Warning

 

Close
Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Cancel Confirm
AR15.COM
AR Sponsor
10/19/2006 6:09:54 AM EDT
OK...what are the secrets? What matters? I know there is more that goes into assembling a top performing upper than just snapping the pieces together and torquing the barrel nut on...what are they!?!

Assume all top shelf parts are being used. What are the secrets behind:

- torquing a flash suppressor on
- torquing the barrel to the upper receiver
- matching the bolt/carrier group to the barrel
- headspacing
- etc.

Any books or DVDs that cover assembly for performance? I am buying top of the line products (Noveske KX3, Krieger barrel, Vltor block, DD lite rail, LMT enhanced bolt/carrier, and Les Baer upper) and wish to complete the entire assembly as a family project.
10/19/2006 6:37:45 AM EDT
[#1]
Looking for the same info
10/19/2006 9:00:06 AM EDT
[#2]

Quoted:
OK...what are the secrets? What matters? I know there is more that goes into assembling a top performing upper than just snapping the pieces together and torquing the barrel nut on...what are they!?!

Assume all top shelf parts are being used. What are the secrets behind:

- torquing a flash suppressor on
If you going to use a FS, it goes on hand tight.  This allows you to pull the FS during cleaining to get the muzzle clean, and not to worry if you have overtighten the FS and distorted the end of bore.
- torquing the barrel to the upper receiver
Nothing special here.
- matching the bolt/carrier group to the barrel
Yes, to get the match headspace
- headspacing
Yes, match chamber with the matching throat leade for the bullet/ogive being used
- etc.

Bottom line is the heart of the upper is a Match barrel, and then everything built around it.  Also, since you want to be in the 1/2 MOA, you will need to add gas tuneablity to the system as well.

Any books or DVDs that cover assembly for performance? I am buying top of the line products (Noveske KX3, Krieger barrel, Vltor block, DD lite rail, LMT enhanced bolt/carrier, and Les Baer upper) and wish to complete the entire assembly as a family project.
10/19/2006 12:09:23 PM EDT
[#3]



since you want to be in the 1/2 MOA, you will need to add gas tuneablity to the system as well.




does an adjustable gas block really add to accuracy? I was leaning against it, due to ruggedness.
10/19/2006 2:36:55 PM EDT
[#4]

Quoted:

OK...what are the secrets? What matters? I know there is more that goes into assembling a top performing upper than just snapping the pieces together and torquing the barrel nut on...what are they!?!

Assume all top shelf parts are being used. What are the secrets behind:

- torquing a flash suppressor on

Don't use a flash suppressor at all or use the older A1 style with slots all the way around.  Tighten it only enough to keep it on the gun without loosening during firing.

- torquing the barrel to the upper receiver

Barrel nut torque will have no affect on accuracy.  Assure that it is at least 30 lb-ft to prevent any actual looseness and movement of the barrel in the upper.

- matching the bolt/carrier group to the barrel

Assure that headspace just barely allows the bolt to rotate and lock on a GO gauge.  Basically,  a "tighter " chamber is desired for more repeatable lockup as each round is chambered.  The tighter the carrier fits in the upper the better.  This also assures more repeatable positioning of the round in the chamber at lockup.  The Les Baer / Young's carriers are several thousandths larger in diameter and also have additional longitudinal ribs on the OD of the carrier to better support it in the upper during forward movement of the assembly toward battery.  The ID of the Les Baer uppers are also a few thousandths smaller than typical Mil-Spec parts.  This also helps snug things up a bit.

- headspacing

As short as you can achieve and still be able to close the bolt!  This is not easily adjustable unless you are fitting a brand new barrel blank that has not been finish reamed or had the gas port drilled.

- etc.

Buy the best barrel you can afford from a reputable manufacturer.  Have the barrel precisely crowned by an experienced machinist or the barrel maker.  Avoid chrome plated chambers and bores.  Use a full floating handguard.  

Exceptional accuracy goes beyond just the upper receiver.  A good 1 or 2-stage trigger is essential.  JP, Jewell, Jard, McCormick, etc.  There are several good ones out there.  Go to oversize trigger and hammer pins.  The tighter the fit between the lower / pins and the pins / trigger the better.  

Try to minimize the slop between the upper and lower receivers.  There are a variety of ways to do this.

Lastly, use handloads developed for your gun.  The AR is a very fussy weapon.  What shoots very accurately in my rifle may do poorly in yours.  This takes lots of experimentation to find the perfect load for your gun.

Use a good scope.  You will nearly pay as much for good glass as for the rest of the rifle.

1" in 8" twist is optimal for all bullet weights


Any books or DVDs that cover assembly for performance? I am buying top of the line products (Noveske KX3, Krieger barrel, Vltor block, DD lite rail, LMT enhanced bolt/carrier, and Les Baer upper) and wish to complete the entire assembly as a family project.
10/19/2006 5:36:31 PM EDT
[#5]
I did not see it mentioned but a free floating handguard is a must.  Good barrel (I would buy a Compass Lake unit) properly installed, good trigger system and proper handloads.

All simple stuff.
10/19/2006 6:35:59 PM EDT
[#6]
note:  an 8twist barrell is NOT the optimal twist for ALL bullet wieghts.   If you want a barrell that will shoot ALL bullets, id look into a 6.5 twist.  
10/19/2006 6:46:41 PM EDT
[#7]

Quoted:
note:  an 8twist barrell is NOT the optimal twist for ALL bullet wieghts.   If you want a barrell that will shoot ALL bullets, id look into a 6.5 twist.  




WTF kind of rounds are you shooting with that?  A 1:7 will stabilize 100grain bullets, and I dont see many using those.

The most common HEAVY bullets are 80gr - and 1:8 barrels shot those just fine.

The majority of people want to shoot bullets they can actually load in a mag, and for most, that means 77gr and under.  1:8 is a great twist for this.


ETA - "ALL bullets"?  40gr nosler bt's in a 1:6.5  ???
10/19/2006 6:52:57 PM EDT
[#8]

Quoted:
OK...what are the secrets? What matters?


See below:


I know there is more that goes into assembling a top performing upper than just snapping the pieces together and torquing the barrel nut on...


No - sometimes that is exactly how it goes.

The absolutely key is using a quality match barrel, that has been headspaced appropriately.  Then, ensureing it is free floated.  That is 95% of the job.

Beyond that... as was stated - a bare crown with a match cut is best, and if you want a muzzle device, from most testing the vortex is best in the accuracy department.  It is also self tightening so it can be loose.

There is no secret to torquing a barrel.  Some little tricks, that are arguable... like using locktite around the barrel extension to bed it to the upper receiver....


Your achieving 1/2 MOA are mostly affected by using a quality free floated match barrel, handloading all kinds of different bullets, powders, and primers, until you find what she likes.... and practicing like crazy to be able to even shoot 1/2MOA.

Do you handload?  Can you already avg .5MOA with a match gun?  Your patience and skill level will have every bit as much impact as the weapon.
10/19/2006 7:40:05 PM EDT
[#9]
i have personally tested  52gr through 90gr  with a 6.5twist.   it is the only twist rate that sierra recommends for a 90smk bullet.

10/19/2006 10:40:51 PM EDT
[#10]
well, it can be pretty easy.  I bought one of early RRA uppers in 2002 or 2003.  It has a Wilson barrel chambered to Wylde specs.  I added a free float tube from Ameetec.

It will group 3 rounds under a dime easy as long as they are high quality rounds.  If I shoot 5 rounds, it might open up a bit, but its more likely due to me...

I can even shoot cheapie 45 grain HP Winchester White box under 3/4 inch with an 1 in 8 twist barrel.

If you really wanted to take it to the next level.  Go with a 16" bull barrel.  .223 or Wylde chamber.  Free float tube of course.
AR Sponsor