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Accuracy Test of an M16-A1 Barrel (Page 2 of 2)
| I have a couple of "Mostly Colt" rifles. One is a CDNN Colt upper w/o BCG and the other is a SP-1 minus the lower receiver I bought on the EE several yewars ago. Both 1-12 and both really like the old Black Hills blue box 52gr ammo. I really should try sticking some decent glass on them and see what they can do. Nice writeup. |
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Originally Posted By MRW:
I understand, but the A1 hider does not have a closed bottom, so essentially there is no "bottom". It's installed over a lock washer and tightened down. However it lines up, that's how it is. Unless I've been doing it wrong for all these years. Originally Posted By MRW:
Originally Posted By DefaultUsername:
I think he means how the flat sides of the hider are not vertical. I understand, but the A1 hider does not have a closed bottom, so essentially there is no "bottom". It's installed over a lock washer and tightened down. However it lines up, that's how it is. Unless I've been doing it wrong for all these years. you're doing it right. the A1 birdcage is not timed. 
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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin
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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
- Benjamin Franklin
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Anybody ever tried one of these?
1/9" twist. http://www.dpmsinc.com/A1-LITE-20_ep_109-1.html |
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?
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If I remember right, it has a 0.75 gas block and is a heavier profile under the handguards. DPMS chose a really funny profile for that barrel |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
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MRW:
That is a great rifle. Take that thing over here and shoot it!! http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1744566_.html |
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?
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Originally Posted By Sinister:
I would guess that adding a DD Omega 12.0 (free-floating with NO modification to the base upper) and switching to a Geissele trigger you could shrink that group even more. Excellent performance from a stock trigger and barrel!!! Bravo, man, bravo.  Yep, my thought as well. Very nice shooting and a great post. Thanks. |
Happiness is a warm gun,
Bang bang, shoot shoot.
The Beatles
Nov. 1968
Bang bang, shoot shoot.
The Beatles
Nov. 1968
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Originally Posted By EVR: MRW: That is a great rifle. Take that thing over here and shoot it!! http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1744566_.html |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
| OP; I've made a few sweet shooters like yours, and my thing is to not mess with them after finding out how nice they are. I think you are in that same mindset. It basically is ridiculous to take a sweet-shooting rifle made of mostly surplus or low-priced components and spend time and money in the effort to extract every millimeter of accuracy out of it. If that had been the point, you would have used all premium components to start with. And when I say 'sweet-shooter', I mean all aspects of function must be smooth and dependable as well as having acceptable accuracy with moderately-priced factory ammunition. It is beautiful when you find the right ammo and get used to such a rifle - you really can get good with it in the practical sense. |
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Shot it again today Testing this 50 grain tipped ammo with the M16A1 barrel build rifle and the Green Mountain 1/6 twist barrel build  1/12 twist M16A1 barrel results on top.  I zeroed the iron sights first with 55 FMJ, then switched to the 10x scope for the Federal 50 gr tipped ammo test, then intended to switch back to the irons and shoot a 10 shot target with 55 FMJs again. But I only had 7 rounds  I dunno about that round way out left. oops? carry handle did pretty well holding zero after being taken off |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
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Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
62gr is too heavy for any 1 in 12 twist barrel to stabilize. Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Originally Posted By CROWDLG:
Originally Posted By MRW:
Originally Posted By Jeepy2013:
Is that one of the old 1/12 barrels? Yes. It is a surplus 1/12 M16A1 barrel made by Colt They do shoot great with 55gr ammo. I had one that would keyhole 62gr green tip though. Great shooting OP. 62gr is too heavy for any 1 in 12 twist barrel to stabilize. I don't think I agree totally with this statement, although I've got no data to prove it. If you mean M855 type ammo, then yeah. But remington makes a 62 grain BTHP that I thought was meant for the 1/12 twist for match shooting. Of course it's a shorter bullet than the M855 with a steel penetrator. |
Jesus came to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable. - My Pastor
MRW, here was my test that one time a while back with the SAK barreled A1 upper and knock off 4x carry handle scope. And yes, I know it's hard to believe but that was 100 yards:
these next two were the black hills 52's also, IIRC 
That barrel could freakin shoot. |
Jesus came to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable. - My Pastor
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Sweet! Those 52 SMKs are freakin laser beams the bottom group on my target was from the Green Mountain 1/6 twist testing going on here, using a different barrel. The top group is the same ammo shot from the 1/12 twist M16A1 barrel rifle that this thread is about. It's interesting to see the comparison, since the Green mountain barrel has a twist that is twice as fast as the M16A1 |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
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Well it appears they weren't spinning apart. If you were using the 50 grain polymer tipped load in the 1/6. Your notes make it sound like you were shooting 55's though.
But yeah, I've yet to meet a barrel that doesn't like the 52's. Faster twist barrels too. |
Jesus came to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable. - My Pastor
| Will someone test their Green Mountain or Brownells 20" 1/12 barrel and post the results? I wonder if the newer barrels can do better than the old ones |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
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Originally Posted By MRW:
Will someone test their Green Mountain or Brownells 20" 1/12 barrel and post the results? I wonder if the newer barrels can do better than the old ones http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_123/684479_.html&page=1&anc=7021052#i7021052 |
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Originally Posted By MRW:
Yes. It is a surplus 1/12 M16A1 barrel made by Colt Originally Posted By MRW:
Originally Posted By Jeepy2013:
Is that one of the old 1/12 barrels? Yes. It is a surplus 1/12 M16A1 barrel made by Colt Used or "new - old stock"? I have an original circa. 1981 that shoots well but I've never spent any time loading for it. It eats everything I feed it. Thousands of rounds have gone done the tube. I'll see what it can do come spring. |
| used, not new. It was on an upper that was scratched up pretty bad on the left side. I separated them and sold the upper. I have no idea on the barrel's round count |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
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Originally Posted By JJREA:
I don't think I agree totally with this statement, although I've got no data to prove it. If you mean M855 type ammo, then yeah. But remington makes a 62 grain BTHP that I thought was meant for the 1/12 twist for match shooting. Of course it's a shorter bullet than the M855 with a steel penetrator. Originally Posted By JJREA:
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
Originally Posted By CROWDLG:
Originally Posted By MRW:
Originally Posted By Jeepy2013:
Is that one of the old 1/12 barrels? Yes. It is a surplus 1/12 M16A1 barrel made by Colt They do shoot great with 55gr ammo. I had one that would keyhole 62gr green tip though. Great shooting OP. 62gr is too heavy for any 1 in 12 twist barrel to stabilize. I don't think I agree totally with this statement, although I've got no data to prove it. If you mean M855 type ammo, then yeah. But remington makes a 62 grain BTHP that I thought was meant for the 1/12 twist for match shooting. Of course it's a shorter bullet than the M855 with a steel penetrator. There is no reason 62 grain lead core bullets are inherently unstable in a 1/12 twist barrel. For sure, lengthening them by the addition of a less-dense core material like a steel penetrator could tip the scales against them, but don't forget, the old .22 Savage High Power bullet was 70 grains and the rifle twist was 1/12, and that bullet wasn't travelling very fast, either. Velocities ran about 2800 fps. It was a lead-core, semi-pointed job so it was shorter than a similar weight bullet would have been if that bullet had a steel core. Longer the bullet, the more twist is needed to stabilize it |
What are the Rosary, the Cross or the Crucifix other than tools to help maintain the fortress of our faith in Jesus Christ, the Son of God?
| Didn't read this whole thing so somebody else could have mentioned this but before I would mess with other barrels or a free float setup I would swap out the trigger . Generic mil style LPKs don't work well for me if I am really trying to shoot groups . Even a low end RRNM drop in will give a much cleaner letoff and I would expect the OPs results might drop down to near MOA |
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Originally Posted By MRW:
I've really been looking hard at that barrel since last December. Will Fulton install the Front sight base on it too? |
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Originally Posted By JJREA:
MRW, here was my test that one time a while back with the SAK barreled A1 upper and knock off 4x carry handle scope. And yes, I know it's hard to believe but that was 100 yards: http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o475/NomadABPos/102_4995.jpg http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o475/NomadABPos/102_4999.jpg http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o475/NomadABPos/102_5003.jpg these next two were the black hills 52's also, IIRC http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o475/NomadABPos/102_5002.jpg http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o475/NomadABPos/102_5001.jpg http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o475/NomadABPos/102_5000.jpg That barrel could freakin shoot. |
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@JLS81 Ugh..... I don't really remember the brand. I've had it since I've had the gun which was like..... 2000 my Dad gave it to me. He bought it out in AZ from a guy. And the scope was with it. It's a non descript, but very good Colt copy. There was a thread in the retro forum about a year ago where guys had found a certain brand for reasonable and mine looked awfully similar to theirs. And I put up pics of mine with the little info sheet that has absolutely no brand markings..... 
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| I had a Japan made Hakko that was a near identical clone of the Colt. blue ring label |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
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I had the opportunity to fire the first rounds out of an M16a1 brand new out of the box when it was on loan to the PD. It was a 1971 or 1972 made gun in the original factory cardboard box. 50 yards, ball ammo from kneeling. Literally a dime size group. Better than some of the rack guns I was issued. I was pleasantly surprised. We gave them back to the army after a few years. |
NYSRPA Life Member, NRA Life Member
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Originally Posted By JJREA:
@JLS81 Ugh..... I don't really remember the brand. I've had it since I've had the gun which was like..... 2000 my Dad gave it to me. He bought it out in AZ from a guy. And the scope was with it. It's a non descript, but very good Colt copy. There was a thread in the retro forum about a year ago where guys had found a certain brand for reasonable and mine looked awfully similar to theirs. And I put up pics of mine with the little info sheet that has absolutely no brand markings..... https://i.imgur.com/MGn4Dkc.jpg https://i.imgur.com/tyUJStf.jpg |
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MRW you sold the barrel? Nooooo! What if I could get you a new green mountain or a brownells? Would you have time to test it? Heres an interesting thought... How much do handguards affect harmonics of a barrel? What if you shoot with A1 then A2 and then Magpul polymer handguards? Would there be a change in accuracy between the products? Magpuls handguards fit tight and without slop. The spring that pushes the delta ring forward also pushes the handguards against the front sight handguard cap. Does this increase barrel tension? Let me know if you have a chance to try some new gear and I will see if I can get something in your hands. |
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Originally Posted By JJREA: I don't think I agree totally with this statement, although I've got no data to prove it. If you mean M855 type ammo, then yeah. But remington makes a 62 grain BTHP that I thought was meant for the 1/12 twist for match shooting. Of course it's a shorter bullet than the M855 with a steel penetrator. m855 is longer than usual 62g due to its construction.. normal FMJ 62g may work depending on the barrel |
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K_S, I'm interested!
that barrel is unfortunately gone. PS, email me to talk more. thx |
Don't be so open-minded that your brains fall out.
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
General education should not be mere job training, but training of the mind to reason. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/
Accuracy Test of an M16-A1 Barrel (Page 2 of 2)
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