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Posted: 2/1/2013 11:09:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Brandi][Edited]
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Took the Grendel out yesterday for her first time and the first couple rounds seemed great but then a failure to eject, then a failure to feed. I cleared everything out and started again and had a couple more shots that were good. I let my bff shoot it and same thing...rounds not feeding correctly causing spent shells from ejecting and several of the brass had gouges in their bases. Some were ok but several were gouged and I'm not sure why...
Someone suggested it's probably the magazine. I know loading the magazine was a lot more difficult than my 5.56 mags but I don't know if Grendel mags are just that way because I only have one. The magazine was brand new but loading ammo into it was difficult because the follower was rocking all over the place instead of just moving up and down. Any advice? If technical questions aren't allowed here please delete it mods. |
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The unit was built by Loki weapons was it not?
The diagnosis is always problematic without actual access to the unit in question. The description would indicate that the bolt/extractor needs a little dehorning and the magazine seems to have a number of problems. Headspace may need to be checked. Although this sounds like a lot of work it is really only a bit of tuning, It is however only supposition and you should have the rifle examined if you are not confident in doing this yourself. |
I can outshoot you so there's your title biatch.
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Yes, the upper was built by Loki. It was supposed to be under warranty but since they went under I'm stuck having to deal with it myself. I've got some new mags on order from you guys so I'm hoping they'll arrive and, hopefully, that might fix it without having to pay a gunsmith  .
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I can outshoot you so there's your title biatch.
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Brandi,
You have 2 issues, only one possibly related to mags . 1) It appears that your ejector has a sharp edge on it that is scarring the base of the brass, disassembly of the bolt and some very judicious and gentle work with a dremel and/or some emery paper on the face of the ejector should correct that. 2) The scarring on the shoulder and side of the case is most likely from the barrel extension lugs. This can happen with improper feed lip geometry on the mags, if the tip of the bullet is a little too high and the side slams into the lugs instead of feeding into the chamber. A good picture of the barrel extension area might be useful to check the appearance of the feed ramps. What follower is in your mag? A pic of the mag, and then a pic of the mag disassembled would also be helpful. |
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Pics incoming....warning, there are several (I wasn't sure what a barrel extension was). Please excuse the dirt, I haven't cleaned since last range trip. I have noticed that when I first try to remove the charging handle/bcg it gets stuck and won't come out. I have to work it back and forth several times and then it comes out. Once I get it out it will go in and come out easily until shot again.
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Nicely done! I should also have asked for pictures of the mag with 5 or 6 rounds loaded in it to give us an idea of how the rounds are riding in the mag. I'm a little confused by your difficulty loading the mag. That is the proper follower, but it shouldn't be any harder to load than a 5.56 mag. are you pushing the rounds straight down on the follower and each other?
From simply looking at the pictures, I don't see anything grossly out of norms. The 4th picture from the bottom is a great picture of the barrel extension and locking lugs. |
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I'll add another pic. I was mistaken about the follower on the mag being all wonky, it's my Beowulf mag that has the wonky follower which, ironically, runs like a champ. I load the Grendel mag just by pushing the rounds down normally although the edges are frickin' sharp so loading it is done carefully to avoid injury.
To be honest, considering the fact I got screwed over by Loki on this upper and the fact my AA Beowulf is perfect, I really wish I had just bought from you guys to begin with. After seeing the pics does it look like I still need to smooth out the bolt face like you suggest earlier? |
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Originally Posted By Brandi:
I'll add another pic. I was mistaken about the follower on the mag being all wonky, it's my Beowulf mag that has the wonky follower which, ironically, runs like a champ. I load the Grendel mag just by pushing the rounds down normally although the edges are frickin' sharp so loading it is done carefully to avoid injury. To be honest, considering the fact I got screwed over by Loki on this upper and the fact my AA Beowulf is perfect, I really wish I had just bought from you guys to begin with. After seeing the pics does it look like I still need to smooth out the bolt face like you suggest earlier? Replace your Beo follower with a Magpul .223/5.56 follower and those issues will go away. You don't need to smooth the bolt face, just the face of the ejector, be gentle. You can also burnish the edges of the feed lips on the mag with emery paper and fix that issue. |
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Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Sorry for Hijack of thread. Bill do you have any ammo or maybe brass cases instock? I emailed asking which ammo was in stock I got a reply back " yes in stock, please order through website" no mention of what was in stock. Please see this thread; http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_2_453/232163_.html&page=1 |
I can outshoot you so there's your title biatch.
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I can outshoot you so there's your title biatch.
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Originally Posted By GrendelAA:
Originally Posted By Brandi:
I'll add another pic. I was mistaken about the follower on the mag being all wonky, it's my Beowulf mag that has the wonky follower which, ironically, runs like a champ. I load the Grendel mag just by pushing the rounds down normally although the edges are frickin' sharp so loading it is done carefully to avoid injury. To be honest, considering the fact I got screwed over by Loki on this upper and the fact my AA Beowulf is perfect, I really wish I had just bought from you guys to begin with. After seeing the pics does it look like I still need to smooth out the bolt face like you suggest earlier? Replace your Beo follower with a Magpul .223/5.56 follower and those issues will go away. You don't need to smooth the bolt face, just the face of the ejector, be gentle. You can also burnish the edges of the feed lips on the mag with emery paper and fix that issue. Kk, will do. |
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| Your buffer will be marked on the face if it is an H, H2, or H3. If the face is blank then it is a standard carbine buffer. H is now standard issue in the M4 and (IIRC) H2's are used in the MK18's. I run H or H2 in most of my guns, but one has an H3. An H3 buffer is roughly the same weight as a rifle buffer (around 5.4oz IIRC) whereas a standard carbine buffer is 2.9oz. |
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Brandi, I'm a 6.8 guy, but we have similar things going on with both 6.x cartridges, due to the cases being a bit larger, and the way that due to that, the projectile presents itself into the chamber. What happens occasionally, and especially with the old C Products mags like you have, ( the new ones are C Products Defense, and different machinery, and much better mags ) , is that the bullets are not presented at a high enough angle and in some cases are not centered enough left and right into the feed ramps. They end up hitting low or slightly wide, and some may jam, some may get damaged, and some may hit hard enough for the bullet to set back into the case and cause a pressure problem that will result in the case head having extractor or ejector marks like you have.
I had the exact issue you're having with the C Products mags I purchased a few years ago, as did many others. My brass looked terrible on several rounds. Only rounds that had a factory crimp were ok. There is a sticky on 68forums on how to tweak the feed lips of the mags to solve it. Sometimes it works and others it doesn't. Most of the 6.5 and 6.8 mags have the same body, just a different follower. If you can, and I know they are more money, but I would urge you to purchase PRI magazines. I have gone to them exclusively until I can get my hands on some of the new steel mags from C Products Defense. I bought two, and they were great with factory ammo, but wouldn't allow for me to load them long like the PRI mags. They have been retooled to take care of the issue from the welding process. AA may stock the new C Products Defense mags. They are smooth, and have a very nice finish, and are only about $15 vs the $40 for the PRI mags. One thing you might do, if you can, is to take the magazine and insert it in the lower, with a few bullets loaded in it, but not attached to the upper. With that we can see how they are being presented from the mag. Also, with the lower and upper put together, but without the bolt installed, insert a loaded mag and photograph from the ejection port so we can see where the bullets are in relation to the feed ramps in the upper and the extension. A pic of a loaded mag from the front and side will help as well if it's bad off. This is the tweak PDF. http://68forums.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=111&d=1248964678 If AA doesn't have any of the CPD mags, LCJ might. They are the outlet store for the CPD factory. The mags are really nice, like the old blued Colt mags. The mags may not be your only problem, but they appear to be one of them. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CDwQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Flcjwholesalestore.com%2FAR_Magazines.php&ei=D6cYUeboGoWG9QSYrIDYBA&usg=AFQjCNE5Ru5BWQx2r-yCCt2ctNjuD7Ipow&bvm=bv.42080656,d.eWU&cad=rja |
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I can outshoot you so there's your title biatch.
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So a bit of an update...I've cleaned it, shot it, cleaned it, shot it, tried 6.5 mag, tried a Pmag, buffed and smoothed the feed lips of the 6.5 mag and shot 3 boxes of Hornady 123grain A-max during all this and its still having the FtE (stovepipe out the ejection port). Every single spent brass has dings on it. I'm getting around 1 FtE malfunction for every 5-8 rounds fired. I totally forgot to buff the bolt face but at tis point I'm not sure that's going to help (although I'll still do it).
Aside from dinging all the brass and mangling the malf'd brass the FtE's are unacceptable. The rifle itself is super accurate but she still needs help. In this world of impossible to find ammo I don't want to waste even more if I don't have to...I think she needs to see the doctor, what do ya'll think? Doctor or should I try something else? |
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Originally Posted By Brandi:
So a bit of an update...I've cleaned it, shot it, cleaned it, shot it, tried 6.5 mag, tried a Pmag, buffed and smoothed the feed lips of the 6.5 mag and shot 3 boxes of Hornady 123grain A-max during all this and its still having the FtE (stovepipe out the ejection port). Every single spent brass has dings on it. I'm getting around 1 FtE malfunction for every 5-8 rounds fired. I totally forgot to buff the bolt face but at tis point I'm not sure that's going to help (although I'll still do it). Aside from dinging all the brass and mangling the malf'd brass the FtE's are unacceptable. The rifle itself is super accurate but she still needs help. In this world of impossible to find ammo I don't want to waste even more if I don't have to...I think she needs to see the doctor, what do ya'll think? Doctor or should I try something else? I still believe this is either an extractor or ejector issue. Buff both gently. If the extractor claw is sharp, it will hang onto the brass, causing your symptoms. I use a flexible sanding disk on my dremel to gently do both items. The other possibility I can see off the top of my head is a bad ejector spring, but thats somewhat less likely. |
I can outshoot you so there's your title biatch.
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Next time I get a chance to shoot, which unfortunately isn't very often, I'll find out because she'll be buffed before then. I really appreciate all the great help and advice you guys have given to me, it's extremely frustrating for a gun working on'er noob. Plenty of experience shooting them but a total noob at working on them.
I'll let ya'll know how it goes. |
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| Just an update if anyone was wondering....I followed Bill's advice and took the Dremel to the bolt and buffed the bolt face and smoothed off all the sharp edges on the extractor. I was worried I took too much off since the extractor was knife edge sharp but when I got to the range the rifle functioned almost perfectly with one FtE out of 40 rounds fired. Considering the most I ever got was 4 or 5 shots before a malfunction previously I'd say it's fixed...maybe a tiny tweak is left but she's ready for the big time now! Thanks for all the advice and help from Bill and everyone, I really appreciate it!! |
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