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Posted: 11/23/2015 4:18:49 PM EDT
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Team AR15.com, I had the opportunity to do some "3-gun relays" and timed shoot-house events this weekend with some co-workers. I have a PSA Freedom 5.56, which I love, don't get me wrong. However, on this day, I got to shoot a very high end AR-15 that was set up by one of the instructors/range officers at this event (he's a Pro-Class 3-gun shooter). WOWZA!! What a difference!!! I was making 75-100 yard shots with an EOTech like it was my job. The thing that impressed me the most was that this gun had literally NO KICK, I mean it was like shooting a .22. My 5.56 doesn't kick hard, don't get me wrong, but when I shoot mine, I have to reset on target, even if ever so slightly. Not with this gun... no kick, whatsoever! Why is that? Is it just a better built rifle, or is it that mine is a gas gun and this was a piston gun (one of my co-workers said that was the reason)? What are the main differences between the two? Whatever the reason, I now know the difference between a "mid priced" AR and a "high end" AR. Docsdeer1 |
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Quoted:
Team AR15.com, I had the opportunity to do some "3-gun relays" and timed shoot-house events this weekend with some co-workers. I have a PSA Freedom 5.56, which I love, don't get me wrong. However, on this day, I got to shoot a very high end AR-15 that was set up by one of the instructors/range officers at this event (he's a Pro-Class 3-gun shooter). WOWZA!! What a difference!!! I was making 75-100 yard shots with an EOTech like it was my job. The thing that impressed me the most was that this gun had literally NO KICK, I mean it was like shooting a .22. My 5.56 doesn't kick hard, don't get me wrong, but when I shoot mine, I have to reset on target, even if ever so slightly. Not with this gun... no kick, whatsoever! Why is that? Is it just a better built rifle, or is it that mine is a gas gun and this was a piston gun (one of my co-workers said that was the reason)? What are the main differences between the two? Whatever the reason, I now know the difference between a "mid priced" AR and a "high end" AR. Docsdeer1 We can't really tell you for sure because you didn't tell us what AR he had/built. But things that can change the felt recoil you feel in your direct impingement AR are adjustable gas blocks, heavier buffers, stiffer buffer springs, longer gas system length, lighter bolt carrier, and of course shooting colder loads. If you mess with too much of this at once you could end up with a short stroking gun though, it's more of a balancing act between all of the above. |
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I didn't ask him... there were like 15 of us up there going through this timed event, and they were pushing to have us out of there by 3:30 in the afternoon. So I didn't mess with the small-talk too much. I was just impressed that there could be so much a difference. |
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all you need is an adjustable gas block, light weight buffer / bolt carrier, and a big muzzle brake.
The adjustable gas block allows you to turn down the gas so it doesn't bottom the buffer out in the tube. It also allows you to turn it down so you can run light weight action parts. Light weight action parts means less mass to start and stop when the gun cycles. The muzzle brake has baffles that the gas strikes as it exits the barrel. When the gas strikes the baffles it pulls the gun forward which off sets the normal force of the gas going out the front of the barrel. This also makes the gun louder to the people around you because it re directs the sound as well. |
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Has nothing to do with being a piston driven AR. It's how it's "tuned" that makes the difference. Competitors tune their rifles (buffer weight, BCG mass, spring rates, adjustable gas blocks, etc) to work with the least recoil to aid in follow up shots. This is not what you want for a combat rifle, but these are specific purpose built rifles. They usually run the exact same ammo (or reload their own to precise specifications) and tune their rifle accordingly so it BARELY (but reliably enough for comp use) cycles (thus the softer recoil).
Unless you are in competition (with a dedicated rifle for such) I HIGHLY recommend NOT doing that to your rifle. For general (and possible SD/HD) use, I'd recommend living with more recoil/slower follow up shots for the added ability to use different/varying ammo reliably. |
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A lot of people shoot piston guns and assume they have less recoil, which is not completely true.
The reason they have less recoil is because of the adjustable gas system which comes with most piston systems. If you put a adjustable gas block on a direct impingement system it will feel light on the recoil as well. I actually have suppressed full auto setup with adjustable gas block and light weight BCG and buffer and shooting 5.56 feels (and sounds) like shooting .22lr. |
| I was dialing in an adjustable gas block on a new 556/223 upper a few days ago, and with the gas fully OFF the 223 round recoil felt about as light as 22LR being shot out of my heavy, full length wood-stocked plinking rifle. Practically NO recoil at all, which was very surprising at first. There's a good silencerco muzzle brake on the end that I'm sure was contributing a lot as well. Though once I turned up the gas to the minimum needed to consistently cycle the gun, that heavy FA BCG being pushed around added a lot to the recoil with each shot. Though not that the 223 cycling on minimum gas was that bad in the first place. I think putting a lightweight BCG into that setup will make a huge difference, though I have not tried it yet. This is a DI setup FYI, not a piston. |
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The piston action is not the reason the high end AR is easier to shoot accurately than yours.
One of the biggest contributors to a (relatively) hard recoiling AR-15 is when the buffer bottoms in the receiver extension. Your rifle is overgassed, so it will run a wider variety of (potentially weak) ammo. This overgassing can be mitigated a number of ways that have been mentioned here. I prefer to use the extra energy (heavier buffer and/or spring) of the larger than necessary gas port rather than choke it off (adjustable gas block). Either (or both if necessary) will give the BCG a little more "oomph" to strip and chamber the next round. I like the Spikes T2 buffer for starters. If the buffer still slams into the end of the RE ("buffer tube") then it's time to play with springs. I like the blue springs from SPRINCO myself. Far superior spring steel makes a spring that will last hundreds of thousands (possibly millions) of rounds, and there are a few different spring rates to choose from. Color coding on the spring comes in handy when you're not sure which spring you're running, too. Joe |
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Could have been a longer gas system.
Adjustable gas block with a lighter buffer and bolt group... less mass moving is less recoil. A lot of shooters do this with the hybid systems of the standard AR. Could have been a very good brake on the end. If anything a piston will increase felt recoil, with everything else being the same, because of the increase moving mass. |
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