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Posted: 2/1/2014 7:42:12 AM EDT
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A few years ago, I was into AR, but ditched them once I got into AKs. It's not really a loss on my part because I was very new to firearms and didn't know what I really liked/wanted in a rifle. The ARs I had then, I would definitely not want now.
However, I am thinking about getting back into ARs for a few reasons: AKs have gotten rather expensive I think .223/5.56 is an awesome round. Import bans could really push up the price of 5.45 and 7.62 Now, here is what I am looking for: I'd like to pick up an flat-top, piston-driven upper and I would then add flip-up sights (front and rear). If I can find one that already has sights, that would be a bonus. I want it to be a short as possible while having a functional brake/comp. So, I guess a barrel that is 14" or so with a permanently attached muzzle device to get the barrel over 16" would be best. When it comes to lowers, I am completely open to suggestions. Building one or buying a near-complete upper would be fine my me - whichever is the most cost-effect and give me the best bang for my buck would be my preference. Thanks in advance for any assistance. Adam |
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you've been reading some interesting stuff then. Quoted:
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From everything that I've read, they run cleaner and cooler. you've been reading some interesting stuff then. Have I? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw I'm not here to argue about DI vs PD. I want what I want. If you are posting to try and talk me out of what I want, don't bother. However, if you would like to post and provide options to help me find what I want, I am all ears. ETA: The PD bolt clearly stays cooler. It's not even close, really. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the bolt stays cooler because there is less hot gas being blown back into the receiver/bolt/carrier. So, if there is less gas being brought into the receiver, I would come to the conclusion that there is less carbon being introduced into the receiver and it would run cleaner. Am I missing something? |
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You might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. That sounds like a good idea. The last thing I want to to sit here and argue with DI fanboys all day long. Let's allow this thread to die. I'll be reposting in the AR Piston Systems section. |
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That sounds like a good idea. The last thing I want to to sit here and argue with DI fanboys all day long. Let's allow this thread to die. I'll be reposting in the AR Piston Systems section. Quoted:
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You might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. That sounds like a good idea. The last thing I want to to sit here and argue with DI fanboys all day long. Let's allow this thread to die. I'll be reposting in the AR Piston Systems section. I'm sure they will enjoy your attitude |
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I'm sure they will enjoy your attitude Quoted:
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You might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. That sounds like a good idea. The last thing I want to to sit here and argue with DI fanboys all day long. Let's allow this thread to die. I'll be reposting in the AR Piston Systems section. I'm sure they will enjoy your attitude Ahh... I hope I didn't hurt your feelings. Pardon me for asking a specific question and wanting a specific answer rather than debate over systems. |
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 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw&feature=player_detailpage
You might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. Oh no, the bolt got hot in that one on the left!!!  That's bad rite?
On a serious note - what are they trying to say with the video? Heat in the carrier / bolt / receiver is bad? For longevity? For accuracy? What exactly? |
| So why did you even waste the time of making this thread if you were going to get butthurt over someone telling you that you would be fine with a gas gun instead of a piston gun. I like both but I still shoot my 6920 the most. Not saying it's any better its just that the bolt getting hot really hasn't been a driving factor for me to shoot the 516. I'm glad I didn't tell you what I thought of Ak's you would really have gotten pissed. |
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Oh no, the bolt got hot in that one on the left!!! That's bad rite?
On a serious note - what are they trying to say with the video? Heat in the carrier / bolt / receiver is bad? For longevity? For accuracy? What exactly? Quoted:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw&feature=player_detailpage
You might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. Oh no, the bolt got hot in that one on the left!!! That's bad rite?
On a serious note - what are they trying to say with the video? Heat in the carrier / bolt / receiver is bad? For longevity? For accuracy? What exactly? First time I've seen that video, very interesting. Looks like the DI system distributes heat more evenly, where the piston system is focused more intensely on the barrel. |
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First time I've seen that video, very interesting. Looks like the DI system distributes heat more evenly, where the piston system is focused more intensely on the barrel. Quoted:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw&feature=player_detailpage
You might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. Oh no, the bolt got hot in that one on the left!!! That's bad rite?
On a serious note - what are they trying to say with the video? Heat in the carrier / bolt / receiver is bad? For longevity? For accuracy? What exactly? First time I've seen that video, very interesting. Looks like the DI system distributes heat more evenly, where the piston system is focused more intensely on the barrel. That's what I got from it too- way more heat at the barrel... I'd say it makes the DI look even better if anything. |
I won't debate the merits of either system. It's really a waste of time. I have both and like both. OP if you want inaccurate opinions based mostly on emotion then post your piston questions in this forum. Mention piston here and the townspeople grab torches and pitchforks. (Not saying anyone did that yet. These fellas have been nice. It will go there though.  )
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So why did you even waste the time of making this thread if you were going to get butthurt over someone telling you that you would be fine with a gas gun instead of a piston gun. I like both but I still shoot my 6920 the most. Not saying it's any better its just that the bolt getting hot really hasn't been a driving factor for me to shoot the 516. I'm glad I didn't tell you what I thought of Ak's you would really have gotten pissed. Butthurt? Man, that juvenile term is used far too often. I think it's more like being underwhelmed by those who lack reading comprehension (you included). I went to the piston section because it was quite clear that this thread was going to have a hard time staying on-topic. Your post is a fine example of that. Had I posted a thread, saying ''Hey guys, lets compare the pros and cons of DI and PD ARs!'', sure, I'd obviously be all about that conversation. Buuuuut, that's not what I asked, now was it? Also, I could not care less of your opinion on AKs. Each platform has strong supporters and rightfully so. To each their own. |
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Butthurt? Man, that juvenile term is used far too often. I think it's more like being underwhelmed by those who lack reading comprehension (you included). I went to the piston section because it was quite clear that this thread was going to have a hard time staying on-topic. Your post is a fine example of that. Had I posted a thread, saying ''Hey guys, lets compare the pros and cons of DI and PD ARs!'', sure, I'd obviously be all about that conversation. Buuuuut, that's not what I asked, now was it? Also, I could not care less of your opinion on AKs. Each platform has strong supporters and rightfully so. To each their own. Quoted:
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So why did you even waste the time of making this thread if you were going to get butthurt over someone telling you that you would be fine with a gas gun instead of a piston gun. I like both but I still shoot my 6920 the most. Not saying it's any better its just that the bolt getting hot really hasn't been a driving factor for me to shoot the 516. I'm glad I didn't tell you what I thought of Ak's you would really have gotten pissed. Butthurt? Man, that juvenile term is used far too often. I think it's more like being underwhelmed by those who lack reading comprehension (you included). I went to the piston section because it was quite clear that this thread was going to have a hard time staying on-topic. Your post is a fine example of that. Had I posted a thread, saying ''Hey guys, lets compare the pros and cons of DI and PD ARs!'', sure, I'd obviously be all about that conversation. Buuuuut, that's not what I asked, now was it? Also, I could not care less of your opinion on AKs. Each platform has strong supporters and rightfully so. To each their own. What a dick |
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What a dick Quoted:
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So why did you even waste the time of making this thread if you were going to get butthurt over someone telling you that you would be fine with a gas gun instead of a piston gun. I like both but I still shoot my 6920 the most. Not saying it's any better its just that the bolt getting hot really hasn't been a driving factor for me to shoot the 516. I'm glad I didn't tell you what I thought of Ak's you would really have gotten pissed. Butthurt? Man, that juvenile term is used far too often. I think it's more like being underwhelmed by those who lack reading comprehension (you included). I went to the piston section because it was quite clear that this thread was going to have a hard time staying on-topic. Your post is a fine example of that. Had I posted a thread, saying ''Hey guys, lets compare the pros and cons of DI and PD ARs!'', sure, I'd obviously be all about that conversation. Buuuuut, that's not what I asked, now was it? Also, I could not care less of your opinion on AKs. Each platform has strong supporters and rightfully so. To each their own. What a dick And not even a thirteener! 
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Quoted: Oh no, the bolt got hot in that one on the left!!! That's bad rite? On a serious note - what are they trying to say with the video? Heat in the carrier / bolt / receiver is bad? For longevity? For accuracy? What exactly? Quoted: Quoted: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw&feature=player_detailpageYou might ask about this in the Piston subforum, you are likely to hear more of what you would like to. Oh no, the bolt got hot in that one on the left!!! That's bad rite? On a serious note - what are they trying to say with the video? Heat in the carrier / bolt / receiver is bad? For longevity? For accuracy? What exactly? |
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Have I? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw I'm not here to argue about DI vs PD. I want what I want. If you are posting to try and talk me out of what I want, don't bother. However, if you would like to post and provide options to help me find what I want, I am all ears. ETA: The PD bolt clearly stays cooler. It's not even close, really. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the bolt stays cooler because there is less hot gas being blown back into the receiver/bolt/carrier. So, if there is less gas being brought into the receiver, I would come to the conclusion that there is less carbon being introduced into the receiver and it would run cleaner. Am I missing something? Quoted:
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From everything that I've read, they run cleaner and cooler. you've been reading some interesting stuff then. Have I? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw I'm not here to argue about DI vs PD. I want what I want. If you are posting to try and talk me out of what I want, don't bother. However, if you would like to post and provide options to help me find what I want, I am all ears. ETA: The PD bolt clearly stays cooler. It's not even close, really. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the bolt stays cooler because there is less hot gas being blown back into the receiver/bolt/carrier. So, if there is less gas being brought into the receiver, I would come to the conclusion that there is less carbon being introduced into the receiver and it would run cleaner. Am I missing something? I think you're missing the fact that these rifles have been in military service for over 40 years without piston systems. They're now being used by our military in some of the harshest environments you can put them in. Pistons have more moving parts to break, plus they tend to weight more due to the parts. And, as a general statement, the "inferior" DI gun seems to be well liked by tens of thousands of soldiers that use them. My personal opinion is each have specific philosophies of use that they excel at. Also, personally, I couldn't care less which one you pick or what you like best. It's your money. But hey, you've got this figured out. Your attitude towards others shows how much you know. But you watch a video on YouTube and then come in to a forum dedicated to these rifles and tell everyone how wrong they are. I bet you're a blast at parties. |
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I think you're missing the fact that these rifles have been in military service for over 40 years without piston systems. They're now being used by our military in some of the harshest environments you can put them in. Pistons have more moving parts to break, plus they tend to weight more due to the parts. And, as a general statement, the "inferior" DI gun seems to be well liked by tens of thousands of soldiers that use them. My personal opinion is each have specific philosophies of use that they excel at. Also, personally, I couldn't care less which one you pick or what you like best. It's your money. But hey, you've got this figured out. Your attitude towards others shows how much you know. But you watch a video on YouTube and then come in to a forum dedicated to these rifles and tell everyone how wrong they are. I bet you're a blast at parties. Quoted:
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From everything that I've read, they run cleaner and cooler. you've been reading some interesting stuff then. Have I? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw I'm not here to argue about DI vs PD. I want what I want. If you are posting to try and talk me out of what I want, don't bother. However, if you would like to post and provide options to help me find what I want, I am all ears. ETA: The PD bolt clearly stays cooler. It's not even close, really. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the bolt stays cooler because there is less hot gas being blown back into the receiver/bolt/carrier. So, if there is less gas being brought into the receiver, I would come to the conclusion that there is less carbon being introduced into the receiver and it would run cleaner. Am I missing something? I think you're missing the fact that these rifles have been in military service for over 40 years without piston systems. They're now being used by our military in some of the harshest environments you can put them in. Pistons have more moving parts to break, plus they tend to weight more due to the parts. And, as a general statement, the "inferior" DI gun seems to be well liked by tens of thousands of soldiers that use them. My personal opinion is each have specific philosophies of use that they excel at. Also, personally, I couldn't care less which one you pick or what you like best. It's your money. But hey, you've got this figured out. Your attitude towards others shows how much you know. But you watch a video on YouTube and then come in to a forum dedicated to these rifles and tell everyone how wrong they are. I bet you're a blast at parties. Yeah, my M16 withstood more abuse than most folks can imagine (not just laying sideways on the ground with some dirt on it for a photo op). I swam (not waded) across rivers with the thing, dragged it through dirt, mud, snow, and sand...including on beaches, in jungles, and in 50 below conditions in Northern Alaska. It withstood the elements for weeks on end before either one of us would see shelter...and it always worked...so DI works for me. Is piston better? I could not care less. DI is combat proven and my AR is a weapon that I count on to work with zero maintenance besides lube. I also like standard parts. Feel free to buy what you like. If piston-driven is what you want, go for it...but as has been said, you'll get better advice in that forum. The vast majority of ARs that have been made and that are being made are DI...and that's what most folks here know and love. |
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I prefer di however more due to the cost difference. However if I were to buy piston it would be LWRCi, PWS, or Adams Arm in tht order. Also Rainier is releasing their new ruc with an Adams arms piton setup. Yep, I would really like an LMT... I think i could get over the piston thing to have one of these 
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I think you're missing the fact that these rifles have been in military service for over 40 years without piston systems. They're now being used by our military in some of the harshest environments you can put them in. Pistons have more moving parts to break, plus they tend to weight more due to the parts. And, as a general statement, the "inferior" DI gun seems to be well liked by tens of thousands of soldiers that use them. My personal opinion is each have specific philosophies of use that they excel at. Also, personally, I couldn't care less which one you pick or what you like best. It's your money. But hey, you've got this figured out. Your attitude towards others shows how much you know. But you watch a video on YouTube and then come in to a forum dedicated to these rifles and tell everyone how wrong they are. I bet you're a blast at parties. Quoted:
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From everything that I've read, they run cleaner and cooler. you've been reading some interesting stuff then. Have I? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMJBIVY-8Jw I'm not here to argue about DI vs PD. I want what I want. If you are posting to try and talk me out of what I want, don't bother. However, if you would like to post and provide options to help me find what I want, I am all ears. ETA: The PD bolt clearly stays cooler. It's not even close, really. Now, correct me if I am wrong, but the bolt stays cooler because there is less hot gas being blown back into the receiver/bolt/carrier. So, if there is less gas being brought into the receiver, I would come to the conclusion that there is less carbon being introduced into the receiver and it would run cleaner. Am I missing something? I think you're missing the fact that these rifles have been in military service for over 40 years without piston systems. They're now being used by our military in some of the harshest environments you can put them in. Pistons have more moving parts to break, plus they tend to weight more due to the parts. And, as a general statement, the "inferior" DI gun seems to be well liked by tens of thousands of soldiers that use them. My personal opinion is each have specific philosophies of use that they excel at. Also, personally, I couldn't care less which one you pick or what you like best. It's your money. But hey, you've got this figured out. Your attitude towards others shows how much you know. But you watch a video on YouTube and then come in to a forum dedicated to these rifles and tell everyone how wrong they are. I bet you're a blast at parties. Apparently, you are another that lacks reading comprehension. I came here for suggestions on PD uppers. I did not come here to show everyone how much I knew based on one video that I watched. If that's how you view it, I would strongly question your critical thinking skills. I only mentioned that I was under the impression that PD ARs run cleaner/cooler along with posting a video after I was questioned as to why I did not want DI. I fail to see how anyone in their right mind could see that as me to coming to this section, trying to look like some sort of AR expert. Let me use an example to simplify if for you. It's the equivalent of someone posting a thread, asking about 30-30 lever guns and poster after poster tries to tell them that pump action and bolt action rifles are superior/just as good. It's just plain stupid and, as an OP looking for specific information, very annoying. |
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IBTL By the way what does this even mean?  I am one of those soldiers and I still prefer the AK platform and a piston system to a DI AR.Quoted:
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I know enough to know what the soldiers who defend my freedom prefer to use is damn good enough for me. By the way what does this even mean? I am one of those soldiers and I still prefer the AK platform and a piston system to a DI AR.It seems like the whole "Team America" or "Go America" mentality. I personally know plenty of former military that either prefer AKs or have nothing but AKs. You are right though, this does need locked. I feel like a Kindergarten teacher that's continually trying to keep the children focused. |
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If you want a piston upper then do it. Look around at some of the new offerings out over shot show. I believe it was called the arak its not my cup of tea but I remember lots of folks got excited about it.
I will tell you this. I have used both. I don't know which one works best. I had a pistol completely seize up on me. It sucked and made me sad. I also had a magpul moe front end on that rifle until the piston died because options for rails that work with pistons suck. I understand lancer is offering new options this year and it is probably something to look for I have always liked what they have to offer. You really didn't tell us anything about shooting style or use before you started your junk measuring contest. What kind of application are you going to use this gun for? How many shots a year would you say will go through the barrel and how many over each range season? Are you planning on suppressing this rifle? What parts of the AK did you like when you started 'running' them? How much did you shoot your ak? Based on what we do and don't know I would offer this. Order a piston driven upper if that is really what you want and hopefully you will find one without iron sights. Then research iron sight options out there and buy the exact ones you want. You need to of course research the piston uppers as well and as cool as promotional videos some companies have out there you should probably look to 3rd party reviewers. The gun magazines (periodicals not ammunition feeding) are generally better at the reviews because they still try to be closer to journalists while the youtube dudes often times are more of the shock jocks type. A youtube video may have been made after a few minutes of familiarization using cool buzz words and pushed to the masses. For most of these 'reviews' one of three formats is used. 1. agree with the fan boys "wow yea this is totally a more dynamic concept of operating the push pins bros." 2. everything is shit hipster approach. " I only need my 6920 with irons because all that other shit will fail you 13er" or 3 giving an honest opinion which will likely be glazed over by the masses because in reality most everything out today is the same "these push pins seemed a bit easier to pull out but I have never really had a problem with them in the first place you can buy them if you are building a new gun but I wouldn't bother replacing the usgi type ones" anyway lower receiver should have a decent trigger in it. I have had great success with geissele and ALG ACT triggers. If you like AK's you probably have no real understanding on how good triggers can feel so that is a huge plus. Any cheap lower that is stripped works. Make sure your receiver extension aka buffer tube is milspec and then find a stock you like. I like the super cheap b5 sopmods these days. On top of that you have mags everyone thinks different shit about them. I like lancers. I have a ton of pmags and I have a ton of usgi. When I buy new mags I get lancers. Ask what to clean with...everyone will say something different. Coming in asking for advice then acting like a dick won't get you any more help though. You didn't really know what you were talking about and were stepping into new waters. Rather than hearing some people out and getting some variance in opinion you pulled the trigger too fast. These are guns people will disagree with you and agree with you. If you want the right answer you might get some wrong ones along the way but you aren't the judge and jury. You aren't the moderator in some great debate you asked a question now enjoy the answers just don't be a dick. |
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IBTL By the way what does this even mean? I am one of those soldiers and I still prefer the AK platform and a piston system to a DI AR.Quoted:
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I know enough to know what the soldiers who defend my freedom prefer to use is damn good enough for me. By the way what does this even mean? I am one of those soldiers and I still prefer the AK platform and a piston system to a DI AR.Obviously he doesn't know you don't get to choose what's issued. |
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If you want a piston gun get it. I prefer DI because I can find parts from different companies to fit pretty much any critical part on my rifle (this is huge for me). When I first started shooting ARs I thought they were all a piece of junk. This was because all I had shot (2002-2005ish) were either dpms, bushmasters, or Olympic. I later bought a double star and it never jammed. Then I bought even better rifles from spike's, LMT, and now this Daniel Defense. I'm not sure if your experience is similar but this is mine...
Either way get what you want. |
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It seems like the whole "Team America" or "Go America" mentality. I personally know plenty of former military that either prefer AKs or have nothing but AKs. You are right though, this does need locked. I feel like a Kindergarten teacher that's continually trying to keep the children focused. Quoted:
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I know enough to know what the soldiers who defend my freedom prefer to use is damn good enough for me. By the way what does this even mean? I am one of those soldiers and I still prefer the AK platform and a piston system to a DI AR.It seems like the whole "Team America" or "Go America" mentality. I personally know plenty of former military that either prefer AKs or have nothing but AKs. You are right though, this does need locked. I feel like a Kindergarten teacher that's continually trying to keep the children focused. Go play with your piston then. Good grief man. Stop going on abouy it and let it go. Who the F even cares? I'm glad your exit interview sample size of a dozen or so ex military is representational of the entire service. |
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Go play with your piston then. Good grief man. Stop going on abouy it and let it go. Who the F even cares? I'm glad your exit interview sample size of a dozen or so ex military is representational of the entire service. Quoted:
Go play with your piston then. Good grief man. Stop going on abouy it and let it go. Who the F even cares? I'm glad your exit interview sample size of a dozen or so ex military is representational of the entire service. So, the genius that bumps a dead/dying thread comes along and tells me to let it go. Good one, man. Quoted:
Who the F even cares? Apparently, you do... |
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So, the genius that bumps a dead/dying thread comes along and tells me to let it go. Good one, man. Apparently, you do... Quoted:
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Go play with your piston then. Good grief man. Stop going on abouy it and let it go. Who the F even cares? I'm glad your exit interview sample size of a dozen or so ex military is representational of the entire service. So, the genius that bumps a dead/dying thread comes along and tells me to let it go. Good one, man. Quoted:
Who the F even cares? Apparently, you do... Nope, I don't. Have fun. |
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