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Posted: 7/1/2006 9:52:28 AM EDT
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Right now I'm still in the planing stage (it may not go any farther). Thinking about building a Viet Nam era retro and I want to build up the whole thing instead of buying a complete upper. Bushmaster has a M16A2 Gov't upper. They state in their catalog that the rifle length hand guards take the triangular hand guard end cap. I'm guessing that this barrel comes with that triangular cap. I want to use the old style triangular handguards on this build if I do it. Are the old style handguards going to fit this cap? This will be built on a slabside upper. Thanks in advance for any info or advice.  Elvis |
Does anyone make a new barrel that would be correct? I've looked at the uppers from CDNN but I really want one with no forward assist and I don't really want a 1/12 twist. I'm open for suggestions. Also this if it happens won't be perfect retro as it will most likely go on a new lower. I need to stay out of this section. (retro forum) as I think I'm coming down with this new strain of BRD.  Elvis |
others here will know more conclusively, but i am under the impression that pencil barrels with twists faster than 1in12 do exist, they are a no longer made (not even sure if anyone makes the correct size FSB anymore) and are a "you find one you grab it cause it ain't hanging around long" item. my suggestion if you want the thin barrel look of a Vietnam era rifle with a "modern" twist is to buy a "Government profile" barrel from bushmaster then send it off to Kurts Kustom Firearms to have the forward portion of the barrel turned down. in fact that may be what i do with the barrel on my wife's rifle, to me the thing is off balance a bit. plus any weight off of it helps with her using it for an extented period. |
Try here: SAW Sales Click on "Colt Rifle Parts" EXPENSIVE but they have 1 in 12 Colt barrels for the A1....doesn't get much more retro than that!!! 
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| If you want a slab side upper SARCO has them. $100 for VG-Ex complete upper(less barrel assembly) and $125 for like new complete upper(less baarrel assembly). has |
Elvis--no experience with Sarco, but big hole uppers are not a problem. There's a bushing-type adapter available at Del-Ton for $2.50, PN LP1003. 
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Perfect! Thanks to my new friend. I'm still thinking about going witha Fulton upper. Since you left my house I have scored a triangular handguard set and an A1 pistol grip. Elvis |
I went to Brownells site, they have the A1 upper with forward assist but they state that the slickside by DPMS has been dropped by the mfg.  It's looking more and more like the Fulton may be the way to go. Has anyone used the Fulton? If so any comments on fit and finish? Thanks guys. Elvis |
Here's a link to SARCO's M16 page: www.sarcoinc.com/m16.html |
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I sent Sarco an e-mail to see if they could clarify exactly what they have. If I don't get a reply I guess I'll call them on Monday or Wed. It just says M16 upper so I want to make sure of what I'm getting first. Another question for you guys. I will be getting the 3 prong FH for this barrel. I am guessing from what I saw in one of the tacked threads at the top that this FH takes a lock washer. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Also what do you use to tighten the 3 prong FH? I know I got a lot of questions so please bear with me. Elvis |
Oops, my bad, sorry..... |
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Well according to biggerhammers website I may have answered one of my questions. According to his faq if it was a military upper (sarco's) then it is a small hole upper. Now if they are slickside I will be in business. Man I'm sick, yesterday I was just mulling the idea over and now I own a barrel, a set of triangular handguards and an A1 pistol grip, and if Sarco has what I want I will be close to having the upper parts ready to assemble.  Elvis |
I know the feeling. I come back from Iraq and decided to build one more AR and ended up with 3 1/2 so far
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i have no experience with the slick side uppers from current vender's but from what i have read that the fulton armory slick side is a DPMS and will only accept a DPMS charging handle. this is what i have read no first hand experience. here is a pic of the correct tool for the 3 prong.  and a link to the thread. ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=123&t=285108 a lock washer is correct for a three prong and birdcage since they don't require indexing of the slots. |
Machinhead I have a machinist friend that could probably make me a tool. How tight is it supposed to be? Elvis |
From what I understand DPMS does not make it's parts to Mill Spec. so interchangeability is next to none. This is why I decided not use a DPMS SP1. I think I have heard this issue comming up on the build it yourself forum. One guy's charging handle was heating up to the point of the anodizing starts giving off some sort of strange smell! Some guys suspected it was possibly a DPMS part being used in a Mill Spec reciever or vice versa. It ended up just needing to be broken it seems but that thread has made me wary of manufacturers who dont make parts to Mill Spec. As I recall DPMS was not the only one. That is also why I am sticking to a Stag Lower with my A1 build. All Mill Spec from them! |
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-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quoted: What is different about DPMS charging handles? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From what I understand DPMS does not make it's parts to Mill Spec. so interchangeability is next to none. This is why I decided not use a DPMS SP1. That is what i have heard too. the part i heard that was out of spec are the little wings at the front of the charging handle that slides in the track. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Machinhead I have a machinist friend that could probably make me a tool. How tight is it supposed to be? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- i just measured mine and there was roughly .030 gap between the tool and the tines. a tight fit is not necessary as you want the tines evanly spaced around so it puts equal pressure on the tines. i have heard people using strap wrenches and screwdrivers but i have the proper tool so i dont. for what it is worth my tool tines measure .230 and 120 degrees apart. |
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from the build it yourseld forum it says 15-20 ft pounds. teh threas is tacked a the top Torque Values: Compensator (Flash Suppressor) - 15 to 20 Ft. Lbs. Barrel Nut - 31 Ft. lbs. Minimum, not to exceed 80 Ft. Lbs. to align the next slot in the barrel nut. Carrier Key Screws - 35 INCH pounds to 40 INCH pounds. Lower Receiver Extension (Buffer Tube) Rifle - 35 to 39 Ft. Lbs. Carbine - Tighten the locking nut to 40 INCH pounds plus or minus 2 INCH pounds. |
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OK, re the DPMS upper thing, I can only post on what I personally have experienced, and that is with the DPMS C7 type upper, which is essentially an A1 profile type, but WITH A CASE DEFLECTOR. All the DPMS and Bushmastrer versions of this upper seem to be marked with the split H Anchor-Harvey forge mark; only it's about half the size you usually find. If you look inside the DPMS version of this upper, you invariably find tool marks along the bore; which tells me that these things were undersized to start with, and had to be reamed out to make tham fit a standard carrier. My educated guess is that the entire inside was a few thousanths undersized to start with, and while they reamed the main bore to standard, they "solved" the charging handle problem by going to a slaightly narrower piece. This is what occured with the unit I own, and we've had posts by others who bought the DPMS C7 uppers and had exactly the same experience. Now, it's an unanswered question as to whether the smooth side uppers have this problem or not. I don't recall ever seeing a posting about fit issues with that batch, but since DPMS has quit selling the smoothsides, it may be a moot point. Yes, all the Fulton uppers are DPMS. If they have a few smoothsides left, I guess you're good to go, but if they're out, then you're back at square one. That is, looking for a milsurp Colt piece. Or alternatively, a Colt SP1 or 2 upper than you can put a 1/4 inch liner into to use w/a standard lower. |
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Well I just got off the phone with a very nice gentleman and a very nice lady from Sarco. I made the man go put his hands on one a make sure it was what I wanted. He assured me no foward assist and no deflector. Anyway there is one on the way, M16 upper excellant to like new. Bad part is she said it might be 2 weeks before I see it.  Oh well I quess I'll live. It's not like I have all the other goodies yet. And the search continues.  Elvis |
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