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Posted: 1/12/2014 12:53:19 AM EDT
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Hey every one, Ive already searched through the archives and didn't see anything so thought Id ask here. Im currently building my dream AR, not holding back on anything and just saving up for each item no matter what it costs and trying to find a short stroke gas piston kit that will fit under a Troy MRF-RX rail. I don't want to drop the money for both of these items (rail and gas piston kit) then find out they wont fit together. Any suggestions?
I really like the HK style gas system, and heard there was a company making exact clones of them for much cheaper than HK would sell them for. It would seem to me that an HK "416" gas piston kit would fit under this rail, but wanted to know if anyone knows what company is making these clone kits and if it will indeed fit under this rail (1.36" inner diameter, gas tube channel diameter .410"). Also who makes a standard mil-spec barrel nut that is of high quality? All I can find is high standard or some cheaper than dirt Chinese junk. I know every one says "a barrel nut is a barrel nut" but I don't want to drop all this money on this build and have it all held together with a $7 part... just not my style! Incase youre all wondering I have decided to go with the following... and before anyone jumps the gun, yes I do know the MRF rail will not work as is with the VLTOR MUR upper, I plan on fitting it and shouldn't be to difficult. As you can see, I drink the kool-aid. 
Trijicon ACOG TA31F w/ flashkill & quick throw detach mount VLTOR MUR-1A upper Gunfighter Mod-3 charging handle Ares Armor Billet 80% lower MagPul UBR stock, tan MagPul MOE grip, tan MagPul AFG, tan Troy 6.2" BattleRail Covers, tan (x3) MaTech auto-ranging BUIS Troy HK style Folding front BUIS Surefire XM962 light Geissele S3G trigger Noveske K9 (x3) Spikes Nickel-Boron Bolt/Carrier Troy MRF-RX 13.8" Rail Spikes 14.5" CHF Mid Length Opt-Prof w/ Noveske KX3 (pinned & welded) |
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Nice first post. May I suggested next time break up your huge paragraph into smaller ones. Its much easier to read.
That is one nice list of parts but why Troy? There are several rails out there made for piston guns. Order a barrel nut from BCM if your worried about quality. Also your FH will need to be pinned and welded. Not one or the other if there was a confusion their. |
The Troy MRF is the strongest non monolithic rail on the market, or so they say. It also comes apart and off easily without having to thread onto anything which is a huge plus for a gas piston kit which will be inside it. Im just trying to find a gas piston kit that will fit under it, looks like the vertical height of the inside of the Troy MRF works with the Adams Arms lite piston kit but the gas tube channel width is .090" dia to small, which would be an easy fix if I had access to a mill but I do not (or would that just mill away the entire wall thickness?). 
Im not aware of any quad rails that cover any piston kits, if there are I have not been able to find them with an entire night of internet searching.  Im going to be running a 14.5" barrel (mid length gas system) and want the rail to end right before to right after the end of the barrel (a 13.5" to 15" rail). If some one would finally make a full length quad rail that covers a gas piston kit and the TOP comes off in a similar fashion to the bottom of the Troy MRF, that'd be great...
I was looking at the Osprey piston kit but it looks far to wide to be used under a freefloat quad rail... my suspicions were further enhanced when I saw a picture of a guy who chopped the sides of his Troy alpha rail off to fit an Osprey piston kit. 
edit: also I did brain fart and misspoke in the original post, I know you have to weld the muzzle device to the blind pin (not the barrel) |
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Quoted:
I would check on using the KNS pins with the Geissele trigger, I have read in the past (even by Geissele themselves) that they do not work together well and arent needed. Exactly what I was going to say. They will work, but Geissele recommends against it. |
| Thanks for that bit of info, what would be the downside to the GS2 kit being used with the KNS 2nd gen anti walk kit? My main reason for using the KNS kit is because im drilling out the FCG pin holes myself, and don't want the slightest chance of the pins ever walking out. Secondly, lets be honest... it looks neat. The KNS pins themselves are highly polished stainless steel, I don't see the issue but maybe im missing something. |
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KNS pins are of crappy quality, not properly sized are hardened. You are paying more to use an inferior part.
Additionally, while they will fit in some Geissele triggers, they certainly will not work with the non standard pin arrangement on the G2S. Also, maybe read up on Troy before you decide to give them any of your hard earned money. |
| I'd sell the KNS pins. BUT- other than that It sounds like it's gonna be a sweet build once you get the quirks out. Make sure to upload lots of pics! Man i wish i could afford an ACOG right now. I dearly miss my old one. Just sticking with irons until that day comes |
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Quoted:
13.8" quad rail, 3 kx9 and a piston kit is going to make your rifle pretty hefty. not to mention the ubr stock as well. I came to post this, at least. OP is this your only AR? Short of a bipod and a BAD lever, you have every trinket there is. This is going to be one heavy SOB. Do you already have a DI rifle? Just curious why the piston. I have the MRF on my .308, it is one hell of a quad, but heavy. Good luck on your build. |
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Quoted: KNS pins are of crappy quality, not properly sized are hardened. You are paying more to use an inferior part. Additionally, while they will fit in some Geissele triggers, they certainly will not work with the non standard pin arrangement on the G2S. Also, maybe read up on Troy before you decide to give them any of your hard earned money. They might not be needed, but that doesn't mean they are inferior. As stated above, Geissele recommends to not use anything other than their supplied pins. |
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Sure,
Start here. A quote from Bill Geiselle, posted by adco. Quoted:
BS. Please provide supporting information in regards to them not being of the proper size, material or specifications when it comes to any of your claims. They might not be needed, but that doesn't mean they are inferior. As stated above, Geissele recommends to not use anything other than their supplied pins. Quoted:
Quoted:
KNS pins are of crappy quality, not properly sized are hardened. You are paying more to use an inferior part. Additionally, while they will fit in some Geissele triggers, they certainly will not work with the non standard pin arrangement on the G2S. Also, maybe read up on Troy before you decide to give them any of your hard earned money. They might not be needed, but that doesn't mean they are inferior. As stated above, Geissele recommends to not use anything other than their supplied pins. |
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Quoted:
Hey every one, Ive already searched through the archives and didn't see anything so thought Id ask here. Im currently building my dream AR, not holding back on anything and just saving up for each item no matter what it costs and trying to find a short stroke gas piston kit that will fit under a Troy MRF-RX rail. I don't want to drop the money for both of these items (rail and gas piston kit) then find out they wont fit together. Any suggestions? I really like the HK style gas system, and heard there was a company making exact clones of them for much cheaper than HK would sell them for. It would seem to me that an HK "416" gas piston kit would fit under this rail, but wanted to know if anyone knows what company is making these clone kits and if it will indeed fit under this rail (1.36" inner diameter, gas tube channel diameter .410"). Also who makes a standard mil-spec barrel nut that is of high quality? All I can find is high standard or some cheaper than dirt Chinese junk. I know every one says "a barrel nut is a barrel nut" but I don't want to drop all this money on this build and have it all held together with a $7 part... just not my style! Incase youre all wondering I have decided to go with the following... and before anyone jumps the gun, yes I do know the MRF rail will not work as is with the VLTOR MUR upper, I plan on fitting it and shouldn't be to difficult. As you can see, I drink the kool-aid.
The stuff I have already... Trijicon ACOG TA31F w/ flashkill & quick throw detach mount VLTOR MUR-1A Gunfighter Mod-3 charging handle Ares Armor Billet 80% lower MagPul UBR stock, tan MagPul MOE grip, tan MagPul AFG, tan Troy 6.2" BattleRail Covers, tan (x3) MaTech auto-ranging BUIS Surefire XM962 light KNS anti walk pin set 2nd gen Geissele GS2 2 stage trigger group Parts Im still saving up for... Troy HK style Folding front BUIS Noveske K9 (x3) Spikes or FailZero Nickel-Boron Bolt/Carrier Troy MRF-RX 13.8" Rail Spikes 14.5" CHF Mid Opt-Prof w/ Noveske KX3 (pinned or welded?...) Short stroke gas piston kit of some kind, as long as it works with the Troy MRF-RX Have you checked out the WMD Guns BCG? They are treated and seem to be pretty affordable. Saw these on AR15 news |
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Quoted:
13.8" quad rail, 3 kx9 and a piston kit is going to make your rifle pretty hefty. not to mention the ubr stock as well. Quoted:
13.8" quad rail, 3 kx9 and a piston kit is going to make your rifle pretty hefty. not to mention the ubr stock as well. Im not going to be running around mountainsides with this like a lot of people delusionally think of themselves doing when building an AR, so some weight is just fine with me. 
Quoted:
I came to post this, at least. OP is this your only AR? Short of a bipod and a BAD lever, you have every trinket there is. This is going to be one heavy SOB. Do you already have a DI rifle? Just curious why the piston. I have the MRF on my .308, it is one hell of a quad, but heavy. Good luck on your build. Certainly not my only AR, to keep it simple Ive been training with and using AR's for a long time. This is my "dream build", everything I want on one rifle. Again, some weight is fine... as Im not lugging it around Mount Matterhorn. I also excersize and weight lift on a regular basis so a 10lb rifle or whatever it ends up being isn't much to me personally. I know some people go nuts when they see an AR over 7.5lbs, that's not me. Yes, I have numerous standard DI AR's. Why the piston? Because it would be nice to have one for a change, it takes a few minutes to clean up a piston AR vs an hour to clean up a filthy DI AR after a day of shooting. Ive used a few HK416's and LWRC carbines several times and cleaning them was so simple even after a full day of shooting. I see no reason not to go with a piston set up besides the hassle of getting it set up how you want it plus the initial cost. Quoted:
Quoted:
Spikes or FailZero Nickel-Boron Bolt/Carrier Have you checked out the WMD Guns BCG? They are treated and seem to be pretty affordable. Saw these on AR15 news I have not but will check them out for sure, thanks!
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Id like to give a special thanks to DSG Arms for not only having the VLTOR MUR-1A upper in stock, but having it on sale, and having EXCELLENT pricing on very fast shipping. $196.65 total with 2 day priority shipping, awesome! I ordered it on Sunday night and it is posted to be delivered here Wednesday from halfway across the country. As a huge plus they also included $100 worth of insurance on the item free of charge to me. I believe this kind of excellent customer service should be rewarded and this is the only real way I can pay that back.
On an exact opposite note... PSA took nearly 6 weeks to get me my UBR stock. I understand it was the holiday season but seriously, that's crazy. I was told there was an issue with the website not showing correct stock, and that was the issue. Not cool, I spent nearly $300 on a stock just to be left wondering if they didn't have it or something until I called them after waiting several weeks with no call or email. Customer service then assured me I would have it but they couldn't say when. You'd think after having me wait this long for my item they would have rushed it, but no... UPS ground all the way from South Carolina to San Diego. Tracking for it says it should be here today, we'll see. PSA has some great deals on things, but they need to hire more people so things don't slip through cracks it would seem. |
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The UBR stock came in from PSA, it was black not FDE... sent it back for refund. Threw a MOE stock on it for now. Couldn't help myself, even though the lower isn't done yet I couldn't help it. Parts are still coming in... should have the Gunfighter Mod.3 CH and BCM barrel nut on Monday/Tuesday... ordering the barrel and LPGB on Monday as well.
https://scontent-a-pao.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/1506495_3883024970357_453871698_n.jpg https://scontent-a-pao.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1506666_3881088321942_428394785_n.jpg edit: add I call it the M-4A5, will have a few more bells n whistles on it (see first post for parts list) but the builder website didn't have them. https://scontent-a-pao.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/q71/s720x720/1538936_3888483386814_1243576834_n.jpg |
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Gunfighter Mod.3 Charging Handle and BCM Barrel Nut came in last night.
https://scontent-b-pao.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/q71/s720x720/1535706_3890558878700_2049813911_n.jpg |
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SPIKES Tactical / Fabrique National Chrome Vanadium Steel Cold Hammer Forged 5.56x45mm NATO 1/7 Right Hand Twist Chrome Lined High Pressure Magnetic Particle inspected 14.5" Optimum Contour barrel... that's a long name lol
https://scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1/551116_3921865461345_1780743472_n.jpg https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t1/1794731_3921865621349_383864513_n.jpg https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/t1/1499688_3921865861355_919958523_n.jpg https://scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1/1499642_3921866021359_868868444_n.jpg https://scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/t1/9382_3921866261365_1332649725_n.jpg |
| Show me another rail that comes off without having to torque anything and has full length rails thats atleast 13.5" long. Options would be nice, I hate Troy's business ethics after hearing who they knowingly hired, but this is the only option I am seeing for this and I can get it for a little under $200 shipped. If you know of something else, post it up. |
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