Russian T-3 kit....keep it? > AK Discussions

Posted: 4/2/2009 5:11:14 AM EDT

I bought a matching numbers T-3 off someone on another board, and it turns out to have a non matching electropenciled bolt, and it appears to be a Yugo bolt. The guy is being a real ass, but he finally agreed to a refund, not for a swap (he has other T3 kits). The thing is, I paid $600 for the kit, and it has a very good bore. I'm inclined to keep it and find another bolt, since lots of the kits that came through had shitty bores. I'd love to send the kit back adn tell him to shove it up his ass, but I don't want to cut off my nose to spite my face.

Posted: 4/2/2009 5:48:31 AM EDT

[#1]

I would just send it back.
Are you dead set on a t3?

Posted: 4/2/2009 5:59:58 AM EDT

[#2]

Don't you have to headspace the bolt on a milled build anyway? I wouldn't worry about it myself.

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:03:07 AM EDT

[#3]

I'd like a T-3, and I have a builder lined up as part of a trade package. I don't want to build a kit with a Yugo bolt...that's just wrong. :)

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:51:31 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
I'd like a T-3, and I have a builder lined up as part of a trade package. I don't want to build a kit with a Yugo bolt...that's just wrong. :)

I would return it and wait for the right kit to come along. Im a bit of a purist myself, if the BC,Bolt and receiver atleast dont match im not interested. I wouldnt want a yugo bolt, later on when people are collecting AKs like they collect k98s now, there will be a difference in value I think.

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:57:43 AM EDT

[#5]

have you confirmed the bolt is Yugo?

Posted: 4/2/2009 7:15:18 AM EDT

[#6]

Pretty much. It has XXXXed out serial numbers on it, and one of them is on the bolt head. Only Yugos do that. Here's the identifying thread:

http://www.theakforum.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=92530

Posted: 4/2/2009 7:16:10 AM EDT

[#7]

whats wrong with the yugo bolt..cheaper or sumthing?
or is it just the fact you want everything matching?

Posted: 4/2/2009 7:17:42 AM EDT

[#8]

I'd at least prefer it all to be Russian. If I'm going to have to headspace a non matching bolt, I'd rather it not be a Yugo. The quality is just fine though, and this one seems to be in decent shape.

Posted: 4/2/2009 7:57:45 AM EDT

[#9]

It's up to you. If it's going to bug you inside to know it's not a true all matching kit, send it back. I wonder why he won't send you a different kit, since you stated he has others...

Posted: 4/2/2009 8:08:35 AM EDT

[#10]

He's a real jerk. Didn't even wrap the parts up...just threw them in a box and sent 'em. Tried to get me to pay $50 to ship the kit, and I sent him a label that cost me under $15. He's a real class act.

Posted: 4/2/2009 8:10:15 AM EDT

[#11]

600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

Posted: 4/2/2009 8:22:05 AM EDT

[#12]

$600? NO FN WAY!
I paid $500 for mine, matching with an excellent bore.(This was of course 2 weeks before the election)
Send it back, make him pay shipping and tell him you want what you paid for or your money back including shipping since its HIS fault.

The panic has only driven up prices on lower-mid level AKs and kits. Most of the panic is caused by noobs just wanting a semi auto, so they get the cheapest thing they can. There wasnt a huge demand for Russian AK47s considering its a collectors item and gets expensive, theres no reason for the milled kits to change in value.

Posted: 4/2/2009 8:22:13 AM EDT

[#13]

Furniture is beat up, but the rest of the kit looks good. IT's been grey sprayed, but it was done prior to disassembly.

Posted: 4/2/2009 8:23:54 AM EDT

[#14]

Post pics

Posted: 4/2/2009 11:17:42 AM EDT

[#15]

What's the sellers name?

Posted: 4/2/2009 11:45:53 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
Don't you have to headspace the bolt on a milled build anyway? I wouldn't worry about it myself.

He paid $600 and was told it was a matching kit. Shady seller. If you keep it he should reimburse for some of the payment. You can get a nice matching kit for that pice. Thats what you should have received if thats how it was advertised.

Posted: 4/2/2009 11:48:40 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Posted: 4/2/2009 12:09:50 PM EDT

[#18]

Get another kit.
You are looking for a collecter piece and a franken gun with multi-nation parts ain't it.

The guy is refunding as he should, but welshing on a promise to trade?

Quoted:
What's the sellers name?

Indeed.

Posted: 4/2/2009 12:59:50 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Posted: 4/2/2009 2:40:11 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Posted: 4/2/2009 2:48:13 PM EDT

[#21]

He's actually one of the technical advisors over there, goes by Sasm7. I was promised a numbers match (BCG, bolt, and stub) T3 kit, and found it to be force matched with an electropencil. Further investigation showed it to be a Yugo. Initially he offered a refund if I shipped to him on my dime, but the mods got involved. Suddenly he wanted to trade it, but then he stopped responding and then said he would send me a call tag and refund my $600 so he wouldn't have to "go through this" with me again. Definitely a shady guy. He also didn't pack the kit, just threw it in a box loose. I'll have to take pics at home, I'm on break at work now.

Posted: 4/2/2009 2:57:09 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
He's actually one of the technical advisors over there, goes by Sasm7. I was promised a numbers match (BCG, bolt, and stub) T3 kit, and found it to be force matched with an electropencil. Further investigation showed it to be a Yugo. Initially he offered a refund if I shipped to him on my dime, but the mods got involved. Suddenly he wanted to trade it, but then he stopped responding and then said he would send me a call tag and refund my $600 so he wouldn't have to "go through this" with me again. Definitely a shady guy. He also didn't pack the kit, just threw it in a box loose. I'll have to take pics at home, I'm on break at work now.

Hope he makes good. BTW I see you now have 762 posts.

Posted: 4/2/2009 3:25:19 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
He's actually one of the technical advisors over there, goes by Sasm7. I was promised a numbers match (BCG, bolt, and stub) T3 kit, and found it to be force matched with an electropencil. Further investigation showed it to be a Yugo. Initially he offered a refund if I shipped to him on my dime, but the mods got involved. Suddenly he wanted to trade it, but then he stopped responding and then said he would send me a call tag and refund my $600 so he wouldn't have to "go through this" with me again. Definitely a shady guy. He also didn't pack the kit, just threw it in a box loose. I'll have to take pics at home, I'm on break at work now.

He'll make good or He'll be gone.
JohnO and the gang won't stand for it.

Posted: 4/2/2009 3:43:33 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Posted: 4/2/2009 5:02:00 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Hey if your happy cool, IDGF. I like what I got and $600 for a non match (not same country) is not right when advertised as matching. A bulgarian is real deal so is hungarian... just because a guy did it first doesnt mean he did it better. In most cases they get surpassed. The whole Ferrari shit was red hering. And quite honestly yes I do want my bulgy kit over 99% of all russian kits I have seen. Yes, sure I would like a russian for the collection but I dont need it to feel like a man.

Posted: 4/2/2009 5:25:34 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:

Quoted:
He's actually one of the technical advisors over there, goes by Sasm7. I was promised a numbers match (BCG, bolt, and stub) T3 kit, and found it to be force matched with an electropencil. Further investigation showed it to be a Yugo. Initially he offered a refund if I shipped to him on my dime, but the mods got involved. Suddenly he wanted to trade it, but then he stopped responding and then said he would send me a call tag and refund my $600 so he wouldn't have to "go through this" with me again. Definitely a shady guy. He also didn't pack the kit, just threw it in a box loose. I'll have to take pics at home, I'm on break at work now.

He'll make good or He'll be gone.
JohnO and the gang won't stand for it.

Wow. Hope they stand up for the guy if it is in fact a replacement bolt that someone tried to fake as original.

AZ guy?

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:06:01 PM EDT

[#27]

They got involved, which greased the wheels a bit, but he won't trade for the kit like he originally promised. It's refund or zilch. Pisses me off.

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:24:00 PM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
They got involved, which greased the wheels a bit, but he won't trade for the kit like he originally promised. It's refund or zilch. Pisses me off.

In my experience I would assume that means the other kits have mismatched bolts as well.

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:25:19 PM EDT

[#29]

Take the refund, give him negative feedback.

Posted: 4/2/2009 6:54:28 PM EDT

[#30]

I would probably keep the kit you got. If he is dishonest enough to pull the crap he did, is he honest enough to actually give you a refund?

Posted: 4/2/2009 7:35:03 PM EDT

[#31]

I’m surprised sasm7 would try something like that, considering he’s been a forum regular and appears to be pretty well respected. I bought something from him in the past and he was pretty spot-on about the item he was selling.

Send it back, there has been quite a few showing up on Gunbroker lately that look just as good as the kit you purchased.

Posted: 4/3/2009 4:59:10 AM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
I would probably keep the kit you got. If he is dishonest enough to pull the crap he did, is he honest enough to actually give you a refund?

Just make him send first.

The buyer has already proved he is honest by sending first.

Posted: 4/3/2009 5:02:04 AM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Hey if your happy cool, IDGF. I like what I got and $600 for a non match (not same country) is not right when advertised as matching. A bulgarian is real deal so is hungarian... just because a guy did it first doesnt mean he did it better. In most cases they get surpassed. The whole Ferrari shit was red hering. And quite honestly yes I do want my bulgy kit over 99% of all russian kits I have seen. Yes, sure I would like a russian for the collection but I dont need it to feel like a man.

Whatever floats your boat bud.
Im just saying the Russians have same or better quality than the bulgarians considering the bulgarian type 3s are direct copies and for a while there they even used Russian guns to build theirs!! But more than anything its the history.

When you say AK47, you think Russia.
So why not an actuall Russian AK47?

Im glad you like your bulgy kit, but people pay this kinda money for Russian AK47s not because of quality(which is extremely high on most type 3s) but because of the history and rarity. So your post was a little outaplace.

Posted: 4/3/2009 8:00:52 AM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Hey if your happy cool, IDGF. I like what I got and $600 for a non match (not same country) is not right when advertised as matching. A bulgarian is real deal so is hungarian... just because a guy did it first doesnt mean he did it better. In most cases they get surpassed. The whole Ferrari shit was red hering. And quite honestly yes I do want my bulgy kit over 99% of all russian kits I have seen. Yes, sure I would like a russian for the collection but I dont need it to feel like a man.

Whatever floats your boat bud.
Im just saying the Russians have same or better quality than the bulgarians considering the bulgarian type 3s are direct copies and for a while there they even used Russian guns to build theirs!! But more than anything its the history.

When you say AK47, you think Russia.
So why not an actuall Russian AK47?

Im glad you like your bulgy kit, but people pay this kinda money for Russian AK47s not because of quality(which is extremely high on most type 3s) but because of the history and rarity. So your post was a little outaplace.

I know why people buy russian T3's but I feel the quality of most of them that made it here is not near as nice as other countries. Most were beat to shit. Yes, at one time those parts were really nice but those kits tend 2 have a lot more wear on them. Lets face if, by your own words, they are the same then why are you being such a prick over a damn roll mark? Take your shitty day out on someone else.

Posted: 4/3/2009 8:56:23 AM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Hey if your happy cool, IDGF. I like what I got and $600 for a non match (not same country) is not right when advertised as matching. A bulgarian is real deal so is hungarian... just because a guy did it first doesnt mean he did it better. In most cases they get surpassed. The whole Ferrari shit was red hering. And quite honestly yes I do want my bulgy kit over 99% of all russian kits I have seen. Yes, sure I would like a russian for the collection but I dont need it to feel like a man.

Whatever floats your boat bud.
Im just saying the Russians have same or better quality than the bulgarians considering the bulgarian type 3s are direct copies and for a while there they even used Russian guns to build theirs!! But more than anything its the history.

When you say AK47, you think Russia.
So why not an actuall Russian AK47?

Im glad you like your bulgy kit, but people pay this kinda money for Russian AK47s not because of quality(which is extremely high on most type 3s) but because of the history and rarity. So your post was a little outaplace.

I know why people buy russian T3's but I feel the quality of most of them that made it here is not near as nice as other countries. Most were beat to shit. Yes, at one time those parts were really nice but those kits tend 2 have a lot more wear on them. Lets face if, by your own words, they are the same then why are you being such a prick over a damn roll mark? Take your shitty day out on someone else.

Im not having a shitty day. I just dont think people should put a Bulgarian t3 in the same class as a Russian t3.
Just like Dragunov owners dont like Tigers or PSLs being put in the same class. People pay the extra so they have something special, they dont want it lumped in with the common stuff.

Posted: 4/3/2009 8:57:58 AM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Hey if your happy cool, IDGF. I like what I got and $600 for a non match (not same country) is not right when advertised as matching. A bulgarian is real deal so is hungarian... just because a guy did it first doesnt mean he did it better. In most cases they get surpassed. The whole Ferrari shit was red hering. And quite honestly yes I do want my bulgy kit over 99% of all russian kits I have seen. Yes, sure I would like a russian for the collection but I dont need it to feel like a man.

Whatever floats your boat bud.
Im just saying the Russians have same or better quality than the bulgarians considering the bulgarian type 3s are direct copies and for a while there they even used Russian guns to build theirs!! But more than anything its the history.

When you say AK47, you think Russia.
So why not an actuall Russian AK47?

Im glad you like your bulgy kit, but people pay this kinda money for Russian AK47s not because of quality(which is extremely high on most type 3s) but because of the history and rarity. So your post was a little outaplace.

I know why people buy russian T3's but I feel the quality of most of them that made it here is not near as nice as other countries. Most were beat to shit. Yes, at one time those parts were really nice but those kits tend 2 have a lot more wear on them. Lets face if, by your own words, they are the same then why are you being such a prick over a damn roll mark? Take your shitty day out on someone else.

Ol' MK says the best AKs were built in Bulgaria.

Posted: 4/3/2009 9:00:54 AM EDT

[#37]

Ok, since this is my thread, I'm going to chime in on you two. Regardless of quality of the kit, people select the (general more beat up) Russian kits for the history and the Holy Grailishness of a "true" AK47. I have a stamped PLO and it shoots worse than my WASR-3, but who cares? The WASR will never been a collectible rifle, while the Russian always gets an "Oooooo" when I drag it out of the safe. The Type 3 would simply be another older and more exotic variant.

Posted: 4/3/2009 10:00:40 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:

Quoted:
600 sounds like a good deal for an almost numbers matching russian kit with a good bore. How's the condition on the rest of the parts?

I paid alot more for a much more common yugo m92 kit.

For $630 I got a perfect matching Bulgarian T3 kit.

Bulgarian is not Russian.
Theres a big difference in the history and value.

Sure, some people value shot out plo's over a really nice kit because of the history, but there is not much of a difference in price. I have not seen a russian kit in 1/10 of the shape. I like history but I want quality more.

Really? The bore on my PLO Russian type 3 is in excellent shape, I would say almost new.
Guess im just the miracle man.

You can have the real deal, or a copy made by the bulgarians.

As for quality, lmao. You do know the bulgarians copied just about everything from the Russians?
Thats like buying a Ferrari built by ford, sure it may be near the same quality, but do you really want that?

Hey if your happy cool, IDGF. I like what I got and $600 for a non match (not same country) is not right when advertised as matching. A bulgarian is real deal so is hungarian... just because a guy did it first doesnt mean he did it better. In most cases they get surpassed. The whole Ferrari shit was red hering. And quite honestly yes I do want my bulgy kit over 99% of all russian kits I have seen. Yes, sure I would like a russian for the collection but I dont need it to feel like a man.

Whatever floats your boat bud.
Im just saying the Russians have same or better quality than the bulgarians considering the bulgarian type 3s are direct copies and for a while there they even used Russian guns to build theirs!! But more than anything its the history.

When you say AK47, you think Russia.
So why not an actuall Russian AK47?

Im glad you like your bulgy kit, but people pay this kinda money for Russian AK47s not because of quality(which is extremely high on most type 3s) but because of the history and rarity. So your post was a little outaplace.

I know why people buy russian T3's but I feel the quality of most of them that made it here is not near as nice as other countries. Most were beat to shit. Yes, at one time those parts were really nice but those kits tend 2 have a lot more wear on them. Lets face if, by your own words, they are the same then why are you being such a prick over a damn roll mark? Take your shitty day out on someone else.

Ol' MK says the best AKs were built in Bulgaria.

I really do love your opinions sundance. Always a good ammount of BS with a touch of Pot Stiring.

Posted: 4/3/2009 10:05:25 AM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
Ok, since this is my thread, I'm going to chime in on you two. Regardless of quality of the kit, people select the (general more beat up) Russian kits for the history and the Holy Grailishness of a "true" AK47. I have a stamped PLO and it shoots worse than my WASR-3, but who cares? The WASR will never been a collectible rifle, while the Russian always gets an "Oooooo" when I drag it out of the safe. The Type 3 would simply be another older and more exotic variant.

But but but... The bulgarian is better quality and stuff?

Posted: 4/3/2009 10:14:45 AM EDT

[#40]