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Posted: 12/7/2004 11:20:33 AM EDT
| I tried a couple searches but came up mostly empty. Do many people do .22 builds? Or is it just cheaper and/or easiser just to buy a .22 upper? The "off the rack" .22 uppers seem expensive to me and I was hoping I might be able to assemble one cheaper... |
No way will find one cheaper. You can get a blued 10/22 for 150.00, the cheapest conversion I found was the CZ V22 at 265.00. I love my conversion upper. besides if you're a member of this forum you've all ready been bitten by the black rifle bug. Building your own is just a step away...it's fun. |
I'm working on my first build. It will be a lightweight carbine (Cav. Arms Mk. II lower w/upgraded trigger and ambidexterous safety, Les Baer or Mega upper with no forward assist, slick side chrome bolt carrier and Colt "MPC" bolt, Bushmaster Superlight barrel with A1 flash suppressor and a Clark Custom Guns carbon fiber float tube. It should weigh in right around 5 pounds... I've looked at the V22, but had not seen one at that price. Where did you see that price? The AR I've got now is a Fulton Armory Legacy Rifle built around a 1 in 12 twist USGI "pencil" barrel. I wonder if shooting heavier .22 long rifle rounds through a Ceiner conversion or the like would hurt the slower-twist barrel? I know there would be some leading... |
| You can get them for less than that (as I said, about the cost of a 10/22) |
The V22 is a complete upper with its own barrel. I will probably go with a 10/22, but a V22 at $265 would be tempting. I've never seen a new one for less than $300. |
That setup might work fine for you. I've gotten very good accuracy shooting Winchester Dynapoints (copper-washed, which minimizes leading problems) in a M281 .22 conversion in an old 1:12 M16A1 upper. Cheap, accurate, fun--what more do you want?  Didn't have much luck at all shooting .22s in a 1:9 barrel, though. 
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Good luck. I looked around for a year for a 1:14 twist and never found one. No one makes these to my knowledge, so you'll have to look for one of the very first M16 barrels. Very few of these barrels were ever made. You'll have better luck finding a 1:12, which is what I ended up getting. Accuracy is much much better than a 1:9, and a 1:12 is very suitable for 55gr .223. |
What's "very good accuracy"? How does it compare to your typical 10/22? |
It will plop the Dynapoints into 3/8" at 25 yards all day. Other .22 ammo will go 5/8-3/4" groups at 25, though I did have one box of Federal Walmart Bulks that would match the Dynapoints in accuracy. The next box didn't, though, they were back to "normal." Both my 10/22s are about 5/8" guns at 25 yards, though they will put Dynapoints into just under half an inch. The 1:12 M261 is thus more accurate with Dynapoints (which fortunately are cheap, if you can find them). The M261 also shot CCI MiniMags very well, though I don't like to use them in that for a couple of reasons. Typical groups with a 1:9 barrel ran between 3/4" and 1 1/4", and one brand averaged over TWO inches! Even the (expensive, stinky) 60 grain Aguilas would only do around a half inch. |
I seen Tennesee Gun had them for 265.00 or you keep an eye out on the EE. I picked a used one for (260.00 delivered). I would have gotten one for TG but I already bought this one. I was considering the Ciener conversion but didn't like the idea of fouling out the gas tube and barrel with waxed lead desposits. My V22 now looks like a Kuehl upper. It is great fun and easy to shoot at the indoor ranges (winter time ). They usually charge the pistol price at most ranges. contact info: Tennessee Guns at 865-977-9707 |
| Don't forget to check out the Bushmaster Carbon Fiber .22 upper - here(http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/uppers/post-ban/az15846k.asp). It's very light and easy to point. Mine shoots 3/8" groups at 25 with Wolf Match. Not quite 100% faithful to the AR-15 look, but it does come with good quality sights. I like mine. R/ Jim |
| I just can't bring myself to spend the better part of $400 or more on a .22 upper when you can get a 10/22 for half of that. It would be another matter if I shot competitively with an AR or if I shot much more (so the ammo savings pay back would come sooner). I've pretty much decided to go with a 10/22, although an M261 or Ciener is tempting since I have a 1x12 barrel on my AR... |
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Essayons, If you want a practice rifle that will exactly mirror your across-the-course rifle than go with the Compass Lake AR22. If the cost (more than a CLE .223 upper) bothers you, you can get an M-261 kit, replace the barrel extension with a solid one and resleve the tube with a rimfire liner. It may or may not shoot as good as a SS Dougulas form CLE, but it will save you a couple of hundred. The important things in an accurate AR22 is 1:16 twist and no false chamber (gas leaks) that the adaptors use. Regards, Ray |
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As far as accuracy between the V22 and a stock 10/22. I'd have to give it to the V22. At 30 yards I have shot 9 shot grouping measure 1/2" The 10th shot opened it to 3/4". I have a modified 10/22 with a fluted GM barrel that can shoot about the same but it is nowhere near as fun to shoot as the V22. If I'm going to the range for target practice and can only take 1 rifle...the V22 goes to range and the 10/22 stays home. DO you have any pictures of builds in process? |
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I use KPF uppers but they also sell their barrels separately. I get match accuracy (less than 1 MOA on mine) with my KPF 14.5" M4gery upper. Yeah, you could buy a 10/22 but it's nothing like using a good AR setup. With a rimfire upper, I get to use all the cool optics, accessories, match trigger, and more that my AR's give me. I think it's well worth the extra money and ammo cost savings in getting to shoot your AR in rimfire will more than make up for it (mine did the very first day). |
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The main purpose for a AR22 upper is for high power offhand practice. The uppers built by Compass Lake Engineering can exactly match your .223 competition rifle in every way except for the recoil. Practice with a .22 helps offhand in several ways. First, the bullet is in the barrel twice as long as it is for .223 so it forces you to develope a good follow through. Second for folks up North, where few indoor ranges allow centerfire rifles, they can shoot in the winter. Or they can practice at home with a .22 bullet trap. The CLE AR22 costs more than their .223 match uppers because they require more work and add/delete components brings in more cost and I don't care to discuss it here. One interesting alternative I heard of is to get a M-261 kit (what CLE uses). Next get any shot-out AR15 barrel and replace the barrel extension with a steel piece that replicates the M-261 breech. Then drill out the whole thing and glue or solder in a 1:16 liner from Brownells. If you just want a semi-auto .22, disregard the above and get a Ruger.... Regards, Ray in FLA 
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