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Posted: 7/8/2024 4:18:55 PM EDT
I have a 14.5 mid length that I've had a carbine buffer in for a while. I just wanted to see if I can notice anything different by changing the buffers. The carbine buffer worked just fine with ejection at around 3:00. 3. :30, and bolt lock at end of magazine. I tried the h6, still around 3:00 to 3:30 Ejection, and got the same ejection with the H buffer. All locking back on last round. It does seem to shoot a little softer, so I think right now I'm just going to leave the h6 in. I surely felt that there would at least be a change in ejection pattern, but there wasn't. Is this normal? This was using the cheapest wolf 223 ammo I had.
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MI, USA
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Posted: 7/8/2024 6:52:43 PM EDT
[#1]
What rifle are you running that will cycle Wolf unsuppressed with an H6!? Sounds extremely overgassed.
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Posted: 7/8/2024 8:14:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Brawnydog]
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bluedog82: What rifle are you running that will cycle Wolf unsuppressed with an H6!? Sounds extremely overgassed. H6 is not that heavy, I measured 5oz. I understand that it fits between the H2 and H3 buffers in weight. |
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Posted: 7/8/2024 11:56:22 PM EDT
[#3]
Small changes in buffer weight don’t always make the profound lifechanging impact that the internet would lead you to believe.
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Posted: 7/9/2024 6:26:49 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: Small changes in buffer weight don't always make the profound lifechanging impact that the internet would lead you to believe. |
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Posted: 7/9/2024 7:49:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1168RGR]
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: That's a fact. I watched a Youtube video recently where a guy kept going up in buffer weight and I don't think he ever could tell a difference. It's odd how in one rifle it doesn't do much and another it dramatically changes the ejection pattern and felt recoil. I just wanted to see if this was typical behavior, or if he (the Youtube guy) and I had outlier guns. Not saying that it doesn’t work at all. For example a gun that normally has an H2, but doesn’t run that way with steel cased might work with steel cased well enough for training purposes with an H0. And if you add a suppressor occasionally, switching to an H4 during that occasion might make the gun more tolerable with the extra gas. This is why an H0 and an A5H0 live in one of my cans of steel cased, and extra heavy buffers travel with my guns that are only suppressed occasionally. A gun might feel “clunkier” while using a heavier buffer, and for competition that involves a shot timer, turning down the gas and using a lighter buffer is the normal practice. |
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Posted: 7/9/2024 9:32:02 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: Used to be somewhat common "wisdom", and maybe it still is in some circles, that you'd tune a gun by stepping up in buffer weight until the gun doesn't lock back, and then back off one. Well, even with a click adj gas block, usually guns that will run with an H1 will also run with an H3. And if they don't run an H3, stepping down to an H2 won't be a big enough step down to work 100% while dirty, cold, and shooting downwards. Not saying that it doesn't work at all. For example a gun that normally has an H2, but doesn't run that way with steel cased might work with steel cased well enough for training purposes with an H0. And if you add a suppressor occasionally, switching to an H4 during that occasion might make the gun more tolerable with the extra gas. This is why an H0 and an A5H0 live in one of my cans of steel cased, and extra heavy buffers travel with my guns that are only suppressed occasionally. A gun might feel "clunkier" while using a heavier buffer, and for competition that involves a shot timer, turning down the gas and using a lighter buffer is the normal practice. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 7/9/2024 1:48:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: TheQuadfather]
[#7]
Heavier buffers make it harder to stay on target. The dot/reticle will ‘dance’ more between shots.
You have to get pretty extreme for buffer weight to make any difference in reliability. If an upper will run, it will run anything from Carbine-H3. H and H2 are the best bets for anything even half ass normal. |
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Posted: 7/9/2024 1:56:19 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TheQuadfather: Heavier buffers make it harder to stay on target. The dot/reticle will ‘dance’ more between shots. This. The BCG returning to battery will cause the muzzle to dip hard, especially with a lighter weight barrel. Follow up shot accuracy suffers. |
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Posted: 7/9/2024 1:58:32 PM EDT
[#9]
I generally use H or H2 as they are heavy enough to tame bolt bounce and cost less than H3's.
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Posted: 7/9/2024 2:13:39 PM EDT
[#10]
Thanks guys. I'm learning all kinds of stuff.
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Posted: 7/9/2024 2:20:41 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: This. The BCG returning to battery will cause the muzzle to dip hard, especially with a lighter weight barrel. Follow up shot accuracy suffers. |
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Posted: 7/9/2024 2:54:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: TGWLDR]
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: My mid has some weight, but I have a couple of pencil barrels. So, unless otherwise indicated, it's best to stay with carbine buffer on pencil barrels, and maybe a little bit heavier on government? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: Originally Posted By TGWLDR: This. The BCG returning to battery will cause the muzzle to dip hard, especially with a lighter weight barrel. Follow up shot accuracy suffers. H/H2 are all that I use and should run just fine in any properly configured AR. Any AR that functions properly with a carbine buffer will benefit from an H weight, IME. H1/USGI spring is my preferred starting point. ETA: Gas system/action spring/buffer are all key factors to consider as they all must work together. |
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Posted: 7/9/2024 5:00:01 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: H/H2 are all that I use and should run just fine in any properly configured AR. Any AR that functions properly with a carbine buffer will benefit from an H weight, IME. H1/USGI spring is my preferred starting point. ETA: Gas system/action spring/buffer are all key factors to consider as they all must work together. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 7/10/2024 3:25:15 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: H/H2 are all that I use and should run just fine in any properly configured AR. Any AR that functions properly with a carbine buffer will benefit from an H weight, IME. H1/USGI spring is my preferred starting point. ETA: Gas system/action spring/buffer are all key factors to consider as they all must work together. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: Originally Posted By Brawnydog: Originally Posted By TGWLDR: This. The BCG returning to battery will cause the muzzle to dip hard, especially with a lighter weight barrel. Follow up shot accuracy suffers. H/H2 are all that I use and should run just fine in any properly configured AR. Any AR that functions properly with a carbine buffer will benefit from an H weight, IME. H1/USGI spring is my preferred starting point. ETA: Gas system/action spring/buffer are all key factors to consider as they all must work together. Agreed. H / usgi spring is the most reliable combination and will have the best recoil impulse in any upper using a full mass bcg. It bests all the gucci springs, A5 bullshit, etc. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 7/12/2024 11:19:45 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: Used to be somewhat common “wisdom”, and maybe it still is in some circles, that you’d tune a gun by stepping up in buffer weight until the gun doesn’t lock back, and then back off one. Well, even with a click adj gas block, usually guns that will run with an H1 will also run with an H3. And if they don’t run an H3, stepping down to an H2 won’t be a big enough step down to work 100% while dirty, cold, and shooting downwards. Not saying that it doesn’t work at all. For example a gun that normally has an H2, but doesn’t run that way with steel cased might work with steel cased well enough for training purposes with an H0. And if you add a suppressor occasionally, switching to an H4 during that occasion might make the gun more tolerable with the extra gas. This is why an H0 and an A5H0 live in one of my cans of steel cased, and extra heavy buffers travel with my guns that are only suppressed occasionally. A gun might feel “clunkier” while using a heavier buffer, and for competition that involves a shot timer, turning down the gas and using a lighter buffer is the normal practice. The 5.56 AR is not gas / reciprocating mass sensitive. Any 5.56 that runs and locks back on the last round with an H2 buffer using brass cased 5.56 ball ammo will cycle steel cased .223 55 grain just fine. It just might not lock the bolt back 100% of the time but every round will cycle. It takes a LOT of cut mass to get an AR15 to fail to cycle. Likewise, it takes a lot of added mass to get it to fail to lock the bolt back and even more to get it to fail to cycle 100%. The spread of a buffer from carbine to H3 is not enough. |
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USA
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Posted: 7/12/2024 11:28:36 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: Small changes in buffer weight don’t always make the profound lifechanging impact that the internet would lead you to believe. When at the range, using the same ammo, shooting back to back in the same rifle, I swapped between 3.0oz, 4.0oz and 4.6oz buffers and noticed no difference in function, felt recoil, ejection distance, or ejection angle in a carbine length gas system. The buffer spring was standard carbine length. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 12:02:10 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TheQuadfather: Agreed. H / usgi spring is the most reliable combination and will have the best recoil impulse in any upper using a full mass bcg. It bests all the gucci springs, A5 bullshit, etc. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 12:37:30 PM EDT
[#18]
One more thing, and I hope I'm going to be able to double check this out today, but my 14.5 carbine seems to shoot softer than my 14.5 midlength. I was shooting one of my carbines the other day, and then shot the mid length, and was like damn. That was even after putting the H buffer in.
They all work reliably, I just like tinkering and can never leave well enough alone. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 12:40:22 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: One more thing, and I hope I'm going to be able to double check this out today, but my 14.5 carbine seems to shoot softer than my 14.5 midlength. I was shooting one of my carbines the other day, and then shot the mid length, and was like damn. That was even after putting the H buffer in. They all work reliably, I just like tinkering and can never leave well enough alone. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 12:50:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: TGWLDR]
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: I just like tinkering and can never leave well enough alone. This is the case for many. And while not a negative in every aspect, much of the time it causes issues for many AR owners. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 12:55:17 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1168RGR]
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: One more thing, and I hope I'm going to be able to double check this out today, but my 14.5 carbine seems to shoot softer than my 14.5 midlength. I was shooting one of my carbines the other day, and then shot the mid length, and was like damn. That was even after putting the H buffer in. They all work reliably, I just like tinkering and can never leave well enough alone. Also, rain. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 4:10:45 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jaqufrost: Your middy probably has a much larger gas port. But on another rifle, a 14.5 carbine, I had some kind of malfunction. I don't even know what it's called. It was probably the 3rd or 4th round from empty magazine, and it just went click. I'm like, ok a hard primer, just eject and keep going. Only I could not pull back the bolt. I had to mortar it. After that I popped it back in and it fired just right. Does anybody have a name for that malfunction? |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 4:13:27 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: This is the case for many. And while not a negative in every aspect, much of the time it causes issues for many AR owners. |
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Posted: 7/12/2024 4:15:08 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: This is more common than you might expect. Also, rain. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 7/13/2024 10:05:51 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Brawnydog: One more thing, and I hope I'm going to be able to double check this out today, but my 14.5 carbine seems to shoot softer than my 14.5 midlength. I was shooting one of my carbines the other day, and then shot the mid length, and was like damn. That was even after putting the H buffer in. They all work reliably, I just like tinkering and can never leave well enough alone. Port size matters more than location. That malfunction was a bad round. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 7/14/2024 8:07:26 AM EDT
[#26]
Now I'm wondering if I put a carbine buffer in my 14.5" mid will I feel less recoil vs the H2 in there now?
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Posted: 7/14/2024 10:42:59 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RangeToy: Now I'm wondering if I put a carbine buffer in my 14.5" mid will I feel less recoil vs the H2 in there now? If you only swap them out, you’ll just have to try it and let the shot timer be the judge. When I’ve done that, for a given gas setting and ammo, neither the heaviest nor the lightest buffer that would run gave the best results. Either way, an ounce of buffer weight is splitting hairs. |
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Posted: 7/23/2024 4:30:24 PM EDT
[#28]
I just shot with an Armaspec SRS with H buffer and will admit that it felt smoother and less recoil. No malfunctions, 4 o'clock ejection, bolt hold open on last round of Wolf .223 55g.
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