk ex, he pushed her out of his doorway. Cops arrested him for DV, ex did not want charges. DA pushed anyway. In 1990 it happened. Guy has never been arrested, drugs, etc since, but cannot buy guns. Seems the DV charge is worse than a felon. Application of Lautenberg for convictions that preceded its passage is ex post facto. We all know this, but feels trump constitutionality in clown world. |
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