Originally Posted By Geralt55:


I'm going to pause the gamefilm here. If this was just a mere curiosity, this detail wouldn't have ruined your evening. It wouldn't be an "unfortunate" update. It would be matter of fact.
This whole scenario has far more of your emotional investment than you're admitting to yourself



I'm going to hit pause here, and again point out: This letter isn't a mere curiosity thing, you have a version of events you want deep down.

I'm also going to point out:



"Might ONLY have a boyfriend."
Here's how this reads to me ^

"Well if she isn't married and just has a boyfriend, I can work my way in, first under the guise of speaking out of curiosity, then I work on her, then I hope she drops him, and names me #1 Quarterback."

That's how it reads.
Let me tell you something - early on in a relationship I once saw some shit like this.
Someone who had known her a long time "suddenly" decided he needed to tell her something
And it was important, and he couldn't just tell her like, in a text or over the phone.

I knew what that was.
and (due to the social circles he knew her from) they ran into eachother, and yep he he confessed to feelings for her, while I was with her.

I'm a more of a goofyball "huggy" type- but let me tell you, THAT pissed me off.
If I wasn't, a "nice" guy deep down, something like this ^ can absolutely get a "Caveman"-logic response for what really is a caveman logic problem.
"Guy believes he loves her, it's an attraction/chemical thing, and he wants the title belt you're holding, and wants versions of events that would get him what he wants."

Said simply: Upon finding out something like this ^ There are men who would handle that in physical way, or have friends do it for him. For better or worse.
Whether that's right or not, "Adult" or not, "civilized" or not, it's playing with fire.
Love triangles are dangerous and people do crazy things.
The space-diaper incident comes to mind.


I'm sorry for pressing on the "wound", but seeing this, you need some spiritual medicine, harsh stuff, to feel better.

Why is it killing you? Because you're "just" curious?
No. You were not, "just curious."

And the emotional attachment you had to this scenario was not in a healthy balance vs what was ACTUALLY happening in the real world, vs the hope you had in your head.
You have to drop this, this whole line of thinking, the tactics used, the excuses you used to gaslight yourself into staying here - because it's ripping you apart.

It's NOT good for you.

https://media2.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExMTE3b3Y5MGE3dnhwdzlxdWlmbHByY29ibzFrbWZxYmtnazh1cGE2YyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/5qFQfXEc27SIMwrako/giphy.gif

If there's one thing I feel sure about on this, it's that this ^ whole thing is holding you back in life, and is tearing you up, and you need to see that and digest it, and move past it.
No one is perfect, people make mistakes, but staying in the mistake-zone is a choice.




Yes it is!


That's not true.
That might be how it's written, but that's not what you want, deep down, that's not what you wanted.

This ^ is what I mean about you lying to yourself. That's what it looks like to me.



Go re-read your own words above, go re-read your own words below, someone doesn't feel gutted, to find out their "old friend" got married - they're excited for them, they're happy for them, it doesn't ruin their life.
There's a word for this, saying you want A when B was your desire,
Deception.




And this would accomplish what exactly?



I think one of the roughest things about life, is that the world can see our blindspots when we can't. It knows things about us we don't know about ourselves.

Unless I'm mis-remembering (And it's been a rough sleepless few months for me so my apologies if my memory is off),
- You and her haven't spoken in 30 years.
- You last spoke and interacted in the "puppy-love" age bracket where cooties are still kind of a thing.
- She's been married twice.
- She's married, RIGHT NOW
- You don't speak to her regularly, or have a functioning relationship with her.
- You posted photos of her from social media, onto a public forum, without her knowledge and consent over it, Jesus Christ

Dude she's more likely to try to get a restraining order or hide behind her husband, than she is to make you "just friends" and install you in some sort of #1 contender male friend role.  (which appears to sound like what you want).

I'm really sorry for being "mean", but I'm doing this because we care about you to some degree, and this is not right.
I've tried softer words, I don't think it took.

This whole situation, and your REAL desires and motivations, are holding you back.




The reality is, you were never in like a real adult relationship with girl 1. Never were. I'm sorry for the harsh medicine, but we are at that point now.

It's totally rationale, for a single man, not in a relationship, to be curious about a relationship with a nice lady (in this case, girl 2)
He's not supposed to hold that "ghost of the relationship that never happened" in the attic
It's bad luck that girl 2 was taken - but also it's not good that you were THAT emotionally invested in a woman who had a damn husband.

You knew her so well, that you didn't know she was totally offmarket?
Is it healthy, to be that far invested, it someone you do not know?

No, no no.




No.
Sending a semi-deceptive message (what's in it, is what you're hoping flies under the radar, but you have feelings for a woman you do not know as an adult, who you haven't spoken to in decades, who is married - and you have it SO bad you want to talk to her) is kinda selfish.

If you want to talk to her as just friends, okay, do that, in a few years after you've worked on yourself, dropped this whole thing, and that's the ACTUAL Truth.

She moved on with her life, and you need to move on with your life. That's what I think here.
You're not going to accomplish anything other than attempting to scratch an itch you have, that you can and should ignore, because you are ripping yourself apart over it.



Pause. I'm really sorry, more harsh medicine but...
1) You never "lost her" except for maybe, the first time. Maybe the first one counts, you guys liked eachother, she moved away, I get that.

.............But there were no 3 other times. Fuckin stop it.
And again, "I'm just an old friiiend, I'm just an old friiiennd, I just wanna talk". Go re-read the above.
No you don't.

What if he's a member here? Her HUSBAND. What if he's a member here, and a letter shows up out of the blue from some dude who had to look her up on the web to find it.
Say he's read allll of your posts. And he reads that ^
"Omg I lost her 4 times"
And a letter rolls in, "ohhh don't worrrryyy, I'm just friiiiends"

No. No that's not what this is.

2) You guys had feelings, as 11 year olds.
That's puppy love age. People grow out of that in some cases.
I understand feeling maybe some attachment, but this ^ All this above, all these things that are going on, it's too far. It's just too far.



You. Were not. In a relationship with her, as an adult.
You did not "lose" her, because you were not with her, you did not have "her"

You are obsessed in an unhealthy way, that's tearing you up.

Look you're an adult, you can make your decisions, but by no means does this scenario sound like one where any sort of letter is going to just "fix" things in any real way.

I'm sorry man, but you need to cope with this whole situation and move on from this, without sending a letter that would only get your hopes up.
I sincerely doubt it's so good that it's so persuasive that it would do anything other than cause a lot of trouble.

Originally Posted By Geralt55:


I'm going to pause the gamefilm here. If this was just a mere curiosity, this detail wouldn't have ruined your evening. It wouldn't be an "unfortunate" update. It would be matter of fact.
This whole scenario has far more of your emotional investment than you're admitting to yourself



I'm going to hit pause here, and again point out: This letter isn't a mere curiosity thing, you have a version of events you want deep down.

I'm also going to point out:



"Might ONLY have a boyfriend."
Here's how this reads to me ^

"Well if she isn't married and just has a boyfriend, I can work my way in, first under the guise of speaking out of curiosity, then I work on her, then I hope she drops him, and names me #1 Quarterback."

That's how it reads.
Let me tell you something - early on in a relationship I once saw some shit like this.
Someone who had known her a long time "suddenly" decided he needed to tell her something
And it was important, and he couldn't just tell her like, in a text or over the phone.

I knew what that was.
and (due to the social circles he knew her from) they ran into eachother, and yep he he confessed to feelings for her, while I was with her.

I'm a more of a goofyball "huggy" type- but let me tell you, THAT pissed me off.
If I wasn't, a "nice" guy deep down, something like this ^ can absolutely get a "Caveman"-logic response for what really is a caveman logic problem.
"Guy believes he loves her, it's an attraction/chemical thing, and he wants the title belt you're holding, and wants versions of events that would get him what he wants."

Said simply: Upon finding out something like this ^ There are men who would handle that in physical way, or have friends do it for him. For better or worse.
Whether that's right or not, "Adult" or not, "civilized" or not, it's playing with fire.
Love triangles are dangerous and people do crazy things.
The space-diaper incident comes to mind.


I'm sorry for pressing on the "wound", but seeing this, you need some spiritual medicine, harsh stuff, to feel better.

Why is it killing you? Because you're "just" curious?
No. You were not, "just curious."

And the emotional attachment you had to this scenario was not in a healthy balance vs what was ACTUALLY happening in the real world, vs the hope you had in your head.
You have to drop this, this whole line of thinking, the tactics used, the excuses you used to gaslight yourself into staying here - because it's ripping you apart.

It's NOT good for you.

https://media2.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExMTE3b3Y5MGE3dnhwdzlxdWlmbHByY29ibzFrbWZxYmtnazh1cGE2YyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/5qFQfXEc27SIMwrako/giphy.gif

If there's one thing I feel sure about on this, it's that this ^ whole thing is holding you back in life, and is tearing you up, and you need to see that and digest it, and move past it.
No one is perfect, people make mistakes, but staying in the mistake-zone is a choice.




Yes it is!


That's not true.
That might be how it's written, but that's not what you want, deep down, that's not what you wanted.

This ^ is what I mean about you lying to yourself. That's what it looks like to me.



Go re-read your own words above, go re-read your own words below, someone doesn't feel gutted, to find out their "old friend" got married - they're excited for them, they're happy for them, it doesn't ruin their life.
There's a word for this, saying you want A when B was your desire,
Deception.




And this would accomplish what exactly?



I think one of the roughest things about life, is that the world can see our blindspots when we can't. It knows things about us we don't know about ourselves.

Unless I'm mis-remembering (And it's been a rough sleepless few months for me so my apologies if my memory is off),
- You and her haven't spoken in 30 years.
- You last spoke and interacted in the "puppy-love" age bracket where cooties are still kind of a thing.
- She's been married twice.
- She's married, RIGHT NOW
- You don't speak to her regularly, or have a functioning relationship with her.
- You posted photos of her from social media, onto a public forum, without her knowledge and consent over it, Jesus Christ

Dude she's more likely to try to get a restraining order or hide behind her husband, than she is to make you "just friends" and install you in some sort of #1 contender male friend role.  (which appears to sound like what you want).

I'm really sorry for being "mean", but I'm doing this because we care about you to some degree, and this is not right.
I've tried softer words, I don't think it took.

This whole situation, and your REAL desires and motivations, are holding you back.




The reality is, you were never in like a real adult relationship with girl 1. Never were. I'm sorry for the harsh medicine, but we are at that point now.

It's totally rationale, for a single man, not in a relationship, to be curious about a relationship with a nice lady (in this case, girl 2)
He's not supposed to hold that "ghost of the relationship that never happened" in the attic
It's bad luck that girl 2 was taken - but also it's not good that you were THAT emotionally invested in a woman who had a damn husband.

You knew her so well, that you didn't know she was totally offmarket?
Is it healthy, to be that far invested, it someone you do not know?

No, no no.




No.
Sending a semi-deceptive message (what's in it, is what you're hoping flies under the radar, but you have feelings for a woman you do not know as an adult, who you haven't spoken to in decades, who is married - and you have it SO bad you want to talk to her) is kinda selfish.

If you want to talk to her as just friends, okay, do that, in a few years after you've worked on yourself, dropped this whole thing, and that's the ACTUAL Truth.

She moved on with her life, and you need to move on with your life. That's what I think here.
You're not going to accomplish anything other than attempting to scratch an itch you have, that you can and should ignore, because you are ripping yourself apart over it.



Pause. I'm really sorry, more harsh medicine but...
1) You never "lost her" except for maybe, the first time. Maybe the first one counts, you guys liked eachother, she moved away, I get that.

.............But there were no 3 other times. Fuckin stop it.
And again, "I'm just an old friiiend, I'm just an old friiiennd, I just wanna talk". Go re-read the above.
No you don't.

What if he's a member here? Her HUSBAND. What if he's a member here, and a letter shows up out of the blue from some dude who had to look her up on the web to find it.
Say he's read allll of your posts. And he reads that ^
"Omg I lost her 4 times"
And a letter rolls in, "ohhh don't worrrryyy, I'm just friiiiends"

No. No that's not what this is.

2) You guys had feelings, as 11 year olds.
That's puppy love age. People grow out of that in some cases.
I understand feeling maybe some attachment, but this ^ All this above, all these things that are going on, it's too far. It's just too far.



You. Were not. In a relationship with her, as an adult.
You did not "lose" her, because you were not with her, you did not have "her"

You are obsessed in an unhealthy way, that's tearing you up.

Look you're an adult, you can make your decisions, but by no means does this scenario sound like one where any sort of letter is going to just "fix" things in any real way.

I'm sorry man, but you need to cope with this whole situation and move on from this, without sending a letter that would only get your hopes up.
I sincerely doubt it's so good that it's so persuasive that it would do anything other than cause a lot of trouble.

Originally Posted By Walkure:


Indeed.

Additionally, I would highly suggest looking up YouTube videos on the subject of limerence.

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:

Cliff, you gotta listen to this man. To be honest I was kind of the same way with Gena back then. We did become friends and she was starting to like me, but we never dated. As I said before "I dealt with it in an unhealthy way." One my buddies told me once "dude, you're addicted to the meth you haven't even smoked" and he was right. I know it takes a long time to get over it, but I eventually did. Sure, there's still some residuals, but I accepted it is never going to happen. And really, if you don't, you'll never be emotionally available to fall for someone else. I know I've been telling you "it sounds like a good idea" but your last post is rather quite revealing. I'm gonna have to agree with Geralt on pretty much all his points.

ETA: And even if I did see her again, and we reconnected, I know it would be a bad idea to even attempt to get romantically involved. I don't need a repeat of that.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:


I can't respond directly to all of that... But man, you're right.

My feelings are contradicting a lot of what I've said and I need to let this go. I know I completely missed my chance to be with her

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:


I'm taking his advise seriously, as harsh as it is he's 100% right.

I just need to drop it.

Originally Posted By Geralt55:
Life's not always about this. "chances" and the like. Perhaps it's going the way it's meant to go - what if you were meant to, as part of your journey, snap out of this.
Learn some self love, move on, fix your physical ailments, talk to someone, and re-emerge a better version, and into a life you could have only dreamed of.
What if that's the case?

But you have to leave behind 1 or 2 bad ideas to get there.
It's a choice you have to make.

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:

You're a good dude, I hope you know that. At least you seem like one with everything you've said in this thread. Like Geralt already said, gotta work on yourself. I chose to do that after my previous flings. They actually helped me realize I was happier single, because if I'm not with the right person what's the point? I know I still have some work to do but I've come a long way in the last few years. I'm certainly not the spaz anymore that people have known me to be.

You're gonna do fine, you have the ability to see and admit to yourself what is going on, even if someone else has to point it out. It's good that you're listening.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:



I do like to think I'm going through all this for a reason. I believe it's a hard lesson teaching me that I have to figure out how to let go without burying feelings and memories. The catch for me is that I believe I never got back in touch with Nicole back when it was really a possibility because of my anxiety I developed starting around the time I last saw her. In a big way I feel like me deciding against making contact with her now with this message is me letting the anxiety win another round... I want to let it go, but I don't want the anxiety to beat me yet again.

Originally Posted By Geralt55:


I'll just be honest, taking the 10,000ft view, this last part above, and SOME of the rationale, IMHO is part of you trying to manufacture reasons to keep the feelings alive and keep the letter too.




it's upsetting, but the part of you you're cutting off, is the toxic part that isn't serving you.





But oddly enough, the problem with your life is that you are trying to live your present by doing over the past - you need to accept that it happened. You do not need a letter to do that.
It happened. It cannot be undone, there is no time machine.

Chance is a thing in life,  it can be wonderful, it can be terrible, we all get a taste of it.
And that's okay.





I've heard this from Scott Adams - there's facts, there's logic, and those 2 things dictate outcomes. But then there's persuasion, and persuasion is what we believe.
The God's honest truth is that just about everyone arrives to a gut-level conclusion, and wraps facts and rationales around it afterward.

I tried to tell you no, just guy to guy - and you wrapped other evidence around the "I should send it" conclusion
In this case, the letter to the second woman:



I'm going to press a wound here: Was it successful past making her smile? Is she with you right now?
You and I have different ideas of success.

There's a lot of reasons that, after soul-searching you should mull over online dating, it's because you need to SEE other women out there in the wild, to allow yourself to be open to the idea of dating one.
The single biggest reason, IMHO, that you would not do it, as because you didn't want to move on.

Just my opinion, just calling it like I see it.
At least that moment, you were not wanting to hear it man


And that's coming through, when you offered for me to read it, this is 100% ^ what I knew that meant.
"But if I say it right-"

No. No man, it doesn't, friggin matter, how "good" it is. The problem is: The whole scenario.



IMHO this is why you were holding on, a secret desire for this ^
"Whoa what if she really liked me all this time and ditches her husband and my life gets redone with me in the Captain's Chair and I got my girl?"
That's why I started shaking you






Stop right there.
It's not like you built a Saturn V rocket. You could have 100% burned that thing and not sent it, no matter how much time you spent in it.

I have old journals from my early 20s, I ended up pulling some of the pages out cackling about how I could have ever put that crap on paper. Pages and pages.
But I don't, hate myself over it? I was just 23 when I put them down. That's all.
I also don't think "My God it took like 3 hours to write some of this I-I just can't... It has to stay in there, cringe and all"

No? You live you learn, you make mistakes, you grow as a person, life goes on.



I'm going to offer another opinion from the outside.
You don't want to.
You're not ready to delete it.

No, you let the feelings out, you felt them, okay - but you ultimately know, this is a toxic lane of thought.
All we can do in life, is make the best decisions at the time we can make them, with the information we have. The end.

"Okay, it's just not smart to send this stealth-love letter to this twice married woman I haven't talked to in 30 years and never dated." is a rational decision to make.



"I'm not ready to let go"
You can and should.



"Because I'm trying to keep the door open to me creating another reason to not give up on this."




I have to cut open the wound and press out more puss here.
It was 30 years ago.
You never dated her, not as an adult.
You don't know her favorite color, or her favorite movie, or band - you don't know what kind of car she likes to drive -

What feelings? Based on what?
I get it, she made you smile when you guys were young - it felt nice, I got you.
That doesn't justify the letter campaign and how much emotional bandwidth this whole thing has taken up.



Here's a challenge: Why?
What value is it?
What did it do other than hold you back from living life in the present?

"I got my feelings out" - okay, okay I hear that.
They're out.
Delete the letter.  



IMHO, I think one of the problems here, is that you digitally remastered them in Ultra-HD quality into a bigger version than the original work.



"I want to hold on to it."

https://media1.tenor.com/m/4cy0jbmQUlcAAAAC/lord-of-the-rings-cast-it.gif

Stuck why, because what?
Because what bad happens if you delete it?

Here's the real because: Because you're closing off the toxic part that needs to go, and the toxic part wants to stay.



(*Never dated as adults, never spoke to her as an adult, she is twice married*)



Because you don't want to let go yet, despite the reasons.



Hopefully yes to some degree, this is ripping you apart.
I'm going to borrow a Thomas Sowell quote he used when talking about getting rid of a leftie policy,

"When they ask me what to replace ____________ with I think to myself,
that's like asking what to replace a house fire with.
You don't replace a house fire, you put it out."



No, the healed and evolved version of you will look back on this with some embarrassment, and would say,
"Ahhhh ya know, I remember losing the game that day, I don't need to see the play by play in every single detail, including that injury in the 2nd Quarter."



"I haven't figured out the reason to keep the letter and try to revamp letter-idea version 3"





I believe it



That is up to you. Only you can shred the letter and accept it never was.



And this is why I'm so fuckin mad about the whole, "Welll I'm just reaching out as a friend and closure an-"
No. No that's a lie. Because of the above part in red.
It's more than that.




I deleted my just started Facebook account that I was using to see Nicole's abandoned account. I guess that's a start... But I did it more because people were friend requesting me and I don't handle stuff like that very well. My mom will be sad that I deleted the account though.

I think in the short term this is wise - consider, in a year, after some self work, starting another one, maybe if it's just to make your Ma smile.

Just trying to digest all this... Again it's a lot and it's very difficult to respond to it all point by point. But you have fully convinced me that I need to delete the message. It's going to be real emotional kick to the groin to do it though, I'm not going to lie about that.


Things I know for a fact and can't argue:

1# I don't know Nicole anymore, she may or may not resemble the girl I knew as a kid. I'm in love with an idea of who she might be that's heavily influenced by the way I remember her.

2# She has moved on with her life since we were kids. That is more than obvious.

3# There's a possibility that if she read my message that it could influence her life in a negative way. And I don't want that for her sake or mine.

4# I'm happy for her if she's happy with her life as it is now. She may or may not be, I don't get to know this.

5# I need to work on myself (anxiety being the biggest underlying issue) and holding on to all this is preventing anything from happening there. I have it all out in the open now and I'll never forget. It's no longer buried like it was in a way that's detrimental to me.

6# I'm not in any position to handle any kind of relationship, not even just having a girl as a friend and especially not a girlfriend... I more than likely will never get there, so I have to let go of the idea that I ever will.

Originally Posted By ButterBacon:
Jumping into this real late but it’s safe to say that your feelings have almost nothing to do with her. She’s just the object you need to project this fantasy on, about what could have been in some other life, with a different version of you.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:
Just trying to digest all this... Again it's a lot and it's very difficult to respond to it all point by point.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:


I'm not sure, I've tried my hand at being on social media a couple of times now. I had an Instagram account from 2019 to 2022 and I absolutely hated it. I started up a Facebook account for a very short time (maybe in 2020), possibly around the time Nicole got married for the second time just to check to see if she had anything on her account about it,

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:


Yeah, I'm not sure what I see exactly as successful when it came to my message to Rachel

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:

You may not be in a position to handle a relationship right now, but you have to get the idea out of your head that you never will be. I know from where you're standing it looks like an insurmountable task, I've been there myself. There was a time I thought to myself and seriously believed "I guess life just doesn't have that in store for me." If you keep believing that, it will become a self-manifesting prophecy.

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:
You may not be in a position to handle a relationship right now, but you have to get the idea out of your head that you never will be. I know from where you're standing it looks like an insurmountable task, I've been there myself. There was a time I thought to myself and seriously believed "I guess life just doesn't have that in store for me." If you keep believing that, it will become a self-manifesting prophecy. Just because you can't see yourself with someone at this time, doesn't mean it is hopeless. Honestly, I can't really visualize myself with anybody right now. But that's because I don't know anyone, I don't have any leads. Hence why I'm trying online dating again (that's how I met the other girls I briefly dated). I don't know when it will happen, but I do believe it will.

Originally Posted By Geralt55:
What's interesting is, your physical issues and your anxiety are quite possibly linked (and often time they are)
Fixing one will likely help the other, and vice versa, a snowball effect in a good way

Originally Posted By Geralt55:
I won't harp on it but, man, this ^ is why the "Well this is just a curiosity letter sent out of friendship" thing isn't the truth. Oh no.

Originally Posted By Geralt55:
My guess?
-See attractive lady, get to like her
-"Shoot your shot"
-It made her smile, felt validated by that

I think that means you're guilty of the great awful crime of being human on that part

My point about pressing on that spot was to say: There are limits to "confessional letter" as a tactic in terms of what ANYONE can accomplish with them, generally speaking.

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:

Exactly what you're doing. I used to do the same thing about Gena. "If only I hadn't judged her when she was open with me." "If only I hadn't freaked out and tried so hard to win her back." "If only I hadn't called her, drunk as fuck, that one night." "If only I'd just left her alone after I gave her the letter."

All completely useless to think about. Because I did do all those things, and nothing will ever change that. I fucked up. Believe me, I know it's hard NOT to think about those things. You gotta catch yourself when you're doing it and set yourself straight. Look yourself in the mirror and tell yourself to cut it out, what's done is done. And at this point it doesn't matter.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:



And highlighted in blue is exactly how I feel at this current moment, though it's also how I've felt throughout the last 20/25 years of my life up to this point. Honestly that thought is so ingrained in me that I don't get too depressed about it thinking about it. But otherwise I try to keep an open mind about the possibility (though it seems much more like wishful thinking) that I'll just meet someone out of nowhere. That's a rare thing in today world (super rare IMO), but I'm open to that idea. I have no idea idea why with as unlikely as it is?

On the other side of things I know I couldn't handle a relationship right now even if it fell in my lap... That's not even all due to my anxiety and lack of confidence. The reason lies elsewhere and without revealing too much to avoid further embarrassment I'll just say I can't support it. It's not a possibility in the cards I have. That's why I can't at this time put myself out there through online dating. Could it be possible in the future? Possibly, but by the time I imagine that enough change might have happened in my life I'll be too old by that point.





I understand that, though I'm not sure how quickly I really get emotionally invested. I know looks alone are enough for getting most guys attention, but as I've mentioned in this thread before I have to get a good idea of a girls personality first. Yes looks are important to but it's secondary in the list of what's important to me. I may have gotten a little bit emotionally invested in the idea of Rachel before I knew much about her, she was very good looking, but as I saw her interacting with her horses for a few years I knew she had a quiet and gentle type of personality. She was a very calm type of person and that was obvious. That had my attention and I knew I wanted to know her better. Then I found out she was married and I gave up on the idea, but I still wanted to complement her with the letter I gave her and say goodbye. Nicole was a bit of a subconscious influence on that because I never got to say goodbye to her... So again. I have no idea how quickly I'd become emotionally invested. Nicole was really only one I was ever that invested in, but I got to know her for years to get to that point. Sure she was a kid then, I'm sure she's changed a bit since then. Maybe even a lot.

I'll say the limerence thing was interesting... It doesn't fit perfectly for me, but a lot of it does. Nicole (as she is now) may or may not fit the idea I have of her in my head that was influenced by how she was as a kid. That's some limerence stuff. But I'll never get to find out.





And that's kinda what I was trying to do for the longest time, I was trying to do things that made me happy (don't drink kids ). And sure they were little things, but it kept me going for a while. As I've aged and worked, you eventually start to wonder why you keep doing it, what's the purpose, I kinda broke down over that thought a couple times over the last few years (especially around this time last year). But just keeping yourself going alone in your own existence without anyone to share it with is just... I don't even know how to put it into words, but it makes you not want to wake up in the morning. I've had suicidal thoughts since I was a 15 year old kid and I'm still holding on.

I try to keep myself open to the idea that someone could come along that would change that way of thinking in me and give me more reason to keep going. I've probably been more open to it recently than I ever have because the little things are meaning less and less.

No I'm not currently suicidal. It usually comes on with work (depending on what kind of work it is) for me.





I'm hopeful for you with Jamie though... I know you actually have to meet her, there's just no other way to form any real idea about her unless you do (same for her about you). As we've discussed that's my biggest hang up about dating sites. I'd just hate dragging myself along based on a short description and some pictures and long drawn out text conversations only to finally meet up and realize within 20 minutes (probably in the first 5) that it was all a complete waste of time. Then on to the next possible complete waste of time.

I know that's how people do it in today's world, but there's just got to be a better system... I don't just don't have it in me to put myself through it at this current point in my life. I greatly prefer the idea of "randomly met" guided by the hand of God or the forces of the universe over the dating sites. But I also sorta believe in things happening for a reason and some greater power guiding things around, so I'm a little biased.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:


100% right. Can't go back. But if someone starts selling ride tickets on a time machine I'm buying a seat.

I do find it odd that most of my thoughts are of the past. I'm not sure if I've always been that way though, it might be a more recent development (within the last few years). But maybe the future is just too unimaginable for me at this current stage of life.

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:
Bold #1: I was at that point too. Seemed like wishful thinking. You have to remind yourself "she'll find me some day." Say it outloud to yourself as you're falling asleep, even if you don't believe it. It will take a long time, but if you keep repeating it eventually you'll start to believe it.

Originally Posted By CastleBravo91:

We all do it, brother. Everyone. It's in our nature.

Originally Posted By ButterBacon:


The secret to social skills is really just taking a healthy interest in other people. Be present and really pay attention to what they’re saying and their body language. Try to figure out why they’re saying whatever and what they’re trying to get out the interaction.

People who are loners naturally get lost in their own head. When they talk to people they don’t really pay attention to them and instead are just trying to think of what to say, and it becomes obvious they aren’t listening. That’s a rapport killer.

Of course, this might be kind of hard at first, but it’s something to practice and be mindful of when you interact with others.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:

That makes sense. The letter writing is my tool of choice (and yes it's currently the only tool I have), the thing I like about it is it's a very low risk option, I don't have to be on top of my game thinking up things to say on the spot to someone in person. It's a heavily edited version of me, but what's written out is still my own thoughts. I don't have to be there when they read it is another thing I like.

Originally Posted By 556Cliff:



I think you're not wrong there, that's were my feelings are. The message doesn't fully reveal it, but it's just under the surface