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Posted: 10/5/2014 11:10:37 AM EDT
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So I accidentally screwed off a pinned and welded flash hider. It was my future BILs AR, and it has a 16" barrel, so I didn't think much of turning it off. It was a little tight, but not too bad, so I assumed it was just thread locked. When I got it off, there was no threads left. I swapped him a brand new 16" barrel I had laying around, and kept this one. I have a lathe, and could cut and rethread it, but I don't want to pin another one on. I hate pinned FH's. Would it be possible to weld up the end the barrel, then turn it back down and rethread it to keep it at 16"? I'm woo tied it might distort the barrel with the heat, but I don't know much about welding.
Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. Edit: Here's what I got... 
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It was a little tight, but not too bad, so I assumed it was just thread locked. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks. Edit: Here's what I got... http://i1084.photobucket.com/albums/j416/ctbreitwieser/1A00061E-856A-408E-88BE-02F428174649-202-00000028F210A63B_zps47472b4d.jpg How about a picture of the wrench you used and the size of your bicep? That's some serious torque applied to do that much damage. You'd be better off just cutting it back for use as either a pistol or SBR. |
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How in the f*ck? You have got to be the strongest person on this planet. Depositing enough metal back on there to re-thread will cause warpage from constant heating/cooling. Why did you take it off anyways? Im still curious how you couldve done this by hand Holy Crap!! With the amount of torque required to do THAT, I wonder what else on the barrel is FUBAR. What clamps a barrel hard enough to allow that without crushing the barrel? OTOH, if it wasn't a herculean effort to do that, what is the barrel made of? TAGNO (Throw Away Get New One) |
I don't think you want to have it welded-up, for fear of damaging the chrome lining, but there's an easy way out: have it cut to 14.5" and re-threaded, then use a Voodoo Innovations "Manimal" flash hider to bring it to 16. You can have it re-pinned and still remove your gas block, as the outside diameter is under .750". HTH |
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Well I can promise I'm far from Hercules. I only weigh about 165. I had it in a regular upper vise block, clamped in a bench vise. It's a Windham barrel, so maybe they just don't put the pins very deep. But really, who would expect a 16" barrel to be pinned and welded? Stupid CA compliant gun. If I didn't already have a 223 SBR I'd just do that, but I have no need for another one. And I don't really wanna cut it back too far and sell it, cause the caliber stamp would be removed. Oh, and I wa taking it off to put on a YHM barrel nut for a diamond FF rail.
Edit: What about turning the formerly threaded area to a specific diameter, then making a new muzzle device on the lathe that would press fit on? If not, I'll probably go the Voodoo Innovations route. Would anyone even buy a barrel that looked like this if I were just gonna sell it? |
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Well I can promise I'm far from Hercules. I only weigh about 165. I had it in a regular upper vise block, clamped in a bench vise. It's a Windham barrel, so maybe they just don't put the pins very deep. But really, who would expect a 16" barrel to be pinned and welded? Stupid CA compliant gun. If I didn't already have a 223 SBR I'd just do that, but I have no need for another one. And I don't really wanna cut it back too far and sell it, cause the caliber stamp would be removed. Oh, and I wa taking it off to put on a YHM barrel nut for a diamond FF rail. Edit: What about turning the formerly threaded area to a specific diameter, then making a new muzzle device on the lathe that would press fit on? If not, I'll probably go the Voodoo Innovations route. Would anyone even buy a barrel that looked like this if I were just gonna sell it? I wouldn't touch it. Not even with Bloombergs money. Seriously, like I said up there, either you wrenched on it REAL hard to rip barrel steel away like that, or there's something seriously F'd up at the molecular level of the material. Since you most definitely didn't King Kong the thing, apparently something made that part of the barrel brittle. Who knows how far it goes. I would never consent to being near THAT when someone subjects it to 65,000 PSI internal pressure. Count yourself lucky that it hasn't blown up in your face, YET, and TAGNO. (see above) |
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Send it to Adco to have the bad threaded section of barrel cut off, the new end of barrel turned down/crowned/threaded, then a extended FS permanently (blind pin again) installed to get the barrel back to 16" legal.
https://www.adcofirearms.com/ 
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Well I can promise I'm far from Hercules. I only weigh about 165. I had it in a regular upper vise block, clamped in a bench vise. It's a Windham barrel, so maybe they just don't put the pins very deep. But really, who would expect a 16" barrel to be pinned and welded? Stupid CA compliant gun. If I didn't already have a 223 SBR I'd just do that, but I have no need for another one. And I don't really wanna cut it back too far and sell it, cause the caliber stamp would be removed. Oh, and I wa taking it off to put on a YHM barrel nut for a diamond FF rail. Edit: What about turning the formerly threaded area to a specific diameter, then making a new muzzle device on the lathe that would press fit on? If not, I'll probably go the Voodoo Innovations route. Would anyone even buy a barrel that looked like this if I were just gonna sell it? You didn't have it in a barrel vise? And there was no damage to the upper receiver? |
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To the OP- barrel length is the same here in CA as every state. 16" overall. This isn't a CA compliance thing, it's an idiot pinning a 16 instead of a 14.5 w/ extended muzzle device thing. I'd take Dano's advice tho. I know barrel length is the same, but after this happened he told me his gun also had a "collapsible" stock that didn't actually collapse, and it didn't have the bayo lug either. CA compliant is the only thing that would make sense, and I'm assuming the FH being pinned eliminated one of the "evil" features. And yes, it was just in a regular vise block, no, there was no damage done to the upper. |
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Send it to Adco to have the bad threaded section of barrel cut off, the new end of barrel turned down/crowned/threaded, then a extended FS permanently (blind pin again) installed to get the barrel back to 16" legal. https://www.adcofirearms.com/ http://vtsupply.com/images/manimal-extended-flash-hider.jpg How is that different from what I suggested, please? |
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How is that different from what I suggested, please? Quoted:
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Send it to Adco to have the bad threaded section of barrel cut off, the new end of barrel turned down/crowned/threaded, then a extended FS permanently (blind pin again) installed to get the barrel back to 16" legal. https://www.adcofirearms.com/ http://vtsupply.com/images/manimal-extended-flash-hider.jpg How is that different from what I suggested, please? He included linxz. An pichurs. We likes pichurs. Who wants to arm wrestle OP? Any volunteers? Can't OP have his lovely bbl cut to 14.7" & have a standard flash hider installed? |
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I know barrel length is the same, but after this happened he told me his gun also had a "collapsible" stock that didn't actually collapse, and it didn't have the bayo lug either. CA compliant is the only thing that would make sense, and I'm assuming the FH being pinned eliminated one of the "evil" features. And yes, it was just in a regular vise block, no, there was no damage done to the upper. Quoted:
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To the OP- barrel length is the same here in CA as every state. 16" overall. This isn't a CA compliance thing, it's an idiot pinning a 16 instead of a 14.5 w/ extended muzzle device thing. I'd take Dano's advice tho. I know barrel length is the same, but after this happened he told me his gun also had a "collapsible" stock that didn't actually collapse, and it didn't have the bayo lug either. CA compliant is the only thing that would make sense, and I'm assuming the FH being pinned eliminated one of the "evil" features. And yes, it was just in a regular vise block, no, there was no damage done to the upper. We can have collapsable stocks here too. If this weapon was state compliant, it wasnt for CA. There are other states that can't have collapsable stocks tho. And a flash hider isn't considered an evil feature here either |
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Can't OP have his lovely bbl cut to 14.7" & have a standard flash hider installed? Maybe, but might be a bit dodgy on the OAL of the barrel since you can't count the threaded section on the permantly attahced FS that it's threads are going to over lap with the threads on the barrel it being attached to after the barrel has been shortened, crowned, and re-threaded. |
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Maybe, but might be a bit dodgy on the OAL of the barrel since you can't count the threaded section on the permantly attahced FS that it's threads are going to over lap with the threads on the barrel it being attached to after the barrel has been shortened, crowned, and re-threaded. Quoted:
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Can't OP have his lovely bbl cut to 14.7" & have a standard flash hider installed? Maybe, but might be a bit dodgy on the OAL of the barrel since you can't count the threaded section on the permantly attahced FS that it's threads are going to over lap with the threads on the barrel it being attached to after the barrel has been shortened, crowned, and re-threaded. I've been wondering this myself. What about the other end? Does measuring start from the extension pin or at the end of the barrel nut threads on upper? |
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I've been wondering this myself. What about the other end? Does measuring start from the extension pin or at the end of the barrel nut threads on upper? Quoted:
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Can't OP have his lovely bbl cut to 14.7" & have a standard flash hider installed? Maybe, but might be a bit dodgy on the OAL of the barrel since you can't count the threaded section on the permantly attahced FS that it's threads are going to over lap with the threads on the barrel it being attached to after the barrel has been shortened, crowned, and re-threaded. I've been wondering this myself. What about the other end? Does measuring start from the extension pin or at the end of the barrel nut threads on upper? A wooden dowel dropped down into the barrel to the (closed) bolt face. Mark where the end of the barrel is and measure. |
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A wooden dowel dropped down into the barrel to the (closed) bolt face. Mark where the end of the barrel is and measure. Quoted:
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Can't OP have his lovely bbl cut to 14.7" & have a standard flash hider installed? Maybe, but might be a bit dodgy on the OAL of the barrel since you can't count the threaded section on the permantly attahced FS that it's threads are going to over lap with the threads on the barrel it being attached to after the barrel has been shortened, crowned, and re-threaded. I've been wondering this myself. What about the other end? Does measuring start from the extension pin or at the end of the barrel nut threads on upper? A wooden dowel dropped down into the barrel to the (closed) bolt face. Mark where the end of the barrel is and measure. Closes, but since the bolt face is recessed, you do get a semi wrong reading that can get you in trouble if push comes to shove (why you always want to end up with a reading like 16 1/4" when using a dowel). The actual length of barrel is from the start edge of the back of chamber edge inside the barrel extension (as if the barrel extension was removed from the barrel), to the end of the muzzle (or in this case, to the end of the permanent attached FS). |
| Ok, talked to a guy at work today (I'm a machinist in a tool and die shop), and we discussed the possibility of turning down the formerly threaded section to a specific diameter, then making a press fit bushing to press over it. Then threading the OD of said bushing to 1/2-28. It would keep the barrel at 16", require no permanent attaching, and should be strong enough for use with a flash hider, possibly even a muzzle brake (muzzle brake preferred, since this is a budget build for my 110lb fiancé). How effective does this sound to you all? |
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Gotcha. So on a lets say.....20" barrel it would be from the beginning of the chamber to the bbl shoulder that the crush washer is smashed against. Then on my service rifle clone, beginning of chamber to end of pinned FH. No, to the end of the threaded section of the muzzle (to crown), and not the barrel shoulder that is back from the crown. Think of this as a AR barrel with the barrel extension removed, so the sum of the chamber and the sum of the running bore after the chamber is the true length of the barrel (loading breach edge to muzzle crown). 
When a device is permanently attached to the barrel (BATF approved method), the added length of the device now becomes added length of barrel, even through there is an increase in OD from the bore to the inside of the sleeve. Such as in the case of even the short 12" Anschutz bore length barrels that have permanently attached barrel sleeves that increase the length of the barrel to 20"+ to move the front sight out farther for a longer sighting radius. And again, depending on the firearm, the dowel rod test method can be very effective. Take a shotgun barrel where you have a long hooded section on the barrel for the bolt to lock into that is not part of the chamber/bore sections, but since the bolt face is not recessed, dropping a dowel down the barrel with the bolt locked up will give you a true reading of chamber and bore sections to the end of the muzzle for total barrel length (which includes the end of the barrel that is bored and threaded out for removable chokes). |
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No, to the end of the threaded section of the muzzle (to crown), and not the barrel shoulder that is back from the crown. Think of this as a AR barrel with the barrel extension removed, so the sum of the chamber and the sum of the running bore after the chamber is the true length of the barrel (loading breach edge to muzzle crown). http://www.brownells.com/userdocs/products/l_801723145_1.jpg When a device is permanently attached to the barrel (BATF approved method), the added length of the device now becomes added length of barrel, even through there is an increase in OD from the bore to the inside of the sleeve. Such as in the case of even the short 12" Anschutz bore length barrels that have permanently attached barrel sleeves that increase the length of the barrel to 20"+ to move the front sight out farther for a longer sighting radius. And again, depending on the firearm, the dowel rod test method can be very effective. Take a shotgun barrel where you have a long hooded section on the barrel for the bolt to lock into that is not part of the chamber/bore sections, but since the bolt face is not recessed, dropping a dowel down the barrel with the bolt locked up will give you a true reading of chamber and bore sections to the end of the muzzle for total barrel length (which includes the end of the barrel that is bored and threaded out for removable chokes). Quoted:
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Gotcha. So on a lets say.....20" barrel it would be from the beginning of the chamber to the bbl shoulder that the crush washer is smashed against. Then on my service rifle clone, beginning of chamber to end of pinned FH. No, to the end of the threaded section of the muzzle (to crown), and not the barrel shoulder that is back from the crown. Think of this as a AR barrel with the barrel extension removed, so the sum of the chamber and the sum of the running bore after the chamber is the true length of the barrel (loading breach edge to muzzle crown). http://www.brownells.com/userdocs/products/l_801723145_1.jpg When a device is permanently attached to the barrel (BATF approved method), the added length of the device now becomes added length of barrel, even through there is an increase in OD from the bore to the inside of the sleeve. Such as in the case of even the short 12" Anschutz bore length barrels that have permanently attached barrel sleeves that increase the length of the barrel to 20"+ to move the front sight out farther for a longer sighting radius. And again, depending on the firearm, the dowel rod test method can be very effective. Take a shotgun barrel where you have a long hooded section on the barrel for the bolt to lock into that is not part of the chamber/bore sections, but since the bolt face is not recessed, dropping a dowel down the barrel with the bolt locked up will give you a true reading of chamber and bore sections to the end of the muzzle for total barrel length (which includes the end of the barrel that is bored and threaded out for removable chokes). Oh ok I gotcha now. I was thinking the threaded portion wouldn't count for length since the FH threads into it. Never took the time to actually measure any of my barrels before a build or if purchased pre-built since I already knew the length lol |
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ATF on how to measure. Rifle is part way down the link page.
https://www.atf.gov/files/publications/download/p/atf-p-5320-8/atf-p-5320-8-chapter-2.pdf |
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MossyOak, Sounds workable and seems like a good option. Would another option be to run a die over the previous threads and place and pin another flash suppressor? It would hide the threads and work for suppression. ?Cheap fix? The only problem with that is there isn't anything there to run the die over, except the three threads at the rear. And I'm trying to avoid pinning as much as possible. I'm really thinking about going with the press fitted bushing. I think that'll be the easiest, and most effective option for now. Worst case senario, it doesn't work and I have to cut and rethread it anyways. |
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Quoted: Ok, talked to a guy at work today (I'm a machinist in a tool and die shop), and we discussed the possibility of turning down the formerly threaded section to a specific diameter, then making a press fit bushing to press over it. Then threading the OD of said bushing to 1/2-28. It would keep the barrel at 16", require no permanent attaching, and should be strong enough for use with a flash hider, possibly even a muzzle brake (muzzle brake preferred, since this is a budget build for my 110lb fiancé). How effective does this sound to you all? Unless she's noise insensitive, I'd skip the muzzle brake for an AR & go w/ a flash hider, or preferably, a flash can. Recoil on an AR isn't much. But a flash can or linear compensator will send some of the noise downrange, where a muzzle brake will direct it back @ you. |
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