User Panel
Posted: 3/20/2024 11:15:41 AM EDT
I do not have an AR in 5.56, I know I'm late to the game for this caliber. But after the Oct. 7 incident and the masses of illegals pouring into this country, I should have at least one AR in this ubiquitous caliber. I need to start stacking 5.56 ASAP as well. But I decided to build this AR as I have certain qualities I prefer and it allows me to have the attributes I want from the start.
Most 5.56 AR barrels are 1/7 twist of which I've owned in the past and have never been impressed when using the lighter bullets. They performed well using the heavier bullets like 69gr and 77gr, but those are considerably more expensive, especially when you want to stack deep. So, for shooting the lighter weight more affordable/available 55gr. and 62gr. bullets, I'm going with a 1/9 twist. I don't want to get into the SBR world, I considered going in the opposite direction and thought really hard about going with a 20" bbl for more velocity, but reason prevailed and I'm going with a 16" bbl. I figured if the frontline guys can get it done with 14.5" or 10.5" bbls, a 16" bbl can certainly get it done. It will be mid-length gas port and chrome lined and am buying from Del-Ton. I'm going with a standard A2 flash hider and a MOE SL handguard, I feel they're lighter than the aluminum free-float handguards and as durable. I'll be using a fixed front sight gas block from DEZ Tactical as the barrel is not drilled for sight pins. I have a BCG from Palmetto State and a slick sided flat-top upper from Spike's Tactical. I'm getting the lower from PSA with MOE furniture and their nickel boron 2-stage trigger. I use the latch-less charging handles from Strike Industries and the ratchet castle nut end-plate with QD attach point. It has a A.R.M.S 40L folding rear sight, a Primary Arms micro red dot on a QD mount and a 3x magnifier on flip-to-side QD mount. I know this is not a spectacular build considering the high-end builds available today, but I want to keep it as simple and clean and light as possible. |
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Sounds good to me, only thing i'd suggest changing is that Del-ton barrel, and go with an FN CHF barrel with a pinned A2 front sight/gas block. User here "hochimin" sells a lot of Spike's stuff and often has a Spike's/FN barrel with the A2 sight and a delta ring assembly already installed, makes for an easy build, it's worth messaging him to see if he has one.
Slick side uppers are alright, I have one on a pistol build, but if it were my only AR i'd want a standard model with a port-door and FA. Those Magpul SL handguards are the bomb, they extend farther than regular handguards too, the midlength is almost as long as a conventional rifle length. Love 'em. |
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Platinum status courtesy of Rudukai13, thanks brother!
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@Molon will be along shortly to scold you for thinking a 1:7 can’t shoot lighter ammo properly. I’d go 1:8 or 1:7 so that you have the option of shooting the heavy stuff if necessary.
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I have a 1:7 14.5” bbl that shoots 40gr vmax’s well.
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I get that a FN CHF barrel would probably be a better barrel than Del-Ton's, I could almost buy 3 Del-Tons for 1 of those though. Also the Del-Ton is the lightweight profile. What I don't understand is why the assembled barrels use the triangular handguard caps, who uses those anymore?
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I have a few 1:7's and all shoot my 55 grain handloads into little clusters.
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Originally Posted By amprecon: I get that a FN CHF barrel would probably be a better barrel than Del-Ton's, I could almost buy 3 Del-Tons for 1 of those though. Also the Del-Ton is the lightweight profile. What I don't understand is why the assembled barrels use the triangular handguard caps, who uses those anymore? View Quote More than one builder, i've had to swap out a bunch when i've bought assembled uppers. ETA: The Spike's FN barrels I mentioned, you can get in a very slim profile, plenty lightweight and well balanced. ETA2: All my rifles have 1:7 twist, and they shoot 55 gr and 62 gr really well, never tried 'em with anything heavier though, so don't know if they'd get even more accurate, but i'm very happy with them with the rounds I do shoot. |
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Platinum status courtesy of Rudukai13, thanks brother!
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Well, the Del-Ton barrel was delivered today. I'm going to put it through it's paces and see how it performs. But first........I need ammo!
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Triangle caps are std. for mid & rifle-length. A mid-length with round cap is going to significantly limit handguard options.
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Platinum status courtesy of Rudukai13, thanks brother!
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After the 10/7 invasion my thinking has changed greatly as far has having a few ar's around. All middies .all 1/7 .
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Platinum status courtesy of Rudukai13, thanks brother!
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Originally Posted By Dragynn: Sounds good to me, only thing i'd suggest changing is that Del-ton barrel, and go with an FN CHF barrel with a pinned A2 front sight/gas block. User here "hochimin" sells a lot of Spike's stuff and often has a Spike's/FN barrel with the A2 sight and a delta ring assembly already installed, makes for an easy build, it's worth messaging him to see if he has one. Slick side uppers are alright, I have one on a pistol build, but if it were my only AR i'd want a standard model with a port-door and FA. Those Magpul SL handguards are the bomb, they extend farther than regular handguards too, the midlength is almost as long as a conventional rifle length. Love 'em. View Quote Definitely this, just get an FN middy barrel if you can find one and run with it, its a quality piece you will not need to worry about for a very long time. I have two of the Spikes/FN barrels and they are great, and the absolute last rifles I would ever part with. |
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Left-handed and right-minded!
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Looks like a solid build!
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Left-handed and right-minded!
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Originally Posted By amprecon: Well, the Del-Ton barrel was delivered today. I'm going to put it through it's paces and see how it performs. But first........I need ammo! View Quote I built a 16" Franken using a light weight 1/9 DelTon barrel. I did get a chrome lined barrel and it took some rounds and some cleaning to get it to tighten up the groups. I chose the 1/9 twist barrel for the 50, 52 and 55 grain bullets. I have not been disappointed. It just took a bit longer than I expected to get the accuracy to come out. Plan on 75 or 100 rounds with some stiff cleaning after each range session then watch the groups close up. kwg |
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Originally Posted By kwg020: I built a 16" Franken using a light weight 1/9 DelTon barrel. I did get a chrome lined barrel and it took some rounds and some cleaning to get it to tighten up the groups. I chose the 1/9 twist barrel for the 50, 52 and 55 grain bullets. I have not been disappointed. It just took a bit longer than I expected to get the accuracy to come out. Plan on 75 or 100 rounds with some stiff cleaning after each range session then watch the groups close up. kwg View Quote Thanks for the heads up, looking forward to putting it through it's paces. |
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Due to the modularity of the AR platform and the multitude of sales, it's easy for the Black Rifle Disease to kick in and you'll discover yourself owning several differently configured AR's. My first one was a bull-barreled varmint gun that was a heavy pig. Second was an 18" mid length SPR-ish build. The next was very M4-ish. After I covered the bases with a heavy, mid, and lightweight build, I created variations of the themes.
If you plan to upgrade your barrel, build another complete upper versus replacing the barrel. Then you can swap the upper and put your original on another lower. Spare parts become the seeds for the next build. |
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Originally Posted By Moondog: Due to the modularity of the AR platform and the multitude of sales, it's easy for the Black Rifle Disease to kick in and you'll discover yourself owning several differently configured AR's. My first one was a bull-barreled varmint gun that was a heavy pig. Second was an 18" mid length SPR-ish build. The next was very M4-ish. After I covered the bases with a heavy, mid, and lightweight build, I created variations of the themes. If you plan to upgrade your barrel, build another complete upper versus replacing the barrel. Then you can swap the upper and put your original on another lower. Spare parts become the seeds for the next build. View Quote It's funny you say that, I was fortunate enough to have several spare parts to use for the build and save a few coin. I have already changed out the MOE grips for 15 degree grips and pulled the camo tape from the metal parts as I didn't want to have corrosion problems in the future with moisture getting trapped under there. I finally have ammo inbound so the moment of truth is nearly at hand. I have gone through many parts and configs on my 6.8 AR's but feel they're how I want them to be at this point. I have spare bolts and have gone from folding front sights to fixed where I can. I still might get a 20" upper in the future just because. |
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When I re-assembled after cleaning I could not get the cam pin to seat properly in the cam pin hole in the bolt. It came out properly with no resistance. I removed the bolt from the carrier and tried to put it in the bolt cam pin hole. It would go down until the bottom of the pin was flush with the bottom of the bolt but no further.
I felt no burrs or could visually detect any deformities in either the cam pin or the hole in the bolt. I tried to turn the pin as I applied pressure but it would only go to the same spot and go no further. I ended up taking a dremel to the cam pin hole in the bolt where the cam pin had resistance and all seems to be well now but I'm perplexed as to how this happened. It's as if the cam pin hole swaged after I removed the cam pin. I had done nothing to it but remove it for cleaning. |
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How much she weigh w/o a mag or the magnifier?
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Death to quislings.
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pmc m855 is not the best.
try some medium dollar hunting rounds - like $1.50 per round from one of the big names. back to back same rifle, same day, same target, pmc m855 and Sierra GameKing tipped hollowpoints were stunningly different. 50yd zero session to sight in the new 1-4 lpvo. the pmc was shooting 2-3" groups at 50yd. the Sierra was touching holes. pmc is cheap and it goes bang but if I need to hit the coyote and not hit one of my dogs in the backyard, either the 5.56 with the Sierra or my 6.8 spc with the Hornady $1.80/rd vmax. those rounds were touching at 50yd today. |
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The deuce you say.
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Originally Posted By racer765: pmc m855 is not the best. try some medium dollar hunting rounds - like $1.50 per round from one of the big names. back to back same rifle, same day, same target, pmc m855 and Sierra GameKing tipped hollowpoints were stunningly different. 50yd zero session to sight in the new 1-4 lpvo. the pmc was shooting 2-3" groups at 50yd. the Sierra was touching holes. pmc is cheap and it goes bang but if I need to hit the coyote and not hit one of my dogs in the backyard, either the 5.56 with the Sierra or my 6.8 spc with the Hornady $1.80/rd vmax. those rounds were touching at 50yd today. View Quote I have some 69gr hpbt from freedom munitions coming, we'll see how they do. BTW, I can keep most of the shots from my ARP barreled 6.8's nearly in the x ring, those are the Silver State Armory Tactical load 110gr sp, very impressive. |
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Got to the range today and things were looking good, the groups were much better. I was satisfied with the zero on the irons and started on the red dot, then things went sideways. The 25th or 26th round was an overcharged round and there was like a small explosion and the bottom of the mag blew out.
I had a bit of blood on my left forearm from the mag spring plate that ended up somewhere, I couldn't find it. The bolt wouldn't retract at all, so that was my range day as I was clearly at a stopping point. I got home and had to use a brass cleaning rod to get the bolt to open, it came open with the back half of the case, the rest is still stuck in the chamber. The rim had flowed down between the extractor and the bolt, the extractor was pretty well bent and the o-ring was broken in half, the barrel looks fine as does the barrel extension, upper and lower. |
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Originally Posted By amprecon: Got to the range today and things were looking good, the groups were much better. I was satisfied with the zero on the irons and started on the red dot, then things went sideways. The 25th or 26th round was an overcharged round and there was like a small explosion and the bottom of the mag blew out. I had a bit of blood on my left forearm from the mag spring plate that ended up somewhere, I couldn't find it. The bolt wouldn't retract at all, so that was my range day as I was clearly at a stopping point. I got home and had to use a brass cleaning rod to get the bolt to open, it came open with the back half of the case, the rest is still stuck in the chamber. The rim had flowed down between the extractor and the bolt, the extractor was pretty well bent and the o-ring was broken in half, the barrel looks fine as does the barrel extension, upper and lower. View Quote Glad you're ok. Pics? |
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Death to quislings.
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What ammo, brand, load, & lot #?
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Death to quislings.
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I hope you contacted Freedom Munitions! And hopefully they will make it right for you.
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"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading." -Thomas Jefferson
RIP TSgt Jason Norton and SSgt Brian McElroy. KIA 22 Jan 06, near Taji, Iraq. LaRue Armorer Glock Armorer NRA Life Member |
Unfortunately that’s not surprising for Freedom munitions.
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Can't never could 'til try came along.
"All welchers should be removed from the EE".-Aimless R.I.P. to the EE |
Originally Posted By CATM: I hope you contacted Freedom Munitions! And hopefully they will make it right for you. View Quote I have contacted them and given them a detailed description of what happened and the build I used with plenty of pics, still waiting disposition. They have not asked for the remaining ammo to be returned yet. If I were to keep it, I'd probably end up weighing every round just to be sure. |
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Originally Posted By amprecon: I have contacted them and given them a detailed description of what happened and the build I used with plenty of pics, still waiting disposition. They have not asked for the remaining ammo to be returned yet. If I were to keep it, I'd View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By CATM: I hope you contacted Freedom Munitions! And hopefully they will make it right for you. I have contacted them and given them a detailed description of what happened and the build I used with plenty of pics, still waiting disposition. They have not asked for the remaining ammo to be returned yet. If I were to keep it, I'd FIFY. |
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You need to hear back from Freedom Arms before you touch the rest of those rounds. You can weigh them but don't pull them apart. Freedom has some 'splainin' to do. That sounds like a classic over loaded round to me.
kwg |
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Originally Posted By kwg020: You need to hear back from Freedom Arms before you touch the rest of those rounds. You can weigh them but don't pull them apart. Freedom has some 'splainin' to do. That sounds like a classic over loaded round to me. kwg View Quote Isn't this a known issue w/ Freedom Munitions? |
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Death to quislings.
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Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes.
I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. |
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Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. View Quote With different ammo? |
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Death to quislings.
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Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. View Quote I do not know how often ammo is recalled but they seem to have lots of issue's. https://www.freedommunitions.com/safety-center |
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Originally Posted By amprecon: I do not have an AR in 5.56, I know I'm late to the game for this caliber. But after the Oct. 7 incident and the masses of illegals pouring into this country, I should have at least one AR in this ubiquitous caliber. I need to start stacking 5.56 ASAP as well. But I decided to build this AR as I have certain qualities I prefer and it allows me to have the attributes I want from the start. Most 5.56 AR barrels are 1/7 twist of which I've owned in the past and have never been impressed when using the lighter bullets. They performed well using the heavier bullets like 69gr and 77gr, but those are considerably more expensive, especially when you want to stack deep. So, for shooting the lighter weight more affordable/available 55gr. and 62gr. bullets, I'm going with a 1/9 twist. I don't want to get into the SBR world, I considered going in the opposite direction and thought really hard about going with a 20" bbl for more velocity, but reason prevailed and I'm going with a 16" bbl. I figured if the frontline guys can get it done with 14.5" or 10.5" bbls, a 16" bbl can certainly get it done. It will be mid-length gas port and chrome lined and am buying from Del-Ton. I'm going with a standard A2 flash hider and a MOE SL handguard, I feel they're lighter than the aluminum free-float handguards and as durable. I'll be using a fixed front sight gas block from DEZ Tactical as the barrel is not drilled for sight pins. I have a BCG from Palmetto State and a slick sided flat-top upper from Spike's Tactical. I'm getting the lower from PSA with MOE furniture and their nickel boron 2-stage trigger. I use the latch-less charging handles from Strike Industries and the ratchet castle nut end-plate with QD attach point. It has a A.R.M.S 40L folding rear sight, a Primary Arms micro red dot on a QD mount and a 3x magnifier on flip-to-side QD mount. I know this is not a spectacular build considering the high-end builds available today, but I want to keep it as simple and clean and light as possible. View Quote "Illegals pouring into this country" is what made you want an AR...in 2024?! Why? Also, do you live in a high crime area? If so, I must say...MOVE... |
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Originally Posted By backbencher: With different ammo? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. With different ammo? I used the same ammo, no issues. ETA: I'm not buying anything else from them. |
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Originally Posted By RangeToy: "Illegals pouring into this country" is what made you want an AR...in 2024?! Why? Also, do you live in a high crime area? If so, I must say...MOVE... View Quote I already have AR's they're just not 5.56, I felt that if the world went sideways there is much 5.56 about, 6.8 spc, not so much. I don't live in a high crime area, but do work in one. |
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I got it to the range yesterday and all went well, got the irons zero'd, then the red dot then with the 3x magnifier, no issues. I will say the 69gr did much better than the 62gr, I will have to get some 55gr to see how it does.
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Originally Posted By amprecon: I used the same ammo, no issues. ETA: I'm not buying anything else from them. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. With different ammo? I used the same ammo, no issues. ETA: I'm not buying anything else from them. I think I am misunderstanding. Are you saying you used the same ammo that blew up your gun? Or did you use a different brand of ammo ? |
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Originally Posted By nyrifle: I think I am misunderstanding. Are you saying you used the same ammo that blew up your gun? Or did you use a different brand of ammo ? View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By nyrifle: Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. With different ammo? I used the same ammo, no issues. ETA: I'm not buying anything else from them. I think I am misunderstanding. Are you saying you used the same ammo that blew up your gun? Or did you use a different brand of ammo ? I used the same ammo that wrecked my bolt extractor and magazine, yes. But as I said earlier I weighed the rounds beforehand. |
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Originally Posted By amprecon: I used the same ammo that wrecked my bolt extractor and magazine, yes. But as I said earlier I weighed the rounds beforehand. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By nyrifle: Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. With different ammo? I used the same ammo, no issues. ETA: I'm not buying anything else from them. I think I am misunderstanding. Are you saying you used the same ammo that blew up your gun? Or did you use a different brand of ammo ? I used the same ammo that wrecked my bolt extractor and magazine, yes. But as I said earlier I weighed the rounds beforehand. You're shooting ammo from that same lot, after the mfg requested you to send the remaining cartridges to them? Or just shooting more Freedom from a different lot? Either way that's pretty bold. Good luck and wear all the protection. |
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Originally Posted By amprecon: I used the same ammo that wrecked my bolt extractor and magazine, yes. But as I said earlier I weighed the rounds beforehand. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By nyrifle: Originally Posted By amprecon: Originally Posted By backbencher: Originally Posted By amprecon: Their response has been to return any unopened boxes for a refund for the returned boxes. I'm still out for a replacement extractor, extractor spring, o-ring and insert. Also had to replace the Magpul floorplate insert and floorplate on my 20-round mag. I weighed every loose round I had, all weighed 13 grams. I then weighed 50 rounds together in a baggie, then weighed every 50 round box and the weights jived minus the tare wt for the cardboard boxes. I have my bolt and magazine re-assembled and am taking it back to the range today to try and zero again albeit with a little anxiety. With different ammo? I used the same ammo, no issues. ETA: I'm not buying anything else from them. I think I am misunderstanding. Are you saying you used the same ammo that blew up your gun? Or did you use a different brand of ammo ? I used the same ammo that wrecked my bolt extractor and magazine, yes. But as I said earlier I weighed the rounds beforehand. Umm. Maybe not your best plan. Variations in brass & bullet weight can conceal a significant variation in charge weight, and you don't have a known load - you don't know what powder they're using, nor a safe load of that powder. Whatever they don't refund, pull the bullets, dump the powder, & load w/ a safe known load. Your plants and your optometrist will thank you. |
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Death to quislings.
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