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Posted: 9/9/2015 8:59:24 PM EDT
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Pretty torn on the purchase of a weapon light.
Between the Inforce HSP WML and a Surefire 951/52 with tape switch and mount. I've owned a WML and love the simplicity. Surefire is 225 lumens to the WMLs 200. Suggestions please. |
Lights I have wasted more money time and been less happy here than any others accessory...''
whats your goal  indoor use - stay around 120 lumens
outdoor use sky is the limit do you have night vision
do you actually want a tape switch the wire is a snag magnet.
where do you want to mount the light
If the goal is simply to look cool get the scout I f you want a good light for hunting the streamlight tlr-1HP offers 630 lumens plus with a turbo head for more range its not much bigger than the scout. but can be hard to mount because of the big turbo head. my favorite is the streamlight tlr-2hl 630 lumens with a strobe feature - but its really too bright for indoor use. for a versatile light the tl-1 c4 led offers 160ish lumens with a strobe and is much smaller than the surefire 951,961 series.the scouts are seen as the gold standard but they are absurdly priced for the performance you get. If the goal is simply to look cool get the scout but note that's not the end you will still drop another $100 on switches tail caps & bulbs. think long and hard about ypur goal my end game was this- I want only one battery type that runs my red dot , night vision, ir laser, white light & IR light. I want only lights/optics that I can put on &tae off without tools. I wanted no tape switches. I wanted the lights as small light weight & powerful as I could get. your goals, want, and needs might be different but you need to have this much thought out before you begin to purchase or yo'll end up buying stuff you can't use won't use or don't need. thst's my 3 cents good luck. |
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Quoted:
Lights I have wasted more money time and been less happy here than any others accessory...''
whats your goal indoor use - stay around 120 lumens
outdoor use sky is the limit do you have night vision
do you actually want a tape switch the wire is a snag magnet.
where do you want to mount the light
If the goal is simply to look cool get the scout I f you want a good light for hunting the streamlight tlr-1HP offers 630 lumens plus with a turbo head for more range its not much bigger than the scout. but can be hard to mount because of the big turbo head. my favorite is the streamlight tlr-2hl 630 lumens with a strobe feature - but its really too bright for indoor use. for a versatile light the tl-1 c4 led offers 160ish lumens with a strobe and is much smaller than the surefire 951,961 series.the scouts are seen as the gold standard but they are absurdly priced for the performance you get. If the goal is simply to look cool get the scout but note that's not the end you will still drop another $100 on switches tail caps & bulbs. think long and hard about ypur goal my end game was this- I want only one battery type that runs my red dot , night vision, ir laser, white light & IR light. I want only lights/optics that I can put on &tae off without tools. I wanted no tape switches. I wanted the lights as small light weight & powerful as I could get. your goals, want, and needs might be different but you need to have this much thought out before you begin to purchase or yo'll end up buying stuff you can't use won't use or don't need. thst's my 3 cents good luck. lol You seem to not like the Scout, since all you can say about it is it'll make you look cool. I have to ask, why don't you like it? I've owned quite a few, and have been using an M600U on my work rifle for almost 2 years now without issue. ETA: Also, why are you dropping $100 on tailcaps, switches and bulbs? The Scout comes with both tape switch and push button tailcaps, as well as a tape switch. There are no bulbs. I'm kind of at a loss on this part. |
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Yep, I've been down the light road too.... Went with the WML in Coyote and haven't looked back. I think it's the best designed long gun light on the market. Meh, they're not all that durable. I've seen more than a few with the mount portion cracked and my buddy completely shattered the body on his when his rifle fell over on the tile in his house. |
| Sad but true. I've seen way too many cases now to deny it, but if Inforce would strengthen their polymer to Magpul polymer standards, the WML would be one of the best lights around. Has alot of pros to it incuding the price point, but they need to fucking fix their polymer strength ASAP |
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Thanks Tomac. This changes everything. Surefire it is. |
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You can also piece together your own Scout or Mini Scout by getting an Arisaka Scout body, a tailcap, and a Malkoff head of your choice. They make their standard one and a new one that has an optic and produces a tighter beam, similar to the Surefire TIR. Then just get whatever mount you want to use. Most end up ditching the factory Surefire mount anyway.
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Going to save some more pennies and go with the Mini Scout. |
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Quoted: Sad but true. I've seen way too many cases now to deny it, but if Inforce would strengthen their polymer to Magpul polymer standards, the WML would be one of the best lights around. Has alot of pros to it incuding the price point, but they need to fucking fix their polymer strength ASAP |
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Streamlight TLR1 HL is the best value in a light. 600 lumens, integral mount, strobe, durable. But the throw isn't like a Scout. And they don't come in tan. They are fine for indoors if you keep your weapon at low ready, the spill of the light is easily enough to ID a target. After ID, you can bring up the sights/light if necessary. Scouts are awesome but at 2x the cost it's hard for me to love them. |
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What about the Elzetta Mini CQB? Seems like a good little light. 375 lumens, 1 CR123, and has the IWC mount. Not bad for $200. They also offer tape switches to buy separate.
Are the Surefire 951/952 pretty heavy for the front end? I have a lead on one for under $100 with tape switch and mount. That a decent price point? |
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Quoted: What about the Elzetta Mini CQB? Seems like a good little light. 375 lumens, 1 CR123, and has the IWC mount. Not bad for $200. They also offer tape switches to buy separate. Are the Surefire 951/952 pretty heavy for the front end? I have a lead on one for under $100 with tape switch and mount. That a decent price point? The 951 is outdated, big, and heavy. But you can get an LED retrofit to modernize them. However the mass is still there. |
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What about the Elzetta Mini CQB? Seems like a good little light. 375 lumens, 1 CR123, and has the IWC mount. Not bad for $200. They also offer tape switches to buy separate. Are the Surefire 951/952 pretty heavy for the front end? I have a lead on one for under $100 with tape switch and mount. That a decent price point? They'll certainly be heavier than the scout lights but I don't have any issue with it (951) on my carbine. If I had a longer handguard/rail I would go smaller but I think they're fine for a carbine. 
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You can also piece together your own Scout or Mini Scout by getting an Arisaka Scout body, a tailcap, and a Malkoff head of your choice. They make their standard one and a new one that has an optic and produces a tighter beam, similar to the Surefire TIR. Then just get whatever mount you want to use. Most end up ditching the factory Surefire mount anyway. Quoted:
You can also piece together your own Scout or Mini Scout by getting an Arisaka Scout body, a tailcap, and a Malkoff head of your choice. They make their standard one and a new one that has an optic and produces a tighter beam, similar to the Surefire TIR. Then just get whatever mount you want to use. Most end up ditching the factory Surefire mount anyway. Quoted:
Going to save some more pennies and go with the Mini Scout. This is what I did, I have this light, the elzetta and the wml. The scout is by far my favorite for throw. |
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i'd recommend building a scout out of arisaka components. 300 series light Arisaka also offers the option of the complete light including the Malkoff head. |
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There's nothing magic about Magpul polymer that would save the WML, it's simply too thin. The bezel imparts a lot of leverage against the body when it's impacted, and they crack. Quoted:
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Sad but true. I've seen way too many cases now to deny it, but if Inforce would strengthen their polymer to Magpul polymer standards, the WML would be one of the best lights around. Has alot of pros to it incuding the price point, but they need to fucking fix their polymer strength ASAP Negative. If you had experience with the WML, you would know that they crack on their own. Tomac had 3 that cracked on their own (literally just sitting on the rifle) And guess what, mine just developed a crack as well (just sitting on the rifle) If it wasn't covered under fresh paint I'd take a pic and show you. Magpul polymer would absolutely, positively fix this issue. |
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Lights I have wasted more money time and been less happy here than any others accessory...''
whats your goal indoor use - stay around 120 lumens
outdoor use sky is the limit do you have night vision
do you actually want a tape switch the wire is a snag magnet.
where do you want to mount the light
If the goal is simply to look cool get the scout I f you want a good light for hunting the streamlight tlr-1HP offers 630 lumens plus with a turbo head for more range its not much bigger than the scout. but can be hard to mount because of the big turbo head. my favorite is the streamlight tlr-2hl 630 lumens with a strobe feature - but its really too bright for indoor use. for a versatile light the tl-1 c4 led offers 160ish lumens with a strobe and is much smaller than the surefire 951,961 series.the scouts are seen as the gold standard but they are absurdly priced for the performance you get. If the goal is simply to look cool get the scout but note that's not the end you will still drop another $100 on switches tail caps & bulbs. think long and hard about ypur goal my end game was this- I want only one battery type that runs my red dot , night vision, ir laser, white light & IR light. I want only lights/optics that I can put on &tae off without tools. I wanted no tape switches. I wanted the lights as small light weight & powerful as I could get. your goals, want, and needs might be different but you need to have this much thought out before you begin to purchase or yo'll end up buying stuff you can't use won't use or don't need. thst's my 3 cents good luck. You're about 5 years out of date with the bulbs and buying different switches, at least. LEDs replaced incandescent bulbs in Scouts a long time ago. Having owned several M951s, a scout, a TLR2, an X300, and a bunch of SF and Streamlight handhelds, I would recommend you either look at the M600U, or if you don't want to spend the money, one of the newer Fury handhelds. You could also look into an Arisaka light, if you want a lower cost variation on the M600/M300. I bought a M300B, and I wish I would have got the M600U or the M600P. You can call them "Tacticool" all you want, but they're the best balance available for output, durability, weight, and size. |
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Link? Quoted:
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i'd recommend building a scout out of arisaka components. Link? http://arisakadefense.com/collections/light-mounts |
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Pretty torn on the purchase of a weapon light. Between the Inforce HSP WML and a Surefire 951/52 with tape switch and mount. I've owned a WML and love the simplicity. Surefire is 225 lumens to the WMLs 200. Suggestions please. I'm surprised I'm the first one to catch this, but a Surefire M95x is only 60 lumen with the P60, I think about 120 lumens with the optional P61. You can drop in LEDs though up to 1200 lumen (that I'm aware of) ($18 on ebay). I still love getting used surefires cheap off ebay though. Bullet proof and real deal US military issue! |
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Do yourself a favor and spend less than $100 on an Olight warrior 21.
Can be had for $69 I think now and bomb proof. And there is a YouTube vid of one getting dropped from a second story. Getting run over. Getting dragged behind a car. Et cetera for the naysayers. No reason to spend hundreds unless your a SEAL or sonthing and you know you're hitting the shit. Even then I'd still trust an olight. I can't kill either of mine. |
I'm also looking for one
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I'm surprised I'm the first one to catch this, but a Surefire M95x is only 60 lumen with the P60, I think about 120 lumens with the optional P61. You can drop in LEDs though up to 1200 lumen (that I'm aware of) ($18 on ebay). I still love getting used surefires cheap off ebay though. Bullet proof and real deal US military issue! Quoted:
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Pretty torn on the purchase of a weapon light. Between the Inforce HSP WML and a Surefire 951/52 with tape switch and mount. I've owned a WML and love the simplicity. Surefire is 225 lumens to the WMLs 200. Suggestions please. I'm surprised I'm the first one to catch this, but a Surefire M95x is only 60 lumen with the P60, I think about 120 lumens with the optional P61. You can drop in LEDs though up to 1200 lumen (that I'm aware of) ($18 on ebay). I still love getting used surefires cheap off ebay though. Bullet proof and real deal US military issue! Seller isn't 100% of model and I'm not familiar with them enough to know for sure what it is either. Just know yes saying its 225 lumens. Still waiting to hear back about it though. In the meantime I've found a 600B that's really catching my eye. Includes tape switch and mount just Still debating on the 300 or 600 platform. |
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Do yourself a favor and spend less than $100 on an Olight warrior 21. Can be had for $69 I think now and bomb proof. And there is a YouTube vid of one getting dropped from a second story. Getting run over. Getting dragged behind a car. Et cetera for the naysayers. No reason to spend hundreds unless your a SEAL or sonthing and you know you're hitting the shit. Even then I'd still trust an olight. I can't kill either of mine. 750 lumens? Thats pretty bright for tight spots. Do you have the ability to change the caps or run these on a tape switch? |
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750 lumens? Thats pretty bright for tight spots. Do you have the ability to change the caps or run these on a tape switch? Quoted:
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Do yourself a favor and spend less than $100 on an Olight warrior 21. Can be had for $69 I think now and bomb proof. And there is a YouTube vid of one getting dropped from a second story. Getting run over. Getting dragged behind a car. Et cetera for the naysayers. No reason to spend hundreds unless your a SEAL or sonthing and you know you're hitting the shit. Even then I'd still trust an olight. I can't kill either of mine. 750 lumens? Thats pretty bright for tight spots. Do you have the ability to change the caps or run these on a tape switch? 750 is the highest setting. You have three settings plus strobe and yes you can get a switch but I've had switches from different manufacturers fail so I just don't trust them. I use my thumb now. Not quite as fast as the switch but I trust it more. Google for more reviews on it. You should see some from light forums like candlepower. For the price I feel it's a strong contender and like I said I think they are hard to kill. Edit: not sure on the caps. I'll have to look. |
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What about the Elzetta Mini CQB? Seems like a good little light. 375 lumens, 1 CR123, and has the IWC mount. Not bad for $200. They also offer tape switches to buy separate. Are the Surefire 951/952 pretty heavy for the front end? I have a lead on one for under $100 with tape switch and mount. That a decent price point? IMHO just spring for the mini scout. Those 951's are old tech and huge. Even at under $100 it will get old if you plan on leaving it in the rifle full time. |
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They'll certainly be heavier than the scout lights but I don't have any issue with it (951) on my carbine. If I had a longer handguard/rail I would go smaller but I think they're fine for a carbine. http://i.imgur.com/rlXV1uP.jpg Quoted:
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What about the Elzetta Mini CQB? Seems like a good little light. 375 lumens, 1 CR123, and has the IWC mount. Not bad for $200. They also offer tape switches to buy separate. Are the Surefire 951/952 pretty heavy for the front end? I have a lead on one for under $100 with tape switch and mount. That a decent price point? They'll certainly be heavier than the scout lights but I don't have any issue with it (951) on my carbine. If I had a longer handguard/rail I would go smaller but I think they're fine for a carbine. http://i.imgur.com/rlXV1uP.jpg This right here. I can tell you that the tape switch is a fad if you don't have a vertical forgrip. If you are just running a standard rail up front, operate the light with your thumb and ditch the tape switch. |
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Quoted: Negative. If you had experience with the WML, you would know that they crack on their own. Tomac had 3 that cracked on their own (literally just sitting on the rifle) And guess what, mine just developed a crack as well (just sitting on the rifle) If it wasn't covered under fresh paint I'd take a pic and show you. Magpul polymer would absolutely, positively fix this issue. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Sad but true. I've seen way too many cases now to deny it, but if Inforce would strengthen their polymer to Magpul polymer standards, the WML would be one of the best lights around. Has alot of pros to it incuding the price point, but they need to fucking fix their polymer strength ASAP Negative. If you had experience with the WML, you would know that they crack on their own. Tomac had 3 that cracked on their own (literally just sitting on the rifle) And guess what, mine just developed a crack as well (just sitting on the rifle) If it wasn't covered under fresh paint I'd take a pic and show you. Magpul polymer would absolutely, positively fix this issue. A stronger polymer might help, but certainly not solve the problem. The steel liner with the polymer sheath on the WML series is a design flaw, as the two different materials expand, contract, and flex at much different rates. |
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Seller isn't 100% of model and I'm not familiar with them enough to know for sure what it is either. Just know yes saying its 225 lumens. Still waiting to hear back about it though. In the meantime I've found a 600B that's really catching my eye. Includes tape switch and mount just Still debating on the 300 or 600 platform. Quoted:
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Pretty torn on the purchase of a weapon light. Between the Inforce HSP WML and a Surefire 951/52 with tape switch and mount. I've owned a WML and love the simplicity. Surefire is 225 lumens to the WMLs 200. Suggestions please. I'm surprised I'm the first one to catch this, but a Surefire M95x is only 60 lumen with the P60, I think about 120 lumens with the optional P61. You can drop in LEDs though up to 1200 lumen (that I'm aware of) ($18 on ebay). I still love getting used surefires cheap off ebay though. Bullet proof and real deal US military issue! Seller isn't 100% of model and I'm not familiar with them enough to know for sure what it is either. Just know yes saying its 225 lumens. Still waiting to hear back about it though. In the meantime I've found a 600B that's really catching my eye. Includes tape switch and mount just Still debating on the 300 or 600 platform. The M600B is the older incandescent model, which while great if you're looking to use an IR filter, pretty much sucks at everything else. If you're going to get a dual cell Scout, stick with the M600C or M600U. |
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Quoted: Possible to switch out the head on the M600B? Quoted: The M600B is the older incandescent model, which while great if you're looking to use an IR filter, pretty much sucks at everything else. If you're going to get a dual cell Scout, stick with the M600C or M600U. Possible to switch out the head on the M600B? |
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Meh, they're not all that durable. I've seen more than a few with the mount portion cracked and my buddy completely shattered the body on his when his rifle fell over on the tile in his house. Quoted:
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Yep, I've been down the light road too.... Went with the WML in Coyote and haven't looked back. I think it's the best designed long gun light on the market. Meh, they're not all that durable. I've seen more than a few with the mount portion cracked and my buddy completely shattered the body on his when his rifle fell over on the tile in his house. Had the front of mine come unglued and fall off. Gonna give Gorilla Glue a try before I replace it. |
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The M600B is the older incandescent model, which while great if you're looking to use an IR filter, pretty much sucks at everything else.
If you're going to get a dual cell Scout, stick with the M600C or M600U. Possible to switch out the head on the M600B? I think he'd want this one for an M600. FWIW, depending on how much the host unit (M600B) is going to cost you, I'd look at a used M600U or at minimum just picking up some components from Arisaka to build one out. |
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I use the HSP WML and love it. Served me well at home and during low light courses. +1 here. Simple, not that expensive and it works for indoor. Now that said, I'm NOT a heavy end user. I'm not an LEO or military person, I'm not kicking in doors or cracking people over the head with my rifle. I'm just an average guy who wanted something nice but cost effective on my rifle that will work inside my house. Others may need more. And that's ok, too! |
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