monolthic domes? paging 1 big bunker (Page 8 of 12)
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tunnels are defiantley not cheap, with theses, and any other structure, the cheapest thing to build is the best ration of surface area to interior voulme. A tunnel is long and narrow and thus not a good ratio.
From the spreadsheets I have worked up it seems like stemwalls are rather cheap compared to larger sizes, once you get past a large enough size that the stairwell fits ok. By the math, adding a 9 foot stemwall increases the material volume by about 50% only, so the real key would be the second floor cost, and the reduced accisbility. IBB, do you perfer the brick over monolithics orion Method? if so why? visual appeall? I would think the increased labor of hireing masons would be a factor. |
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Originally Posted By 1_BIG_BUNKER:
The airform is on top of the brick wall and attached to it. The brick wall just replaces the airform from the footing to the start of the curve. I'm not going to put up a web page on building domes. What I was thinking of doing, is maybe make a series of videos on start to finish on how to build a dome, and post it here for those who are interested in learning how to really build them without all the trouble, or at least have a place to come back to for trouble shooting a problem or questions. I'm not sure if I will or not, it just depends on the level of interest. It's a lot of video and talking to really explain things so people can build with confidence. A series of videos is an excellent idea, I know I would be interested, and I'm sure many others would be too. Especially with the new brick on the exterior, it looks more "inhabitable" to me. I always liked domes, but this makes them far less of an oddity I think. As for it being a lot of video, I don't see that as a bad thing, the more the better! I would rather have an over explained 2 hour video, than a 30 minute video that leaves unanswered questions. Hell, break it up into chunks and even a 3+ hour video is digestable. |
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We are a go for operation Banana Monkey 029 Yankee Hotel Foxtrot.
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Originally Posted By Orion_Shall_Rise:
tunnels are defiantley not cheap, with theses, and any other structure, the cheapest thing to build is the best ration of surface area to interior voulme. A tunnel is long and narrow and thus not a good ratio. From the spreadsheets I have worked up it seems like stemwalls are rather cheap compared to larger sizes, once you get past a large enough size that the stairwell fits ok. By the math, adding a 9 foot stemwall increases the material volume by about 50% only, so the real key would be the second floor cost, and the reduced accisbility. IBB, do you perfer the brick over monolithics orion Method? if so why? visual appeall? I would think the increased labor of hireing masons would be a factor. Yes, I do like the brick over the Orion method of building but then again, what are we building? I like it because it not only looks better, windows and doors are all already designed to go into a brick wall. That saves a lot of man hours and possible headaches when it's time to install them. Now if I was building an above ground bunker type home, I would go with the Orion style. It can be built as thick as you want, and a real bullet stopper. I would probably go 4-5 inches thick with a 9 bag mix. That alone will stop 99% of anything fired at it. Most domes are only 4'' thick on the inside, and 3'' of foam towards the outside and then the airform. Really foam and airform stop nothing. Now if we have 4-5 inches of shotcrete on the outside, then 3 inches of foam and then a 4 or 5 inch thick wall on the inside, what are you going to throw at it to punch through it? Keep in mind, those concrete walls are made from shotcrete that's around 13,000 psi. It's not your normal stuff you get off the truck or cinder blocks or anything like that. Now what I would do is around each door and window, I would add in number 5 rebar 3 or 4 feet to each side of the opening and about 6 feet up from the floor. Mainly to really reinforce and give you another layer of protection should you have to defend and fire from a window. No one will shoot through 10 inches of 13,000 psi concrete with three layers of harden steel rebar totaling 1.5 inches thick in that concrete. Brick won't give you that much protection, but it looks nicer and is more accepted as normal. In a BOL, who cares really if it doesn't look as nice but is MUCH safer. Here, I posted this before, but read it again, and remember, this is just a normal dome with no bunker thinking to it at all when built. http://www.monolithic.com/stories/bullet-test Now if I was building underground, I would just have the very thick heavy ecoshell airform material and build it like in the past. It's going underground, and what I'm more worried about is water proofing, and that heavy thick rubber airform material gives me that. I would also spray a polyurea on the outside of the airform. This will protect it while back filling and burying it. Here's the stuff. http://www.polyurea.com/spps/ahpg.cfm?spgid=12 Then I would spray 5 inches of foam as that too is a closed cell foam and water proof. This is way more than you need, but when it comes to water leaking, I want as much protection against it as possible, but that's me. Then build the dome as normal. Maybe add another inch or two of shotcrete if you want. As far as cost, well if you can, build NOW. You will never see constructions costs as low as they are now in almost all locations. I've had brick layers ask for work, and guys just starting out with only a few years under their belt, were willing to work damn near for food. In the past, you could figure about $1 per brick, bought and laid, but now, I've seen that as low as $0.50 a brick. Now if you build a 50' dome with an 8' stem wall of brick, you talking about 1,256 square feet minus doors and window openings, so maybe we're down to 1,050 sf after the openings. There's about 7 bricks per square foot or about 7,350 bricks. Multiply by about $0.75 and that wall is built for about $5,513 brick, motar, and labor. You buy brick by the 1000 and each brick is between $0.30 to $0.45. Motar you can figure at about $0.35 per square foot or $0.05 per brick. The rest is labor. Here's a good site for brick, just to get you thinking. http://www.yankeehillbrick.com/ |
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You can make your own airform, within certain size limits. The Merrell's, of Mountain View Dome, created a self-published booklet entitled Building Your Own Air-Form. It describes the math needed to make a dome, and some info about selecting materials––the two main ones they recommend are basically tyvek home wrap and plastic shopping bag material (one can be taped, the other heat welded, and one can be had at your local store, the other is usually an order through a supplier).
Without any building experiences whatsoever, I'd say it's just enough information to get into a lot of trouble, but the booklet is informative. 
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I also found these guys when I was googling for something else. Basically, triangular EPS panels with 1/2" concrete external and 1/4" wallboard internal, seams meshed and concreted. It doesn't look like they have nearly the strength or mass of a monolithic dome, and sizes are limited to 60ft. Still, seems superior to stick.
AI Domes What else I like: -doesn't seem to require specialized labor (shotcrete) -doesn't require an airform -square openings make window fitment a lot easier than with bucks on md's |
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Oh yeah, here is the name of the FL dome, they have a CD book/album of their process:
Safe Harbor Dome |
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bump b/c domes are cool
anyone in DFW area...this weekend @ Mesquite Convention Center http://www.selfrelianceexpo.com monolithic domes is supposed to have an exhibitor wonder if 1BB will be there? |
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Originally Posted By 1_BIG_BUNKER:
Start to finish really depends on the size of the dome. Let's use a 3000 sf home as a standard size. That is a dome that is 50' across and 24' tall. You have about 2000sf on the first floor, and a 50' balcony that is VERY cool looking and over looking your living room and kitchen area, and it is about 1000sf. The dome will COST about: Airform ====$12,000 including BP Foam ===== $5600 Rebar =====$5300 Concrete====$5500 Floor ======$4600 Misc======$12,000 Total cost for shell ==== $45,000 Add in another $75,000 and you can have the interior done and done NICE with a 50' balcony that's about 10' high over looking everything. So for about $120K, and three months MAX, you can build yourself a 3000 square foot bunker that looks like a dome home. You can get away with less money to finish off the inside, but that's up to you. This home will cost you about a dollar a day to heat in the northern states. At least every one I have built has cost that much and most have no AC in the summer time or just a window AC to keep the inside around 72-75 all the time. Really, they are NOT that hard to build. It all comes down to attention to detail. Concrete will not wait for you to fix it in the morning. I know people are saying that you need special equipment and what not, and you do to some degree, but it can be rented. I know an older couple who were in their late 60's who built a 1200sf dome home about ten years ago. They put ALL the concrete on the dome by hand and never used a shotcrete pump. Now that is hard as reinforced woodpecker lips. They basically mixed and applied by hand about 60 yards for the whole dome. Then again, they are an older couple who have a work ethic, and are not afraid of it. Read into that whatever you want. Also, a couple years back, I offered to help ANYONE build their own home for FREE and use my equipment. No one took me up on it. 
If I had the money I would... awesome looking homes. |
Originally Posted By kcolg30:
The GD helped me find my cum sock from 1977 under my water heater...
The GD helped me find my cum sock from 1977 under my water heater...
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I'm seriously looking into this. My wife is really interested as well. I'd build it myself, but I just don't have that kind of time. Plus, it's going to take a while to build up the capital for land. $98,000 for 5 acres in Southern NH, and that was the best we found.
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Originally Posted By Orion_Shall_Rise:
capitol is the main problem right now, these are nonconforming so you cant get a mortgage on em That seems to be the main problem. I have heard of banks wanting 50% or more down payment to finance one of these ... Turns it from a super attractive option into an unobtainable pipe dream. Sucks.
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Power. Agility. Endurance.
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When / if I move from my house - I could see getting some land and get one of the monolithic domes trailers setup while I slowly built up the house. The shell + core power / water / floor / septic ruff ins could be doable + land.
If at all possible I would rather be in a position of having the house 100% paid for when it was finished. I like the ability of the dome to be secure in really bad weather. The cost savings for running it has peaked my interest. |
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if it wasnt for the foam, you could easily build one yourself with a compressor, plaster gun and cement mixer, the foam does crazy things to the price.
Though really compared to the energy savings it is a great deal. The financing problem is killer though. Hard to resell, and you have to eat all the costs upfront. |
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Originally Posted By Matt_mg: Maybe someone could dig up how much a bare shell costs, I know there were calculations in the thread. I would assume that you would have to be more specific about what you want. |
2.1
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Originally Posted By Orion_Shall_Rise:
if it wasnt for the foam, you could easily build one yourself with a compressor, plaster gun and cement mixer, the foam does crazy things to the price. Though really compared to the energy savings it is a great deal. The financing problem is killer though. Hard to resell, and you have to eat all the costs upfront. If you build it well, and put some thought into what type of land to put it on, the scarcity might actually make it pretty easy to sell. Especially these days. |
I drink only the blood of my enemies! And the occasional strawberry Yoohoo. -Sarge
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Originally Posted By E-Mag:
Originally Posted By Matt_mg:
Maybe someone could dig up how much a bare shell costs, I know there were calculations in the thread. I would assume that you would have to be more specific about what you want. back around page three or so. NOTE: those are two years old and foam cost have increase signifigantly. Also those were materials only prices, no labor or equipment costs |
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Originally Posted By 1_BIG_BUNKER:
Start to finish really depends on the size of the dome. Let's use a 3000 sf home as a standard size. That is a dome that is 50' across and 24' tall. You have about 2000sf on the first floor, and a 50' balcony that is VERY cool looking and over looking your living room and kitchen area, and it is about 1000sf. The dome will COST about: Airform ====$12,000 including BP Foam ===== $5600 Rebar =====$5300 Concrete====$5500 Floor ======$4600 Misc======$12,000 Total cost for shell ==== $45,000 Add in another $75,000 and you can have the interior done and done NICE with a 50' balcony that's about 10' high over looking everything. So for about $120K, and three months MAX, you can build yourself a 3000 square foot bunker that looks like a dome home. You can get away with less money to finish off the inside, but that's up to you. This home will cost you about a dollar a day to heat in the northern states. At least every one I have built has cost that much and most have no AC in the summer time or just a window AC to keep the inside around 72-75 all the time. Really, they are NOT that hard to build. It all comes down to attention to detail. Concrete will not wait for you to fix it in the morning. I know people are saying that you need special equipment and what not, and you do to some degree, but it can be rented. I know an older couple who were in their late 60's who built a 1200sf dome home about ten years ago. They put ALL the concrete on the dome by hand and never used a shotcrete pump. Now that is hard as reinforced woodpecker lips. They basically mixed and applied by hand about 60 yards for the whole dome. Then again, they are an older couple who have a work ethic, and are not afraid of it. Read into that whatever you want. Also, a couple years back, I offered to help ANYONE build their own home for FREE and use my equipment. No one took me up on it.
When it comes to being handy, I've got two left hands. Are you saying I'm too late???  I'm not interested in a 50 ft. dome, My plans are for something a bit smaller.
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Originally Posted By stre-tch: would like to see the interior to one of these Plenty of pics online Try googling Monolithic dome or check out http://www.monolithic.com
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I still want a dome, but I do have a (perhaps odd) question that has been nagging at me.
What about arson? If you batten the hatches on your dome, and somebody hits you with a molotov or just some gas and a match--- will the foam on the outside of the dome all burn and turn your dome into an oven? |
"it also is something the site doesn't need the publicity of being associated with when cnn finds the thread."--- Something I never thought I'd hear on this site.....
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Originally Posted By Variable556:
I still want a dome, but I do have a (perhaps odd) question that has been nagging at me. What about arson? If you batten the hatches on your dome, and somebody hits you with a molotov or just some gas and a match--- will the foam on the outside of the dome all burn and turn your dome into an oven? At one time there was an article on the Monolithic home page about one of their domes having a close call from a forest fire in California. Did damage but not horrible, IIRC. ETA: The airform is another layer of protection, and many people add some kind of stucco on top of that. I think with a coating and a sprinkler system on top of the dome you'd be sitting pretty calmly shooting back from the gun ports. |
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Skip to about 4:00 |
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Has anyone heard from 1Bigbunker lately?
I sent him a pm and an email through Arfcom a while back and haven't gotten a response. |
"Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you: Jesus Christ and the American GI. One Died for your sins, the other for your freedom." Ronald Reagan
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Originally Posted By thumper10mm: Has anyone heard from 1Bigbunker lately? I sent him a pm and an email through Arfcom a while back and haven't gotten a response. I would like to ask him a question also but  Last Login Date: 7/17/2012 4:00:28 AM CDT Last Post Date: 7/17/2012 3:00:25 AM CDT |
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I seem to recall that 1BB once had a client who wanted to fireproof the outside of the dome. He came up with a great solution. They mounted chain link fencing all over the dome on the airform side. The fencing was in lieu of rebar and acted just like meshing found in any concrete slab. He then shot it with another 3" - 4" of concrete just like one does the interior. I think they even colored the concrete so that it needed no paint. He posted some pictures of it here at one time, but it may not have been in this thread. |
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Originally Posted By Fox: I seem to recall that 1BB once had a client who wanted to fireproof the outside of the dome. He came up with a great solution. They mounted chain link fencing all over the dome on the airform side. The fencing was in lieu of rebar and acted just like meshing found in any concrete slab. He then shot it with another 3" - 4" of concrete just like one does the interior. I think they even colored the concrete so that it needed no paint. He posted some pictures of it here at one time, but it may not have been in this thread. That would be super cool! |
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The monolithic dome youtube channel has tons of good information.
https://www.youtube.com/user/mdi01?feature=watch |
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Originally Posted By 223Sauce:
Originally Posted By JohnnyScience:
Does anyone have an email for 1_Big_Bunker? If you find one of his old posts you may be able to email him through his profile. I tried that over a month ago, no response. Does anyone have his contact info? |
"Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you: Jesus Christ and the American GI. One Died for your sins, the other for your freedom." Ronald Reagan
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Originally Posted By mPisi:
Originally Posted By Variable556:
I still want a dome, but I do have a (perhaps odd) question that has been nagging at me. What about arson? If you batten the hatches on your dome, and somebody hits you with a molotov or just some gas and a match––- will the foam on the outside of the dome all burn and turn your dome into an oven? At one time there was an article on the Monolithic home page about one of their domes having a close call from a forest fire in California. Did damage but not horrible, IIRC. ETA: The airform is another layer of protection, and many people add some kind of stucco on top of that. I think with a coating and a sprinkler system on top of the dome you'd be sitting pretty calmly shooting back from the gun ports. First time I ever heard of monolithic domes was in a SoF magazine article in the 90's. The dome in the review was finished with shotcrete on the exterior and withstood a 30-06 round. |
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Originally Posted By OKIE-CARBINE:
I REALLY need to talk to 1 big bunker. if anybody has any contact information on him, please send me a message. Hey OKIE, I answered your message, and everyone else as well. Give me a call and we'll talk. Man it's been a loooong time since I've been on here. I had messages over a year old. I am sorry for the delay, but I did reply to everyone. I'll try to check back here within the next day or so. |