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Posted: 6/26/2024 3:32:15 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: See if your boss will give you a key. Then you can come in a bit early and knock it out  Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: When you’re spending increasingly more time dealing with this shit, it’s a problem. It’s not difficult, but I’ve got better things to do with my time. I’ve found most people don’t know how to scan with pdf with their phones or don’t know the capability even exists. People have to learn how to work with technology. My company stopped taking paper checks as payment a while back. Oh, the wailing and gnashing of teeth. We take eChecks with no additional fees. People finally calmed down after a while. See if your boss will give you a key. Then you can come in a bit early and knock it out or work from home to transfer jpegs |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 3:34:51 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You get signatures that look like this? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/279183/IMG_0985-3251206.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Lmao This is how things were done before Adobe had the digital signature option. Client would print out the contract or form, sign/initial and date, then scan and send it back to me so I could get the ball rolling, so I wouldn't have to wait to get the wet signatures by snail mail. This was done for contracts worth 10's of millions of dollars. You get signatures that look like this? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/279183/IMG_0985-3251206.jpg Ahh, I misunderstood your OP. I get what you're saying now. I have a signature saved in Adobe with my actual signature that I made with my touchscreen on my computer. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 3:36:32 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ahh, I misunderstood your OP. I get what you're saying now. I have a signature saved in Adobe with my actual signature that I made with my touchscreen on my computer. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Lmao This is how things were done before Adobe had the digital signature option. Client would print out the contract or form, sign/initial and date, then scan and send it back to me so I could get the ball rolling, so I wouldn't have to wait to get the wet signatures by snail mail. This was done for contracts worth 10's of millions of dollars. You get signatures that look like this? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/279183/IMG_0985-3251206.jpg Ahh, I misunderstood your OP. I get what you're saying now. I have a signature saved in Adobe with my actual signature that I made with my touchscreen on my computer. I’d be fine with a digital signature like you’re describing. No one does that, though. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 3:58:40 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You don't need to do all that rigamarole to turn a JPEG into a PDF old man. Assuming you have Adobe Acrobat installed: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/178958/Capture_JPG-3251222.JPG I have Adobe. This option didn't show up unless I clicked on "show more options." This Boomer thanks you for saving me some time. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 4:34:55 PM EDT
[#5]
Digital signatures:
   
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Posted: 6/26/2024 4:37:41 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They’re not signing with their actual signature. They are just choosing a font that looks like cursive. Yeah, that's not kosher. It's not a signature, period. |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 6:31:51 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The way it was explained to me by my notorized attorney is it doesn't matter. "Make your mark, it could just be an X or whatever the hell you want" Nobody is going to match signatures, just that there is a witness to "I agree". Same when I sign contracts at work, always with company name and title. I'm acting as officer of company, not personally Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Maybe I don't understand, but a signature is cursive. Ever legally binding thing I've done was my name in cursive. Nobody is going to match signatures, just that there is a witness to "I agree". Same when I sign contracts at work, always with company name and title. I'm acting as officer of company, not personally |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 7:17:42 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: go run this by someone < 20yo they dont even do signatures anymore Exactly. They don't know how. Signed, X |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 7:29:30 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: Running into a rash of new customers who think it’s totally acceptable to sign legal documents in a font that looks like cursive writing. I’m a customs broker and new customers have to sign a power of attorney authorizing us to act on their behalf with CBP. Our POA is a PDF you can type in and sign with a legit digital signature (such as through Adobe or other electronic representation of your actual signature). Some people will actually print POA, complete by hand, and physically sign it. I don’t care as long as it’s legible. I had an argument with someone this morning who insisted the cursive font was a legal signature. I told him it wasn’t. Anyone could “sign” a document that way. There’s no way of proving who signed it. And don’t get me started on the people who “scan” documents with their phone as .jpeg files when I need PDFs and also put their documents in the body of emails instead of an attachment. I’m done dumping jpegs into a Word doc and saving as PDF. I can and have given people instructions to scan to pdf on both iPhone and Android. ETA: type of typed signature in fancy font I get https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/279183/IMG_0985-3251206.jpg Totally agree, the cursive font isn't a legit signature  I'm not surprised that people think that, though, IQs have dropped sharply |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 8:22:01 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bingo. Concerning wet signatures, depending on my mood, my signature varies from cursive, print, "X", "-" or a dick. I'd be shocked if I ever made the same signature twice. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Maybe I don't understand, but a signature is cursive. Ever legally binding thing I've done was my name in cursive. Nobody is going to match signatures, just that there is a witness to "I agree". Same when I sign contracts at work, always with company name and title. I'm acting as officer of company, not personally This is the benefit of consulting an attorney instead of GD. OP, what does your company policy state on the matter? Has your company consulting an attorney familiar with your industry and locality to determine what is applicable to your business (especially in light of the POA)? Is this your business, or someplace you work? Electronic signature != Digital signature. You can "sign" a contract via email by typing your name into it if you want. An electronic signature is “an electronic sound, symbol, or process attached to or logically associated with a record and executed or adopted by a person with the intent to sign the record." An e-sign platform is easier for everyone, including your lawyer if the contract is challenged. https://www.findlaw.com/smallbusiness/business-operations/contracts-and-electronic-signatures.html This is specific to Texas: In interpreting these requirements, Texas courts have generally found that an electronic signature is enforceable if the sender signs off on the email with his or her name and if it is reasonably apparent from the context of the communications, or from the parties’ actions, that both sides have agreed to conduct transactions electronically. Courts have generally recognized that an email is signed if the sender’s name is on an email, the email is generated from the sender’s email address and closes with at least the sender’s first name, or if it contains a header with the sender’s name even if the typed name does not appear at the bottom of the email itself. For example, in Parks v. Seybold, the 5th Court of Appeals in Dallas held that emails concluding with “Thank you, Clyde Parks” immediately above a block containing Parks’ full name and contact information sufficiently demonstrated that Parks had signed the emails himself. https://www.texasbar.com/AM/Template.cfm?Section=articles&Template=/CM/HTMLDisplay.cfm&ContentID=38641 https://casetext.com/case/parks-v-seybold-1 |
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Posted: 6/26/2024 8:25:56 PM EDT
[#11]
A lot of you need to read up on ESIGN and UETA. It's a little industry dependent and OP may have a proper gripe, I don't know. But with a LOT of industries, the OP describes a proper signature, so long as the signature can be appropriated to the person who signed it. This can be done as simply as asking that person if it was them who signed it.
Adobe's Acrobat Standard signature function allows a user to sign exactly how the OP describes, and it's compliant with UETA. There are serious concerns, however, with the security of these signatures. (There is none) There are upgraded features to allow certificates, fwiw. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:06:30 AM EDT
[#12]
Another new customer just threw a hissy fit over my objections to their CEO “signing” the power of attorney with typing his name in a fancy font. When I told him he had to sign it in ink or with a digital signature, dude lost it. Doesn’t seem to understand the concept that’s not a legal signature. I’m letting sales deal with the idiot.
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:24:38 AM EDT
[#13]
I share your frustration, OP. I have a ton of customers who will send me a blank copy of a contract and state “approved” in the email. Well that’s great but you need to sign and initial the contract first… Then I’ll receive a terrible scanned copy of only the signature page, and no initials… then I’ll send it to them through DocuSign for convenience…. “I don’t know how to do all this computer signature stuff!”
Half the time they just go quiet after that. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:35:44 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I share your frustration, OP. I have a ton of customers who will send me a blank copy of a contract and state “approved” in the email. Well that’s great but you need to sign and initial the contract first… Then I’ll receive a terrible scanned copy of only the signature page, and no initials… then I’ll send it to them through DocuSign for convenience…. “I don’t know how to do all this computer signature stuff!” Half the time they just go quiet after that. Ugh. There’s that too. I have done up sample forms with fields highlighted, etc. I get them back quite often only partially completed. The back and forth sometimes is just ridiculous. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:46:40 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Another new customer just threw a hissy fit over my objections to their CEO “signing” the power of attorney with typing his name in a fancy font. When I told him he had to sign it in ink or with a digital signature, dude lost it. Doesn’t seem to understand the concept that’s not a legal signature. I’m letting sales deal with the idiot. For my future benefit and understanding, what is the regulation, etc. that governs the signature process? Is it specific to POA’s or even Illinois? |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 11:55:59 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For my future benefit and understanding, what is the regulation, etc. that governs the signature process? Is it specific to POA’s or even Illinois? CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone’s name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don’t know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn’t sign it with that fancy font typed name. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:41:54 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone’s name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don’t know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn’t sign it with that fancy font typed name. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: For my future benefit and understanding, what is the regulation, etc. that governs the signature process? Is it specific to POA’s or even Illinois? CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone’s name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don’t know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn’t sign it with that fancy font typed name. If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:45:50 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. Those two options are still better than what I’m seeing now. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:48:24 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: For my future benefit and understanding, what is the regulation, etc. that governs the signature process? Is it specific to POA's or even Illinois? CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone's name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don't know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn't sign it with that fancy font typed name. If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. We are talking about legally enforceable industry standards, not absolutes. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:49:52 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone’s name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don’t know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn’t sign it with that fancy font typed name. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: For my future benefit and understanding, what is the regulation, etc. that governs the signature process? Is it specific to POA’s or even Illinois? CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone’s name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don’t know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn’t sign it with that fancy font typed name. There is a well established legal principle of “In regard to signatures, it is the intent rather than the form of the act that is important”. This intent can be as abstract as clicking a box in lieu of any form of “traditional signature”, etc. Proving validity of intent is fairly simple over the course of normal business transactions, emails, etc. If you wanted to be proactive, you could request confirmation of intent following the completion of the agreement. As far as “anyone could have signed it”, the law recognizes three types of authority; actual, implied (or apparent), or ostensible. It would be an extremely rare case where someone, having gone through the process in representation of the company’s interests, falls outside those three categories. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:53:28 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quote HistoryQuoted: You can send that along with those font signatures to the Gov bureaucrats reviewing them! |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:53:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bingo. Concerning wet signatures, depending on my mood, my signature varies from cursive, print, "X", "-" or a dick. I'd be shocked if I ever made the same signature twice. My signature could be described as “Architectural Chicken Scratch” if it were a font. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 12:58:39 PM EDT
[#23]
Your're right but I've seen medical releases inside of the MyChart app that will fill in the patient signature with that same font. Maybe that's why people believe it's legal. I seriously doubt that it is.
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:07:01 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Your're right but I've seen medical releases inside of the MyChart app that will fill in the patient signature with that same font. Maybe that's why people believe it's legal. I seriously doubt that it is. The Electronic Signatures in Global and National Commerce Act, 15 USC 7001, from 2000 sates: The term “electronic signature” means an electronic sound, symbol, or process, attached to or logically associated with a contract or other record and executed or adopted by a person with the intent to sign the record. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:09:16 PM EDT
[#25]
OP you should really be using this as your example, say you're getting a signature like this but in a different font:
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:15:59 PM EDT
[#26]
hell even the IRS says hit enter and understand this is your signature attesting to the accuracy of your filings punishable by death.
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:17:36 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: By those standards then arguments could be made that the DNA is not mine, but either a doppelganger or unknown twin. We are talking about legally enforceable industry standards, not absolutes. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: For my future benefit and understanding, what is the regulation, etc. that governs the signature process? Is it specific to POA's or even Illinois? CBP requires customs brokers to vet POAs. Someone's name typed in a fancy font is not a legal signature. I don't know who signed the POA and I have no way of proving it. Anyone could have signed it. They could later say they didn't sign it with that fancy font typed name. If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. We are talking about legally enforceable industry standards, not absolutes. Or, perhaps, the presence of your DNA is incidental and only proves that you came into contact with someone or something, and not proof that you stabbed or signed that thing? If we're talking legally enforceable industry standards, pasting in an "X" or their name at the bottom of an email can be enforceable outside of legal requirements for digital signatures or notarized documents. People keep focusing on one tree. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:20:09 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Those two options are still better than what I’m seeing now. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. Those two options are still better than what I’m seeing now. I hear you. What's your company policy say on the matter? If it doesn't address it, and you aren't the decision maker regarding what level of legal risk the company is willing to accept, bump it up to the decision maker. If you are the decision maker, consult with an attorney, set a policy, and work with your closing team so that they can communicate expectations properly with the client. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:20:56 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: go run this by someone < 20yo they dont even do signatures anymore "What's that? I don't know how."  |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:22:31 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are wrong OP, cursive signatures are perfectly legal. Stop being an annoying zoomer. There is a fucking reason why most forms have a spot for Printed/Legible name and a signature in two different places. He said nothing about cursive signatures. Did you read? |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:24:51 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I hear you. What's your company policy say on the matter? If it doesn't address it, and you aren't the decision maker regarding what level of legal risk the company is willing to accept, bump it up to the decision maker. If you are the decision maker, consult with an attorney, set a policy, and work with your closing team so that they can communicate expectations properly with the client. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. Those two options are still better than what I’m seeing now. I hear you. What's your company policy say on the matter? If it doesn't address it, and you aren't the decision maker regarding what level of legal risk the company is willing to accept, bump it up to the decision maker. If you are the decision maker, consult with an attorney, set a policy, and work with your closing team so that they can communicate expectations properly with the client. This is a very new issue, from the last couple of weeks. Owners have been out of the office. I’m going to talk with them when they’re back. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:27:18 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: OP you should really be using this as your example, say you're getting a signature like this but in a different font: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/77166/Screenshot_2024-06-27_at_12_08_19_PM-3251936.png  This is a good example of what I’ve been getting. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:27:35 PM EDT
[#33]
Nevermind!
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:29:57 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is a very new issue, from the last couple of weeks. Owners have been out of the office. I’m going to talk with them when they’re back. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: If you receive an ink-signed copy, anyone could have signed it. If you receive one executed via DocuSign, anyone with access to that account could have signed it. Those two options are still better than what I’m seeing now. I hear you. What's your company policy say on the matter? If it doesn't address it, and you aren't the decision maker regarding what level of legal risk the company is willing to accept, bump it up to the decision maker. If you are the decision maker, consult with an attorney, set a policy, and work with your closing team so that they can communicate expectations properly with the client. This is a very new issue, from the last couple of weeks. Owners have been out of the office. I’m going to talk with them when they’re back. Good plan. They might find out after consulting an attorney that their current practices aren't going to protect them, and that they need to change. Or maybe it's fine. Or ownership might say "we don't give a shit, what you got's good enough." Their capital, their risk. Define requirements (with legal input), set policy, find a product that satisfies the policy, communicate, train, and adopt. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:29:58 PM EDT
[#35]
funny.
I just got in an argument with a customs broker, no shit, about this same thing. it's dumb and you're not going to convince me it matters. I can sign more sensitive documents for a mortgage, etc. using online utilities. Instead, I have go leave my job site, go to a printers shop, print out the document, sign document with witnesses then scan document in, log in to computer, forward document over where the asshole on the other end is going to forward it on to someone else. if it's ever even printed to physical paper, I bet it's trashed right after the customs agent checks whatever dumb box they have to. All to ship a $30.00 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" Bronze Angle Ball valve to canada. My favorite part is when the customs broker tells me "you have to have the CEO sign this...shipping coordinator isn't a responsible party" then i don't change shit except scratch out "shipping coordinator" and write CFO beside it. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:33:13 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: funny. I just got in an argument with a customs broker, no shit, about this same thing. it's dumb and you're not going to convince me it matters. I can sign more sensitive documents for a mortgage, etc. using online utilities. Instead, I have go leave my job site, go to a printers shop, print out the document, sign document with witnesses then scan document in, log in to computer, forward document over where the asshole on the other end is going to forward it on to someone else. if it's ever even printed to physical paper, I bet it's trashed right after the customs agent checks whatever dumb box they have to. All to ship a $30.00 1-1/2" x 1-1/2" Bronze Angle Ball valve to canada. My favorite part is when the customs broker tells me "you have to have the CEO sign this...shipping coordinator isn't a responsible party" then i don't change shit except scratch out "shipping coordinator" and write CFO beside it. POA has to be signed by a corporate officer, at least for US POAs. But I believe it’s the same for Canada. I deal with a fair number of shipments into Canada for my customers, cleared by a Canadian broker. I have to keep POAs on file. They’re not trashed. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:38:54 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: POA has to be signed by a corporate officer, at least for US POAs. But I believe it’s the same for Canada. I deal with a fair number of shipments into Canada for my customers, cleared by a Canadian broker. I have to keep POAs on file. They’re not trashed. I understand the need to have an officer sign the POA. You don't want some jackleg from the shop floor who can't read the document to sign it. but they won't even accept a digital signature from like bluebeam or adobe...it's nonsense. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:40:57 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A lot of you need to read up on ESIGN and UETA. It's a little industry dependent and OP may have a proper gripe, I don't know. But with a LOT of industries, the OP describes a proper signature, so long as the signature can be appropriated to the person who signed it. This can be done as simply as asking that person if it was them who signed it. Adobe's Acrobat Standard signature function allows a user to sign exactly how the OP describes, and it's compliant with UETA. There are serious concerns, however, with the security of these signatures. (There is none) There are upgraded features to allow certificates, fwiw. Quote HistoryQuoted: A lot of you need to read up on ESIGN and UETA. It's a little industry dependent and OP may have a proper gripe, I don't know. But with a LOT of industries, the OP describes a proper signature, so long as the signature can be appropriated to the person who signed it. This can be done as simply as asking that person if it was them who signed it. Adobe's Acrobat Standard signature function allows a user to sign exactly how the OP describes, and it's compliant with UETA. There are serious concerns, however, with the security of these signatures. (There is none) There are upgraded features to allow certificates, fwiw. This. A typewritten signature is enforceable per the ESIGN Act. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/15/chapter-96 15 U.S. Code § 7001 - General rule of validity (a)In general Notwithstanding any statute, regulation, or other rule of law (other than this subchapter and subchapter II), with respect to any transaction in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce— (1)a signature, contract, or other record relating to such transaction may not be denied legal effect, validity, or enforceability solely because it is in electronic form; and It doesn't even need to be preceded by /s/ or be between slashes. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:41:53 PM EDT
[#39]
Why aren't you, the originator of the documents, taking control of the method of signature by providing them to the signatories via DocuSign or similar?
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:44:12 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why aren't you, the originator of the documents, taking control of the method of signature by providing them to the signatories via DocuSign or similar? Because I’ve been asking for that to be done and it’s gone nowhere. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:45:05 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I understand the need to have an officer sign the POA. You don't want some jackleg from the shop floor who can't read the document to sign it. but they won't even accept a digital signature from like bluebeam or adobe...it's nonsense. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: POA has to be signed by a corporate officer, at least for US POAs. But I believe it’s the same for Canada. I deal with a fair number of shipments into Canada for my customers, cleared by a Canadian broker. I have to keep POAs on file. They’re not trashed. I understand the need to have an officer sign the POA. You don't want some jackleg from the shop floor who can't read the document to sign it. but they won't even accept a digital signature from like bluebeam or adobe...it's nonsense. The Canadian broker won’t accept a digital signature? |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:46:39 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: See if your boss will give you a key. Then you can come in a bit early and knock it out  Attached File |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 1:57:05 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yep, iPad and a stylus makes this super easy. Unfortunately, a lot of businesses don’t seem to have this. Disagree. Stylus never looks the same I'm a physician, I'm shocked my signature looks even worse. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:10:30 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: TBH, I don't see why people make a big deal out of not teaching cursive. It's an outdated handwriting. I'm 39 and was taught cursive and my day to day handwriting is a weird mix between standard and cursive. There is absolutely no need to teach it in schools anymore. There is better stuff that kids can learn instead of that lol. Maybe they can teach it in art class or something. I am actually glad I was taught cursive handwriting (3rd grade). I actually prefer cursive, as I can write faster and much neater (especially as a lefty). It increases my productivity. IMO, while there may be “no need” to teach cursive handwriting anymore, kids should be given the opportunity to try it out and decide for themselves. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 2:24:22 PM EDT
[#45]
I just did exactly that with a life insurance policy. There wasnt a way to digitally sign the paperwork, so i just used the signature thing included in adobe. Typed in my name, made it look fancy, and plopped it into the sig block. Ins company accepted it no problem.
Thats a lot different than customs shit though. I'd want either PKI certs, something on a pen pad, or wet ink. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 3:48:00 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: it's dumb and you're not going to convince me it matters. I can sign more sensitive documents for a mortgage, etc. using online utilities. In healthcare you can fax all sorts of stuff you are not allowed to email, and no one has a fax machine anymore. Faxes are all sent via email now. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 4:36:59 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In healthcare you can fax all sorts of stuff you are not allowed to email, and no one has a fax machine anymore. Faxes are all sent via email now. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: it's dumb and you're not going to convince me it matters. I can sign more sensitive documents for a mortgage, etc. using online utilities. In healthcare you can fax all sorts of stuff you are not allowed to email, and no one has a fax machine anymore. Faxes are all sent via email now. Not sure how that applies nowadays. |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 4:52:20 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The origins of "fax only" for healthcare is because, since fax's are analog, they (supposedly) cannot be read if intercepted/hacked between sender and receiver. So it had its' own "security." Not sure how that applies nowadays. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: it's dumb and you're not going to convince me it matters. I can sign more sensitive documents for a mortgage, etc. using online utilities. In healthcare you can fax all sorts of stuff you are not allowed to email, and no one has a fax machine anymore. Faxes are all sent via email now. Not sure how that applies nowadays. It depends on the fax machines and your threat model. I don't think actual encryption is common. Also, I think that the reason healthcare started using faxes first is simply that faxes were more available before email for many institutions. and they hate spending money on IT. === For example, fax data is sent with no cryptographic protections; anyone who can tap a phone line can instantly intercept all data transmitted across it. "Fax is perceived as a secure method of data transmission," says Balmas. "That’s a huge misconception—it’s absolutely not secure." https://www.wired.com/story/fax-machine-vulnerabilities/ === One medical worker recalled a fax fiasco from the 1990s when he practically sent medical records to the moon. “The FBI called about a half-hour later and asked how I got the number,” he said. “I told them that I was faxing Minnesota. They told me I had faxed NASA.” ... In short, economics gave hospitals plenty of reasons not to connect their records with other hospitals — to stick with a clunky technology, like fax, that makes it hard to transmit information. And the government didn’t give any incentives to connect — it stopped at digitizing medicine, falling short of the interoperability that patients actually want. https://www.vox.com/health-care/2017/10/30/16228054/american-medical-system-fax-machines-why |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 5:43:25 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It depends on the fax machines and your threat model. I don't think actual encryption is common. Also, I think that the reason healthcare started using faxes first is simply that faxes were more available before email for many institutions. and they hate spending money on IT. === For example, fax data is sent with no cryptographic protections; anyone who can tap a phone line can instantly intercept all data transmitted across it. "Fax is perceived as a secure method of data transmission," says Balmas. "That's a huge misconception it's absolutely not secure." https://www.wired.com/story/fax-machine-vulnerabilities/ === One medical worker recalled a fax fiasco from the 1990s when he practically sent medical records to the moon. "The FBI called about a half-hour later and asked how I got the number," he said. "I told them that I was faxing Minnesota. They told me I had faxed NASA." ... In short, economics gave hospitals plenty of reasons not to connect their records with other hospitals to stick with a clunky technology, like fax, that makes it hard to transmit information. And the government didn't give any incentives to connect it stopped at digitizing medicine, falling short of the interoperability that patients actually want. https://www.vox.com/health-care/2017/10/30/16228054/american-medical-system-fax-machines-why Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: it's dumb and you're not going to convince me it matters. I can sign more sensitive documents for a mortgage, etc. using online utilities. In healthcare you can fax all sorts of stuff you are not allowed to email, and no one has a fax machine anymore. Faxes are all sent via email now. Not sure how that applies nowadays. It depends on the fax machines and your threat model. I don't think actual encryption is common. Also, I think that the reason healthcare started using faxes first is simply that faxes were more available before email for many institutions. and they hate spending money on IT. === For example, fax data is sent with no cryptographic protections; anyone who can tap a phone line can instantly intercept all data transmitted across it. "Fax is perceived as a secure method of data transmission," says Balmas. "That's a huge misconception it's absolutely not secure." https://www.wired.com/story/fax-machine-vulnerabilities/ === One medical worker recalled a fax fiasco from the 1990s when he practically sent medical records to the moon. "The FBI called about a half-hour later and asked how I got the number," he said. "I told them that I was faxing Minnesota. They told me I had faxed NASA." ... In short, economics gave hospitals plenty of reasons not to connect their records with other hospitals to stick with a clunky technology, like fax, that makes it hard to transmit information. And the government didn't give any incentives to connect it stopped at digitizing medicine, falling short of the interoperability that patients actually want. https://www.vox.com/health-care/2017/10/30/16228054/american-medical-system-fax-machines-why |
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Posted: 6/27/2024 5:53:22 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The origins of "fax only" for healthcare is because, since fax's are analog, they (supposedly) cannot be read if intercepted/hacked between sender and receiver. So it had its' own "security." Not sure how that applies nowadays. Paper docs sitting on an open fax tray. SECURE! (I know they have password to print functions, I also know their use is less than universal.) |
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