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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:35:05 PM EDT
[#1]
Sun rises in the west, sets in the east. What do I win?
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:35:22 PM EDT
[#2]
Well first you face north, then real suttle like you turn left. That’s west.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:35:23 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Had to look up "magnetic deviation"... "East is least and west is best." (Old navigator's mnemonic for remembering whether you add or subtract).  |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:36:04 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Works just fine if you have the maps cached ahead of time. Don't need a cell signal for your phone to give you a GPS-based position. Do you and most people you know keep maps cached? The answer to the first night be yes, but not for the second. For the 99% of people that don't even know what map caching is, phone based navigation doesn't work without a data signal. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:36:05 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: People call phone based navigation GPS, you know this. Phone based navigation doesn't work without a data signal. Most of it wouldn't work for sure, the parts that need the internet, which is 99.99% of everything. However I think a lot of phones have gps receivers in them. With the right app and presuming you already had coordinates, I wager its not impossible to use a grid down phone as a hiking type gps. Also I think for a while you could have actually download road maps to your device, though I'm not sure things work that way any more. I do have one of these in my car. Not so hot for in town but great for the country. https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/575993 |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:36:29 PM EDT
[#6]
I gots Injun blood in me. I can find my way to any liquor store.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:38:14 PM EDT
[#7]
Yes.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:38:23 PM EDT
[#8]
I know my way around Tenino
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:38:44 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If google maps goes down in downtown Nashville I wont grab a lensatic compass and a topo map  You're not going to pace count your way between blocks?
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:39:33 PM EDT
[#10]
I once was lost, but then I was found. Navigated ships from Seattle to dang near the diamedes, land wise, map or not, I can figure out which way to go by sense of direction. It is like a sixth sense, but I don't see dead people unless I shoot them.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:40:01 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Well first you face north, then real suttle like you turn left. That’s west. Subtle |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:41:00 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Do you and most people you know keep maps cached? The answer to the first night be yes, but not for the second. For the 99% of people that don't even know what map caching is, phone based navigation doesn't work without a data signal. Depends on your goal, where you are, where you're trying to go. If you're frequently using your phone for navigation (I rarely do), you probably have at least some high level maps on your phone at any given time for your area. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:42:22 PM EDT
[#13]
Not very well. Over many years of solo hiking, I've been "turned around" enough times that I actually looked forward to
it and took it as a challenge. At this stage, I no longer bushwhack in places I've not been before. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:43:10 PM EDT
[#14]
Well, I'm a geologist and field mapping is basically taking a blank topo map and drawing the geologic features on to them. So yes I can shoot an azimuth, triangulate a location from features on a map, determine elevation.
I'm well versed in the use of a Brunton pocket transit.  Get this book  And learn to use your hand like a sextant in ways that porn has never shown you. ETA: It's called magnetic declination, and on a Brunton you adjust for it with the brass screw on the side. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:43:25 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "East is least and west is best." (Old navigator's mnemonic for remembering whether you add or subtract). Can Dead Men Vote Twice At Elections True Virgins Make Dull Companions At Weddings |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:43:31 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted: How to “shoot an azimuth” , identify terrain features on a map and in the real world. Identify 2 or more major features in person plot them on a map and triangulate your position? Do you know how to adjust for magnetic deviation and know your personal pace to distance count If not why not? Do you own a legit lensatic compass? The recent Nashville events should have people rethinking tactics when if comms go down. You can’t rely on GPS to find your way. Yes, I can nav quite well. Even in the dark, without a light or NVGs when I'm in a treeline. For anyone who is interested, APC or your local orienteering club is a great place to learn. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:44:04 PM EDT
[#17]
I don't get how someone can't know the basics of this.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:45:49 PM EDT
[#18]
I do, but the AT&T situation unscores the need for an offline map app, not just basic manual navigation (which is still good to know.)
Which is what I have loaded on my phone and car's head unit. You could blow up the entire internet and all the GPS ground stations along with it and the satellites in the system would still work, with decaying usability, for a couple weeks. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:46:17 PM EDT
[#19]
What is the terrain thing you speak of. While it is flatter in Kansas we have a lack of terrain.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:46:42 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get how someone can't know the basics of this. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:47:41 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted: How to “shoot an azimuth” , identify terrain features on a map and in the real world. Identify 2 or more major features in person plot them on a map and triangulate your position? Do you know how to adjust for magnetic deviation and know your personal pace to distance count If not why not? Do you own a legit lensatic compass? The recent Nashville events should have people rethinking tactics when if comms go down. You can’t rely on GPS to find your way. Hey officer I'm shitfaced. Just take me to jail. I don't want to stand on one foot right now. I'm sleepy. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:48:03 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I grew up before GPS, so yes to all. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:48:10 PM EDT
[#23]
For about a year and a half, when I was a kid at Ft. Riley, my Scout Master was a Ranger, my ASM was a green beenie, both rotated back from 'Nam.
Ever try doing land nav in Kansas? In january? Yes sir, I earned my orienteering badge. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:48:16 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I used to work for a land surveyor and have a brunton pocket transit. I can find my way around okay without a GPS. But... I live where you can see mountains, so you'd have to be a really, really stupid person to actually get lost here. in the swamp where you can't see more than 50' in front of you? That's another story. You can't take bearings if you can't see landmarks. Also, get a copy of "The Essential Wilderness Navigator". Very good, easy to understand book on map and compass navigation. See that's a bit harder here on the gulf coast plains. Got to figure out sunrise, sunset, time of year, and you can get your cardinal directions based on that. Unless it's night time and you know the time of year, then it's easy. Unless it's cloudy out. Or you can just follow a creek or river and see if you can match it to a known segment on a map... if the meanders haven't changed in the latest flood. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:49:11 PM EDT
[#25]
I've done air and sea navigation.
Studied land nav but never applied it. I do have a very good compass in my bag. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:49:50 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was thoroughly trained in land navigation by a second lieutenant.   |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:50:58 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted: How to “shoot an azimuth” , identify terrain features on a map and in the real world. Identify 2 or more major features in person plot them on a map and triangulate your position? Do you know how to adjust for magnetic deviation and know your personal pace to distance count If not why not? Do you own a legit lensatic compass? The recent Nashville events should have people rethinking tactics when if comms go down. You can’t rely on GPS to find your way. No. Just today my 47 year old ass was driving to a gunsmith in BFE thinking, "How did I get by before gps?" |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:50:59 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was thoroughly trained in land navigation by a second lieutenant. So you are hopelessly lost? |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:52:23 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't get how someone can't know the basics of this. Most people grow up in the city or suburbs and never step off the pavement unless it's a city park or school field. They can live their entire life like that. I'd bet most people have no idea what direction north is even when they know where they are at. And topo maps. Forget about it. 95% of the population hasn't ever heard the term. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:53:15 PM EDT
[#30]
I've found my way across multiple states with nothing more than a compass and no maps. This was before GPS and traffic was at a complete standstill... I said "fuck it, I need to go east". Made it in basically the same time I would have normally.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:54:16 PM EDT
[#31]
Pilotage and dead reckoning
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:55:39 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No. Just today my 47 year old ass was driving to a gunsmith in BFE thinking, "How did I get by before gps?" Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: How to “shoot an azimuth” , identify terrain features on a map and in the real world. Identify 2 or more major features in person plot them on a map and triangulate your position? Do you know how to adjust for magnetic deviation and know your personal pace to distance count If not why not? Do you own a legit lensatic compass? The recent Nashville events should have people rethinking tactics when if comms go down. You can’t rely on GPS to find your way. No. Just today my 47 year old ass was driving to a gunsmith in BFE thinking, "How did I get by before gps?" Mapquest
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:58:13 PM EDT
[#33]
I cannot even use a compass to stay on a degree but I have never really been lost in the woods. Well there was one time when I was in the middle of nowhere way up in Canada and my hunting buddy said which way back to camp. Internally I was thinking fuck if I know as I was thinking he was paying attention. So I looked around and said that way. He said NOPE, if you go that way you are headed to the north pole.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 9:58:41 PM EDT
[#34]
Three minute rule
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:02:57 PM EDT
[#35]
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:03:25 PM EDT
[#36]
Thomas Brothers! But yes, was pretty familiar with map and compass skill, plenty of navigating into and out of ports, channels, etc., didn't keep up with celestial. Not sure where my Silva compass is. I tend to study or preplan trips so have spent some time on various maps before we go someplace. Don't like depending on some of the map services for driving. I've seen some odd results while it was trying to get us to the "easiest" routes or via numbered roads, etc.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:07:59 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: People call phone based navigation GPS, you know this. Phone based navigation doesn't work without a data signal. Depends on the phone and program you're using. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:09:52 PM EDT
[#38]
I'm surprised I don't get lost in my own yard.
Thanks for reminding me to update my offline maps. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:13:55 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was thoroughly trained in land navigation by a second lieutenant. Can’t spell lost without LT For the record I was a 2LT.. after I was enlisted and topped out at SSG. And learned and used mounted and dismounted land nav in the 1980-90s |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:14:08 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most people have never needed to know basic land nav because most people are never out of cell coverage for Google maps, nor have ever been more than a couple of miles from some type of road. Well that is just a sad life to have lived. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:15:31 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: People call phone based navigation GPS, you know this. Phone based navigation doesn't work without a data signal. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Did he blow up a satellite? People call phone based navigation GPS, you know this. Phone based navigation doesn't work without a data signal. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:15:45 PM EDT
[#42]
A little
Have a old compass from the Boy Scouts
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:16:44 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most people grow up in the city or suburbs and never step off the pavement unless it's a city park or school field. They can live their entire life like that. I'd bet most people have no idea what direction north is even when they know where they are at. And topo maps. Forget about it. 95% of the population hasn't ever heard the term. I grew up in the city and suburbs. From the stories I hear, I can out-nav 90% of the kids in basic without trying. But I did grow up before GPS, and I do make a point of getting out in the boonies. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:17:09 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I was thoroughly trained in land navigation by a second lieutenant.  |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:20:35 PM EDT
[#45]
Even Red Nuns have Odd Black Cans
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:23:13 PM EDT
[#46]
I was on the Army and I’m a highly experienced archaeologist. I can do all of that in daylight. I was never good at landnav at night b
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:27:28 PM EDT
[#47]
Basic 11B bro.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:28:31 PM EDT
[#48]
Yes. Even still have my Land Nav MCI circa 1992.
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:32:50 PM EDT
[#49]
I made it through night land nav at Benning without getting stuck in that ravine full of barbed wire. Does that count? No Ranger beads, but we found every waypoint sign.
We used creative methods to make up time. Until we got caught. |
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Posted: 12/30/2020 10:32:51 PM EDT
[#50]
I have a lensatic compass, it's packed away in one of twenty different boxes of Boy Scout shit at my parents' house.
Land navigation around Baltimore was really easy for a few years. There were two aerostats at 10k feet, located at two different Army posts. Get a clear view of them and you were golden. They were even lit up before sunrise and after sunset due to their altitude and the curve of the Earth. Kharn |
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