My first prediction is that you won't be able to find the tomatoes because of the hundreds of walnut seedlings coming up.

That said, I admit that I'm skeptical because of the level of juglone you've built up there.  Of course I don't expect the Rutgers to do well. Do you have any more of the SWIRE line of seedlings?  Would love it if you would ALSO do an experiment outdoors in soil that is not so heavily augmented with the juglone.  Like a "normal" level of juglone.

Here's the thing--

I have not been able to find any really good research about how long juglone persists in the soil.  I believe it is persistant, but not FOREVER persistant.  I think, were it forever persistant, that you'd have old-timers saying, "don't buy that land. It's contaminated with walnut and nuthin good will grow,"  etc etc.

They don't. Which means that over time, that chemical will lose efficacy through leaching and through normal root cycling and soil processes, and we can once again grow intolerant species in that soil.  

Combined with that theory (and it is only a theory) you have to take into account, what if the trees are still there, leaching hydrojuglone every time it rains, which then fixes in the soil and here we go again....?

So it's not a simple "this or that" scenario, but we have to reduce it to simple questions to properly experiment.

To develop a tolerant tomato that would grow in, say, a planter box that was filled with, maybe, peat-based potting mix, but that was UNDER a Juglans nigra would be an accomplishment indeed!  And what if that soil mix was not removed and replaced, but simply augmented with compost the following year, and the tomatoes still grew and produced.   That would be life changing for some gardeners.

So there is so much to unpack, it's almost too big to think about.  

I really like that you still have this going on, and I love that you are trying to develop a juglone-resistant variety.  

If you can install ANY KIND of edges on that plot, even the cheap plastic edging from the big box store, your weeding job will get easier.   Edging is 3/4 of weed control.  

That's a lot more expensive than I would have thought.

At that price, I would buy 4 X 4s treated and dig them in.  

That's crazy expensive for plastic junk.

That is so cool.

At least you have a bit of Fionna still with you, through her lineage.

I'm worried that whatever took her and the others, will be back.

digging a trench and putting in brick/block/concrete block edging sound just about as cheap.

That plastic is stupid expensive for the distance it covers.

Edited to add:  I forgot I had responded to this, but my brain evidently is consistent in its reaction.

Yeah that plastic is just....wrong.

Watching this again.


God bless her, and may Fiona live on through her.

That is surprising.

I think you should put a cage around it (like a tomato cage...just something so you have that plant identified and can weed around it if you need to, and so no animal bites it off) and see what happens with it.

Your observations about the plants doing okay until it rains again, then they are overcome by juglone...

This makes me wonder whether plants give water all along, consistently, would have the same issues.

See what I mean about it being too much to unpack, unless it is done as consistent experiments?  It's hard to tell what is the determining factor for any effect.

People wonder why research is so expensive...this is why.   Isolating the questions and answers...that's hard.

Edited to add:  If you haven't already, I would pull up those walnut seedlings right f***ing now.  They add nothing to your experiment and you certainly don't need them.  And you already know that once they hit six months, they become MUCH harder to just pull up.

Sorry...this is long.  I'm going fast and may not make sense, so if I'm not clear, holler.

I have something that may become an important part of this at some point.

I think  if you could isolate (like build a little perimeter around) a few of the new "germinated in walnuts" seedlings, you could try some soil mitigation.  Or you might rather try it another way, like....in pots, and maybe not this year,, BUT.....

There is something exciting I have found.  You may know about it already, but I didn't.

Background:
Are you aware that for the past 4-5 years, folks all over the country have been getting bad soil, compost, and mulch, that is destroying their gardens, because that product contains residue from herbicides?  It's either plant material that was sprayed with Grazon and then ended up in mulch or compost, or it's MANURE that contains herbicide residue.  That stuff is so persistent that it can get absorbed by the pasture grasses, get eaten, pass through the digestive system of ruminants, get pooped out, get COMPOSTED for a year, get bagged or trucked to a garden, get spread, and STILL there is so much residue that it kills whatever is planted in there (broadleaf plants, which are most of what people grow for food crops).      

I have good friends who lost their business because Western KY University screwed up and dumped grazon trimmings into the public leaf compost program piles.   My buddies who had a (mostly) organic produce farm got a big grant and expanded their business with high tunnels, and then LOST THEIR BUSINESS because they used that compost.  The cost of tearing out the soil and starting over, on top of the crop sale loss for that season, was too much for them.  They had extended themselves with the support of the community, but they couldn't overcome the hit.  The university investigated and denied all wrongdoing, of course.

Anyway, it's become a bad problem, and most producers know SOMEBODY who has gotten bad soil, mulch, or compost, laced with this herbicide or another within a small group of similar chems.  Grazon is the worst because it is so often used on pastures, and composted manure bought in bags or truckloads is a staple for gardeners and producers.

Now the new stuff:



Just last week I found a video from Roots & Refuge, a channel out of South Carolina, and when she lost most of a high tunnel to herbicide damage (the producer of the bagged compost owned the problem...said it was all over the place and they had obviously gotten a bad bunch of bulk product...) because she has income from the youtube channel, she was able to take a different path.

Instead of tearing out the whole tunnel and replacing the soil,  she left it in there, and did experiments with mitigation.

She used combinations of Vermiculture (worm casting) tea, and some other amendments, in an attempt to heal the soil.

She documented this, and it worked!!!

(I don't have the precise details, only what she shared on her channel, but She is the first I've seen to successfully mitigate herbicide damaged soil rather than tear it out and replace.

SO...I wonder if a similar protocol could mitigate the effect of the juglone in the soil?  

I started thinking about it when you mentioned the water component...that water flow through the soil had something to do with the uptake of the juglone (or the blocking effect of the juglone, whichever it is.)

In ADDITION, I wondered whether some of the humic/fulvic acid compounds I use on lawns and in planters, might also have a positive effect, because the polyelectrolytic nature of those compounds tends to tie up certain things, and make other things available, to positive effect.  

So...it would be really interesting, since you have these seedlings that show at least SOME resistance, to find out whether mitigation around those seedlings in particular would show a positive effect over time.

I can't do it tonight but give me a bit and I'll find the video series for you.

So these are your "bred for resistance" tomatoes?

Technically my understanding is that juglone is in the entire plant, roots to fruits.  So I think you are doing right.  And you ARE creating a resistant tomato!  I started a little garden this year for the first time in a while, and I came across your seeds.  It's a little late to try them this season, but next season, I'm going to.  I will plant some in my regular garden (raised beds this time) and some in soil that's been rained on by juglone, and some right under the big old walnut.  We will see.

No plan to be up that far, I'm afraid.   I have serious doubts that I could get seeds sprouted, grown to transplant size, and up in the garden before frost, but I will absolutely keep them til next year.  I COULD try direct-sowing a seed or two, to see what would happen.

Those tomatoes are some of the best looking ones I've seen all year actually.  You have less splitting than what I see at the Farmer's market.   Inconsistent water is what I was understanding...letting them stay on til it rains.  But this year that doesn't seem to be making any difference for experienced growers.

Every heirloom tomato I come across has a lot of that.  I just processed a big box I bought for $20 from a farmer's market grower--it was his castoffs.  I cored and scored the bottoms and put them in the freezer. There was a lot of loss so chickens ate well, but I got five, one-gallon bags full of whole tomatoes and tomato parts.  I need to get them processed asap while they lose quality in that freezer.

That's fantastic!  You're getting a lot of leaf dieback but I don't see that it's any more than normal for this time of year with high heat.  (Not sure if that's normal for tomatoes up where you are).

Right.

next project:  Select for the juglone-resistant, leaf-spot-resistant, tomato!

You won't need to create that soil.

It's so damn efficate, you will just need to introduce it.  

But...so you know...based on your photos I would have called that Tomato blight (fungal).  

A wet, hot weather spell is great for growing things...including blight.