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Posted: 6/16/2010 8:09:25 AM EDT
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I don't get it, these sights are everywhere for $30-$50 on the internet, yet brand new (Brownells for instance) are $130+
What's the deal? The Chinese get their hands on these and start making knock offs or are they AirSoft? Why so cheap, I thought they were decent BUIS's ? |
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In all honesty, earlier, when they were harder to get, there was a big market for Airsoft knock-offs because it was what the military was issuing. At the time, a lot of troops also were going without BUIS because they were issued detachable carry handles and optics, so a lot of guys were either buying their own or not worrying about it.
A lot of times, BUIS and replacements are drop shipped to a unit needing them as Class IX - durable (expendable) items, and inventoried by the box, not by the individual part, not that it would matter, again, because they're expendable items. It's like magazines, while I'm sure it's happened before in the past, I've never seen a statement of charges written over a magazine, and I'd raise holy hell over it if I were to see one. Inevitably, things will happen like a platoon will be given a box full of the things and told to install or replace any BUIS in the platoon that needs 'em, and then when they try to return the leftovers to the supply room, they'll be told "we don't want that shit..." it's extra stuff to inventory, even though they're an expendable item, like blanks, and like blanks, it's a bigger hassle to accept them for turn in than to simply "allow them to be expended." Inevitably, many of these leftovers get picked up by someone and sold on the open market, whether it's asupply sergeant who calls his buddy over to see if he "wants any of this crap that's not on my property book," or an individual soldier who looks at a box full of BUIS and says "seriously? You're just gonna throw these all away? And takes 'em home and gets on eBay." It's a hell of a grey area, again, like shooting up blanks just to get rid of them, and then it turns out a few months down the road that you can't properly execute a training iteration because there's not enough blank ammo in the larder. What it means in the civilian market, though, is that essentially, the real-deal can undersell even the airsoft clones, because the "wholesale costs" are essentially zero to the "distributors." Airsoft knockoffs still have to be manufactured and imported, while the real deal simply needs to be picked up. $40 for a knock-off Troy might be worth it considering what a real one goes, but $40 for a knock-off MATECH can't compete with a real MATECH for $50. Nevertheless, the "new" price for one more "legitimately" sourced through proper channels and direct to the commercial market, not through a government purchase is still about $150. That being said, the same can be said for the KAC M4 RAS as well. With a street value of $100-$150, yet an MSRP of over $300. There is something to be said for volume production, there's just so freaking many of them out there that have already been paid for by the government that only a few end up purchased through "legitimate" channels. ~Augee |
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The US military uses them. They are an expendable item. End of story. Bingo ! And since you already paid full price for them with your taxes you might as well throw 45 bucks at them to take em home! On the other side, I ditch mine as soon as I get issued a rifle. GGGaz sight that has been replaced on my personal rifle always sits on my .mil guns. The MAtech sight locking spring clip breaks so fucking often its absurd. And that sucks when its wiggling around in front of your ACOG while youre shooting. |
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The US military uses them. They are an expendable item. End of story. Bingo ! And since you already paid full price for them with your taxes you might as well throw 45 bucks at them to take em home! On the other side, I ditch mine as soon as I get issued a rifle. GGGaz sight that has been replaced on my personal rifle always sits on my .mil guns. The MAtech sight locking spring clip breaks so fucking often its absurd. And that sucks when its wiggling around in front of your ACOG while youre shooting. That's one way to look at it and tend to agree more than I disagree. The morality is debatable, though. As another poster said, same as the KAC RAS; retail= $300+, secondary market= $140+/-. Personally I don't like Matechs, got a couple in a trade, and quickly sold them for $55ea. The big question is in deed why in the hell are they going for $130-150 retail?! I'd take a Troy in a heartbeat while pocketing $30+. |
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Quoted:
In all honesty, earlier, when they were harder to get, there was a big market for Airsoft knock-offs because it was what the military was issuing. At the time, a lot of troops also were going without BUIS because they were issued detachable carry handles and optics, so a lot of guys were either buying their own or not worrying about it. A lot of times, BUIS and replacements are drop shipped to a unit needing them as Class IX - durable (expendable) items, and inventoried by the box, not by the individual part, not that it would matter, again, because they're expendable items. It's like magazines, while I'm sure it's happened before in the past, I've never seen a statement of charges written over a magazine, and I'd raise holy hell over it if I were to see one. Inevitably, things will happen like a platoon will be given a box full of the things and told to install or replace any BUIS in the platoon that needs 'em, and then when they try to return the leftovers to the supply room, they'll be told "we don't want that shit..." it's extra stuff to inventory, even though they're an expendable item, like blanks, and like blanks, it's a bigger hassle to accept them for turn in than to simply "allow them to be expended." Inevitably, many of these leftovers get picked up by someone and sold on the open market, whether it's asupply sergeant who calls his buddy over to see if he "wants any of this crap that's not on my property book," or an individual soldier who looks at a box full of BUIS and says "seriously? You're just gonna throw these all away? And takes 'em home and gets on eBay." It's a hell of a grey area, again, like shooting up blanks just to get rid of them, and then it turns out a few months down the road that you can't properly execute a training iteration because there's not enough blank ammo in the larder. What it means in the civilian market, though, is that essentially, the real-deal can undersell even the airsoft clones, because the "wholesale costs" are essentially zero to the "distributors." Airsoft knockoffs still have to be manufactured and imported, while the real deal simply needs to be picked up. $40 for a knock-off Troy might be worth it considering what a real one goes, but $40 for a knock-off MATECH can't compete with a real MATECH for $50. Nevertheless, the "new" price for one more "legitimately" sourced through proper channels and direct to the commercial market, not through a government purchase is still about $150. That being said, the same can be said for the KAC M4 RAS as well. With a street value of $100-$150, yet an MSRP of over $300. There is something to be said for volume production, there's just so freaking many of them out there that have already been paid for by the government that only a few end up purchased through "legitimate" channels. ~Augee Very well written, and very accurate. |
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Got the Matech today.
Now the only other folding sight I've owned was an MI ERS and it felt rock solid when it locked up. This sight the way it operates I'm curious does it even hold zero? You can flex it left & right on it's shaft, does it not move around while firing? It's not as solid as I hoped, not exactly what I was looking for. I'll have to get to the range to at least see how it does under fire. It'll probably be a few months before I can afford an Eotech |
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Never had any problems with the MATECH as long as it's installed correctly (not over-torqued and the screw broke). The one issue that there is with it is that if you really really just spend all your time playing with it, the metal tab that holds it locked closed might get worn down causing unwanted deployments. I've seen the problem with others, and I've seen them get looser over time on my own, but none of mine, on both personal and issued carbines have the problem. Again, I don't spend my hours idly finger-fucking it though and popping it up and down.
Never had a problem with wandering zero or worried that it would fail, honestly, most magnified optics won't allow the BUIS to fully deploy anyways while using it with a red dot is like having co-witnessed sights, so I don't even see that as a terribly big issue, either. That and with the price, if you use the thing enough to wear it out, I suspect you've probably got your fifty bucks worth out of it. If you don't think that it's sturdy enough, you'd really hate the KAC 300m, which doesn't lock positively either up or down, yet is considered to be one of the best and most simple BUIS out there. The MATECH is certainly not simple, but if you use it like a sight and not a chew toy, you shouldn't have any problems with it, thousands are in service in some much more grueling conditions. Ever seen what a Private can do to a weapon? ~Augee |
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I like the Matech sights, as we make the improved bracket and screw kit for these sights (not on behalf of the OEM, we do it on our own) we studied the sight a little more than the average user.
The screw and bracket we did improve on, there are things that can't be reversed, such as the mounting system that's not as tolerant of over sized rails, and the little nub that holds the sight down. For a backup sight, as Augee said, unless you play with it all the time, the little nub won't be a problem. A flaw yes, but something that can be prevented and addressed if you make another nub for the sight stalk. For the price (not the retail), they're hard to beat. |
| I’ve used the Matech sight for years both while deployed and for 3 gun matches. Never had a problem holding zero, and while not perfect, it’s robust enough for most users. In fact, the M4’s in our armory came from the factory with a rail system and the BUIS installed—and no carry handle. |
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