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Link Posted: 11/19/2021 11:20:01 AM EDT
[#1]
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Quoted:
Frankly, I helped a femaie friend buy a handgun, and she settled on a 9mm S & W Shield EZ.

I think we might go that route, but I wanted to see if there's a 9mm 1911 that is just universally loved first.
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I know they’re a boutique low volume gun but the Kahr M9 and Mk9 triggers are stupidly simple to be smooth with.  I have an Mk40 and I could outshoot my Glock model 22 accuracy wise with it.

No safety except for the long sweep of the trigger, which is buttery smooth and light.
Link Posted: 11/19/2021 11:41:00 AM EDT
[#2]
There is a lot of WTF going on in here.

OP so you want to get the lady a 1911 pistol to resolve trigger control issue is what I gather.  So here is my $.02...
Changing pistol to resolve a trigger issue may not yield the results you expect and buying before letting her try is absolutely the worst decision I and many people have made.  My suggestion is go to a range that rents and has a selection of different pistols to try and let her try before you buy.  That is one thing another is buying a different pistol to resolve trigger issues is not going to fix your problem.  If she cannot exercise trigger fundamentals on a Glock it will show on any other pistol you decide to buy.  Now it may not show close in on a pistol with a lighter trigger but back her up and it will start showing.  Millions of people have bought Glocks and been able to shoot them just fine with the triggers they come with and I went through this already with the wife unit myself.  At the end of all this one positive may come out of it you will end up with several 9mm pistols so make sure you like the pistol when you buy.

Pistols you should try and let her try
Sig P226, P229, P320, P365
Glock Gen5 17/19, 43/43x/48
M&P 9 2.0 Compact, Shield line up
CZ P-10F/C, P-07/09, or a 75 series
Walther PDP or PPQ
Ruger Security 9, LCP max
1911 9mm

Let her choose what she likes do not try and influence her decision only guide her away from options you recognize she may have difficulty with.  When I say difficulty ones where she cannot reach or operate the controls of the pistol easily.
Link Posted: 11/19/2021 1:02:09 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
There is a lot of WTF going on in here.

OP so you want to get the lady a 1911 pistol to resolve trigger control issue is what I gather.  So here is my $.02...
Changing pistol to resolve a trigger issue may not yield the results you expect and buying before letting her try is absolutely the worst decision I and many people have made.  My suggestion is go to a range that rents and has a selection of different pistols to try and let her try before you buy.  That is one thing another is buying a different pistol to resolve trigger issues is not going to fix your problem.  If she cannot exercise trigger fundamentals on a Glock it will show on any other pistol you decide to buy.  Now it may not show close in on a pistol with a lighter trigger but back her up and it will start showing.  Millions of people have bought Glocks and been able to shoot them just fine with the triggers they come with and I went through this already with the wife unit myself.  At the end of all this one positive may come out of it you will end up with several 9mm pistols so make sure you like the pistol when you buy.

Pistols you should try and let her try
Sig P226, P229, P320, P365
Glock Gen5 17/19, 43/43x/48
M&P 9 2.0 Compact, Shield line up
CZ P-10F/C, P-07/09, or a 75 series
Walther PDP or PPQ
Ruger Security 9, LCP max
1911 9mm

Let her choose what she likes do not try and influence her decision only guide her away from options you recognize she may have difficulty with.  When I say difficulty ones where she cannot reach or operate the controls of the pistol easily.
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This
Link Posted: 11/20/2021 12:09:46 AM EDT
[#4]
1911 in 9mm.  NO don't.

Get the single action auto, designed to shoot 9mm that was partially designed but JMB.

Its called a High Power.

Springfield SA-35 is a good start. You can get it and blast away or its a really good foundation to build a nice High Power out of later after you shoot it some.
Link Posted: 11/20/2021 11:58:13 AM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
Try a Walther PPQ or PDP.
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Or better still, a PPS.  
Link Posted: 11/20/2021 12:28:20 PM EDT
[#6]
Colt Competition with factory ammo.

Reloads that run fine in my Walther won't seat in the Colt. But no hiccups with factory ammo.
Link Posted: 11/21/2021 10:06:17 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
DW Vigil or Guardian.    I carry my Vigil commander length daily, and it has ran flawless.
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If you definitely want a 1911 style gun in 9mm for carry, the Guardian is the one I would get. if you want something smaller or less expensive, take a look at the Sig P938

If you open to considering staying with a striker fired gun but just don't like the Glock, Sig P320 (or P365) or CZ P10c are reliably guns that I personally feel have better ergos and triggers then the Glock equivalents.
Link Posted: 11/21/2021 3:05:06 PM EDT
[#8]
Wilson ACP 9mm Commander, Wilson Experior, DW Guardian.  Also take a look at the Staccato C.  But honestly, when you talk reliability, that will depend on the particular gun.  



Link Posted: 11/21/2021 9:00:15 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Have a gunsmith look at that mag release all the Hi Powers that I have had were flawless in operation and quite accurate.
I have to agree with you on the Hi Power safety being too small to be ideal however the new Springfield Armory version appears much improved.  Perhaps the term expert only is an over statement but one absolutely must be willing to train and spend time using it.  This is not a platform that you can load it put it in the dresser drawer and take it out 20 years later to use in an emergency and be proficient with.   I have see several negligent discharges with 1911 one fatal.

It is a thinking mans weapon.

For a novice having problems with a glock who is wanting a lighter trigger a DA/SA either a revolver or semi auto is a safe choice, even a single action revolver can be a great place to start and fine tune those skills on sight control and trigger control but until someone  learns muzzle discipline and off target off trigger, they are not safe with any firearm  and the 1911 is not very forgiving.  With a 1911 if the safety is off the grip safety is depressed and the trigger is depressed they go bang and while that makes sense to most of us what seems to f up is that people grasp with their whole hand sometimes without thinking about what they are doing unintentionally causing the hammer to fall under certain conditions. brakes slammed on in the car, trip and fall, gunsmith trying to force a feeding issue round goes into the chamber and surprise grip safety and trigger were depressed but he sure had a solid grip on that handle ...Bang.  De-cocking the hammer to 1/4 cock or to carry with the hammer down and have the hammer get away from you......  Walk through a commercial building after finding an open door in the middle of the night and let an air compressor kick on... I know a cop who shot an air compressor that way.  Have someone try to run over you with a car and dive to the side landing on your shoulder ....  bang ... people grip with their whole hand as a reflex under certain conditions ....that finger has to be off the trigger.  Note:  they have only been teaching  Off target off trigger for about the last 25 years before that it didn't exist.

1911 is a thinking mans gun.
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You state all these accidental discharges with the 1911 involving disengaging two separate safeties and pulling the trigger. How is that any different than the DA/SA/striker fired guns you have suggested prior where the safety is literally a heavy trigger pull. Regardless of the firearm in question, squeezing the trigger is the issue, not what type of action it is. I have seen ADs from all types of firearms, M9s, M-16s, 240s, 249s etc. proper trigger discipline would have solved all of them. All guns should be a thinking man’s gun. How are any of the guns you mention a safer choice than a 1911? You pull the trigger it goes bang, no grip safety, no thumb safety just a marginally heavier trigger. If you “grip with your whole hand” “slam the brakes” etc, the trigger will still be pulled. Keep your thumb safety on and you don’t have these issues. How many injuries have come from people holstering a striker fired gun and something catches the trigger? I have a friend that is missing his ring finger because he shot it off with a Glock trying to disassemble it and didn’t clear it first.

My point is, if you treat any firearm as a nonthinking mans firearm, you’re an idiot. Every example you have provided would have been an issue with any handgun, they all involved the trigger being manipulated while the safeties were disengaged. 2lb, 5lb, 15lb trigger pull wouldn’t make a difference, A 1911 was my first gun and I daily carry one to this day, never had an issue. I have had  a negligent discharge with an AK because I wasn’t following proper weapons safety rules like a dumbass. Don’t blame the gun, blame the operator, in that case it was all on me.
Link Posted: 11/22/2021 9:22:53 PM EDT
[#10]
Take a look at the sig p320.  You can change the plastic lower out to whatever type of grip you would like.  You can also get one that is already cut for an optic. The guns have a rail for a light. I am pretty sure you can also add a thumb safety if you like that feature of the 1911.

If you really want a single action 9mm that is affordable and reliable, that Springfield Hi Power would be good to look at.  It holds more ammo than most 1911 9mms.  The downside is that the Hi Power is not cut for an optic and lacks a rail for a light.

The Staccato 2011 guns, Wilson 1911, and Nighthawk 1911's seem to be reliable. You can put a light and red dot on the Staccato. They are just a good bit more than a Springfield Hi Power or a Sig 320.
Link Posted: 11/24/2021 12:44:45 AM EDT
[#11]
Wilson Combat Lightweight Professional 9mm is flawless using WC ETM 10 round mags

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Link Posted: 11/24/2021 2:47:23 AM EDT
[#12]
m&p 2.0 with thumb safety from an operational standpoint is the most reliable 1911 clone. nearly identical ergonomics, streamlined and balanced with space age materials for greater reliability without need of extreme precision tolerances
Link Posted: 11/25/2021 1:05:55 PM EDT
[#13]
Dan Wesson Specialist. I had good luck with the Metal Form "springfield" style mags and the Metal Form 10rd mags were identical to what my gun came with from the factory and worked flawlessly.

I had quite a few Wilson Combat ETMs but if I pushed up on those while dropping the slide it would stop the slide from going into battery. Realized it was because the Wilson mags sat a little higher in the gun and the slide would rub on the top of the feedlips if I pushed up on them. They worked fine during actual shooting though.

I liked the DW but got rid of it because I just couldn't retrain myself to not grip the gun so high that I had trouble disengaging the grip safety.
Link Posted: 11/25/2021 1:46:44 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Dan Wesson Specialist. I had good luck with the Metal Form "springfield" style mags and the Metal Form 10rd mags were identical to what my gun came with from the factory and worked flawlessly.

I had quite a few Wilson Combat ETMs but if I pushed up on those while dropping the slide it would stop the slide from going into battery. Realized it was because the Wilson mags sat a little higher in the gun and the slide would rub on the top of the feedlips if I pushed up on them. They worked fine during actual shooting though.

I liked the DW but got rid of it because I just couldn't retrain myself to not grip the gun so high that I had trouble disengaging the grip safety.
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Not a 1911, but this would be my choice for something vaguely similar.  
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Link Posted: 11/27/2021 5:32:36 AM EDT
[#15]
None of them…but I’d get a dan wesson
Link Posted: 11/27/2021 10:30:51 AM EDT
[#16]
You want a 9mm in a 1911? Simple. Get a gun MADE for the 9mm round. All of the other 1911s in 9mm are just work arounds to get the shorter 9mm round to work in it. Springfield Armory's EMP is a gun designed to take the 9mm (and .40). Get yourself one of these. S/A EMP
Link Posted: 11/27/2021 7:30:17 PM EDT
[#17]
I'd gander to say the glock trigger isn't the problem. It's the glock angle. Have her rent a VP9, PPQ, and a M&P 2.0 and see if she shoots them better. I bet she does. Hard pass on 1911 9mm
Link Posted: 11/29/2021 4:26:40 PM EDT
[#18]
Just picked up a 5" Rock Island from a fellow arfcommer and took it to the range for the first time a few hours ago. Older model with the billboard, ambi safety and Novak style sights. Polished the all the parkerized internals until shiny last night, with no issues with fit or function afterwards.  

Ran my own cast 125, 147, and jacketed 115s through it without a hiccup, 200 rounds worth. Used mecgar 9 round, mecgar 10 round, and hooper gun works 9 round mags. Each type of ammo functioned flawlessly through each.

Glad I picked it up, I've always wanted one.
Link Posted: 11/29/2021 7:44:52 PM EDT
[#19]
Have her try a CZ.

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It’s really hard to beat an M&P 2.0 compact though.
Link Posted: 12/2/2021 1:13:42 PM EDT
[#20]
On topic, the most extensively tested and most reliable 1911 chambered in 9mm that I know of was the Springfield / Warren Tactical Series Operator.

https://pistol-training.com/archives/7850

Link Posted: 12/3/2021 12:03:00 AM EDT
[#21]
I've owned a Kimber 1911 9mm ultra carry for close to 20 yrs (yeah Kimber, but it's been great). It's the most accurate pistol I own and of course the trigger is fantastic.

I would also recommend Sig P229, SRT models, another excellent trigger.
Link Posted: 12/3/2021 12:35:08 AM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
A 1911 is an expert only gun. It is a thinking man’s gun.  I have even seen a trained police gunsmith accident discharge a 1911.
Go look for an H&K P30 or a similar Sig like P226.  Those have a heavy double action first shot followed by single action. But because they have a de-cocking feature you reduce the risk of accidental discharge. The ultra light first shot trigger pull of a 1911 which has to be carried cocked and locked with the chamber loaded is a problem for inexperienced shooters. Army reduced the risk by carrying a 1911 with chamber empty but for a self defense gun an empty chamber will get you killed. When carrying a 1911 one has to regularly check that the safety is still on and has not accidentally been bumped to off. That is not a huge problem because of the grip safety a feature that the Browning HiPower lacks. If it’s a range only gun go Wilson Combat or for a fourth the price the new Springfield Armory clone of a Browning HiPower. But understand the risk.  Some people should never progress past double action revolvers then thay have the safe carry option of the heavy double action trigger but can cock the hammer for that light trigger to make a precise controlled shot. That is what the guns like H&K P30 and Sig P226 P229 mimic. That heavy first pull unless you intentionally cock it saves inexperienced shooters a lot of negligent discharges.
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Link Posted: 12/3/2021 7:56:02 AM EDT
[#23]
Am I the only one that owns/shoots/carries  a 1911 and doesn’t find a stock Glock trigger hateful? If you hate it that bad add a 3.5 connector. Or get one if the other wonder 9. For small hands the vp9 has to be high on the list.
Link Posted: 12/3/2021 9:37:47 AM EDT
[#24]
My Colt Lightweight Commander in 9 mm has been great. Good size and balance. I have small paws so my go to pistol is a 1911.
Link Posted: 12/5/2021 8:20:22 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Am I the only one that owns/shoots/carries  a 1911 and doesn’t find a stock Glock trigger hateful? If you hate it that bad add a 3.5 connector. Or get one if the other wonder 9. For small hands the vp9 has to be high on the list.
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Nope, I own and shoot Glocks well. I don't  like carrying them. They're fat and print more. Same with their mags.

I'd try a g48 and even be happy with the 10rd mags. The reason I haven't is just a matter of cost. Gun, mags, holsters, mag pouches, sights, more 9mm ammo, etc
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