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Posted: 8/18/2015 5:48:20 PM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
DD has a countdown timer for the 308 on their website now. As of today, 43 days to go. I set a date in my calendar on my phone. 
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Posted: 8/20/2015 9:16:15 AM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I set a date in my calendar on my phone. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
DD has a countdown timer for the 308 on their website now. As of today, 43 days to go. I set a date in my calendar on my phone. Amazingly good news! |
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Posted: 8/26/2015 2:31:11 PM EST
[#3]
So. . . . . DD5V1 is the actual model name of this rifle?
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Posted: 8/26/2015 3:47:06 PM EST
[#4]
recoilmagazineRECOIL is on the range with @recoilboss today filming a @danieldefense DD5V1 video. Video will be out first of October 2015. #danieldefense #dd5v1 #7.62 #308 #videoreview #recoil #recoilweb #recoilmagazine #iain #iainharrison #nightforceoptics #surefire #bts 
recoilmagazine@recoilboss is now ready to test the @danieldefense DD5V1 out to 700 yards and up. Stay tuned for video review first of October 2015 and rifle available from DD 10/1/15. #dmr #danieldefense #dd5v1 #recoil #recoilweb #recoilmagazine #iain #iainharrison #nightforceoptics #federalpremium #7.62 #308 #lancersysyems #bts |
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Posted: 8/31/2015 4:02:49 PM EST
[#5]
31 days to go.
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Posted: 9/4/2015 1:13:29 PM EST
[#6]
Okay..... now I am getting antsy. I have been waiting for awhile to add a 7.62 to the stable and had it narrowed down to only one other mfg or waiting on DD to produce one. Lucky for me I have not bought yet and now see a count down for the DD and can hardly wait. I have been hoping for a little more info as in bbl lengths and even a finish choice. And about twenty other questions. Hurry up and wait. Now to figure out what will go to finance this. Decisions, decisions.
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Posted: 9/10/2015 9:10:50 AM EST
[#7]
I just sold my M&P10 and am picking up an Aero 308 from a friend of mine today and I can't imagine that I'll be keeping that one too long when this gun starts showing up at our distributors.
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Posted: 9/12/2015 2:47:18 PM EST
[#8]
So is this countdown to the release of the rifle itself or just information about the rifle?
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Posted: 9/14/2015 7:09:11 AM EST
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Look at what I got hands on at the Houston Hunting show about two, three weeks ago... 
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m317/airforcefd/11781725_10153571977447053_4951539118932193248_n_zpseha336pi.jpg I will be ordering one when they become available!  Looks like a different handguard- - - yes ? |
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Posted: 9/14/2015 9:20:52 AM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks like a different handguard- - - yes ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Look at what I got hands on at the Houston Hunting show about two, three weeks ago...
http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m317/airforcefd/11781725_10153571977447053_4951539118932193248_n_zpseha336pi.jpg I will be ordering one when they become available! Looks like a different handguard- - - yes ? Nope it's the same as the production handguard. It's longer than the early tease photos from the original magazine article. |
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Posted: 9/29/2015 5:08:40 PM EST
[#11]
Less than 2 days till release.
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Posted: 9/30/2015 12:05:36 PM EST
[#12]
One day to go!
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Posted: 10/1/2015 9:31:01 AM EST
[#13]
Today is the day!
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Posted: 10/1/2015 2:45:19 PM EST
[#14]
It's out!!!!!!!!
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Posted: 10/1/2015 3:02:57 PM EST
[#15]
They went and priced it at more than a SCAR 17s
I'll pass. |
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Posted: 10/1/2015 3:07:14 PM EST
[#16]
DD5V1
$2,899.00 8.3 lbs -Innovative 4-bolt connection system securely attaches free-floating CHF barrel and KeyMod handguard mounts securely to upper without barrel nut -Bolt and carrier designed with oversized cam pin, enhanced extractor geometry, and dual ejectors -Ambidextrous safety selector, magazine catch, bolt release, and configurable modular charging handle -Lower receiver features integral oversized trigger guard and flared magazine well for SR-25 type magazines - Geissele SSA 2-Stage Trigger with its smooth 2.5 lb take-up and clean 2 lb break |
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Posted: 10/1/2015 3:39:55 PM EST
[#17]
I'm digging most of it except the KeyMod. I'm still hoping that they make an M-Lok handguard instead of DickMod.
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Posted: 10/1/2015 3:57:03 PM EST
[#18]
wow, its like they are not even trying to release the gun, nothing on twitter,nothing on here or even other gun news sites, just a blip on their own website with generic details.
Edit found it out of stock but priced at $2551 at Tombstone Tactical. Still about $500 more than was willing to pay even as a DD fanboy. |
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Posted: 10/1/2015 7:50:57 PM EST
[#19]
Agreed. I am a DD enthusiast for $2500? Not happening. I would have been game at $1800-2000 street price. And how about a regular rail?
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Posted: 10/2/2015 4:51:13 AM EST
[#20]
Get the price down to about 2k and I'm interested .... At $2500-$2600 street price there's alot of options already out there that are proven
At that price point I can get a Scar 17s, LMT MWS, PWS MK series, LaRue Predatar(within $200-$300) |
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Posted: 10/2/2015 7:23:01 AM EST
[#21]
1800? youre dumb as fuck. thats what MSRP is on some of their 5.56 guns. keep shooting your DPMS
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Posted: 10/2/2015 7:59:44 AM EST
[#22]
You must have trouble reading in between your babbling. I own two Daniel Defense rifles now. I know what they cost. And I know no one is going to buy a 762 rifle that has a MSRP above a SCAR17. One that isn't a Larue or KAC anyway.
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Posted: 10/2/2015 8:00:43 AM EST
[#23]
Need more info on gas system.
Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 10/2/2015 10:54:36 AM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You must have trouble reading in between your babbling. I own two Daniel Defense rifles now. I know what they cost. And I know no one is going to buy a 762 rifle that has a MSRP above a SCAR17. One that isn't a Larue or KAC anyway. I will. And the MSRP of a SCAR 17s is $3349.00 |
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Posted: 10/2/2015 11:58:30 AM EST
[#25]
Like i stated above if they can get the street price to 2k or a little over I would buy one..... If I'm dropping $2500+ on an AR10 platform it will be on a LaRue
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Posted: 10/2/2015 12:29:18 PM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Like i stated above if they can get the street price to 2k or a little over I would buy one..... If I'm dropping $2500+ on an AR10 platform it will be on a LaRue If it gets to $2K or lower I'd get one as well. |
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Posted: 10/2/2015 5:23:26 PM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I will. And the MSRP of a SCAR 17s is $3349.00 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You must have trouble reading in between your babbling. I own two Daniel Defense rifles now. I know what they cost. And I know no one is going to buy a 762 rifle that has a MSRP above a SCAR17. One that isn't a Larue or KAC anyway. I will. And the MSRP of a SCAR 17s is $3349.00 I couldn't find the SCAR MSRPs for either the 16 or 17. But for those saying it's expensive, I'm kind of in agreement. I took a sample of prices of .308 guns and their prices in relation to their 5.56 counterparts and the DD is1.8x as expensive as an equivalent 5.56. The KAC are the most expensive at 2x. I tried to use published MSRPs, but several (SCAR, HK, LWC, KAC) don't have MSRPs published on their websites, so I used prices from companies who had both guns listed. _________5.56_____308 SCAR____$2,995___$3,349___1.12 HK______$2,729____$3,423___1.25 GGP_____$2,000___$2,500___1.25 SIG______$1,885___$2,399___1.27 PWS_____$1,949___$2,599___1.33 LWRC____$2,349___$3,199___1.36 LMT LM8__$2,254___$3,148___1.40 Colt______$1,399___$1,999___1.43 OBR______$2,245___$3,370___1.50 tOBR_____$2,245___$3,370___1.50 tAR_______$1,807___$2,932___1.62 MWS_____$2,100___$3,565___1.70 DD_______$1,599___$2,899___1.81 KAC______$2,436___$4,861___2.00 |
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Posted: 10/2/2015 7:33:35 PM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I couldn't find the SCAR MSRPs for either the 16 or 17. But for those saying it's expensive, I'm kind of in agreement. I took a sample of prices of .308 guns and their prices in relation to their 5.56 counterparts and the DD is1.8x as expensive as an equivalent 5.56. The KAC are the most expensive at 2x. I tried to use published MSRPs, but several (SCAR, HK, LWC, KAC) don't have MSRPs published on their websites, so I used prices from companies who had both guns listed. _________5.56_____308 SCAR____$2,500___$2,900___1.16 HK______$2,729____$3,423___1.25 GGP_____$2,000___$2,500___1.25 SIG______$1,885___$2,399___1.27 PWS_____$1,949___$2,599___1.33 LWRC____$2,349___$3,199___1.36 LMT LM8__$2,254___$3,148___1.40 Colt______$1,399___$1,999___1.43 OBR______$2,245___$3,370___1.50 tOBR_____$2,245___$3,370___1.50 tAR_______$1,807___$2,932___1.62 MWS_____$2,100___$3,565___1.70 DD_______$1,599___$2,899___1.81 KAC______$2,436___$4,861___2.00 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
You must have trouble reading in between your babbling. I own two Daniel Defense rifles now. I know what they cost. And I know no one is going to buy a 762 rifle that has a MSRP above a SCAR17. One that isn't a Larue or KAC anyway. I will. And the MSRP of a SCAR 17s is $3349.00 I couldn't find the SCAR MSRPs for either the 16 or 17. But for those saying it's expensive, I'm kind of in agreement. I took a sample of prices of .308 guns and their prices in relation to their 5.56 counterparts and the DD is1.8x as expensive as an equivalent 5.56. The KAC are the most expensive at 2x. I tried to use published MSRPs, but several (SCAR, HK, LWC, KAC) don't have MSRPs published on their websites, so I used prices from companies who had both guns listed. _________5.56_____308 SCAR____$2,500___$2,900___1.16 HK______$2,729____$3,423___1.25 GGP_____$2,000___$2,500___1.25 SIG______$1,885___$2,399___1.27 PWS_____$1,949___$2,599___1.33 LWRC____$2,349___$3,199___1.36 LMT LM8__$2,254___$3,148___1.40 Colt______$1,399___$1,999___1.43 OBR______$2,245___$3,370___1.50 tOBR_____$2,245___$3,370___1.50 tAR_______$1,807___$2,932___1.62 MWS_____$2,100___$3,565___1.70 DD_______$1,599___$2,899___1.81 KAC______$2,436___$4,861___2.00 SCAR 16s $2995.00 |
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Posted: 10/2/2015 7:43:14 PM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SCAR 16s $2995.00 Thanks. That changes (noted above) the ratio to 1.12, which makes it even smaller, and is still the smallest difference between a 5.56 and its .308 rifle. |
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Posted: 10/4/2015 11:57:32 PM EST
[#30]
Blackmarket arms has the SCAR 17S in FDE for $2499.95
I wouldn't even consider looking at a AR in 308 unless it was $1500 or less. Zero interested in this rifle. For the price I would pick the SCAR everytime. |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 1:28:22 PM EST
[#31]
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those.
And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 2:29:25 PM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. I'm sure it's a great rifle and the price isn't out of line. My only comparison was "MSRP of 5.56 to .308" and DD ranks as having the second largest gap between the 2 types of rifles, and I was comparing rifles in its class, not DPMS or BM. I'm sure the street price will be lower. I'd love to see how well it performs and being a fan of DD I'm sure it will be great. |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 3:40:33 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm sure it's a great rifle and the price isn't out of line. My only comparison was "MSRP of 5.56 to .308" and DD ranks as having the second largest gap between the 2 types of rifles, and I was comparing rifles in its class, not DPMS or BM. I'm sure the street price will be lower. I'd love to see how well it performs and being a fan of DD I'm sure it will be great. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. I'm sure it's a great rifle and the price isn't out of line. My only comparison was "MSRP of 5.56 to .308" and DD ranks as having the second largest gap between the 2 types of rifles, and I was comparing rifles in its class, not DPMS or BM. I'm sure the street price will be lower. I'd love to see how well it performs and being a fan of DD I'm sure it will be great. That was to everyone in general, not directed towards you. |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 5:38:30 PM EST
[#34]
I'm soon to be in the market, and I ain't going to lie the idea of a 308 DD to sit beside the MK18 and MK12 is very tempting.
I'm gonna wait a while and see some reports before I buy anything. They are dangerously close to the price of a Larue, that will be my big hang up. Been there done that with a Scar 17 already. |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 7:23:55 PM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. The SCAR is overpriced but it's also imported which adds to the cost .... I still love my 17s and its a different platform No one on here owns one of these DD 7.62 rifles yet so none of us can say if it's on the same level as the larue, lmt and kac ..... I think it's harder for most myself included to spend that cash without seeing more testing/results The OBR and SR25 are incredibly accurate and proven ..... If the DD can group as tight as both of those rifles and maintain reliability then the DD will be a "bargain" |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 7:37:25 PM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The SCAR is overpriced but it's also imported which adds to the cost .... I still love my 17s and its a different platform No one on here owns one of these DD 7.62 rifles yet so none of us can say if it's on the same level as the larue, lmt and kac ..... I think it's harder for most myself included to spend that cash without seeing more testing/results The OBR and SR25 are incredibly accurate and proven ..... If the DD can group as tight as both of those rifles and maintain reliability then the DD will be a "bargain" Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. The SCAR is overpriced but it's also imported which adds to the cost .... I still love my 17s and its a different platform No one on here owns one of these DD 7.62 rifles yet so none of us can say if it's on the same level as the larue, lmt and kac ..... I think it's harder for most myself included to spend that cash without seeing more testing/results The OBR and SR25 are incredibly accurate and proven ..... If the DD can group as tight as both of those rifles and maintain reliability then the DD will be a "bargain" I can understand that, but with DD's track record this will be a great rifle. They aren't going to put out shit. |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 8:12:03 PM EST
[#37]
Sometimes you need to rain 7.62mm projectiles on target with great haste and precision. For this purpose, many look to an AR-10 style platform. This big brother to the AR-15 was developed prior to its ubiquitous little sibling, which was adopted by the U.S. military instead. While the Mk 11 and M110 7.62mm weapon systems have been fielded for service, there really is no Mil-spec standard for AR-10 platforms, as there is for the AR-15. Thus, there’s a patchwork of different types of specs and systems in the commercial market for .308 AR-pattern rifles.
Read More at RecoilWeb.com |
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Posted: 10/5/2015 8:46:01 PM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can understand that, but with DD's track record this will be a great rifle. They aren't going to put out shit. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. The SCAR is overpriced but it's also imported which adds to the cost .... I still love my 17s and its a different platform No one on here owns one of these DD 7.62 rifles yet so none of us can say if it's on the same level as the larue, lmt and kac ..... I think it's harder for most myself included to spend that cash without seeing more testing/results The OBR and SR25 are incredibly accurate and proven ..... If the DD can group as tight as both of those rifles and maintain reliability then the DD will be a "bargain" I can understand that, but with DD's track record this will be a great rifle. They aren't going to put out shit. I agree ..... I have an MK18 SBR and an older DDM4V1 both are fantastic I hope this rifle will be great |
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Posted: 10/6/2015 4:44:21 PM EST
[#39]
Joe, any word on an M-Lok variant instead of KeyMod?
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Posted: 10/7/2015 7:10:57 AM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Joe, any word on an M-Lok variant instead of KeyMod? No, sir. But I can guarantee that we will let everyone know if/when that happens. |
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Posted: 10/8/2015 7:07:49 AM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, sir. But I can guarantee that we will let everyone know if/when that happens. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Joe, any word on an M-Lok variant instead of KeyMod? No, sir. But I can guarantee that we will let everyone know if/when that happens. How about a regular rail then? |
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Posted: 10/8/2015 7:20:12 AM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How about a regular rail then? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Joe, any word on an M-Lok variant instead of KeyMod? No, sir. But I can guarantee that we will let everyone know if/when that happens. How about a regular rail then? This. Not a big modular rail fan, more of a quad rail guy. |
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Posted: 10/8/2015 11:36:38 AM EST
[#43]
Any chance of a California version with a bullet button installed
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Posted: 10/8/2015 4:05:35 PM EST
[#44]
Oooh! So nice!
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Posted: 10/11/2015 10:26:02 PM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm sure it's a great rifle and the price isn't out of line. My only comparison was "MSRP of 5.56 to .308" and DD ranks as having the second largest gap between the 2 types of rifles, and I was comparing rifles in its class, not DPMS or BM. I'm sure the street price will be lower. I'd love to see how well it performs and being a fan of DD I'm sure it will be great. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. I'm sure it's a great rifle and the price isn't out of line. My only comparison was "MSRP of 5.56 to .308" and DD ranks as having the second largest gap between the 2 types of rifles, and I was comparing rifles in its class, not DPMS or BM. I'm sure the street price will be lower. I'd love to see how well it performs and being a fan of DD I'm sure it will be great. I don't have a dog in this fight (not a .308 man myself, just here tonight on the DD side to research low pro gas blocks) but... Your chart says something different to me. According to your chart, with the SCAR-16 price corrected, the average selling price of the 5.56 NATO rifles listed is $2142 or about 33% over Daniel Defense. When you take out Colt (going through severe business problems) and Daniel Defense (the point of the chart) that 5.56 average jumps up to $2249, or 42% over DD's price. The average 7.62 NATO rifle price (of those listed) is $3083, or about 6.3% over DD. With Colt and DD taken out, that average jumps to $3188, or about 10% over DD's offering. Heck even if you remove KAC as an expensive ($4,861) outlyer your still at a $3036 average without Colt and DD, and a $2946 if you leave them in. My point is, the reason for the ratio seems to be that DD is selling their 5.56 NATO rifles significantly under the average of their competitors, not that they've priced their 7.62 NATO offering higher than the market. In other words, DD's 5.56 NATO rifles may be priced too cheap (if the point was to have a closer ratio) edited for clarity |
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Posted: 10/11/2015 10:58:50 PM EST
[#46]
This would be really interesting but a few things that are nagging me:
1. Chrome-lined barrel. Nitriding is clearly superior for accuracy and the 5.56 S2W barrels are all nitrided as well, so it's weird to see chrome lining here. 2. The S2W profile is a bit excessive. Medium profile would go a long way to getting this into the 7.x pound range. 3. 15" rail is a bit excessive, even a 12" rail is likely to be fine. 4. Why not an 18-20" variant with rifle-length gas system? |
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Posted: 10/11/2015 11:07:06 PM EST
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't have a dog in this fight (not a .308 man myself, just here tonight on the DD side to research low pro gas blocks) but... Your chart says something different to me. According to your chart, with the SCAR-16 price corrected, the average selling price of the 5.56 NATO rifles listed is $2142 or about 33% over Daniel Defense. When you take out Colt (going through severe business problems) and Daniel Defense (the point of the chart) that 5.56 average jumps up to $2249, or 42% over DD's price. The average 7.62 NATO rifle price (of those listed) is $3083, or about 6.3% over DD. With Colt and DD taken out, that average jumps to $3188, or about 10% over DD's offering. Heck even if you remove KAC as an expensive ($4,861) outlyer your still at a $3036 average without Colt and DD, and a $2946 if you leave them in. My point is, the reason for the ratio seems to be that DD is selling their 5.56 NATO rifles significantly under the average of their competitors, not that they've priced their 7.62 NATO offering higher than the market. In other words, DD's 5.56 NATO rifles may be priced too cheap (if the point was to have a closer ratio) edited for clarity Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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I think what a lot of people are failing to realize is that DD just didn't take existing design and just make it bigger to work with 308 specs. They are using better barrel steel, better bolt and BCG materials, and several other improvements. The Book of the AR15 that was released around Christmas last year goes over all of this. This rifle is the same category as LMT, KAC, and LaRue, you can't compare it with Armalite, DPMS or CMMG cause it is simply not the same quality of those. And for those who compare this to SCAR 17s, if you don't think that SCARs are grossly overpriced for what they are, I can't help you there. I'm sure it's a great rifle and the price isn't out of line. My only comparison was "MSRP of 5.56 to .308" and DD ranks as having the second largest gap between the 2 types of rifles, and I was comparing rifles in its class, not DPMS or BM. I'm sure the street price will be lower. I'd love to see how well it performs and being a fan of DD I'm sure it will be great. I don't have a dog in this fight (not a .308 man myself, just here tonight on the DD side to research low pro gas blocks) but... Your chart says something different to me. According to your chart, with the SCAR-16 price corrected, the average selling price of the 5.56 NATO rifles listed is $2142 or about 33% over Daniel Defense. When you take out Colt (going through severe business problems) and Daniel Defense (the point of the chart) that 5.56 average jumps up to $2249, or 42% over DD's price. The average 7.62 NATO rifle price (of those listed) is $3083, or about 6.3% over DD. With Colt and DD taken out, that average jumps to $3188, or about 10% over DD's offering. Heck even if you remove KAC as an expensive ($4,861) outlyer your still at a $3036 average without Colt and DD, and a $2946 if you leave them in. My point is, the reason for the ratio seems to be that DD is selling their 5.56 NATO rifles significantly under the average of their competitors, not that they've priced their 7.62 NATO offering higher than the market. In other words, DD's 5.56 NATO rifles may be priced too cheap (if the point was to have a closer ratio) edited for clarity I'd buy one of their 5.56 rifles if they offered a M-LOK hand-guard. |
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Posted: 10/11/2015 11:09:01 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This would be really interesting but a few things that are nagging me: 1. Chrome-lined barrel. Nitriding is clearly superior for accuracy and the 5.56 S2W barrels are all nitrided as well, so it's weird to see chrome lining here. 2. The S2W profile is a bit excessive. Medium profile would go a long way to getting this into the 7.x pound range. 3. 15" rail is a bit excessive, even a 12" rail is likely to be fine. 4. Why not an 18-20" variant with rifle-length gas system? These details have been puzzling me as well. A 18" nitride medium profile barrel would be a winner. + M-LOK hand-guard |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 7:11:31 PM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This would be really interesting but a few things that are nagging me: 1. Chrome-lined barrel. Nitriding is clearly superior for accuracy and the 5.56 S2W barrels are all nitrided as well, so it's weird to see chrome lining here. 2. The S2W profile is a bit excessive. Medium profile would go a long way to getting this into the 7.x pound range. 3. 15" rail is a bit excessive, even a 12" rail is likely to be fine. 4. Why not an 18-20" variant with rifle-length gas system? I'm guessing but it looks like the gun is kind of a dual-purpose/battle rifle type of platform that can be shot up close like a carbine and reach out if necessary. I think the longer rail allows it to be used in that battle rifle role -- it complements the modern shooting style that allows you to drive the muzzle etc. You also get a longer sight radius and more options for mounting accessories. You can get a lot done with a 16" AR-10 type gun. The barrel length options might just be matter of practicality and cost: It falls well into most people's requirements, there's a larger market for them, and so they're easier to sell. In general I think people do a lot of hand wringing about features and manufacturing techniques (chrome lining vs. nitriding, barrel profile, etc.) that won't have a measurable impact on performance for most people. The MK762 looks like a really handy rifle that covers a lot of ground and it has features that similarly priced guns don't have (ambi lower, CHF barrel, innovative rail design, etc.). |
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Posted: 10/12/2015 7:54:36 PM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm guessing but it looks like the gun is kind of a dual-purpose/battle rifle type of platform that can be shot up close like a carbine and reach out if necessary. I think the longer rail allows it to be used in that battle rifle role -- it complements the modern shooting style that allows you to drive the muzzle etc. You also get a longer sight radius and more options for mounting accessories. You can get a lot done with a 16" AR-10 type gun. The barrel length options might just be matter of practicality and cost: It falls well into most people's requirements, there's a larger market for them, and so they're easier to sell. In general I think people do a lot of hand wringing about features and manufacturing techniques (chrome lining vs. nitriding, barrel profile, etc.) that won't have a measurable impact on performance for most people. The MK762 looks like a really handy rifle that covers a lot of ground and it has features that similarly priced guns don't have (ambi lower, CHF barrel, innovative rail design, etc.). That's fair, but I suspect most people are going to be using optics of some sort and I kind of question whether it makes sense to enable people to have the extra 3" of rails to hang more heavy accessories. Nitrided barrels are as good as chrome-lining for corrosion resistance and hardness if not better, while retaining better accuracy, so I'm a fan of that type of barrel treatment seeing as how these rifles are probably never going to be used with a DIAS. I think the 18" option would be pretty good seeing as how that's the shortest practical length that appears to be possible with a rifle-length gas system. I was hoping that they would release a rifle that's about as heavy as the S&W M&P 10, the original AR-10 was right around 7.3 pounds with a 20 inch barrel so I'm really just hoping for something in the 7.x pound range for a light 18" 308 rifle. |
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