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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:01:06 PM EDT
[#1]
Chicago Electric didn't fool you?
 Kharn |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:10:31 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted: Have y'all noticed that places that sell cheap tools, principally Harbor Freight and Wal Mart (to a much lesser degree) trying to up their prices by creating lines of name brand tools? How did you make it through all of 1995 without noticing this? |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:23:36 PM EDT
[#3]
I doubt they will be as good as the Powr Kraft tools my Dad gave me in 1981 he got from Montgomery Wards. Surprisingly good for a store brand. I did buy some VERY low end tool sets from Harbor Freight recently to keep in my truck, and they are junk. Good enough to assemble a ladder tree stand, but I'd hate to depend on it for an auto repair.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:27:38 PM EDT
[#4]
Harbor Freight is jumping on that hardcore right now.
ICON tool boxes that are near direct copies of Sanp-on with some improvements. 
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:31:18 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Harbor Freight is jumping on that hardcore right now. ICON tool boxes that are near direct copies of Sanp-on with some improvements. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIoZw67XUAM0JYv.jpg They do look like copy's , I'll have to try some out |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:35:19 PM EDT
[#6]
They are following the same plan major tool companies follow if they want to cover the entire market, entry tier, hobby tier, and professional tier. Some companies acquire other brands along the way, Harbor Freight is developing them internally.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:35:29 PM EDT
[#7]
I hear the Vulcan welders at Harbor Fright are pretty decent. But their lack of coupons keeps me out. And those prices on ICON ...
 . Actually the increase in prices at HF has made it easier for me to justify German, Czech, and USA tools lately.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:36:14 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Harbor Freight is jumping on that hardcore right now. ICON tool boxes that are near direct copies of Sanp-on with some improvements. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIoZw67XUAM0JYv.jpg That's the nicest looking Harbor Freight I've ever seen. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:39:04 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Harbor Freight is jumping on that hardcore right now. ICON tool boxes that are near direct copies of Sanp-on with some improvements. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIoZw67XUAM0JYv.jpg They hired one of Snap-on's design guys to work on that tool box line. He took a whole bunch of inside information with him. They took the overall look and scaled it back to better fit in a homeowner's garage. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:40:52 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's the nicest looking Harbor Freight I've ever seen. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:45:29 PM EDT
[#11]
I think the last things I bought at a Harbor Freight was a tarp and some ratchet straps. They all come from china anyways these days.
I haven't bought any tools from there since I was a broke-ass teen. I'd much rather buy quality used tools. The store will forever be associated with cheap chinesium garbage. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:45:50 PM EDT
[#12]
I used to buy their "one time use tools" when it was for something specific that I would only use once and was otherwise expensive, ie a pulley puller.
Prices have gone up and I am not longer dirt poor. So I go for quality instead Also screw china |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:47:13 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's the nicest looking Harbor Freight I've ever seen. Yeah, mine is full of barely literate people who smell bad. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:49:16 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yeah, mine is full of barely literate people who smell bad. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That's the nicest looking Harbor Freight I've ever seen. Yeah, mine is full of barely literate people who smell bad. I'm surprised you can smell them over the smell of outgassing chinese plastic and rubber. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 1:52:58 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They hired one of Snap-on's design guys to work on that tool box line. He took a whole bunch of inside information with him. They took the overall look and scaled it back to better fit in a homeowner's garage. Got a source for any of that? Not exactly a lot of super secret trade secrets for a toolbox. A lot faster and cheaper to just buy one and reverse engineer it anyways |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:08:27 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How did you make it through all of 1995 without noticing this? Because they didn't do that in 1995. Heck, I ordered from HF back in the late 80s when they were still just mail order. The introduction of Warrior, Bauer, etc. has come within the last 5 years. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:08:54 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They are following the same plan major tool companies follow if they want to cover the entire market, entry tier, hobby tier, and professional tier. Some companies acquire other brands along the way, Harbor Freight is developing them internally. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/374309/Tool_Brands_jpg-1858674.JPG That's a great chart and surprised me the first time I saw it. Very good reference. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:14:07 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They do look like copy's , I'll have to try some out Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Harbor Freight is jumping on that hardcore right now. ICON tool boxes that are near direct copies of Sanp-on with some improvements. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EIoZw67XUAM0JYv.jpg They do look like copy's , I'll have to try some out Iirc they are made on MATCO lines as per GJ |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:20:10 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Iirc they are made on MATCO lines as per GJ Have lots of tools all different brands, you only notice the fit and finish difference if you use them a lot |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:36:05 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Got a source for any of that? Not exactly a lot of super secret trade secrets for a toolbox. A lot faster and cheaper to just buy one and reverse engineer it anyways PM me an I'll send you his LinkedIn profile. Yes, you can reverse engineer the basic design, but you don't have all the R&D behind it, or the customer focus group testing, or the hours of discussions regarding marketing and new product design. They even stole the Icon brand before Snap-on could release it. You also don't have contacts with the various powder paint, aluminum extrusion, drawer slides, and caster suppliers. Even the suppliers that didn't get supplier contracts with Snap-on have a lot of inside knowledge regarding paint formulations, and other design information. Feel free to do some research on Snap-on plant locations, I may know some guys that work in the Iowa plant. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:36:12 PM EDT
[#21]
I don't go into HF too often, but I went in recently.
I've got about 4 of the "Apache" (pelican knock off) pistol cases, and one of the rifle cases. They have at least doubled in price since I got mine. I about choked. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:43:21 PM EDT
[#22]
I'll buy Harbor Freight for that tool that I will use once every three or four years or maybe a couple of times in my lifetime.
Anything I use frequently I look elsewhere. However, having said that I bought their large vibrator cleaner for cleaning reloaded brass and it has worked for tens of thousands of rounds. After 15 years it is still working fine. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:45:44 PM EDT
[#23]
Yep.
I used to go to HF all of the time. Now I rarely go there. They can keep their stuff at today's prices. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 2:56:41 PM EDT
[#24]
THE RISE OF HARBOR FREIGHT!
CAN THEY SHAKE OFF THEIR SHIT TIER IMAGE AND BECOME AS ACCEPTED AS THE BIG BOX BRANDS? (I bet it falls flat, and someone else that knows their place drives them out of business) |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:11:04 PM EDT
[#25]
The problem isn't necessarily the Harbor Freight kind of tools, it's when you pick up a Craftsman or a Stanley wrench and realize is a piece of shit, then you're trying to figure out what sucks the least for your budget.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:16:01 PM EDT
[#26]
I got one of their toolboxes this year to set up my gun room. It's leaps and bounds above the Husky stuff I have and much cheaper than snap on. I like them so much I'll be buying a ton more to redo my garage.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:17:43 PM EDT
[#27]
I dont get harbor freights plan, they are making multiple expensive cordless lines that cost almost as much as the name brand, with a crap warranty.
I got to harbor freight for cheap, not expensive. I will buy a 30 dollar circular saw to fry it sawing up a deck, or a couple 15 dollar grinders to not have to change discs. I aint buying a fancier version for 3x as much. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:18:39 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They do look like copy's , I'll have to try some out I very rarely go into HF, but last time I was at the local store they hade a few of these ICON boxes there, and I am man enough to admit I was pretty impressed with what I saw and felt. The heavier drawers are build with 4 slides. I pulled a drawer out and sat on it. Seriously for the price they are really nice boxes... and you have to understand as a former mechanic how hard that is for me to admit. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:19:52 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I used to buy their "one time use tools" when it was for something specific that I would only use once and was otherwise expensive, ie a pulley puller. Prices have gone up and I am not longer dirt poor. So I go for quality instead Also screw china A good portion of their "high-end" power tools are actually made in Taiwan and supporting Taiwan is a good thing. If you need a tool, at least check HF and see if the tool you want is made in Taiwan and help out a country that hates mainland China and the CCP. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:20:40 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The problem isn't necessarily the Harbor Freight kind of tools, it's when you pick up a Craftsman or a Stanley wrench and realize is a piece of shit, then you're trying to figure out what sucks the least for your budget. Customer expectations rule the tool industry. If you go cheap and buy crap you do not expect much out of it. You might buy three ratchets over 10 years, but if you buy them for 1/4 the cost of premium brands your still money ahead. Craftsman had the homeowner/hobbyist market cornered until they no longer gave the customer what they expected. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:21:30 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They hired one of Snap-on's design guys to work on that tool box line. He took a whole bunch of inside information with him. They took the overall look and scaled it back to better fit in a homeowner's garage. OK that makes sense, these are not just cheaper, they are like a Snap-On improved, so the guy had a few ideas while he was working for Snap-On that he never got to try. I was shocked when I started messing around with them at the store. Price for large roll cab is $2400, Sanp-on..LOL... the "I like you" price from the tool guy is over 12 grand. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:22:44 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The problem isn't necessarily the Harbor Freight kind of tools, it's when you pick up a Craftsman or a Stanley wrench and realize is a piece of shit, then you're trying to figure out what sucks the least for your budget. I have had significantly better luck out of the HF Pro line of hand tools than I have out of modern Craftsman or Stanley. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:23:10 PM EDT
[#33]
Marketing: how does it work?
 Speed |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:23:36 PM EDT
[#34]
My Harbor Freight toolbox is much better quality than anything you get at Lowes or Home Depot.
I've seen the price of their equipment go up in price the last few years though. Sadly Harbor Freight is one of the only places to go for specialty tools you might need for a job. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:26:52 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I very rarely go into HF, but last time I was at the local store they hade a few of these ICON boxes there, and I am man enough to admit I was pretty impressed with what I saw and felt. The heavier drawers are build with 4 slides. I pulled a drawer out and sat on it. Seriously for the price they are really nice boxes... and you have to understand as a former mechanic how hard that is form me to admit. 1 of 3  
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:27:17 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My Harbor Freight toolbox is much better quality than anything you get at Lowes or Home Depot. I've seen the price of their equipment go up in price the last few years though. Sadly Harbor Freight is one of the only places to go for specialty tools you might need for a job. I have two of their toolboxes, the big 44in chest and the heavy duty toolcart with drawers. Both of them are excellent for the money. Going strong on about 3yrs now. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:29:04 PM EDT
[#37]
I purchased the $159 five drawer tool cart a few years ago and it is every bit the product that the $800-1200 name brand counterparts are. The only change I made was adding two additional swivel casters so that I can maneuver it around easier in my somewhat cramped garage.
 Attached File NEW!! U.S. General SERIES 2 30" Tool Cart -vs- BLUE POINT (HARBOR FREIGHT -vs- SNAP-ON) I've also had very good luck with anything named ICON. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:30:21 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOnly 3, rookie numbers! Old school KRL series will last you a lifetime. 
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:35:04 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They are following the same plan major tool companies follow if they want to cover the entire market, entry tier, hobby tier, and professional tier. Some companies acquire other brands along the way, Harbor Freight is developing them internally. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/374309/Tool_Brands_jpg-1858674.JPG Hart (Walmart brand) is owned by the same company that owns Milwaukee, Rigid, Ryobi and Makita...TTI |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:36:54 PM EDT
[#40]
Everyone does it. Nothing new. Even the low end stores have a better brand, and some of the good HF stuff is actually really good nowadays. And as pointed out above, Hart is just another rung in a ladder of well known consumer tools.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:44:11 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have had significantly better luck out of the HF Pro line of hand tools than I have out of modern Craftsman or Stanley. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The problem isn't necessarily the Harbor Freight kind of tools, it's when you pick up a Craftsman or a Stanley wrench and realize is a piece of shit, then you're trying to figure out what sucks the least for your budget. I have had significantly better luck out of the HF Pro line of hand tools than I have out of modern Craftsman or Stanley. I have 30 year old crapsman sockets and what not. Use HF wratchets with them. The composite ones and others and they are so much better than the old sloppy crapsmans. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:45:21 PM EDT
[#42]
I like it. I don't always need somthing that is 10/10 for quality. But sometimes i do.
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:53:01 PM EDT
[#43]
There's a saying out there, "If you are gonna need a tool for monkeyfucking around with, you're only gonna pay 'monkeyfucking' prices for it. After all, are you willing to break your nice tools?"
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Posted: 3/9/2021 3:58:25 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's a saying out there, "If you are gonna need a tool for monkeyfucking around with, you're only gonna pay 'monkeyfucking' prices for it. After all, are you willing to break your nice tools?" Snap on guy, you were not prying something with this screwdriver? Me, no, I was just unscrewing a screw
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Posted: 3/9/2021 4:04:17 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My Harbor Freight toolbox is much better quality than anything you get at Lowes or Home Depot. I've seen the price of their equipment go up in price the last few years though. Sadly Harbor Freight is one of the only places to go for specialty tools you might need for a job. Ehh maybe not. Needed to pull the arm off the steering box on my 01 dodge drive to work junker. The HF puller for that broke. So I had to napa that puller and it worked just fine. You can end up purchasing things twice just to get one simple job done. Ohh I am as guilty as anyone trying to get by cheap and I have my share of HF junk. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 4:13:58 PM EDT
[#46]
On a related note, many Chinese companies have tried to copy the grip color (like on pliers) of US companies in order to fool buyers into thinking they were buying a quality known brand.
Many US companies have registered their colors and will sue and win if anyone even comes close to their colors. Yes some hand tool companies "own" certain colors. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 4:19:49 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont get harbor freights plan, they are making multiple expensive cordless lines that cost almost as much as the name brand, with a crap warranty. I got to harbor freight for cheap, not expensive. I will buy a 30 dollar circular saw to fry it sawing up a deck, or a couple 15 dollar grinders to not have to change discs. I aint buying a fancier version for 3x as much. That's something I'm trying to reconcile as well. They are really screwing the pooch with their marketing IMO when they don't clearly delineate what brand is supposed to be better. When should I buy this "Bauer" brand vs. "Hercules"? It's completely confusing. Also agree on your other points. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 4:24:08 PM EDT
[#48]
I will say this much: Even NAME BRAND tools aren't a shoo-in. For a lot of tools on the market, one manufacturer may be completely superior to another. You buy DeWalt impact driver because you think it's good but the Milwaukee will be much better even though they cost about the same. Or a Makita may end up being much better than Bosch. I used those as a hypothetical example, so please no hate mail from DeWaly or Bosch fanbois. Unfortunately, you're kind of locked in to one brand when it comes to cordless tools on account of the battery. For accessories, it's even more of a crapshoot. I watch ProjectFarm on Youtube for a bunch of reviews on grinding discs, screwdriver bits, saw blades, etc. etc. - very eye-opening. I suggest y'all do too...
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Posted: 3/9/2021 4:26:21 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A good portion of their "high-end" power tools are actually made in Taiwan and supporting Taiwan is a good thing. If you need a tool, at least check HF and see if the tool you want is made in Taiwan and help out a country that hates mainland China and the CCP. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I used to buy their "one time use tools" when it was for something specific that I would only use once and was otherwise expensive, ie a pulley puller. Prices have gone up and I am not longer dirt poor. So I go for quality instead Also screw china A good portion of their "high-end" power tools are actually made in Taiwan and supporting Taiwan is a good thing. If you need a tool, at least check HF and see if the tool you want is made in Taiwan and help out a country that hates mainland China and the CCP. I always grab the made in Taiwan tools over the made in China stuff. |
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Posted: 3/9/2021 4:26:29 PM EDT
[#50]
Their stuff is fast becoming on par with the major brand name stuff. I’m a progressional mechanic by trade and have been buying up the ICON stuff just to beat it up to see what it’ll do. I like the fact that I’m not a slave to the Snap on truck and my drawers are full. That’s not to say that I don’t own snap on. I just have been slowly getting away from them.
The whole three inside brands thing is confusing however. They’d be smarter to have one house brand. |
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