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Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:20:25 PM EDT
[#1]
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Originally Posted By PigBat:


Looks like #11 are 4 half-swastikas. The things we are forced to do for political correctness 
View Quote


Why you are correct I didn't even notice that! That's okay I've got a whole sheet downstairs of multiple scale swastikas. I'd rather put a whole one on and try to line two of them up.
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:22:12 PM EDT
[#2]
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Originally Posted By Clockwork138:

@Dog1

The Bf110 1:48 Revell kit I bought ~15-years-ago had an option for that plane. I might have the decals in my left-overs box if you're interested.
View Quote



I may take you up on that. Thanks for the offer. I'm going to work on a 1/72nd scale first, just to see if my right hand wants to work with me when it comes to building models in trying to paint them again LOL

RML paint hell... here I come LOL
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:24:42 PM EDT
[#3]
Those decals have some nice instructions
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:29:40 PM EDT
[#4]
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Originally Posted By Dog1:
Those decals have some nice instructions
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/9749/20200520_122401-1424949.jpg
View Quote


Very nice, did they have 1/48?
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:37:10 PM EDT
[#5]
Behind the camera: Leni Riefenstahl and her film crew gather into place to film Hitler speaking at a Nazi rally for the film 'Triumph of the Will' in 1934
View Quote


Attachment Attached File


Wonder how many takes that took?
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:43:15 PM EDT
[#6]
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Originally Posted By PigBat:


Looks like #11 are 4 half-swastikas. The things we are forced to do for political correctness 
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Originally Posted By PigBat:
Originally Posted By Dog1:
Got my decals today for my 1/72nd scale Bf-110... still waiting on the kit to ship

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/9749/20200520_113656-1424901.jpg

No swastikas because it came from Germany but that's okay I've got swastikas downstairs in the hobby closet


Looks like #11 are 4 half-swastikas. The things we are forced to do for political correctness 


German Law, no swastikas on models.
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:49:22 PM EDT
[#7]
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Originally Posted By 13starsinax:


Very nice, did they have 1/48?
View Quote



After I was sent that link I looked for 1/48 scale and he did not have any and I could not find any.
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 12:59:18 PM EDT
[#8]
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 1:07:56 PM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 1:20:30 PM EDT
[#10]
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 1:25:28 PM EDT
[#11]
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 2:07:55 PM EDT
[#12]
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The former Champlin Fighter Museum at Falcon Field in Mesa, AZ had a many German aircraft cannons on display in their collection.
I have always wondered if the machine guns and cannon collection went to Washington with the aircraft.
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 7:29:51 PM EDT
[#13]
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 7:33:20 PM EDT
[#14]
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Originally Posted By 13starsinax:


I follow the The Flying Heritage & Combat Armor Museum Ju-87 restoration. That is going to be awesome.

no free loading
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/303716/images_jpg-1421067.JPG
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/303716/images_jpg-1421075.JPG
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uvqhA4_2tU
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Originally Posted By 13starsinax:


I follow the The Flying Heritage & Combat Armor Museum Ju-87 restoration. That is going to be awesome.

no free loading
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/303716/images_jpg-1421067.JPG
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/303716/images_jpg-1421075.JPG
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uvqhA4_2tU

Those Jericho Trumpets are loud as hell
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 7:43:59 PM EDT
[#15]
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Originally Posted By PigBat:


Looks like #11 are 4 half-swastikas. The things we are forced to do for political correctness 
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Originally Posted By PigBat:
Originally Posted By Dog1:
Got my decals today for my 1/72nd scale Bf-110... still waiting on the kit to ship

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/9749/20200520_113656-1424901.jpg

No swastikas because it came from Germany but that's okay I've got swastikas downstairs in the hobby closet


Looks like #11 are 4 half-swastikas. The things we are forced to do for political correctness 

Yep...………....they cut them in half to prevent a swastika from being seen...………….you just put them together. I have a sheet for a T-34 "Beutepanzer" ( captured T-34 used by the Germans )that has a turret top decal for ID from the air that is the Nazi flag
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 8:28:39 PM EDT
[#16]
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Originally Posted By cyclone:

 Those Jericho Trumpets are loud as hell
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Originally Posted By cyclone:

 Those Jericho Trumpets are loud as hell


I can not imagine the feeling of knowing here they come.

He-162 Prototype number 6.

Very short video, does anyone know of other flight videos?

Link Posted: 5/20/2020 8:44:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 13starsinax] [#17]
Link Posted: 5/20/2020 8:59:41 PM EDT
[#18]
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Originally Posted By 13starsinax:


I can not imagine the feeling of knowing here they come.


Very short video, does anyone know of other flight videos?
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8eT48ypWLw
View Quote



I've seen that video before but I want to say that I've seen another video but I can't remember where
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 1:14:38 PM EDT
[#19]
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Originally Posted By Dog1:



I've seen that video before but I want to say that I've seen another video but I can't remember where
View Quote


US did testing on it postwar, and the British supposedly did more than we did. I would think there would be some footage of it.

http://me109.airwar1946.nl/family/FiSk-199.htm
Attachment Attached File

Link Posted: 5/21/2020 2:03:45 PM EDT
[#20]
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Originally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
Since there were Ju-87 posted above with the 37mm cannon, found guncam footage of the attack runs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccOXrfBZoLE

Russian shipping? Landing ships?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIcsIuPOBpk
View Quote

That’s the first Stuka tank buster gun cam footage I think I’ve seen.
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 3:58:24 PM EDT
[#21]
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 4:27:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Mal_means_bad] [#22]
The St. Nazaire raid was designed to destroy the only French drydock that could handle Tirpitz so that she'd be forced to run the gauntlet back to Germany the next time she required repair.  HMS Campbeltown (ex-USS Buchanan, an elderly lend lease destroyer), up armored and disguised as a German destroyer, rammed the locks and delivered commandos who spread out to destroy machinery, while accompanying torpedo boats also delivered commando teams.  The sailors joined the commandos, and once ammunition was expended most of the survivors were captured by the Germans.  While the captain of Campbeltown was being interrogated ashore and a contingent of German officers were investigating the ship 4.1 tons of explosives on a time delay detonator exploded in her bow, wrecking the locks and killing about 250 Germans and French civilians.  The dock wasn't repaired until 1947.

Germans investigate Campbeltown shortly before she explodes:





Wreckage afterwards:




Link Posted: 5/21/2020 4:39:30 PM EDT
[#23]
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Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:
The St. Nazaire raid was designed to destroy the only French drydock that could handle Tirpitz so that she'd be forced to run the gauntlet back to Germany the next time she required repair.  HMS Campbeltown (ex-USS Buchanan, an elderly lend lease destroyer), up armored and disguised as a German destroyer, rammed the locks and delivered commandos who spread out to destroy machinery, while accompanying torpedo boats also delivered commando teams.  The sailors joined the commandos, and once ammunition was expended most of the survivors were captured by the Germans.  While the captain of Campbeltown was being interrogated ashore and a contingent of German officers were investigating the ship 4.1 tons of explosives on a time delay detonator exploded in her bow, wrecking the locks and killing about 250 Germans and French civilians.  The dock wasn't repaired until 1947.

Germans investigate Campbeltown shortly before she explodes:
https://i.imgur.com/hA703.jpg
https://usercontent1.hubstatic.com/8527924_f1024.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/61/Bundesarchiv_Bild_101II-MW-3722-19%2C_St._Nazaire%2C_Zerst%C3%B6rer_%22HMS_Campbeltown%22.jpg
https://davidsberry.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/campelwreck.png

Wreckage afterwards:
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/pix1/0513122.jpg



View Quote


I love a good raid.
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 4:46:28 PM EDT
[#24]
HMS Kingston, sunk at a Malta dock by an air raid 11 April 1942.  The damaged midships was scrapped and temporary bulkheads were welded to the fore and aft halves, which were refloated and towed out to be scuttled as a blockship in 1943.

Attachment Attached File



Link Posted: 5/21/2020 6:11:59 PM EDT
[#25]
WPA posters asking for civilians to lend their binoculars to the US Navy:




Repeat of a WWI program in which 51,217 pairs were received and 31,000 were accepted for naval use:





Link Posted: 5/21/2020 7:53:45 PM EDT
[#26]
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Pretty bad ass that the Navy asked. People responded, the Navy paid and returned property where possible.

I'm including Doris Miller, because he was a badass. He risked everything despite being treated as a 3rd class citizen. Doing the right thing because it is the right thing despite risk or consequences is pretty much hard to beat.

Link Posted: 5/21/2020 9:17:01 PM EDT
[#27]
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Originally Posted By Dog1:



After I was sent that link I looked for 1/48 scale and he did not have any and I could not find any.
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Originally Posted By Dog1:
Originally Posted By 13starsinax:


Very nice, did they have 1/48?



After I was sent that link I looked for 1/48 scale and he did not have any and I could not find any.


1:48 scale Totenhand BF 110 G decals

https://www.ebay.com/p/673708049
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 9:48:24 PM EDT
[#28]
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Originally Posted By cyclone:


1:48 scale Totenhand BF 110 G decals

https://www.ebay.com/p/673708049
View Quote



I swear I'm going to contact you every time I look for something on eBay
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 10:28:38 PM EDT
[#29]
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Originally Posted By birdbarian:


Pretty bad ass that the Navy asked. People responded, the Navy paid and returned property where possible.

I'm including Doris Miller, because he was a badass. He risked everything despite being treated as a 3rd class citizen. Doing the right thing because it is the right thing despite risk or consequences is pretty much hard to beat.

https://www.history.navy.mil/content/history/nhhc/research/histories/biographies-list/bios-m/miller-doris/jcr%3Acontent/body/media_asset/image.img.jpg/1412868947456.jpg
View Quote

CVN 81 USS Doris Miller
Link Posted: 5/21/2020 11:10:44 PM EDT
[#30]
I've always thought this a kind of neat photo:


My father's first wife; he was in the Army and she was a WASP. Killed in 1944 when the plane she was flying suffered  a structural failure.


Link Posted: 5/23/2020 7:19:42 PM EDT
[#31]
Especially before enough aircraft carriers were available, Allied convoys were covered by antisubmarine B-24 bombers on extreme range missions.  Far beyond the range of escort fighters, when those convoys came under attack from German bombers the pilots of the 480th Antisubmarine Group chose to intercept and dogfight the Germans.  One of those pilots was Hugh Maxwell Jr. commanding The Ark



Air&Space
The 480th had been flying from Port Lyautey in Morocco against German U-boats for several months....  The Liberators had their share of run-ins with German airplanes. From March through October 1943, they shot down nine German aircraft, including five Condors, three Dornier flying boats, and one Junkers Ju 88 multi-role combat airplane; the 480th’s two squadrons lost three Liberators. The Liberator pilot, Hugh Maxwell Jr., now 98 and living in Altamonte Springs, Florida, had been with the 480th since early March, and had fought another Condor about a month before the August dogfight. Flying parallel courses, the two bombers fired at each other, and Maxwell’s gunners scored hits. The Condor was last seen diving into the clouds with one engine out.

On August 17, the Liberator’s base at Port Lyautey had broken radio silence to warn of the Condors’ approach. Maxwell’s radar operator reported a pair of contacts 15 miles away, and his navigator calculated they would arrive over the convoy at about the same time as the Liberator. That left Maxwell no choice but to engage.

The battle was spectacular. He had never flown fighters—his experience had been in B-18 and B-25 bombers—and he had never been in a dogfight, so the combat that day was the ultimate on-the-job training. He initiated the fight by diving his 28-ton bomber out of the clouds at 1,000 feet on the tail of the lead Condor. He told his gunners to hold fire until they got within range. But the Condor “fired a sighting burst and started hitting me,” he says. “I shoved the throttles and prop pitch forward and closed as fast as I could, and I opened fire. They never came out of their diving turn, and went in on fire. But boy, they had done us damage.”

The second Condor, meanwhile, was firing at Maxwell from behind, and Maxwell’s gunners were returning fire. But the Liberator had lost its number-three and -four engines, and the right wing was full of holes and in flames. The bomber was especially vulnerable to attack because modifications for anti-submarine work (enabling the aircraft to carry more fuel and a maximum load of depth charges) had required removing all the armor plating that protected the crew. So when the Condor’s bullets struck, “all of us got hit by shrapnel and our hydraulic system was knocked out, our intercom radio system was knocked out, the whole instrument panel was knocked out,” Maxwell recalls. Fortunately, one of the crewmen was able to jettison the depth charges.

“As I realized that our right wing would no longer fly and I couldn’t raise it, and was trying to hold left rudder and aileron, my left foot kept slipping off the rudder pedal,” says Maxwell. “I looked down and said, ‘Oh my God.’ My whole left leg and foot were covered with blood, and there was a pool of blood and it was all over that rudder pedal. And I knew I’d been hit in the left side with shrapnel. But then I realized: It ain’t blood, it’s hydraulic fluid.

“At no time did I feel heroic or any of that kind of stuff,” he says. “Hell, I was scared. I didn’t want to die, but I had to do whatever I needed to do. The thing that sticks out in my mind the most was when I realized we were going to be crashing into the Atlantic Ocean, and I thought we were goners. But in a last-minute desperate effort to avoid catastrophe, I kicked in full right rudder and threw the plane into a skid, and sure enough, instead of our cartwheeling and breaking up and exploding, the water put the fire out, and the airplane broke in three pieces, but it didn’t explode or burn.” Seven of the 10 crew members survived.

The second Condor was seen mushing over the waves at low altitude with its number-three engine out. The pilot was able to stay in the air; he made it back to Bordeaux, but his airplane crashed and burned on landing, according to one source. All crew members reportedly survived.

Maxwell’s crew was quickly picked up by one of the convoy’s escorts, the British destroyer Highlander. It also picked up “four survivors from that lead Focke-Wulf 200, two of whom died that night because they were so badly burned,” Maxwell says. The events of the day amounted to “probably my worst experience.”
View Quote


Hugh Maxwell Jr. flies a B-25 at age 99:

After 70 years, World War II Pilot Flies the B-25 again!


Col. Maxwell passed away on July 2, 2017 at the age of 101.
Link Posted: 5/23/2020 7:34:29 PM EDT
[#32]
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Originally Posted By birdbarian:I'm including Doris Miller, because he was a badass. He risked everything despite being treated as a 3rd class citizen. Doing the right thing because it is the right thing despite risk or consequences is pretty much hard to beat.

https://www.history.navy.mil/content/history/nhhc/research/histories/biographies-list/bios-m/miller-doris/jcr%3Acontent/body/media_asset/image.img.jpg/1412868947456.jpg
View Quote

It really is interesting to compare that portrait to the modern equivalent.
Current Navy dress whites are about the same (maybe exactly the same), but probably  no one will ever again have the Navy Cross as their sole decoration.
Link Posted: 5/23/2020 7:37:06 PM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Mal_means_bad:
The St. Nazaire raid was designed to destroy the only French drydock that could handle Tirpitz so that she'd be forced to run the gauntlet back to Germany the next time she required repair.  HMS Campbeltown (ex-USS Buchanan, an elderly lend lease destroyer), up armored and disguised as a German destroyer, rammed the locks and delivered commandos who spread out to destroy machinery, while accompanying torpedo boats also delivered commando teams.  The sailors joined the commandos, and once ammunition was expended most of the survivors were captured by the Germans.  While the captain of Campbeltown was being interrogated ashore and a contingent of German officers were investigating the ship 4.1 tons of explosives on a time delay detonator exploded in her bow, wrecking the locks and killing about 250 Germans and French civilians.  The dock wasn't repaired until 1947.

Germans investigate Campbeltown shortly before she explodes:
https://i.imgur.com/hA703.jpg
https://usercontent1.hubstatic.com/8527924_f1024.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/61/Bundesarchiv_Bild_101II-MW-3722-19%2C_St._Nazaire%2C_Zerst%C3%B6rer_%22HMS_Campbeltown%22.jpg
https://davidsberry.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/campelwreck.png

Wreckage afterwards:
http://www.navsource.org/archives/05/pix1/0513122.jpg
View Quote

An excellent documentary on YouTube

https://youtu.be/07Zd0Oy8JyQ
Link Posted: 5/23/2020 7:41:25 PM EDT
[#34]
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Originally Posted By MMcfpd:

My father's first wife; he was in the Army and she was a WASP. Killed in 1944 when the plane she was flying suffered  a structural failure.

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What was her name?
Link Posted: 5/23/2020 10:53:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MMcfpd] [#35]
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Originally Posted By Not_so_Clever:


What was her name?
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Jeanne; 38 Women Airforce Service Pilots were killed in service.
Link Posted: 5/23/2020 10:57:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Not_so_Clever] [#36]
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Originally Posted By MMcfpd:

Jeanne
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Originally Posted By MMcfpd:
Originally Posted By Not_so_Clever:


What was her name?

Jeanne


Thank you. Seems fitting to know it.
Link Posted: 5/24/2020 10:20:02 AM EDT
[#37]
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Originally Posted By Thug_Hunter12:

It really is interesting to compare that portrait to the modern equivalent.
Current Navy dress whites are about the same (maybe exactly the same), but probably  no one will ever again have the Navy Cross as their sole decoration.
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Originally Posted By Thug_Hunter12:
Originally Posted By birdbarian:I'm including Doris Miller, because he was a badass. He risked everything despite being treated as a 3rd class citizen. Doing the right thing because it is the right thing despite risk or consequences is pretty much hard to beat.

https://www.history.navy.mil/content/history/nhhc/research/histories/biographies-list/bios-m/miller-doris/jcr%3Acontent/body/media_asset/image.img.jpg/1412868947456.jpg

It really is interesting to compare that portrait to the modern equivalent.
Current Navy dress whites are about the same (maybe exactly the same), but probably  no one will ever again have the Navy Cross as their sole decoration.


The Navy added blue piping to the whites at some point in the last 10ish years. When I was in, ours were exactly like his, except different material.
Link Posted: 5/24/2020 10:20:59 AM EDT
[#38]
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Originally Posted By Not_so_Clever:


Thank you. Seems fitting to know it.
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Originally Posted By Not_so_Clever:
Originally Posted By MMcfpd:
Originally Posted By Not_so_Clever:


What was her name?

Jeanne


Thank you. Seems fitting to know it.


I'll bet she was fun to be around.
Link Posted: 5/24/2020 10:43:52 AM EDT
[#39]
DeRuyter

Link Posted: 5/24/2020 10:51:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Riter] [#40]
Good book on WASPs is Amelia Earhart's Daughters.



BTW, worked with a guy whose mother was a WASP.  She got grounded by her husband when they got married. When the kids were teenagers, she and another former WASP rented an airplane and went flying together.

These two sisters were armed with 10 6" guns in single mounts.  Both were obsolete by WW II.  Their torpedoes were inferior to those carried by most Japanese light cruisers.  They had their guns in gun shields, not turrets, making their crews more exposed to the elements than the majority of German light cruisers.  Don't even bring up the Mogami (which were armed with 15 x  6" guns in five triple turrets (until they were rearmed w/10 x 8" guns.)
Java

Sumatra
Link Posted: 5/24/2020 5:05:41 PM EDT
[#41]


Link Posted: 5/24/2020 11:40:46 PM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


The British had a task of dropping bombs at night, and they had a horrible time of it. The tail gunners are always mentioned in the German night fighters books. I would have lost my mind starring out into that darkness.

The tail of the Wellington really does look like a shark fin.
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 5/24/2020 11:56:31 PM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


Tough seat to sit in...some of the Luftwaffe videos of them just pumping cannon fire into the rear gunner position always give me a sick feeling

Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File


McGlashan Air Machine Gun Corporation made full auto BB gun used for training gunners
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGlashan_Air_Machine_Gun
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 12:02:45 AM EDT
[#44]
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Originally Posted By 22caliberKIDD:


Tough seat to sit in...some of the Luftwaffe videos of them just pumping cannon fire into the rear gunner position always give me a sick feeling

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/321106/F41B056B-AA5E-49C7-B29A-E4F0F8786E77_jpe-1431635.JPG

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/321106/909F4A7C-AC18-4337-9502-2A7A0EDFF3AD_jpe-1431636.JPG

McGlashan Air Machine Gun Corporation made full auto BB gun used for training gunners
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGlashan_Air_Machine_Gun
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/321106/0BB75D34-42CC-4737-A477-9238F1EF7D38_jpe-1431639.JPG
View Quote


These were popular at carnivals and penny arcades in the 60s. I remember them along with the BB Tommy guns

They'd put up a little star and if you obliterate the entire thing you'd win a kewpie doll or some such shit.
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 12:46:17 AM EDT
[#45]
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 8:23:11 AM EDT
[#46]
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Originally Posted By piccolo:
I remember them along with the BB Tommy guns

They'd put up a little star and if you obliterate the entire thing you'd win a kewpie doll or some such shit.
View Quote



I remember those back in the 80s (bb Tommy guns) at various fairs. The Villa Feast had them in The Bronx growing up.

I saw one maybe a year ago at a fair somewhere. I always try them, but they're inaccurate to the point of comedy.
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 9:08:43 AM EDT
[#47]
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Originally Posted By piccolo:


These were popular at carnivals and penny arcades in the 60s. I remember them along with the BB Tommy guns

They'd put up a little star and if you obliterate the entire thing you'd win a kewpie doll or some such shit.
View Quote


I see you are in PA.
My first thought before scrolling down and seeing your post was......Knoebles Grove.  
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 9:28:26 AM EDT
[#48]
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Originally Posted By bodybagger:

The 20mm was brutal and absolutely destroyed our planes. We should have dropped the .50 BMG for something at least comparable on our aircraft. My grandpa survived a tour in Europe on B-17s and I can't imagine the fear those cannon caused out aircrews.
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Originally Posted By bodybagger:
Originally Posted By 22caliberKIDD:


Tough seat to sit in...some of the Luftwaffe videos of them just pumping cannon fire into the rear gunner position always give me a sick feeling

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/321106/F41B056B-AA5E-49C7-B29A-E4F0F8786E77_jpe-1431635.JPG

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/321106/909F4A7C-AC18-4337-9502-2A7A0EDFF3AD_jpe-1431636.JPG

McGlashan Air Machine Gun Corporation made full auto BB gun used for training gunners
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McGlashan_Air_Machine_Gun
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/321106/0BB75D34-42CC-4737-A477-9238F1EF7D38_jpe-1431639.JPG

The 20mm was brutal and absolutely destroyed our planes. We should have dropped the .50 BMG for something at least comparable on our aircraft. My grandpa survived a tour in Europe on B-17s and I can't imagine the fear those cannon caused out aircrews.

And what would it have been. Do you even M -2 bro.
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 10:04:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: bodybagger] [#49]
Link Posted: 5/25/2020 10:45:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Deere_John_16] [#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By bodybagger:

I would have looked hard at the French Hispano-Suiza 20mm guns or captured German guns and tooled up production of both fixed and flexible mounted 20mm aircraft guns for both aircraft and ground vehicles. I wouldn't have to have seen too many chopped up allied planes to decide the Germans had a better gun.
I imagine twin 20mm guns on the gun mounts of our bombers would have made a Luftwaffe pilot even more short lived of an occupation.
The M2 has it's place, but if we'd had 20mm cannons in WW2 our guys would have been field mounting 4 or 6 in the noses of planes instead of .50s.
I find it remarkable that with all the innovation we did in aircraft in WW2 our innovation in their basic arnamen revolved around mounting more .50's, we didn't do much in the way of developing a bigger, heavier hitting gun. I'd wager my grandpa wasn't the only gunner then that wished he'd had a big gun like the Germans.

It was probably some stodgy stubborn ass in the war department that said "Bruh!! Do you even M2???" Anytime the subject of a bigger gun came up.
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There were some aircraft that did have the 20mm.   Keep in mind it was much bigger than the .50 cal, so you couldn't just swap them out 1 for one.   Bigger, heavier, more complex ammunition handling, etc.   Sometimes "quantity" has a "quality" all its own.   The 50 cal was mass produced, used in almost everything, and ammunition supply was in good supply throughout the war and its theaters.

P61 had 4 belly mounted.  





The B29 had a version with one in the tail (not sure how many)



The P38-E had one in the nose.



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