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Posted: 9/24/2014 10:31:29 PM EDT
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I am building a long range target/varmint rifle and looking for a decent scope. I want to stay under $300 and get the best possible glass I can. I think I have it narrowed down to a few, one actually includes a mount. Anyone that has experience with any of these, I would love to hear it. I am leaning towards the Redfield because they are made by Leopold and I have heard are basically the same as the VX1, plus a lifetime warranty. But I want yalls opinions. FYI, all are BDC reticles. Thanks for your time guys.
Millet 4-16x50 TRS-1 Nikon 4-12x40 P-223 Nikon 4-12x40 Prostaff Redfield Revolution 4-12x40 w/mount |
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+1 |
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Quoted:
Is 10x enough for 600 yards? Seems like I would need a little more zoom to get some good groups? As long as you match the target size to your reticle you can shoot good groups regardless of magnification. With my 6x Swarovski I can shoot 2.5 inch groups all day long on 10 inch plates at 400 yards with my JP15. Pat |
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If you shoot with mil dot or don't mind it, take a look: |
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Quoted:
Is 10x enough for 600 yards? Seems like I would need a little more zoom to get some good groups? If you want a little more magnification, these are both also Japanese-glass Weavers. Discontinued since 2011 I believe, or whenever ATK bought out Meade, and the Super Slam line replaced it. I love Weaver, always seem to be heavily discounted and a great value. Weaver 4-16x50 Classic Extreme $300 Weaver 6-24x50 Classic Extreme $320 |
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Why would I not want a variable power scope? Seems like the adjustability while hunting would be a nice thing to have. Not to mention, when I go from shooting 200 yards to 600 yards at the range. Please fill me in, I am new to scopes. When you choose less features you can usually get into better glass in the same price range. |
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Quoted:
If you want a little more magnification, these are both also Japanese-glass Weavers. Discontinued since 2011 I believe, or whenever ATK bought out Meade, and the Super Slam line replaced it. I love Weaver, always seem to be heavily discounted and a great value. Weaver 4-16x50 Classic Extreme $300 Weaver 6-24x50 Classic Extreme $320 Quoted:
Quoted:
Is 10x enough for 600 yards? Seems like I would need a little more zoom to get some good groups? If you want a little more magnification, these are both also Japanese-glass Weavers. Discontinued since 2011 I believe, or whenever ATK bought out Meade, and the Super Slam line replaced it. I love Weaver, always seem to be heavily discounted and a great value. Weaver 4-16x50 Classic Extreme $300 Weaver 6-24x50 Classic Extreme $320 They're not Japan anymore. These new ones are Philippines now. |
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A $300 scope with good glass and accurate long range bullet drop estimating capabilities not dependent on specific ammo, is a very, very tall order. You really need milrad turrets and reticle for that kind of work. The Millet scopes have the turrets and reticle, but not the glass. The Nikon is not milrad. The Redfield you are looking at is NOT VX-1 quality, nor does it have milrad or other tactical or target turrets designed to be adjusted with repeatable reliability.
The lowest cost scope with decent glass that might combine those feature might be a non-illuminated Leupold Mark AR. The 3-9x40mm mil dot version should come in at about $350. The 4-12x for longer range is probably going to be closer to $500. Both of these have VX-1 glass and true, accurate, repeatable milrad turrets and reticles. Do not underestimate the capabilities of 9x at extended ranges out to 600. If you feel you need more power and will really be frequently shooting way on out there, then save up for a better 4-12. The longer the range, the more important the quality of the glass becomes. It's not just about magnification. Clarity and resolving power (the ability to see and distinguish find detail) are just as important, if not more so. Cheap scopes just make the fuzzy "blob" bigger at higher power. Higher magnification does not improve the image quality. You can get better glass by going with one of the fixed power 10x scopes, but then will have problems trying to use that scope in close, if it is the only scope you have and you need to shoot at moving targets or at short ranges. Another scope frequently praised here is the special edition Weaver 3-10x40 Grand Slam Tactical offered only through MidwayUSA. This one still has Japanese glass, which should be pretty darn good. It is on sale now for about $270. I do not have that scope, but it does enjoy a decent reputation for price/value and does have the features you need at the price you are seeking. Go here. |
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Quoted:
They're not Japan anymore. These new ones are Philippines now. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Is 10x enough for 600 yards? Seems like I would need a little more zoom to get some good groups? If you want a little more magnification, these are both also Japanese-glass Weavers. Discontinued since 2011 I believe, or whenever ATK bought out Meade, and the Super Slam line replaced it. I love Weaver, always seem to be heavily discounted and a great value. Weaver 4-16x50 Classic Extreme $300 Weaver 6-24x50 Classic Extreme $320 They're not Japan anymore. These new ones are Philippines now. I stand corrected. So Natchez is having Weaver make the Classic Extreme line in the Philippines. I'll stick with the Super Slam line. Very good to know, I was going to order from Natchez in a few weeks. |
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Quoted:
A $300 scope with good glass and accurate long range bullet drop estimating capabilities not dependent on specific ammo, is a very, very tall order. You really need milrad turrets and reticle for that kind of work. The Millet scopes have the turrets and reticle, but not the glass. The Nikon is not milrad. The Redfield you are looking at is NOT VX-1 quality, nor does it have milrad or other tactical or target turrets designed to be adjusted with repeatable reliability. The lowest cost scope with decent glass that might combine those feature might be a non-illuminated Leupold Mark AR. The 3-9x40mm mil dot version should come in at about $350. The 4-12x for longer range is probably going to be closer to $500. Both of these have VX-1 glass and true, accurate, repeatable milrad turrets and reticles. Do not underestimate the capabilities of 9x at extended ranges out to 600. If you feel you need more power and will really be frequently shooting way on out there, then save up for a better 4-12. The longer the range, the more important the quality of the glass becomes. It's not just about magnification. Clarity and resolving power (the ability to see and distinguish find detail) are just as important, if not more so. Cheap scopes just make the fuzzy "blob" bigger at higher power. Higher magnification does not improve the image quality. You can get better glass by going with one of the fixed power 10x scopes, but then will have problems trying to use that scope in close, if it is the only scope you have and you need to shoot at moving targets or at short ranges. Another scope frequently praised here is the special edition Weaver 3-10x40 Grand Slam Tactical offered only through MidwayUSA. This one still has Japanese glass, which should be pretty darn good. It is on sale now for about $270. I do not have that scope, but it does enjoy a decent reputation for price/value and does have the features you need at the price you are seeking. Go here. Thanks for the info, very helpful. I would definitely prefer better glass over more power. I want everything to be as clear as possible, even at higher zoom. I really cant justify spending more than $300. 3x9-40 is probably plenty for what I need 90% of the time and will allow me to get better glass. I will only be shooting 600 yards on occasion at my range for fun, the rest of the time will be between 50-300 yards for messing around and deer/hog hunting in east Texas. |
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I have the redfield revolution 3x9 and like it. Plus made in the USA. Just remember installing it on a good mount like larue lt104 is important.
The scope has an accurange reticle. So you zero it at 200 and it has bullet drop at 300 and 400 which have been right on shooting 55 grain ammo. I wouldn't put anything with more than 10x magnification on a 556/223 gun. |
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How is this mount? Seems like a great deal and would work well.
Burris P.E.P.R. QD Mount |
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I've got the TRS-1 on AR#4. I bought it off the Sample List. Got the SWFA mount there too. Bright, clear and heavy. Perfect for what I use it for. However, I got both. I have the Bushy Elite 10x in a Larue mount. Sometimes I like a lighter, brighter simpler setup. Gratuitous picture of AR#4.with the TRS-1 
FWIW, I like the PEPR that bolts on especially if the scope is going to stay mounted for extended period of time. For QD mounts I'll stick with Larue. YMMV. |
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Not my thing but they always get decent reviews. The price is right, try one. |
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For $50 shipped, I dont see how its not worth a try. I dont care for QD mount either, but as long as its stable and secure on the rail while shooting, it should be fine. Thanks for the input guys. I am liking the specs on the Weaver Tactical Grand Slam. Anyone used Burris? Good glass? I have heard good things about them.
Burris Fullfield II |
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That Burris is fine, but the Weaver's Japanese glass will be better in all probability and it does have true milrad turrets and reticle. If you are going to go with a hunting scope, like the Burris you are looking at, then the VX-1 Leupold would be better.
I do have several Burris scopes, so I have no prejudice against the company. All I can say is that I would get the Leupold Mark AR, if I could. If not, the Tactical Weaver would be my second choice. Both have the features you need most and have good glass at the price point. I know the Leupold turret tracking is accurate. I think either would serve you well. As to mounts, If you do not plan to remove the scope, many vendors are selling the Leupold Mark 2 IMS mounting system as a package deal for only about $40 more than what they sell the scope for. It is not a QD return to zero system, but it is rock solid. Here is one example. I do not advocate any particular vendor and most of them have similar pricing on the combo package. Mark AR 3-9x40 with Mark 2 IMS Mount The Mil Dot reticle version and the mount come to $393.99 with free shipping. |
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Quoted:
Why would I not want a variable power scope? Seems like the adjustability while hunting would be a nice thing to have. Not to mention, when I go from shooting 200 yards to 600 yards at the range. Please fill me in, I am new to scopes. It's sort of like looking for a entry level small aircraft, and debating whether to get a prop plane or a jet. Not quite that extreme but you get the idea. If I wanted to shoot 200-600 on that budget I'd get a 6x or 10x super sniper. |
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http://youtu.be/34Fy1wKupWM?t=5m48s
Here you go check out the PAC4X with ACSS reticle by Primary Arms -Dimitri |
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I know the OP already bought the Weaver (good choice IMAO), but thought I'd give my 2c addiction to the subject.
When evaluating scopes in this price range, my eyes can't tell much difference in the glass until beyond 200 yards and 10x or higher mag. After that, the SS fixed power just plain outshined them all (in this price range). YMMV |
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