AR Sponsor
Posted: 11/25/2010 3:23:14 PM EDT
|
Samson Mfg has introduced a new forend rail system called the Evolution. The Evolution is a tube rail with removable attachment points.
Samson sent me the rail yesterday for photographs. I am posting with Samson's consent. Several factors were considered when building this tube. First was the tube rails propensity for building up heat. Samson used a splined stainless steel thermal bushing over the factory barrel nut to insulate the 6061 rail. Test showed this to reduce the rail temp by 60 degrees over other tube rail systems. Second, some tube rails have harmonics problems that make it "ping" when fired. Samson Mfg worked out the bugs. No more ping. Third, many tubes can be a pain to install and equally difficult to align. The Evolution went on to my rifle in 5 minutes without instructions (First one out of the factory) There are many splines that keep the tube from rotating and small "wings" keep it straight and against the upper receiver. The Evolution will work with most piston systems such as the Adams Arms and most others. The thermal bushing can be removed and it will fit directly onto a DPMS .308 style barrel nut. I haven't received the attachment points from Samson yet (tomorrow) I'll post additional pics with those attached. The tube is wide enough to tuck in a 1.5" sppressor, although I don't think the Surefire cans will fit due to the release lever. To the pics... 
This is an 11" tube over a 10.25" DD CHF barrel, a Samson low profile gas block and a Gemtech M4-02 suppressor. 
I'll post more pics tomorrow and I'll send the link to the thread to Scott Samson. He'll answer any questions. Rob |
|
Hello
Thanks for your interest in our newest rail the "Samson Evolution" I will get the exact weights and measurements for this configuration when I get to the office today. I can say they are the lightest on the market. The tube diameter is very comfortable and is just large enough to allow suppressors to fit inside. These will be available in many sizes,including cutouts for piston gas blocks. Also the Evolution will fit the DPMS .308 without the Thermal bushings. Available in early December. Scott Samson [email protected] |
|
Quoted:
Samson sent me the rail yesterday for photographs. I am posting with Samson's consent. Several factors were considered when building this tube. First was the tube rails propensity for building up heat. Samson used a splined stainless steel thermal bushing over the factory barrel nut to insulate the 6061 rail. Test showed this to reduce the rail temp by 60 degrees over other tube rail systems. Does this system use the standard barrel nut from the AR-15? And then your locking nut over it? It looks like it from the pictures but I'm not 100% certain... Edit: Just for clarification, the barrel nut used in this system in not proprietary. |
|
Quoted:
I wasn't initially sure if I like the look or not. After reflecting on it for a while, it does look promising. I am not really familiar with Samson. What is their reputation for quality and consistency? I got a flip mount for a aimpoint that I've been using for 3 gun since 5/16/2006 still going strong. |
|
Quoted:
I wasn't initially sure if I like the look or not. After reflecting on it for a while, it does look promising. I am not really familiar with Samson. What is their reputation for quality and consistency? I've used their folding sights before and they were solid as rock ... along the lines of Troy quality IMHO I really like the look of the rail ..... so a suppressor fit's under there you say ..... hhhmmmmmm 
|
|
Quoted:
Quoted:This uses the standard barrel nut. There is no need to remove the barrel or replace the nut.
Those of us who are not "handy" are giving you a standing ovation for this. Seriously, this is the deal winner for me! If it's comparably priced to the Troy versions, I'd pick this over it. I hear a small minority of negative reviews regarding the way that the helicoils strip out of the TRX's. I also hope that Samson had addressed this issue as well. |
|
This is definitely right up my alley. Very cool.
Ive been looking for a non gunsmith involved solution to adding a rail to one of my uppers. This right here is perfect. If i may make a suggestion and im probably nitpicking but could you radius the front of the locking screw area on the bottom of the handguard? Im not sure if thats possible at this stage in the game but that area interacts with my clothing/gear and having a sharp edge there isnt something i particularly want. Ill deal with it if i have to but..well, if it didnt have it i think it would be THAT much cooler of a product. |
|
Hello
Yes we will be at SHOT show this year. In the LE section close to where we were last year. Also we will have some at the Ft Benning three gun match next month. Just look for Andrew, I am not sure I can make it to that one Good catch on the radius. It will be done. Thanks Scott Samson |
|
Now THATS cool.
Thank you Mr Samson. Also, i apologize if this was discussed in the thread, i dont believe it was. What lengths will be available? 11 is a great start but i would also be interested in something like a 12 or a 13. I havent been this excited for an AR accessory in a long time for several reasons. 1. There is no gunsmithing involved other than removal of the delta ring which is easily accomplished. 2. This is a tubular style handguard that will mimic the profile of my existing round midlength handguards. 3. I purchased one of your MRF rails a million and a half years ago when i was 19 and instead of treating me like a dumbass kid you patiently answered all of my questions and actually gave me the time of day. Since then im embarrassed to say that the only other Samson product ive bought has been one of your AK rail systems. Im looking forward to spending more money with you guys soon! Thanks again to you and everyone else at Samson MFG. |
I got the rails and hardware to go with the Evolution tube yesterday. It contained one four inch rail and two, two inch rails as well as the stainless backing plates and eight screws.
The stainless backers will prevent anyone from over torquing the screws and stripping the holes. The backers are grooved to match the splines inside the tube. Once tightened, they're not going anywhere. 
I set it up for a vertical grip and a light at 1:00 (I'm a lefty) Mostly I set it up that way because it's not going back to Samson... 
Let me know if you want other views. I'm going to be shooting a lot in the next couple of days. FB |
|
Hello
We will be making a 13 inch. as well as a full variety of sizes. As you know we make all of our products in our own shop, the tooling in this case is easily configured to change lengths. If you want a special size let us know. If we get a few requests we will make that size. Also rails cut out for piston systems like the Adams Arms, the tube will surround the piston block. Sales for the Evolution rails will start sometime in December this year. Thanks Scott Samson |
|
Quoted:
Hello We will be making a 13 inch. as well as a full variety of sizes. As you know we make all of our products in our own shop, the tooling in this case is easily configured to change lengths. If you want a special size let us know. If we get a few requests we will make that size. Also rails cut out for piston systems like the Adams Arms, the tube will surround the piston block. Sales for the Evolution rails will start sometime in December this year. Thanks Scott Samson That is some really really neat stuff actually. This rail looks fantastic, though make sure you stock up on some factory barrel nuts 
I am looking forward to checking these out, and frankly if you guys made something closer to 15" for an SPR/Recce, I think a rail that went just to the threaded portion on a 16" barrel would be great. I'd be in for one for sure! |
|
Quoted:
I got the rails and hardware to go with the Evolution tube yesterday. It contained one four inch rail and two, two inch rails as well as the stainless backing plates and eight screws. http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y13/fatbarrel/_MG_2900_lr.jpg The stainless backers will prevent anyone from over torquing the screws and stripping the holes. The backers are grooved to match the splines inside the tube. Once tightened, they're not going anywhere. http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y13/fatbarrel/_MG_2924_lr.jpg I set it up for a vertical grip and a light at 1:00 (I'm a lefty) Mostly I set it up that way because it's not going back to Samson... http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y13/fatbarrel/_MG_2902_LR.jpg http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y13/fatbarrel/_MG_2903_LR.jpg http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y13/fatbarrel/_MG_2907_LR.jpg http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y13/fatbarrel/_MG_2919_LR.jpg Let me know if you want other views. I'm going to be shooting a lot in the next couple of days. FB Very interesting. Thank you. |
|
Yes & Weight savings!
ETA: Scott Samson said that the 11 in version was 8.3 oz and (according to the Rail Chart) the TRX Extreme is around 9.9 oz (VTAC Extreme @ 11.2 oz). |
|
Quoted:
Yes & Weight savings! ETA: Scott Samson said that the 11 oz version was 8.3 oz and (according to the Rail Chart) the TRX Extreme is around 9.9 oz (VTAC Extreme @ 11.2 oz). In fairness, most weights of other rail systems you would be comparing to would include the barrel nut. So would need to add the weight of a standard barrel nut to this to compare apples to apples. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Yes & Weight savings! ETA: Scott Samson said that the 11 in version was 8.3 oz and (according to the Rail Chart) the TRX Extreme is around 9.9 oz (VTAC Extreme @ 11.2 oz). In fairness, most weights of other rail systems you would be comparing to would include the barrel nut. So would need to add the weight of a standard barrel nut to this to compare apples to apples. Yes. You're right. I don't know how much a barrel nut weighs but it should be nearly on par with the Troy TRX Extreme offering. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Any plans for a 308 version with a DPMS bbl nut??  Try reading the original post again. The thermal bushing can be removed and it will fit directly onto a DPMS .308 style barrel nut. Oh crap, duh. Dang, I think this is perfect timing. I've gotta ditch a DD Lite 12.0 308 rail for weight reasons and a 12" one of these would be perfect!! Please make a 12" for my 308! And soon! 
Also, it'd be nice if the anodizing was the slicker teflon type, similar to, say, an MA-TEN receiver to avoid scuffs and oil stains etc. |
|
Quoted:
I got the rails and hardware to go with the Evolution tube yesterday. It contained one four inch rail and two, two inch rails as well as the stainless backing plates and eight screws.
The stainless backers will prevent anyone from over torquing the screws and stripping the holes. The backers are grooved to match the splines inside the tube. Once tightened, they're not going anywhere. One problem I encountered with my VTAC-Battlerail-13 rail is that the 2" rail's backing plate at the bottom would hit/touch with the bottom of my low profile gas block of my middy. I solve this problem by using the 4" rail and cutting the backing plate into half (single screws) and placing the backing further back and forward, instead of at the middle. I was thinking if Samson could improved on this by having a thinner and less obtrusive backing plate. |
|
I'm not a lawyer, but why would Samson want to mix it up with Troy again after a significant legal battle?
That said, the rail looks great. I'd love to see Addax use this on their upcoming ZK piston upper. http://www.defensereview.com/breaking-news-troy-industries-wins-civil-suit-against-samson-manufacturing/ |
|
Quoted:
I'm not a lawyer, but why would Samson want to mix it up with Troy again after a significant legal battle? That said, the rail looks great. I'd love to see Addax use this on their upcoming ZK piston upper. http://www.defensereview.com/breaking-news-troy-industries-wins-civil-suit-against-samson-manufacturing/ The product appears distinct in numerous ways. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm not a lawyer, but why would Samson want to mix it up with Troy again after a significant legal battle? That said, the rail looks great. I'd love to see Addax use this on their upcoming ZK piston upper. http://www.defensereview.com/breaking-news-troy-industries-wins-civil-suit-against-samson-manufacturing/ The product appears distinct in numerous ways. Indeed, troy did not invent the tubular rail system. The way in which the rail mounts to the upper receiver is also completely different and that is probably the most vital part. To me the product looks unique and the attachment method definitely is. |
|
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm not a lawyer, but why would Samson want to mix it up with Troy again after a significant legal battle? That said, the rail looks great. I'd love to see Addax use this on their upcoming ZK piston upper. http://www.defensereview.com/breaking-news-troy-industries-wins-civil-suit-against-samson-manufacturing/ The product appears distinct in numerous ways. Indeed, troy did not invent the tubular rail system. The way in which the rail mounts to the upper receiver is also completely different and that is probably the most vital part. To me the product looks unique and the attachment method definitely is. |
AR Sponsor