Think I found a solution for my issue without risking my job and jail time.  

Especially since I'm the facility maintenance manager, it's entirely fine to carry something like this openly on my belt.  

Awesome Thanks for sharing.

I thought I was the only one left with a maglite, and I’m only 34

I don’t even know if the batteries are any good
I have surefires and streamlight  when I need light.

40 year old LE collection

No Arfcom Love for the classic "Guard Rail Nut on a Length of Paracord" anymore?

I witnessed an LEO dispatch a full grown doe with an ASP.

'Twas not pretty.

ASP sucks.

If you want a strong Baton, get an RCB Peacekeeper. I've had a pair of those from back when they were made by Wilmoth.

I've bent an ASP with a single full power swing on a sandbag. The Wilmoth batons are still holding strong. They're significantly heavier, though, and they're designed to be tip/forward heavy (which is another reason they hit a lot harder).

The steel Bonowi is another strong baton, but more expensive and harder to find.

This cat understands



I'm dividing by zero here. Unless it was user error, I've never heard or seen of such stuff. Not pointed at you; just saying the sap was the nonelectric TASER.



Haven't heard of a bonowi, but truth on the rest. ASP was designed by and for risk adverse people. Here, you wanted a baton, use this one. lol

Tennessee's read similar. It's weird because, no baton maker would ever say it was designed to inflict serious bodily injury or death. Nor any of the sap makers I knew of.



Dunno. Are you in the habit of carrying fishing accoutrements? Bird stuff? Most reasonable people carry change. Some would like to do it in a more stylish manner. (shrugs) buy a better attorney is all I can say

I think a better ( prosecution ) attorney will have no problem convincing a jury that a coin purse is actually a weapon.

I would rather just get the ccw and carry a sap.

At the end of the day, you are gambling on the DA dropping the case or the jury finding you not guilty.

I bet there is not one single purse company making that kind of purse. And all the companies that do, make saps too.

Ok then.......

What are the two on the left?

Hitting a person in any place with an impact weapon will earn you a felony assault charge unless you're a cop or otherwise justified in using deadly force. I can't think of a single state where that isn't the case.

That being said, saps and other types of blackjacks/batons are great for use as backup weapons to CCWers. I prefer a good dagger, though. I can conceal a dagger but not a sap, here in Ohio.

Hmm I’m going to consider the source on this comment

Face book group.
Alot of makers on here.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/344419813172365/?ref=share&mibextid=NSMWBT

If you want to stop a guy but not shoot him or stab him up, a sap, or hose section filled with sand or shot is a great tool. I've worked out a few guys with various weapons and a sap or jack will do the job and not kill or scar a guy up if you know what you're doing.

Looking at some Boston Leather saps, whats the preferred lanyard design?

Loop:


Or side strap:

Consider anything I've said in the past all you want, but here's Texas law on deadly weapons, which defines clubs. I'd imagine a lawyer would tell you a sap is a deadly weapon.

I made some interesting leather "parking change" holders just for something to do:

1.  A round pouch about the size of a tennis ball that has "parking change" stamped on both sides and it hangs from about 12" of braided para chord.  Fill it with coins and it has a hell of an impact.

2.  A 12" long by 2" wide "parking change" pouch that allows me to stack about $20 worth of quarters slanted on an angle so it is flexible.  It has "parking change" stamped on both sides.  Imagine a stack of quarters that is then pushed over sideways so they are laying like a bunch of dominoes...those are inside the "change holder".

The last one I made wasn't nearly as "elegant" as the first two.  I turned leather inside out and sewed a 14" long X 1.25" wide leather pouch with dental floss.  After sewing it, I turned it back smooth side out.  I put a .25" inch wound round spring inside then filled it with really fine lead shot.  There is no mistaking it's intent.

Do you plan on living in a concrete sailboat and being a bouncer at a local bar in the Keys by chance?

pics of #2?

how does it close?

Attached File

This guy treated several people poorly…..tons of online proof.  One almost filed a police report as the owner was sending images of the guys wife and children back to him.

If you know what you're doing, then yes, you won't kill or scar a guy with a blackjack or a sap.

The legal reality is this: non-LEOs are expected to use the minimum force that is necessary to repel or end an unlawful attack upon their person, and this "minimum force" can vary widely. LEOs get to use force that may be unnecessary but considered reasonable under the context because it's their job to confront and apprehend dangerous persons. Many LEOs are trained and certified to use impact weapons.

In a just world, punching would be enough to deploy a sap, because punching is wholly capable of causing death or serious injury and should therefore be considered deadly force, but the legal system doesn't see it that way. You might be able to get away with using a sap if you get punched in the face repeatedly, it just depends.

ETA: also, in a just world, there would be laws in place to clarify that arm and leg strikes with an impact weapon wouldn't be deadly force in the context of self-defense. Reality is often disappointing. There's also been some cases I've read about non-LEOs charged with felony assault for using tasers or pepper spray. Obviously bullshit cases, but the legal system is a fickle thing.

I tried to purchase one, after two or three emails D3 stopped responding, after I tried confirming color and asking where to send the check. It was the tail end of the pandemic so I figured it wasn’t meant to be. I went ahead and bought a few Boston Leathers instead…

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/beware-foster-impact-devices-blackjacks.1599793/

Where do I apply?

I’ve dealt with Scott and todd Foster dozens and dozens of times.  They are always super cool.  Always.

Am I to understand that a hobbyist with a side business doesn’t respond immediately or something? I’m not reading 5 pages of fudds ashing pall malls into their hungry man dinners while they kick their dogs

BUCHEIMER#7980

Attached File

The foster brothers have always been GTG with me.... they are busy and you have to be patient but the jacks are tier 1

Exactly.  Just be respectful and patient.  Don’t bug them.  They are HOUNDED 24/7.

I haven't read the entire thread.
Foster's is apparently great but almost unobtainium.
I have some from Wyatt Derr on Facebook. They are nice.
Edit : I think He also makes the change purse type.

Attached File

Oh, I agree. Those saps look great, especially the one on the right.

Nice knives, too... A good karambit is hard to beat.

The one on the right is unsprung but has a good "stiff flex" if that makes sense.
A karambit is hard to beat. A great weapon retention tool.

Edit: A little off topic, that Emerson on the left is my daily carry.

These are collection pieces and not intended for traditional use. They may not be carried or used under any circumstances

Is this a "not selling weapons" defense of some sort ?

No idea.  As a side note, I hate posting on an iPad.  Somehow I nuked that post.

I have purchased two from ddwhips. Good communication and solid product.

So, people looking for options other than shooting and information on how to correctly use them is funny??

Why are you here?

I'm only here for the weed threads, and to bash Trump,?? and for the data mining threads.

This thread has inspired me. I had a bizarre altercation at a light rail station the other day. It was at our airport terminal station which doesn't normally attract human excrement. But not on this day. I was flying international so I couldn't carry. Had this drugged out lookin, schizophrenic black dude hanging out in an enclosed, heated area. It's a decently sized area but he made it feel small as he orbited around it, cursing at the air, eyeballing everyone, laughing menacingly. Finally, he took interest in me. Came up to about 24" from my face, told me he was gonna beat my ass and shoot me while punching his open hand with his fist, eyes absolutely locked on me. I had been avoiding eye contact until he came up to me. Then I was focused on him. I told him he'd better get the fuck away from me. He began another, more furious orbit around the room, cursing at the air and saying what he was gonna do to me. I noticed that everyone (about a dozen) in the room had eyes locked on the floor or their phones trying to not attract his attention. But I couldn't keep my eyes off him now, watching his hands to see if he pulled a weapon. I stepped outside to increase distance and began to call 911. This infuriated him further saying "I keel cops, mothafucka! I keel cops ah day!" I give the dispatcher his description and our location as the train pulls in. I watched him get on and I deliberately got into a different car just as the doors are closing. Then I realized our two cars are connected! Fuck! Now his pacing the full length of the two cars, violently swearing and eye fucking me. 911 said they'd keep an eye out for him. Great...
I get off at the next station feeling bare-assed naked without a good weapon. When I'm home I'm armed all the time. Usually, even in my home. When I fly domestic I'm armed too. But I can't do it for 99% of international flying. Inside airport security is never an issue anyway. But that short ride on the light rail for international flying has been a chink in my armor. Again, usually the stations at the airport are trouble free. But wouldn't you know that the one time I couldn't be armed, however brief, is the time that a schizo decides he wants to murder me.

Then this thread comes up. I had an idea. I remembered a custom paracord handle I'd had made once for a backpack that I used to fly with. The old one tore in half so this one was extra tough. I put a padlock on that baby and, ta-da, I have a weapon that when disassembled, I believe I can take through security anywhere. It weighs 13.6oz in total.




I gotta get a different padlock, of course. Don't want to crush somebody with a gov issued lock.

If people understand how to use saps and the legal implications of using a sap in self-defense, then why should they not carry a sap? There may be instances you need to use deadly force but a gun may not be the best option as opposed to an impact weapon.

In the instances that saps have been used, it's in the unwritten social contract to not involve Jonathan Lawrence. I've NEVER involved law enforcement in hundreds of physical interactions, some of which led to ER visits for me nor have the other participants.

The cops had a Desert waterbag on the grill when they went to the bomb site.
Very period correct.

anyone own the desantis city slicker?

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1016613717



any feedback on it?