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Posted: 12/19/2002 6:05:15 AM EDT
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I've heard that many people have a low opinion of the Hesse AR-15s, but there's not a lot of data out there on what specifically is supposed to be wrong with them. I have had a Hesse HAR-15 for a few years and have had zero problems (except for those related to the magazines that still have the black followers - a situation I've fixed on every mag I own). I sent an e-mail to Clint McKee of Fulton Armory, who basically said, "if it hasn't broken yet, that's a positive sign." So, what's the story on this? |
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I have seen a FEW of their offerings that LOOK pretty nice. But then again, they really frown if you get a fingerprint on one of them at a show. I have also seen a few of their items that look terrible. My main reason for crapping on their parade is that the carbon fiber AR lower receiver they offer really lacks substantial reinforcements to be considered "well thought out". It should be a lot beefier in the buffer tube ring and down through the sides, in my educated opinion. Cavarms has a better, more thought-out product. |
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www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=143132 www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=141443 www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=155269 www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=64&t=52924 www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=74&t=142418 www.angelfire.com/ak5/rpkman/index.html And last, this one, which I'll quote here: www.biggerhammer.net/barrett/wwwboard/index.cgi?read=78844 Here is the Hesse Warranty copied from their website with my comments interspersed: WARRANTY Based on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty act, Hesse Ltd. offers no warranty on its product line. > Basically this means that from the beginning you are screwed > and you can't do a thing about it unless they like you. Hesse Ltd. is extremely concerned with its customers’ satisfaction and stands behind its products. Hesse Ltd. has in the past and will continue to offer service on its products for a period of one year from the date of purchase by the original purchaser for defects in materials and workmanship. Please retain your sales receipt for proof of purchase date. > As noted in the AR-15 post, they count "one year" from the time it leaves > their factory to your FFL/Distributor/etc. not when you actually buy it. > (Since the FFL/Distributor technically bought it before you.) Hesse Ltd. shall not be responsible for injury, death, or damage to persons or property resulting from intentional or accidental discharge of this firearm or part thereof or from its function when used for purposes for which it was not designed. > So here they say that if you or someone else are hurt or killed > they are not responsible no matter what. Hesse Ltd. will not honor claims involving this firearm or product which results from careless or improper handling, unauthorized adjustment, modification, parts replacement, corrosion, neglect, use of wrong caliber ammunition, or use of ammunition other than original high quality, domestically produced, commercially manufactured ammunition in good condition, or any combination thereof. > Well, from what people have posted on AR-15.com and in other boards, > the parts have to be modified in order to get them to fit. This voids > whatever warranty you thought you had left. DO NOT USE RELOADED, REMANUFACTURED, OR SURPLUS AMMUNITION! > Well that eliminates just about all ammunition you can buy > or obtain for military style firearms. Nope, BlackHills, > Ultramax and others are remanufactured. Again voiding any > potential warranty remaining. Hesse Ltd. will NOT honor returns if the parts or components have been altered, fit, or modified in any way. Most malfunctions are directly related to ammunition and/or magazine. Hesse Ltd. will not honor claims involving any of its’ products for any reason or cause when such claims are made by the second or subsequent owner. > As mentioned, the parts must be modified to get them to fit. > So in short, you are screwed. A special note on receivers. Hesse receivers are designed to function properly when used with MIL SPEC parts. Assembling a firearm incorrectly or using non mil spec parts or configurations voids the repair policy and is dangerous. This is especially true when using non mil spec buffer systems. DO NOT USE NON MIL SPEC PARTS. > This seems to be an attempt to classify anyone's parts but their own > as non-milspec. This firearm or part thereof is manufactured to perform properly with the original parts as designed. It is your duty to make sure any parts you buy are installed correctly and that neither replacements nor originals are altered or changed. Assembling a firearm incorrectly or with modified parts can result in a damaged gun, danger, injury, or death to you of others. Always send products to Hesse Ltd. for service or modification. All returns MUST have a return authorization number on the OUTSIDE of the package. All returns subject to a 12% restocking fee. Please call Hesse Arms at 651.455.5760 to obtain a return authorization number BEFORE shipping. > In other words, it is your fault if it doesn't work, hurts or kills > you so do not call them unless you want to pay a restocking fee so > that they can peddle it to someone else. -Art -Troy |
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Look, keep this in mind. While I have no specific information about the Hesse AR-15's, I have a lot of experience with his other products/receivers. When I was still a gun dealer, many of these passed through my hands. They were invariably all crap; out of tolerance, not manufactured to specs, warped, twisted, altered, and just bad manufacturing. Function rate was about 20%. I had a 90%+ return rate on his products. I am still saddled with three of them I can't sell as functional. Do yourself a favor, and pass. The Hesse AR-15 may be a good product (yeah, right!), but due to my experience with all his other stuff I would never buy anything he manufactured (or had others manufacture), nor would I ever recommend anyone else buy it. This is just mine and my customer's experience. Good luck to you. What do I really think of Hesse products? [puke] |
| Well, I guess now I understand all the negativity. Mine seems to work all right, and it's been checked by a gunsmith buddy, so I'll hang on to it and see what happens. Thanks for the insight, and the next ones won't be Hesse. Sounds like I'd be pushing my luck... |
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Quoted: Well, I guess now I understand all the negativity. Mine seems to work all right, and it's been checked by a gunsmith buddy, so I'll hang on to it and see what happens. Thanks for the insight, and the next ones won't be Hesse. Sounds like I'd be pushing my luck... I got an upper from them a few years ago. They lost my money order, and I had to research it on MY dime just to clear up their mistake. When I got it, it looked like hell. The Bayonet lug was ground off and un-finnished. Out of fear of another screwup on their end I just kept it and wrote it off as lessons learned. Earlier this year a hairline crack formed in the cast (read NOT MIL-SPEC) front sight base resulting in gas leakage and shortstroking of the action. I got that fixed and am back in business. If yours works it probably always will do ok. Just don't be surprised by little things going wrong with it. Regards, Jon |
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